Hi Everyone,
I've got a dilemma - I'm going to be joining a deadly, wilderness survival game; lots of fey, magic traps and chase scenes. The GM has stated that we will not be starting with equipment. The GM has been silent on future equipment so I can only guess that any kind of item will be hard to come by. We are starting at 1st level, 15 point buy.
I want my character to be fast and unkillable. Because of the low point buy and potential lack of items, I was thinking of a defense-focused dwarf synthesist summoner with the play style of an unbreakable fighter.
I'm considering Dwarf because they have access to some of the best defensive feats, like Steel Soul. Since synthesists don't rely on physical armor, I can put some evolution points on extra limbs (legs) and skilled (acrobatics) to make a crazy-mobile tank.
The problem is, I'm not really sure where to begin with this build. Will the -cha from the dwarf be too debilitating? Which evolutions are most important?
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Dwarf isn't really that useful for a synthesist, basic aasimar are more useful and half-elf by far the most powerful choice because of the evolution points FCB.
Another possibility as well is to do a Samsaran, yeah you don't get +cha bonus but with mystic past life and grabs wizard spells that you wouldn't normally get with the summoner list to add more mobility or whatever you want really plus the -2 con doesn't matter as much for the Synthesist.
Core races only. I was thinking of boosting my con to abuse the life link ability.
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Charisma isn't as important to a summoner as many people think since they primarily use buff and support spells. Just stay away from spells with DCs and you ought to do pretty well for yourself.
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your charisma never needs to be any higher than 16. since all you need is 10+spell level. dont worry about save spells. cast buffs and summon monster spells. consider summon good monster the spell list is pretty sweet and alot of the creatures on it can heal. more importantly its a standard action to summon anything off of it. augment summoning is super important for that kind of build. build your eidolon to be a suit of armor that protects you while you buff your allies and summon monsters to dominate the battle field. the summoner is the most unbalanced class in the game. with synthesist being even worse when it comes to balance. you really cant go wrong. make sure just dump your physical stats as far as you can. and get a harness of eidolon anchoring.
Would feats that increase HP - toughness, tribal scars - increase my HP or my eidolon's temp HP pool?
Also, how would fleet work with the synthesist summoner? Would my character get increased movement while the eidolon is summoned?
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It would only increase your hp. Your eidolon can't pick feats but well...you have spells to heal eidolon hp and on top of it, you can sacrifice your own hp to give it to your eidolon when it gets to 0 from level 1.
Fleet wouldn't work because the feat only works when you are wearing armor and when you are fused with the eidolon you lose benefit of having armor, now your mileage may vary with your dm interpretation of the feat.
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It would only increase your hp. Your eidolon can't pick feats but well...you have spells to heal eidolon hp and on top of it, you can sacrifice your own hp to give it to your eidolon when it gets to 0 from level 1.
Fleet wouldn't work because the feat only works when you are wearing armor and when you are fused with the eidolon you lose benefit of having armor, now your mileage may vary with your dm interpretation of the feat.
Fleet works while wearing light or no armor.
You would continue to benefit from the feat while fused.
I don't know of a fleet evolution. There is extra limbs (legs) that give +10ft to land speed.
Is there another option?
And, correct me if i am wrong, but if I take the quadruped form, I can't cast spells without arms?
Desperate speed is the trait i was thinking of.check it out a worthwhile trait for a synthesist.
Unfortunately, no traits in this game as well.
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Without Limbs(Arms) or still spell you can't cast spells with somatic components.
However If you take limbs (arms) you can also take claws and increase your number of secondary claw attacks (eventually), or you can wield weapons/carry a shield.
I agree, High Charisma is not necessary. Also go ahead and take Arcane Blast at 10th level. Your whole spell progression becomes damaging rays. Its super worthwhile.
if its wilderness, you could with minimal craft skills make a quarterstaff. and either go for two handed or two weapon fighting styles.
No traits or extra traits feat. Sadly
What can you use?
Pretty much every summoner spell has somatic components. Are there any without?
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again you are inferring when you read the actual RULES they specifically state all you need is LIMBS EVOLUTION. specifically says limbs. if they meant hands it would say LIMBS ARMS. but again it doesnt say that. and you still have hands. a synthesist can even combine attacks of his own with that of his fused skin so long as they do not exceed his maximum attacks per round limited by the eidolon chart. read the rule it says you need limbs evolution. and quadraped has it twice.
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unless you can find errata or paizo clarification that changes the rules limitation posted inside the synthesist breakdown. until such a time pointing out all other rules in existence does not matter as this specific ability says it can do it. so please link to errata or official comment by someone like skr.
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Yes, but the fused character's natural attacks are still subject to the Maximum Attacks entry in the table for an eidolon of his level. For example, a 1st-level synthesist is limited to 3 natural attacks per round, whether those natural attacks are from the eidolon, the synthesist, or a combination of the two.
If the synthesist wants to use his eidolon's natural attacks and use his own manufactured weapons or natural weapons in the same round, his eidolon needs to have enough limbs to account for all of these attacks. For example, a gnome synthesist fused with a two-armed biped eidolon has two arms it can use to make attacks; if the synthesist wants to make claw attacks with his eidolon's claws and also make weapon attacks (such as with a dagger or staff), he needs to give his eidolon additional arms evolutions to hold those weapons (as an extension of the summoner's own limbs)--a two-armed eidolon can't make two claw attacks and also make a dagger attack or staff attack in the same round.
Remember that the synthesist is still subject to the rules of combining manufactured weapon attacks and natural weapon attacks in the same round (in that the natural weapons are always considered secondary and therefore have a -5 attack penalty).
Remember also that the summoner is wearing the eidolon like a biological, all-encompassing "suit," and the eidolon's shape limits what the summoner can do. If the eidolon doesn't have arms, the summoner can't use his own arms to manipulate objects, make attacks, cast somatic spells, or anything else requiring arms--while fused, the summoner's limbs are trapped within the armless eidolon-suit, and he isn't able to use them to manipulate things. The summoner isn't able to extend his own body parts outside of the eidolon-suit; if he wants to be able to manipulate things with arms, the eidolon needs arms (though tentacles are sufficient for simple tasks).
(Note: It is a matter of flavor and player's preference whether the synthesist floats immobile within the eidolon-suit and its limbs move at his mental command, if the synthesist moves his own arms and the eidolon-suit's arms echo this movement, or if the eidolon-suit is more form-fitting and the flesh-enveloping limbs move in direct response to the synthesist's own movements.)
Note: This clarifies an earlier FAQ error where the summoner's weapon attacks counted toward the number of attacks on the table.
Edit: removed comment rendered uneccesary by your above post. :)
Edit again: Here is the requested link: FAQ
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thank you for the faq posting i wish that the srd would just reflect faq changes. instead we get to go easter egg hunting with every incarnation of the new character we wish to play. to the op. quadraped is still my favorite form because of pounce. i usually take 2 extra limb evolutions anyways so that my pounce comes with a bunch of attacks.a large quadraped with 2 limbs arms and 2 slam evolutions and increase damage slam and pounce is BRUTAL.
I'd like my synthesist to focus more on defense than offense. Tons of damage is great, but it won't help against traps and fey magic.
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id still recommend large size eidolon with as many nat armors as you can take. use spells for instant immunity to elements. quadraped also has good ref saves which can be nice vs traps. shield meld is also a nice boon to this. its just hard to ignore the huge boon to strength and con that large gives. personally i love pouncing with 4 slams. also this build is very little gear dependance. i have played this in a low buy low magic gear campaign and still just decimated the opposition. really the only piece of gear i ever really want or need is a harness of eidolon anchoring. and that's just so the dm has a hard time countering me.
A small synthesist sounds fun. I would not go Halfling though - as a synthesist, I don't need the dex. The gnome gets +con and that can help with life link. However, the -con for the small eidolon hurts when it comes to temp HP, but, the gnome favored class option would negate that at level 1.
EDIT: asked about saves, but, found an answer.
Thanks for your help everyone! Here is the first attempt for my character.
STR 5 (10): -4-2
DEX 9 (16): -4+2
CON 10 (11): 0
INT 16 (16): 5
WIS 16 (16): 5
CHA 13 (15): 3+2
AC: 18 (22 w/ mage armor) = 10+3+2+2+1
HP: 8/10
Saves: +3/+4/+5, +2 vs. fear
Feat: Great Fortitude
Attack +2
Speed: 40ft
Favored Class: extra skills
Skills: Acrobatics, Climb, Knowledge (Arcane), Perception, Survival,
Evolutions: Imp. Nat Armor, +2 points
I am a little concerned about the relatively low HP. But, the AC and save are high. Please Critique. Thanks!
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Interesting build I'll give my thoughts as best as I can with this darn phone typing.
- climb isn't worth the skill point. For one Evo point you can have a climb speed. It will be more than enough until you can fly at level 5.
- 18 total HP is by no standard a low number at level 1. Still, you should consider the extra hit point as a class bonus instead of skill points. Let the party cover the important skills.
- Great fortitude is a decent feat, but early on you have greater needs. Toughness comes to mind as the most appropriate for your stated desires, but you can never go wrong with improved initiative. Dropping those big spells early is key. Also as a synthesist, consider arcane strike if you want a head start on combat feats. (Melee combat is the reason that archetype exists, really.)
- being survivable is all well and dandy but remember this motto: defense extends fights. Offense ends them. A turn 1 grease followed by full attacking a prone opponent will probably save you more hit points than anything else throughout the day. Plus it saves on scarce healing resources.
- the game may not be as combat focused, guessing by the starting conditions. If that's the case consider the Skilled evolution in stealth and perception. But.... avoid this if you have a rogue that wants to feel useful.
I agree that Great Fort is underwhelming at first level.
I could take Tribal Scars (bear belt). That would give me +6 HP, +1 Fort, and +2 Intimidate. Tribal Scars is such an awesome feat. It's so got that it really shouldn't exist.
Also, should I spend my extra 2 evo points on arms (so I can cast spells in combat), or, something else? Damage or resistance maybe?
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I agree that Great Fort is underwhelming at first level.
I could take Tribal Scars (bear belt). That would give me +6 HP, +1 Fort, and +2 Intimidate. Tribal Scars is such an awesome feat. It's so got that it really shouldn't exist.
Also, should I spend my extra 2 evo points on arms (so I can cast spells in combat), or, something else? Damage or resistance maybe?
I strongly recommend taking a biped eidolon. Not having arms means no casting. Which is bad news bears. With summon monster being unavailable thanks to the eidolon suit, it makes 2/3 of your whole class basically unavailable. Arms evolution fixes this, but that eats 2 of your 3 evo points. Not optimal, but possible if you really really want to stick with a four legged form.
Tribal Scars is a great front-loaded bonus to health, but it falls off at about level 9 or so, depending on how you count it vs Toughness and half of the improved fort save feat. Depends on if you want the early boost or a consistant benefit. Intimidate bonus doesn't matter past level 5 or so unless you also invest ranks.
Feat -> Extra Evolution.
Evolution -> Claws
Extra evolution cannot be taken by the synthesis.