Let me put it in simpler terms:
A wizard finds a wand of a second level spell called Conflugalize. Since it's a wand, the spell is neither divine nor arcane. The wizard, who does not know that spell, then crafts a scroll of that spell.
What level is the spell contained on the scroll? Is the scroll arcane or divine?
However I am not sure if the type is determined by the one with the feat, or the one with the spell.. My guess is the spell caster determines the type, not the one with the crafting feat.
The spell must be of the correct type (arcane or divine). Arcane spellcasters (wizards, sorcerers, and bards) can only use scrolls containing arcane spells, and divine spellcasters (clerics, druids, paladins, and rangers) can only use scrolls containing divine spells. (The type of scroll a character creates is also determined by his class.)
It is possible for more than one character to cooperate in the creation of an item, with each participant providing one or more of the prerequisites. In some cases, cooperation may even be necessary.
If two or more characters cooperate to create an item, they must agree among themselves who will be considered the creator for the purpose of determinations where the creator's level must be known.
I'd say that the type is determined by who they agree is the creator
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Let me put it in simpler terms:
A wizard finds a wand of a second level spell called Conflugalize. Since it's a wand, the spell is neither divine nor arcane. The wizard, who does not know that spell, then crafts a scroll of that spell.
What level is the spell contained on the scroll? Is the scroll arcane or divine?
Let my put it in simple term: you can put on a scroll a spell that exist in a spell list and you must put the spell in the scroll at the level of your source.
Maybe you have missed it the first few times, but I will repeat it again:The prerequisite to putting a specific spell in a scroll is the specific spell
So if your source has Lesser restoration as a level 2 spell with a Caster Level of 3 you put into the scroll a spell of Lesser Restoration with a spell level of 2 with a caster level of 3.
The creator must have prepared the spell to be scribed (or must know the spell, in the case of a sorcerer or bard) and must provide any material component or focus the spell requires.
The spell, not a similar spell, you put into the scroll exactly the spell that you have prepared.
You can't invent a new spell simply because you are scribing it into a scroll.
Let me put it in simpler terms:
A wizard finds a wand of a second level spell called Conflugalize. Since it's a wand, the spell is neither divine nor arcane. The wizard, who does not know that spell, then crafts a scroll of that spell.
What level is the spell contained on the scroll? Is the scroll arcane or divine?
Let my put it in simple term: you can put on a scroll a spell that exist in a spell list and you must put the spell in the scroll at the level of your source.
Maybe you have missed it the first few times, but I will repeat it again:
The prerequisite to putting a specific spell in a scroll is the specific spell
So if your source has Lesser restoration as a level 2 spell with a Caster Level of 3 you put into the scroll a spell of Lesser Restoration with a spell level of 2 with a caster level of 3.The creator must have prepared the spell to be scribed (or must know the spell, in the case of a sorcerer or bard) and must provide any material component or focus the spell requires.The spell, not a similar spell, you put into the scroll exactly the spell that you have prepared.
You can't invent a new spell simply because you are scribing it into a scroll.
I'd say that Divine and Arcane version of a spell are the same spell that is accessible by different sets of classes
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I'd say that Divine and Arcane version of a spell are the same spell that is accessible by different sets of classes
You are wrong, as a Arcane caster can't use a Divine scroll of a spell, even if it is a spell that share the same entry in the CRB, without using UMD. For several of them the material components change too: DF vs M.
They are similar spells, not the same spell.
I'd say that Divine and Arcane version of a spell are the same spell that is accessible by different sets of classesYou are wrong, as a Arcane caster can't use a Divine scroll of a spell, even if it is a spell that share the same entry in the CRB, without using UMD. For several of them the material components change too: DF vs M.
They are similar spells, not the same spell.
Indeed I said that different versions are accessible by different classes.
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Indeed I said that different versions are accessible by different classes.
I'd say that Divine and Arcane version of a spell are the same spell that is accessible by different sets of classesYou are wrong, as a Arcane caster can't use a Divine scroll of a spell, even if it is a spell that share the same entry in the CRB, without using UMD. For several of them the material components change too: DF vs M.
They are similar spells, not the same spell.
Let me get this straight: you recognize that they are different spells but at the same time you say that the wizard scribing a scroll with the arcane version of protection from evil memorized can decide to make a scroll of the divine version of protection from evil, a spell that the crafter or his helpers don't have memorized while making the scroll?
The RAI is that the spell only need to be cast. It does not matter how. Otherwise a 2nd caster could not cast the spell for you.
The reason that language is the way it is, is because that is normally how those classes use spells.I have to admit, I find it quite amusing when random posters confidently assert RAI. Did you steal SKR's diary or something?
I find it amusing when I am citing RAW and/or a dev and people think I am just making things up.
Crafting and Spell Requirements: When crafting an item, can an arcane caster use a divine scroll to fulfill an item's divine spell requirement?
Yes. (Likewise, a divine caster could use an arcane scroll to fulfill an item's arcane spell requirement.)
However, the character has to be able to activate the scroll somehow as part of the crafting process. This probably requires the arcane caster to succeed at a Use Magic Device check to activate the divine spell. If the caster fails to cast the divine spell from the scroll, he makes no progress on the item that day unless he has another source for that divine spell (such as another copy of the scroll).
If I can create the scroll using a spell that is divine and from another scroll then obviously I don't need to have it prepared or know it.
edit: As for spells their type is determined by the caster not the spell. That is how bards and witches use spells that are traditionally divine as arcane spells. They dont have any rules exception to cast divine spells while still being arcane casters.
FAQ'ed because I'm interested in how this interacts with a wiz/clc/MT's combined spells ability.
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It's perfectly find to houserule to match PFS but as standard divine and arcane versions of spells are indeed separate beasts and a bard needs a UMD check to use a cleric-crafted healing wand.
A wand don't differentiate between arcane and divine, it is a spell trigger item and they only require you to have the spell on your spell list.
Spell Completion: This is the activation method for scrolls. A scroll is a spell that is mostly finished. The preparation is done for the caster, so no preparation time is needed beforehand as with normal spellcasting. All that's left to do is perform the finishing parts of the spellcasting (the final gestures, words, and so on). To use a spell completion item safely, a character must be of high enough level in the right class to cast the spell already. If he can't already cast the spell, there's a chance he'll make a mistake. Activating a spell completion item is a standard action (or the spell's casting time, whichever is longer) and provokes attacks of opportunity exactly as casting a spell does.Spell Trigger: Spell trigger activation is similar to spell completion, but it's even simpler. No gestures or spell finishing is needed, just a special knowledge of spellcasting that an appropriate character would know, and a single word that must be spoken. Spell trigger items can be used by anyone whose class can cast the corresponding spell. This is the case even for a character who can't actually cast spells, such as a 3rd-level paladin. The user must still determine what spell is stored in the item before she can activate it. Activating a spell trigger item is a standard action and does not provoke attacks of opportunity.
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Activate the Spell: Activating a scroll requires reading the spell from the scroll. The character must be able to see and read the writing on the scroll. Activating a scroll spell requires no material components or focus. (The creator of the scroll provided these when scribing the scroll.) Note that some spells are effective only when cast on an item or items. In such a case, the scroll user must provide the item when activating the spell. Activating a scroll spell is subject to disruption just as casting a normally prepared spell would be. Using a scroll is like casting a spell for purposes of arcane spell failure chance.
To have any chance of activating a scroll spell, the scroll user must meet the following requirements.
The spell must be of the correct type (arcane or divine). Arcane spellcasters (wizards, sorcerers, and bards) can only use scrolls containing arcane spells, and divine spellcasters (clerics, druids, paladins, and rangers) can only use scrolls containing divine spells. (The type of scroll a character creates is also determined by his class.)
The user must have the spell on her class list.
The user must have the requisite ability score.If the user meets all the requirements noted above, and her caster level is at least equal to the spell's caster level, she can automatically activate the spell without a check. If she meets all three requirements but her own caster level is lower than the scroll spell's caster level, then she has to make a caster level check (DC = scroll's caster level + 1) to cast the spell successfully. If she fails, she must make a DC 5 Wisdom check to avoid a mishap (see Scroll Mishaps). A natural roll of 1 always fails, whatever the modifiers. Activating a scroll is a standard action (or the spell's casting time, whichever is longer) and it provokes attacks of opportunity exactly as casting a spell does.
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Activation: Wands use the spell trigger activation method, so casting a spell from a wand is usually a standard action that doesn't provoke attacks of opportunity. (If the spell being cast has a longer casting time than 1 action, however, it takes that long to cast the spell from a wand.) To activate a wand, a character must hold it in hand (or whatever passes for a hand, for nonhumanoid creatures) and point it in the general direction of the target or area. A wand may be used while grappling or while swallowed whole.
Most items can be made if the spell is available, or circumvented by upping the DC.
The Scribe Scroll feat however specifically requires that the scroll creator KNOW the spell, not merely have it available, or the need bypassed. You can not get help or aid in scribing a scroll save for an assistant to help boost your spellcraft check. The same pretty much holds true for wands as well.
Otherwise it's a completely solitary activity that can not be aided by any form of outside source.
Developer (SKR specifically) commentary explaining that cooperative creation of scrolls is ok.
A caster working with someone else who has Scribe Scroll to create scrolls works fine.
I think this is the third or fourth time I've posted this in a thread.
In regards to the OP, this isn't really an area there are hard and fast rules for. I would probably allow the scroll to be made, costing the use of the ability, but it would remain a divine scroll because the ability is allowing the emulation of divine magic. Therefore the resultant scroll would require a UMD check to cast for a non-divine caster.