Hey all, first time poster. (please excuse the tl;dr) As the title suggests I'm looking for suggestion building/optimizing a lvl 15+ character around the concept of a slayer/shadowdancer/maybe fighter build I'm thinking of.
As little insight into my thinking, I'm playing with a new group of people who tend to be pretty strong power builders and the DM has had to up his EL by a lot to compensate. As someone who has less skill doing so I've found myself taking a back seat in almost every encounter. My DM has allowed me a rebuild to try and strengthen my character and help would be appreciated.
Here's what I have down right now:
Slayer(Vanguard) 9/Shadowdancer 3/Fighter 3Stats: (with items already factored in. These cannot be changed currently)
Str: 19
Dex: 16
Con: 16
Int: 18
Wis: 16
Cha: 15Feats:
Combat exp.
Improv. Feint
Skill focus: bluff
Dodge
Mobility
Great. Feint
Pwr attack
Furious focus
Combat reflex
Vital strike3 levels of shadow dancer grants the summon shadow ability and 3 of fighter gives bonus feats and armor training. Slap on mithril full plate and now have full movement.
The strategy behind this build, as it stands, is a sort of group tactician, who uses his skills to assist others in combat while doing fair damage himself.
Shared studied target(+1 ab and dmg), vanguard tactician ability to share outflank (+4 ab while flanking), feint to remove a targets dex to AC, and my shadow is an auto flanking, str draining partner who uses my full bab and half my d10 health pool. All of these bonuses are designed to boost my ab up as high as possible.
My strategy in combat is to flank with my shadow, grant it and my allies +5 ab and +1 dmg, bluff as move then Pwr attack/vital strike with 3d6 sneak at full and padded ab.
I'm very interested in slayer build ideas. I don't understand the need for a 3 level dip in fighter when slayer gives full BAB other than additional feats when 3 additional levels of slayer would grant full BAB and an additional sneak attack die.
Using summon shadow to achieve flanking for sneak attack is solid.
I've been considering a slayer critical bleeding build however the shadowdancer dip seems very strong mechanically and really fun.
Any consideration of specific weapons? Reach weapons are always nice, and letting enemies accidentally walk into your range while you are hidden is nice too.
If you do go with reach weapons, I might suggest switching out vital strike for lunge. It is unexpectedly one of the best feats for reach builds
Normally, against most targets, you end your turn 10 feet away, and they only need a 5 foot step to reach you, avoiding an Attack of Opportunity and letting them get a full attack; lunge lets you end your turn 15' away from the enemy. That means that they often have to move 10' to reach you, which lets you get an AoO and usually they lose their full attack.
The fact that lunge lets you full attack anything in a 45' circle (15' reachx2, 5' step x2, 5' your square in the middle) with a reach weapon. That is a powerful option (a great consolation prize when the above strategy breaks down against giants and such), and it is made all the more effective because you can do so while hiding in plain sight. So when your GM considers 'can he full attack me?', the answer is usually 'yes'.
Honestly, I would skip the fighter levels. At 15+ levels, a few extra feats isn't all that much for a stealth build. Besides, evasion (from the shadowdancer) does not work in anything but light armor.
You should also pick one method to get enemies flat footed - either feint or HiPS or flanking with the shadow- you don't need all three. This will also save you on feats. If you do need more feats, Combat Trick and Weapon Training can both be taken as a slayer talent.
Reach is a good option for rogues. But, remember that if you go for an attack of opportunity build, only the first attack will deal sneak attack damage.
Unless you're specfically married to shadow dancer and fighter, lose those and go straight Slayer.
In regards to fighter: The loss of slayer progression is very harmful to the overall character power, for what amounts to a few more points of AC. It's not worth it. The extra bonus feats are nice, but don't make up for what you lose. Also, it is quesitonable about whether or not the Slayer (which is based on the ranger) will be errata'd to lose bonus feats if they wear heavy armor. I think this will eventually be the case, and the combat style feats will work the same way as they do on the ranger. If that happens, this is doubly a bad idea.
If Shadow Dancer is truly something that you cannot live without because you want the shadow, then so be it. The shadow can be helpful to flank with and provide a companion.
You're feat selection...is a mess. I'm not sure what you're trying to go for here. Are you wanting to TWF or two hand a weapon? You don't list TWF in any of your feats, but that's the common thing to do on sneak attacking classes so I want to verify.
Edit: I just noticed you want to go Vanguard archetype... I will have to think on this more.
I'm playing a rogue that will take at least one level in Shadow Dancer for the HiPS. It's not the most optimized build, but, it works for me. He is a reach rogue with a longspear. He is only level 1 and the game only uses the CRB. We rolled for stats. This is the general plan for feats:
STR 17, DEX 15, CON 12, INT 11, WIS 12, CHA 8
1 - Combat Reflexes, Dodge
2 - Combat Training (WF: Longspear)
3 - Mobility
4 - Combat Trick (Spring Attack)
5 - Power Attack
When I can't get a sneak attack, I use the Aid Another action to boost my ally's attack or defense. The attacks of opportunity don't get the sneak attack damage BUT they DO let me distribute some extra hurt in a big fight.