I am playing new character and when I was making it I found all the food options listed in the equipment section. I really liked the idea of making a cook for the party so a bought lots of food and cooking supplies and took craft cooking. When I looked at the craft rules however the time it takes to make one meal is ridicules even if I increase the dc of the check.
1 week = 7 days * 8 hr * 60 min = 3360 min
dc 5 + 10 to cut time = 15 dc
take 10 + int 2 + ranks 4 = 16
Meal, good (per day) 5sp * 5 players = 25 sp
15 dc * 16 check = 240
240 / 25 = 9.6
3360 min/ 9.6 = 350 min to cook one meal for everyone or 5.8 hours
obviously this system was not designed for cooking. but with so many food options on the book I figure someone must have a good system somewhere. My DM has said if I can find a good system she will let me use it.
Any ideas?
When you say system, what do you mean?
The craft rules arent meant for just making a meal, its for trying to produce goods for profit. Are you trying to make a profit? Or just put together a nice meal for you party?
In one of my games my witch is actually the cook. The time is left ambiguous but effectively, once per day I can spend enough food resources to make a meal for the party and roll a craft or proffession check. If I beat a DC 20 then the party gets a 'well fed' bonus to xp gained equal to my total divided by 6 (rounded down).
no, no profit just make nice varying meals for the party. I got sick and tired of the eat trail rations, sleep in watches pattern that was forming with no detail. I was thinking I could butcher some of what we kill or find on the way as well. Dragons stakes Mmmmm. lol.
My DM and I are thinking some food is harder to make then others so it would be nice if that was considered. but my dm is being flexible so it dose not have to be an official system just one that is interesting and dose not take hours to compete a meal unless I am making a banquet or cooking something really strange.
We were also hoping for something that might have effects in game as well ie. eat red dragons get 1 point of fire resistance.
Just looking for ideas.
The well fed bonus is what we do with it. But in general, keep in mind that while some things are harder then others, pathfinder leaves actual human ability behind almost immediately.
Assuming a descent int score, by 6th level you are at the peak of human ability (in the real world). With 6 ranks, class skill bonus and skill focus you are better then the any chef on earth. Gordon Ramsey isnt a 20th level character. He's like a 2nd level expert. So keep that in mind when considering the 'dcs' for meals.
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For my game I implemented a house rule, you can eat up to your CON score in the same meals consecutively (CON 10 = 10 DAYS of trail rations), after that, you must roll WILL/FORT to force yourself to eat the same boring food again (plush Wizards low con seem less hardy than grizzled high con fighters so it seems to fit). Failure means your character refuses to eat/demands a new meal (even if that might mean spending their last gold on a home cooked meal). Success means +2 to the next days DC. They can eat trail rations (or same meal) if there are no other options, but it comes with penalties to skills and Initiative (nothing critical, and it caps at a max penalty early).
For meals, 1 hour cook time per 4-6 fed, I set a DC10 chef/survival for meal= burnt to a crisp, but not poison/diseased, unappetizing, +4 to next DC to eat it again. DC15 meal= hearty, leftovers if amount cooked was greater than party number (as per foraging rules), DC20 meal = filling, 1 time bonus to 1 save (eaters choice at time of save), DC30 meal = +1 initiative (1 roll), +1/2 lvl regular healing from sleep, bonus save for ongoing diseases if character is on rest as well.
Failure by 5= waste of materials, food grants no bonus. Failure by 10=sickness, disease/poison check, or penalties. Failure by 15=Sickness ongoing the next day at random (every hour roll for 25% 10 min sickness) until end of day (food poisoning basically).
Even at low levels, anyone can take a 10 survival to eat mysterious tubers baked in the ashes of the campfire.
I added meaningful risk and rewards, but the party did not need to cook for long before they all crafted rings of sustenance, which was unfortunate. At high levels the penalties and bonuses amounted to little anyways, but that is +lvl 12 gaming for you.
I would suggest to your GM that they add "cookbooks", diligent study could increase your "skill" in cook by an amount (similar to ability score books). "Recipes" could be one shot bonuses to specific meals of the recipes descriptor (dragon steak recipe = +1 to cook dragon meat).
Heck, you could add "Secret"/"Magic"/"Famous" recipes that grant a bonus on a successful high DC check, the resulting meals could act as 1/2 alchemical creation (flambe of fire ward 2 anyone?)(frost wolf summer salad of frost ward 2?) (antiplague +2 owlbear noodle soup?).
We both love your cookbook recipes idea. You could even base some neat quest hooks of it (innkeeper has found ancient family recipe for the ultimate in fine cuisine "roost troll heart" but needs adventures to get ingredients for him) it is an awesome idea.
your idea of
you can eat up to your CON score in the same meals consecutively (CON 10 = 10 DAYS of trail rations), after that, you must roll WILL/FORT to force yourself to eat the same boring food again.
Is good as well but I don't see why it has to work only for trail rations they may not need to eat with rings of sustenance but they might get really sick of not eating.
Thanks everyone for the ideas.
Elves of Golarion had magical food items the party could eat for buffs.
We both love your cookbook recipes idea. You could even base some neat quest hooks of it (innkeeper has found ancient family recipe for the ultimate in fine cuisine "roost troll heart" but needs adventures to get ingredients for him) it is an awesome idea.
your idea of
you can eat up to your CON score in the same meals consecutively (CON 10 = 10 DAYS of trail rations), after that, you must roll WILL/FORT to force yourself to eat the same boring food again.Is good as well but I don't see why it has to work only for trail rations they may not need to eat with rings of sustenance but they might get really sick of not eating.
Thanks everyone for the ideas.
The party (ranger and druid) started casting grove of respite, after a few days of eating nothing but "good berries" in fruit form, I had them start rolling, even tasty magical fruit can get boring quickly (I.E. Lord of the Rings and the Elven Bread). Maybe I should push them to get bored with not eating =p
I have also added candy, an example is honey treats that added +2 vs fatigue, I had hard sugar candy, Taffy treats, booze balls, etc. No one said the food had to be nutritious, the candy could come with double edged effects (+will -Fort, etc).
And what about alcoholic drinks? I am sure there are any number of popular drinks that could be concocted (Purple Wurm Tequila? Green Dragon Blood Ale, Imp Wing Margaritas?)
Maybe we should just create a food based magical chef class!
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Cook is actually normally a Profession check - it's not supposed to be about making specific meals so much as running a kitchen, so it doesn't necessarily take as long as the Craft rules suggest.
Assuming a descent int score, by 6th level you are at the peak of human ability (in the real world). With 6 ranks, class skill bonus and skill focus you are better then the any chef on earth. Gordon Ramsey isnt a 20th level character. He's like a 2nd level expert. So keep that in mind when considering the 'dcs' for meals.
Good point, but also remember that skilled professional chefs usually also have masterwork tools and assistants (aid another) for another +4 to +8 or so on their checks. So the best chef on earth has maybe 5 ranks + 3 class bonus +4 ability + 3 skill focus + 8 circumstance = +23 modifier in their home kitchen. Still, that means that a DC 30 meal is the sort of meal with a months-long waiting list, and a DC 40 is the best thing anyone will ever eat.
The party (ranger and druid) started casting grove of respite, after a few days of eating nothing but "good berries" in fruit form, I had them start rolling, even tasty magical fruit can get boring quickly (I.E. Lord of the Rings and the Elven Bread). Maybe I should push them to get bored with not eating =p
I appreciate your desire to make play more flavourful, and I like your ideas, but I hope this is a joke. If your players aren't interested in detailing their meals, and bonuses from food aren't helping, you can't force them to find it interesting.
Cook is actually normally a Profession check - it's not supposed to be about making specific meals so much as running a kitchen, so it doesn't necessarily take as long as the Craft rules suggest.
Assuming a descent int score, by 6th level you are at the peak of human ability (in the real world). With 6 ranks, class skill bonus and skill focus you are better then the any chef on earth. Gordon Ramsey isnt a 20th level character. He's like a 2nd level expert. So keep that in mind when considering the 'dcs' for meals.Good point, but also remember that skilled professional chefs usually also have masterwork tools and assistants (aid another) for another +4 to +8 or so on their checks. So the best chef on earth has maybe 5 ranks + 3 class bonus +4 ability + 3 skill focus + 8 circumstance = +23 modifier in their home kitchen. Still, that means that a DC 30 meal is the sort of meal with a months-long waiting list, and a DC 40 is the best thing anyone will ever eat.
The party (ranger and druid) started casting grove of respite, after a few days of eating nothing but "good berries" in fruit form, I had them start rolling, even tasty magical fruit can get boring quickly (I.E. Lord of the Rings and the Elven Bread). Maybe I should push them to get bored with not eating =pI appreciate your desire to make play more flavourful, and I like your ideas, but I hope this is a joke. If your players aren't interested in detailing their meals, and bonuses from food aren't helping, you can't force them to find it interesting.
The players found it interesting, so they began hunting and foraging, but their amazing survival scores meant that every day was an amazing meal (with tons of excess food from hunting and foraging), interspersed with grove of respite, this meant the bonuses were almost automatic, which led to laziness, which led to rings of sustenance from a craft crazy 5 caster 6 person party.
It worked for a while, they enjoyed it for a good 3 levels after that moment, but I don't think I went far enough with it (recipe books, unique bonuses per meal, detailed meals, etc), so it became another hand-waved set up camp action (except after tough boss battle mithril pan fried, fruit filled pancakes and syrup, almost a ritual celebration). And after lvl 12 +1's are just not worth the trouble to RP anymore, not when they sleep 2 hours and set up camp with a spell.
Thank you Ipslore the food items there were exactly the kind of recipes we were looking for. I think my DM might be planning to use the Newlife Soup against us however ;-(
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The players found it interesting, so they began hunting and foraging, but their amazing survival scores meant that every day was an amazing meal (with tons of excess food from hunting and foraging), interspersed with grove of respite, this meant the bonuses were almost automatic, which led to laziness, which led to rings of sustenance from a craft crazy 5 caster 6 person party.
It worked for a while, they enjoyed it for a good 3 levels after that moment, but I don't think I went far enough with it (recipe books, unique bonuses per meal, detailed meals, etc), so it became another hand-waved set up camp action (except after tough boss battle mithril pan fried, fruit filled pancakes and syrup, almost a ritual celebration). And after lvl 12 +1's are just not worth the trouble to RP anymore, not when they sleep 2 hours and set up camp with a spell.
It's normal for elements of the game to change from low to mid to high levels, and food and navigation are usually more interesting in low-level play. Sounds like your cooking experiment had a pretty good run.
It's normal for elements of the game to change from low to mid to high levels, and food and navigation are usually more interesting in low-level play. Sounds like your cooking experiment had a pretty good run.The players found it interesting, so they began hunting and foraging, but their amazing survival scores meant that every day was an amazing meal (with tons of excess food from hunting and foraging), interspersed with grove of respite, this meant the bonuses were almost automatic, which led to laziness, which led to rings of sustenance from a craft crazy 5 caster 6 person party.
It worked for a while, they enjoyed it for a good 3 levels after that moment, but I don't think I went far enough with it (recipe books, unique bonuses per meal, detailed meals, etc), so it became another hand-waved set up camp action (except after tough boss battle mithril pan fried, fruit filled pancakes and syrup, almost a ritual celebration). And after lvl 12 +1's are just not worth the trouble to RP anymore, not when they sleep 2 hours and set up camp with a spell.
Hopefully Sageann can improve on my, admittedly, ad hoc cooking system into something more substantial and sustainable.
The Elves of Golaron food items seem really interesting. I may have to think up something for the next campaign I run =)