Unicorn Eidolon: How to make it decent for PFS?


Advice

Grand Lodge

I want to build a summoner whose eidolon is very much like a unicorn, primarily because a summoner's eidolon is the closest thing I'll be able to get to a unicorn in PFS.

The Summoner, and particularly their eidolons, are something I haven't touched very often, I'm willing to sacrifice some effectiveness for the sake of the flavor (Like Hooves Evolution instead of claws, or selecting utility evolutions over extra natural attacks), but I realize recreating a unicorn can be rather ineffective: eidolons are meant to be natural attack monsters, and the bestiary unicorn is a support caster mostly.

Any tips and advice for getting the most milage from and adherence to an eidolon modelled after a unicorn?

Grand Lodge

Intrigued...

Grand Lodge

Also of importance, what items (if any) can an eidolon wear?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Ms. Pleiades wrote:
Also of importance, what items (if any) can an eidolon wear?

Unicorn really doesn't give you much in the name of options beyond horseshoes.

Eidolons can't wear armor, but they do have natural armor. You can't ride it until it before level 8 which is when you can apply the Mount and Large evolutions.

Now you can actually play up the support nature of the unicorn by going for evolutions that give it magic. One option to consider would be the First World Summoner to have a caster that's more of a fey/druidic nature.

Grand Lodge

LazarX wrote:
Ms. Pleiades wrote:
Also of importance, what items (if any) can an eidolon wear?

Unicorn really doesn't give you much in the name of options beyond horseshoes.

Eidolons can't wear armor, but they do have natural armor. You can't ride it until it before level 8 which is when you can apply the Mount and Large evolutions.

Now you can actually play up the support nature of the unicorn by going for evolutions that give it magic. One option to consider would be the First World Summoner to have a caster that's more of a fey/druidic nature.

I've been considering the magic evolutions, but the 1/day limit just comes across as way too much for expending what is a very limited resource in the Evolution Pool.

Also, with regards to the Large Evolution, I know that in PFS it's best if a Cavalier is small sized so their mount is medium, is this size concern as important for eidolons (and by extension animal companions)?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Ms. Pleiades wrote:
LazarX wrote:
Ms. Pleiades wrote:
Also of importance, what items (if any) can an eidolon wear?

Unicorn really doesn't give you much in the name of options beyond horseshoes.

Eidolons can't wear armor, but they do have natural armor. You can't ride it until it before level 8 which is when you can apply the Mount and Large evolutions.

Now you can actually play up the support nature of the unicorn by going for evolutions that give it magic. One option to consider would be the First World Summoner to have a caster that's more of a fey/druidic nature.

I've been considering the magic evolutions, but the 1/day limit just comes across as way too much for expending what is a very limited resource in the Evolution Pool.

Also, with regards to the Large Evolution, I know that in PFS it's best if a Cavalier is small sized so their mount is medium, is this size concern as important for eidolons (and by extension animal companions)?

Believe it or not, just about every Cavalier I've seen on PFS tables have been normal sized Humans. While a little cavalier on a mount seems optimal, PFS proves otherwise, because you're not going to get so many clear charge lanes to make up for the diminished damage of small sized weapons.

Sovereign Court

Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
LazarX wrote:
Ms. Pleiades wrote:
LazarX wrote:
Ms. Pleiades wrote:
Also of importance, what items (if any) can an eidolon wear?

Unicorn really doesn't give you much in the name of options beyond horseshoes.

Eidolons can't wear armor, but they do have natural armor. You can't ride it until it before level 8 which is when you can apply the Mount and Large evolutions.

Now you can actually play up the support nature of the unicorn by going for evolutions that give it magic. One option to consider would be the First World Summoner to have a caster that's more of a fey/druidic nature.

I've been considering the magic evolutions, but the 1/day limit just comes across as way too much for expending what is a very limited resource in the Evolution Pool.

Also, with regards to the Large Evolution, I know that in PFS it's best if a Cavalier is small sized so their mount is medium, is this size concern as important for eidolons (and by extension animal companions)?

Believe it or not, just about every Cavalier I've seen on PFS tables have been normal sized Humans. While a little cavalier on a mount seems optimal, PFS proves otherwise, because you're not going to get so many clear charge lanes to make up for the diminished damage of small sized weapons.

You've never played with my cavalier? I played him at one old MEPACON at least...

As someone who has two mounted cavaliers - being small is a godsend. Often you're running around the first round to set up a charge lane, but once you've got a good charge lane the first round, you can convince people to get out of your way.


Pathfinder Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Base form: Quadruped
Free evolutions: Bite, Limbs (2)

1 Hooves (Ultimate Magic)
1 Mount
1 Low-light vision (Ultimate Magic)
1 Scent
2 Gore (unicorn horn)
2 Limbs (Legs), movement now 50'
2 Limbs (Legs), movement now 60'
4 Large (requires 8th level)
1 Magic Attacks (at 10th gives you alignment attacks)
1 Basic Magic (Ultimate Magic -- required for Minor Magic)
2 Minor Magic (Ultimate Magic -- gets you the CLW)
==
18

Take Iron Will as a feat.

Skills made class skills: Acrobatics, Survival, Heal, one more.

You are paying for 8 legs, but just explain to the GMs that it was only to increase the base speed and most should allow you to have the form only show four.

You would have 19 evolution points by 14th level, but could speed this up by taking Extra Evolution feat at 1st, 5th and 10th level (so now only need to be 11th level). If you are a half-elf you can use the 1/4 Evolution FCB from Advanced Race Guide to speed it up more.

It isn't a perfect fit, but you may find it to be close enough.

Sovereign Court

Traditionally a lot of the issues with large animals comes form getting them in and out of places to actually be used. Dungeons with 5' doorways and corridors, stairs/ladders and so forth. It's mostly a logistical problem. A medium sized mount or one that can fly tends to solve some of those issues.

Now an Eidolon doesn't deal with a lot of those problems. It's intelligent and you can summon it into places easily enough if not in combat or pressed for time. That allows it to be less stressed by those logistics.

A themed unicorn mount Eidolon should work just fine. Remember however not to focus on it completely, your summoner is a large part of the build. You can easily turn a lot of problems into solutions. A small summoner on a medium mount with a few mounted combat feats is just as scary as most other things on a mount. They can wear armor, they have d8 hit dice. It's entirely possible to build the summoner to be the combat monster and let the eidolon be the support like that especially with the right traits and feats.

You don't even need to do small if you can just be patient.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Iammars wrote:

[

You've never played with my cavalier? I played him at one old MEPACON at least...

As someone who has two mounted cavaliers - being small is a godsend. Often you're running around the first round to set up a charge lane, but once you've got a good charge lane the first round, you can convince people to get out of your way.

No I haven't. Both I and V Michael Lazar ran a few tables at both Mepacons, but I don't remember a small cavalier. Quite frankly all cavaliers have a tall benchmark to live up to as far as I'm concerned and that would be Lord Melizar of Cheliax, with whom I have the distinct pleasure of running Eyes of Ten with.

Grand Lodge

BretI wrote:

Base form: Quadruped

Free evolutions: Bite, Limbs (2)

1 Hooves (Ultimate Magic)
1 Mount
1 Low-light vision (Ultimate Magic)
1 Scent
2 Gore (unicorn horn)
2 Limbs (Legs), movement now 50'
2 Limbs (Legs), movement now 60'
4 Large (requires 8th level)
1 Magic Attacks (at 10th gives you alignment attacks)
1 Basic Magic (Ultimate Magic -- required for Minor Magic)
2 Minor Magic (Ultimate Magic -- gets you the CLW)
==
18

Take Iron Will as a feat.

Skills made class skills: Acrobatics, Survival, Heal, one more.

You are paying for 8 legs, but just explain to the GMs that it was only to increase the base speed and most should allow you to have the form only show four.

You would have 19 evolution points by 14th level, but could speed this up by taking Extra Evolution feat at 1st, 5th and 10th level (so now only need to be 11th level). If you are a half-elf you can use the 1/4 Evolution FCB from Advanced Race Guide to speed it up more.

It isn't a perfect fit, but you may find it to be close enough.

Is there a reason the extra speed is needed? I've considered taking Limbs (Arms) and Slam as evolutions, and have it just flavored that the unicorn is giving a regular body slam against the enemy. I've also considered keeping eidolon medium and giving it the Fly evolution.

I've also considered just having all of its natural attacks manifest as telekinetic force from its horn, except for the hoof and gore attacks.


Pathfinder Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Ms. Pleiades wrote:
BretI wrote:

Base form: Quadruped

...

It isn't a perfect fit, but you may find it to be close enough.

Is there a reason the extra speed is needed? I've considered taking Limbs (Arms) and Slam as evolutions, and have it just flavored that the unicorn is giving a regular body slam against the enemy. I've also considered keeping eidolon medium and giving it the Fly evolution.

I've also considered just having all of its natural attacks manifest as telekinetic force from its horn, except for the hoof and gore attacks.

Unicorn speed is 60', which is the ONLY reason I put the extra limbs in.

Really depends on how much you want to emulate the Unicorn and what you consider critical.

One thing I didn't include is the Alignment Smite ability from Champions of Purity. If we were going more off lore rather than Pathfinder bestiary, I would have added it.

Grand Lodge

Morgen wrote:

Traditionally a lot of the issues with large animals comes form getting them in and out of places to actually be used. Dungeons with 5' doorways and corridors, stairs/ladders and so forth. It's mostly a logistical problem. A medium sized mount or one that can fly tends to solve some of those issues.

Now an Eidolon doesn't deal with a lot of those problems. It's intelligent and you can summon it into places easily enough if not in combat or pressed for time. That allows it to be less stressed by those logistics.

A themed unicorn mount Eidolon should work just fine. Remember however not to focus on it completely, your summoner is a large part of the build. You can easily turn a lot of problems into solutions. A small summoner on a medium mount with a few mounted combat feats is just as scary as most other things on a mount. They can wear armor, they have d8 hit dice. It's entirely possible to build the summoner to be the combat monster and let the eidolon be the support like that especially with the right traits and feats.

You don't even need to do small if you can just be patient.

And a summoner has the "Summon Monster" line of spell like abilities for just such times as well... So maybe a large eidolon isn't something I should worry about. And I guess pounce isn't as wonderful as some might make it out to be.

Grand Lodge

Question does he need to be a mount? I like the idea of FFX yuna summoning Ixion.

As far as charging feat wise work in dragon style and he can go through team mates and over difficult terrain.

Perhaps try trampling and/or overrun finished off with a gore attack.

Item wise adamantine horse shoes of crushing blows.

Grand Lodge

Fruian Thistlefoot wrote:

Question does he need to be a mount? I like the idea of FFX yuna summoning Ixion.

As far as charging feat wise work in dragon style and he can go through team mates and over difficult terrain.

Perhaps try trampling and/or overrun finished off with a gore attack.

Item wise adamantine horse shoes of crushing blows.

For pure purposes of action economy, and having the benefits of "Shield Ally" as often as possible, and using "Share Spells without having to march over to the Eidolon, I think that mounted is a decent investment.

Grand Lodge

I personally would not bother with mount and making the eidolon large full time. Totally personal though, it is a fine avenue to pursue.

I would build it with a charge/vital strike style, Focusing on the gore. Yes you can put the hooves on, but vital strike will often just be better.

Do not forget the Evolution Surge spell. This is why I said earlier that making the unicorn large all the time is not worth it. Sure it is a high spell level, but it eliminates the "Will it fit through this door?" problem.

Making it flying is a fun option too. It will also let you fill out those max attacks, even if they are at a -5 penalty.

Standard amulet of mighty fists/natural armor (your choice, fist is better imho) and belt of physical stat of your choice are the best options off the top of my head. Horse shoes would be good too, but I do not know them well enough to call out a single one as better then the rest.


Dafydd wrote:

I personally would not bother with mount and making the eidolon large full time. Totally personal though, it is a fine avenue to pursue.

I would build it with a charge/vital strike style, Focusing on the gore. Yes you can put the hooves on, but vital strike will often just be better.

Do not forget the Evolution Surge spell. This is why I said earlier that making the unicorn large all the time is not worth it. Sure it is a high spell level, but it eliminates the "Will it fit through this door?" problem.

Making it flying is a fun option too. It will also let you fill out those max attacks, even if they are at a -5 penalty.

Standard amulet of mighty fists/natural armor (your choice, fist is better imho) and belt of physical stat of your choice are the best options off the top of my head. Horse shoes would be good too, but I do not know them well enough to call out a single one as better then the rest.

I'm not sure if that is your intention, but just to clarify, you know charge and vital strike don't work together, yes?

Grand Lodge

yes, sadly.

Was trying to convey a single attack strategy with the gore, as opposed to the multi attacks of many eidolon (claw/claw/bite style).


Pathfinder Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Dafydd wrote:
Standard amulet of mighty fists/natural armor (your choice, fist is better imho) and belt of physical stat of your choice are the best options off the top of my head. Horse shoes would be good too, but I do not know them well enough to call out a single one as better then the rest.

The problem is putting slotted magic items on the Eidolon prevents the summoner from using that slot. Amulet of Mighty Fists for it means you have to take off your Amulet of Natural Armor.

The good thing is you can leave them on the Eidolon all the time and just take off anything you have in that slot in order to activate the Eidolon's Magic item.

I would suggest Ioun stones for the stat boosts on one or the other.


Dafydd wrote:

yes, sadly.

Was trying to convey a single attack strategy with the gore, as opposed to the multi attacks of many eidolon (claw/claw/bite style).

Except, pounce means charge style with eidolon is better off with multiple attacks.

Really, Eidolons needs to be built with multiple natural attacks if they want to stay relevant. It's a bit sad that it works out that way, really. Kinda like needing to get free action reload to stay relevant as a gunslinger: you are just forced into it as you progress in levels.

Silver Crusade

Change the two horns to one horn and here's a picture of your eidolon [Guide to the Melee Summoner]!

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