Illusionists: How do / can you make a decent one ???

[Deathknight69]

Ok Folks,

The title says it all. I'm thinking about a straight class or combo-ed w/ some Rogue levels. Advice wanted/needed. 11th to 13th effective ECL.

D69

[PIXIE DUST]

Well it depends...

If you want to make a "shadow caster" that is good at Shadow Spells (technically illusion spells) my suggestion would probably be to go Cleric 5 with the Shadow Domain and the Madness Domain. Then you would go into Vieled Illusionist for 2 levels. From there you would go into Umbral Court Agent for a level to grab the +2 Caster Level and Saves and free tenebrous spell to all spells. From there you continue along Vieled Illusionist to keep stealing good illusion spells off the wizard spell list.

so your class would look like:

Cleric 5/Umbral Court Agent 1/Vieled Illusionst 5-7

For reference:

Vieled Illusionst
Umbral Court Agent
Darkness Domain
Madness Domain

Feat wise, you would want the obvious Spell Focus/G.Spell Focus.

On top of that, you would probably want Skill Focus (Know. Any) to grab Eldritch Heritage (arcane) to get the Familair and DC buff later+Spells.

Alternatively, you can grab Skill Focus (stealth) and grab the Shadow Bloodline to gain the ability to dimension door around in shadows.

You would also probably want Umbral Spell and Tenebrous Spell to add more versatility to your magic (Entangling AND adding a darkness spell rider effect is nice).

[kikidmonkey]

The first thing to do is to talk to your GM and have a nice discussion on the limits of illusions spells so you aren't surprised later. Depending on your GM, illusion magic can be great or worthless.

[Deathknight69]

@ PIXIE DUST: I'm thinking along the lines of an old school AD&D Illusionist, Also, What race(s) would be suited for it; Gnomes included ??

@Kikidmonkey: My GM needs "Victims" to run thru "City of the Spider Queen". So I'm reasonably sure I can do a lot with any characters I run.

[PIXIE DUST]

Deathknight69 wrote:

@ PIXIE DUST: I'm thinking along the lines of an old school AD&D Illusionist, Also, What race(s) would be suited for it; Gnomes included ??

@Kikidmonkey: My GM needs "Victims" to run thru "City of the Spider Queen". So I'm reasonably sure I can do a lot with any characters I run.

Oh in that case the Gnome is the best Illusionist race. They racially get a +1 bonus to DCs of illusion spells, which you want to ramp up as far as you can.

The Fetchling makes decent Illusionists as well due to their +1 DC to Illusion (Shadow) spells and their bonus to miss chance when in Dim Lighting.

As for a standard illusionist you would probably go:

School Savant Arcanist 5/Veiled Illusionist 8
Illusion (Mage of the Veil) Sub School with Necromancy and Evocation as your "forbidden" schools.

The Arcanist gives you the ability to ramp up your DCs slighter higher with Arcane Pool points. You would use your level 5 exploit to get the Potent Magic exploit so each use of your pool can increase your DCs by 2.

Vieled Illusionist lets you ramp up your glamour effects and lets your illusions work as psuedo-transmutation abilities for yourself which is pretty cool.

[kikidmonkey]

Or you can go Arcane bloodline Sorcerer, if you are getting up to level 15. That way, with Spell focus and greater spell focus you get a +4 to your DC's, +5 if you apply metamagic (let's say...heighten for an additional +1 DC), and with spell perfection, you can make that go up to a +7(8) for a specific spell, say...one called Shadow evocation/conjuration

So if you do all that nonsense as a Gnome, that's effectively +9 DC

At level 20, that could mean a Heightened Greater Shadow Evocation with a DC of 28+Stat, not too bad.

[Charon's Little Helper]

Deathknight69 wrote:

@Kikidmonkey: My GM needs "Victims" to run thru "City of the Spider Queen". So I'm reasonably sure I can do a lot with any characters I run.

I'm pretty sure that Kikimonkey didn't mean what campaign your GM is running.

There's quite a bit of table variation on what GMs will let you do with the image spells can do. Heck - I've heard someone argue that simply seeing/hearing one counts as 'interacting' and gives them a save. (Ridiculous since there are specific rules for 'studying' illusions to get a save. If you got a save just by seeing/hearing one - why would you need to spend a standard action studying them to get a save? Obviously - you wouldn't!)

Nonetheless - some GMs really don't like the idea of illusions doing much of anything. Some will let you be extremely creative. I'd get your GM's opinion before running an illusion based character.

[ryric]

I agree that this really depends on the GM - find out what they think the limitation of illusions are. What do they think counts as interaction? Do they think a successful Spellcraft check equates with an automatic disbelieve? How clever can you be with your effects? How much can you change an existing effect while you're concentrating on it?
Can you choose to believe your own illusions(can be useful with shadow conjuration)? What happens if someone "disbelieves" something that's real? hash all this stuff out to begin with so it doesn't bog the game down when(not if) it comes up during play.

A well-played illusionist should have their opponents doubting their senses and memories. Mix up your illusions with implausible but real effects and you can have a enemy group doubting reality itself. Think of RL stage magic - you know it's fake but it sure is convincing when done well.

[Charon's Little Helper]

ryric wrote:

A well-played illusionist should have their opponents doubting their senses and memories. Mix up your illusions with implausible but real effects and you can have a enemy group doubting reality itself. Think of RL stage magic - you know it's fake but it sure is convincing when done well.

That reminds me of a scene from Dresden (book 13?) where the girl who's an illusionist makes a fake giant wall of flame. It freaks out her opponents, but they figure it out.

A minute later Dresden summons up a real wall of flame. Their foe's leader snorts and steps through it... and promptly turns to ash.