Help me understand how illusions work in combat

[Grayfeather]

So lets say I have a situation where I get into combat with something, lets say a low tier demon. I don't have anything else left but say an illusion spell, for this example silent image. I create an illusion of a Astral Deva to "defend me". Let say the demon decides what the heck and attacks it, rolls will but fails.

Question is:
- Can the illusion make him think hes being hurt even though hes not?
- Will the illusion seem like its really fighting him but missing?
- Will the illusion not be disbelieved if his attacks go through the illusion?
- And would the attacks not be disbelieved if I speak to the illusion telling it to "cast a spell/use an item to make it immune to attacks" that the attacker can hear?

[Lamontius]

Keep in mind you're talking about a level 1 spell that requires Concentration to maintain...a really fun useful spell that requires a good bit of GM interaction, but still...

I think I've seen/read that there is somewhat of a consensus that the Will save "Disbelief" action is usually associated with taking a Standard Action towards the illusion.

Personally, as long as you're maintaining the illusion, I'd give the baddie a dibelief will save each time it utilizes a standard action against the illusion, if only because, assuming it doesn't immediately run away from the illusion and cry to mommy, at some point it's going to figure out that the dang illusion isn't hurting it or impeding it one little bit.

[mplindustries]

Grayfeather wrote:

Question is:

- Can the illusion make him think hes being hurt even though hes not?

No.

Grayfeather wrote:

- Will the illusion seem like its really fighting him but missing?

Sort of. It will look like it, but there will be no battle sounds at all, which will be less than believable.

Grayfeather wrote:

- Will the illusion not be disbelieved if his attacks go through the illusion?

He will get a new Will save every time the situation changes where he might be tipped off. The devs have said that interacting with an illusion generally requires a standard action, so attacking should be sufficient.

Grayfeather wrote:

- And would the attacks not be disbelieved if I speak to the illusion telling it to "cast a spell/use an item to make it immune to attacks" that the attacker can hear?

That will be irrelevant to the illusion spell.

[VRMH]

Grayfeather wrote:

- Can the illusion make him think hes being hurt even though hes not?

- Will the illusion seem like its really fighting him but missing?
- Will the illusion not be disbelieved if his attacks go through the illusion?
- And would the attacks not be disbelieved if I speak to the illusion telling it to "cast a spell/use an item to make it immune to attacks" that the attacker can hear?

• No.
• If you keep concentrating on it, it might. Talk to your GM about your options.
• The moment the victim has irrefutable proof that the illusion is an illusion, the jig is up.
• A Silent Image can't make any attacks, though you could mock up some convincing approximations of magical attacks and hope that'll cause the enemy to do something foolish.

[Kimera757]

Grayfeather wrote:

So lets say I have a situation where I get into combat with something, lets say a low tier demon. I don't have anything else left but say an illusion spell, for this example silent image. I create an illusion of a Astral Deva to "defend me". Let say the demon decides what the heck and attacks it, rolls will but fails.

Question is:
- Can the illusion make him think hes being hurt even though hes not?

No. There's very few illusions that do something like this.

Quote:

- Will the illusion seem like its really fighting him but missing?

Yes, but that's interaction, and should provoke a Will save.

Quote:

- Will the illusion not be disbelieved if his attacks go through the illusion?

That'll end the illusion right away, at least for whoever is fighting it.

Quote:

- And would the attacks not be disbelieved if I speak to the illusion telling it to "cast a spell/use an item to make it immune to attacks" that the attacker can hear?

Bluff check and Will save when it gets attacked.

[Grayfeather]

So I'm guessing the best use for an illusion is intimidation? For silent image perhaps something already quiet/silent like a dark evil looking a shadow demon or the like? Any ideas?

[MC Templar]

The best ones are placed outside of the view of enemies that are fully cast and completed before they are encountered (illusion of a pile of boxes in an alley way, or a wall ten feet closer than it should be, allowing allies to hide) Things that are not "interacted with" as a matter of course have an easier time avoiding the "disbelief" rules.

You need to be rather creative to use them in combat. If you want to create an illusion that motivates your enemies to not approach, try an illusion of a wall of fire. It is opaque, so they can't see through, they don't have to be a spellcaster to know touching it is a bad idea, and they need a spellcraft to know where the heat "should" be. The wall is a visual blockade that never should stop arrows, so simply shooting at it shouldn't be anything more than "interacting".

Also, in most games I've seen, GM's like rewarding a player who is creative when using illusions, because they keep the game from feeling repetitive, and demonstrate that the player is thinking in the moment and immersed in the game. I have met few GMs that take illusions as an affront, and try to metagame the opposition into immediately trying to disprove the illusions.