The Legend of Korra Book 3: Change ***Spoilers***

[Tels]

Have you seen the premiere episodes? Did you like or dislike them? Any special things that you really liked or enjoyed? Anything specific you disliked?

[Andrew R]

just finished the first 2 looking forward to the rest

[The NPC]

I liked it. Although I thought that someone would have realized a light touch and actually talking to the new air benders would have worked better, but hey comedy.

[Dragon78]

Great so far, I can't wait for the rest of the season.

[Kalshane]

The NPC wrote:

I liked it. Although I thought that someone would have realized a light touch and actually talking to the new air benders would have worked better, but hey comedy.

I think those actions were in character for both Tenzin and Korra. Tenzin has always been a stick-in-mud when it comes to properly honoring the Air Nomad culture that Aang impressed upon him. I don't think the fact that these new Air Benders wouldn't see themselves as part of that culture would ever occur to him, as to him it's what being an Air Bender means.

And Korra, though she is learning to reign it in, has always been a hothead and reacts poorly (and generally aggressively) towards those who don't agree with her. She understood Tenzin's way wasn't working and why, but she let her temper get the better of her when her attempts to reason with Ryu were met with obstinance and derision.

All in all, I enjoyed the new episodes quite a bit, even if they didn't blow me away. I think this season has a lot of potential and I think the quartet of new villains are intriguing.

I also liked that Korra and Asami got to spend some quality time (and do some butt-kicking) together, and they were both able to basically just shrug and say "Mako's an idiot" and move past it.

I still think they're leaning too heavy on Bolin as "the comic relief guy" but at least he wasn't useless like he was for 3/4s of last season.

One thing that I liked was them actually explaining how Mako and Bolin's uncle was able to recognize them. The long lost family member being magically able to recognize a main character has always been problematic, but the fact that it takes place in a world with media and the fact that Mako (as the onetime boyfriend of the Avatar) and Bolin (as a mover star) would show up in the paper/movers, it's no surprise that at least some of their estranged family would have kept up with their activities.

On a similar note, it took that scene to make me realize why so many people recognized Korra as The Avatar on-sight (I originally thought they were just hand-waving the introductions) whereas Aang always had to identify himself as such (when he wanted it known).

[Freehold DM]

I'm enjoying the show as well. I too found Tenzin's actions in character, I enjoyed that part of the show almost as much as the new villains.

[The NPC]

I wonder what that one guy does in the basement considering they don't have the internet, rpgs, or tv. Maybe he's the next season's villain.

[Snorri Nosebiter]

I'm quite certain they have RPG's. without RPG's, society can't endure.

[Tels]

I think if Korra were playing an RPG of her life, she'd claim she's got a dick GM.

Your flames clear the path of brush, allowing you to pass. As you approach, suddenly the brush rapidly regenerates and blocks the path again.

Your spirit bending ability seems to calm down the vines. They begin retreating and the building is left cleared! Congratulations!

Then! Suddenly the vines return, spreading even further than they were before and knock over a building full of people! What do you do

I punch the GM!

Wait, what? *SLAM* OW! WHAT THE HELL!!

I liked Tenzin's horrible persuasiveness, though that does make me wonder if the only reason why he's on the Republic City Council is he's the eldest Airbender.

Earth Queen:

The whole Earth Queen/Airbender Army thing seems odd. I know she's evil and all, but you'd think, at some point, people, even royals who think they have all the power, would be extremely weary of crossing the Avatar. I mean, the amount of arrogance required to think you can defeat someone who is literally capable of taking one entire bending armies entirely by his/herself and capable of defeating the most powerful benders to have ever lived, is just phenomenal.

Kidnapping and trying to force the air benders into an army when the Avatar is looking to train them... She must know that once Korra finds out she's practically declaring war on Tenzin, and by extension, Korra.

Villains:

Still, the Anti-Team Avatar is shaping up to be an awesome set of villains and I'm looking forward to finding out their motivations. It did kind of bug me that Zaheer seemed to master Air bending so quickly. I'd have liked to have seen the story advance more at something like "2 months later" rather than 2 weeks. After 2 months of solitary training, I could see someone like Zaheer who already seems fairly spiritual and powerful mastering certain aspects of Air Bending, but not after 2 weeks. That time frame feels too short for me.

[LazarX]

Despite what Tenzin may believe, being spiritually inclined and mastering AirBending aren't tied to each other.

[Tels]

LazarX wrote:

Despite what Tenzin may believe, being spiritually inclined and mastering AirBending aren't tied to each other.

They are tied together, hence the reason why Korra had such trouble with air bending in season 1. She was not very spiritual and had a difficult time learning to air bend, just as Aang, who wasn't very confrontational, had trouble learning to earth bend.

[Freehold DM]

Tels wrote:

LazarX wrote:

Despite what Tenzin may believe, being spiritually inclined and mastering AirBending aren't tied to each other.

They are tied together, hence the reason why Korra had such trouble with air bending in season 1. She was not very spiritual and had a difficult time learning to air bend, just as Aang, who wasn't very confrontational, had trouble learning to earth bend.

They tried to show that this guy was a philosopher, maybe that's where he got the pointers.

[Freehold DM]

Tels wrote:

I think if Korra were playing an RPG of her life, she'd claim she's got a dick GM.

Your flames clear the path of brush, allowing you to pass. As you approach, suddenly the brush rapidly regenerates and blocks the path again.

Your spirit bending ability seems to calm down the vines. They begin retreating and the building is left cleared! Congratulations!

Then! Suddenly the vines return, spreading even further than they were before and knock over a building full of people! What do you do

I punch the GM!

Wait, what? *SLAM* OW! WHAT THE HELL!!

I liked Tenzin's horrible persuasiveness, though that does make me wonder if the only reason why he's on the Republic City Council is he's the eldest Airbender.

** spoiler omitted **

** spoiler omitted **...

Re: Tenzin, I think they came out and said it. He's also directly related to not two but THREE heroes of the previous age.

RE: Earth Queen, they have shown in the past that Earth Kingdom villains have a yen for creating conquering armies.

[Bjørn Røyrvik]

The NPC wrote:

I wonder what that one guy does in the basement considering they don't have the internet, rpgs, or tv.

Uses a lot of tissues 'because of the dust'.

I feel for Tenzin. As shown last season he has such great responsibilities. He feels the pressure of being the last airbending master, the chief of the air nomad culture (yet they seem quite settled for nomads), trying to teach a headstrong avatar, being a statesman for RC, being a father, trying to be his father. It's amazing he hasn't cracked yet, but it does mean he is too fixed in his ways and on his goals. All this adds up to the fact that he has failed to learn the lesson of Republic City - bending isn't tied to culture any more.
He's blinded by immense relief and hope for the future and can't really comprehend that others don't see airbending in the same light as he. Can't they see how awesome airbending is? Aren't they interested in the ancient, rare culture? Can't they understand that airbending is a sacred and spiritual art? Don't they want to be a part of something special? How can they not see just how amazing and important this is?

I think Tenzin will have to learn the lesson he tried to tell Korra - change can be painful.

[LazarX]

Tels wrote:

LazarX wrote:

Despite what Tenzin may believe, being spiritually inclined and mastering AirBending aren't tied to each other.

They are tied together, hence the reason why Korra had such trouble with air bending in season 1. She was not very spiritual and had a difficult time learning to air bend, just as Aang, who wasn't very confrontational, had trouble learning to earth bend.

There world is full of people who are manifesting air-bending powers who have NO connection to Air Nomad culture. Just as there are Fire, Water, and Earth benders who have no connection to the other Three Nations featured during the original show.

Korra had problems with Air Bending for the same reason that Fire was the last bending art that Aang did. Air had preceded Water just as Fire preceded Air. If the Avatar cycle had not ended with Korra the Avatar after her would have Water as the "problem element".

[Bjørn Røyrvik]

LazarX wrote:

Korra had problems with Air Bending for the same reason that Fire was the last bending art that Aang did. Air had preceded Water just as Fire preceded Air. If the Avatar cycle had not ended with Korra the Avatar after her would have Water as the "problem element".

Has this been stated anywhere or is it just an assumption?

[Tels]

LazarX wrote:

Tels wrote:

LazarX wrote:

Despite what Tenzin may believe, being spiritually inclined and mastering AirBending aren't tied to each other.

They are tied together, hence the reason why Korra had such trouble with air bending in season 1. She was not very spiritual and had a difficult time learning to air bend, just as Aang, who wasn't very confrontational, had trouble learning to earth bend.

There world is full of people who are manifesting air-bending powers who have NO connection to Air Nomad culture. Just as there are Fire, Water, and Earth benders who have no connection to the other Three Nations featured during the original show.

Korra had problems with Air Bending for the same reason that Fire was the last bending art that Aang did. Air had preceded Water just as Fire preceded Air. If the Avatar cycle had not ended with Korra the Avatar after her would have Water as the "problem element".

No, Aang's problem element wasn't fire, it was Earth. Earth requires the bender to be headstrong and confrontational, something Aang was not. He preferred to redirect and defuse situations.

Aang originally had no problem with fire bending, see the Episode in which he meets Jong-Jong and burns Katara. He vowed to never fire bend again. Later on he came to be at more peace with himself and with fire bending, and found he no longer had the required conflict of feelings needed to fire bend, just as Zuko did.

The series has specifically stated that in order to air bend, one had to be somewhat in touch with their spiritual side. Not necessarily Air Bending culture, just more spiritual.

Up until Amon took away Korra's bending, she'd never been in touch with her spiritual side. Korra is brash, headstrong, and confrontational, exactly opposite of what air bending requires to work.

This is not me making this up, in the episode 'Dirty Works' I believe it was, it's even mentioned that Air Nomad Avatars have always had issue with Earth Bending because the mind set needed to earth bend has always been contrary to air nomad teachings.

[Grey Lensman]

Tels wrote:

This is not me making this up, in the episode 'Dirty Works' I believe it was, it's even mentioned that Air Nomad Avatars have always had issue with Earth Bending because the mind set needed to earth bend has always been contrary to air nomad teachings.

The typical thing is the Avatar having trouble with the opposite element to what they were born into. Aang had trouble with earthbending, Roku had trouble with Waterbending, and I believe Kuruk had trouble firebending. Korra having trouble with air instead of fire is a bit of an anomaly, but makes sense considering what she is like.

[Kalshane]

Grey Lensman wrote:

The typical thing is the Avatar having trouble with the opposite element to what they were born into. Aang had trouble with earthbending, Roku had trouble with Waterbending, and I believe Kuruk had trouble firebending. Korra having trouble with air instead of fire is a bit of an anomaly, but makes sense considering what she is like.

Yeah, Fire Bending matches Korra's personality (and she goes to Fire Bending an awful lot in battle, considering she's naturally a Water Bender. While I haven't actually counted how much she uses each element, Fire seems to be her default element. Whereas Aang, even after he mastered all four, still defaulted to Air.) so it makes sense she never had issues learning it, despite the usual Avatar problem of mastering their native element's opposite.

[Kalshane]

I really enjoyed the new episodes this week. Some nice action sequences with the two prison breaks (and the badass showdown between Kya and Zahir), and some interesting looks at the Bei Fong family and what happened with Toph after A:TLA (and the fact she's now apparently wandering the world like Caine from Kung Fu.)

Also, I thought it was surprising for a kid's cartoon to just throw out there that Toph had kids by two different men and apparently never married either of them (since Su and Lin never knew their respective fathers.) especially considering Cartoon Network (I know, different network) required two characters to have been married off-screen between seasons in order for them to have a child together on Young Justice.

[magnuskn]

Um, yeah... if they will go with an armless waterbender, having children out of wedlock from different fathers doesn't seem so far-fetched.

[Kalshane]

I don't know. People get funny about cultural mores, especially when it comes to kid's shows.

[Tels]

I think it's really kind of... odd, how skilled Zaheer has become with airbending in such a short time. I really wish the writers would stop handwaiving his skill level. The fact that he's able to take on powerful and skilled benders like Kya or Zuko without, really, getting touched really irks me.

[Snorri Nosebiter]

who's to say it's a short time? We only just found out about his existance, he could have developped the ability to airbend months ago, and have been training rigorously in between visits from his guards, up untill the time where he was confident enough to chance an attempted breakout.

Most likely it was after the harmonic convergence, but I don't recall hearing how much time has passed since then, and more and more airbenders are crawling out of the woodworks, he could have been the first...

[Tels]

Snorri Nosebiter wrote:

who's to say it's a short time? We only just found out about his existance, he could have developped the ability to airbend months ago, and have been training rigorously in between visits from his guards, up untill the time where he was confident enough to chance an attempted breakout.

Most likely it was after the harmonic convergence, but I don't recall hearing how much time has passed since then, and more and more airbenders are crawling out of the woodworks, he could have been the first...

In the first episode, it mentions that two weeks had passed since Harmonic Convergence. Now it's unknown how much time has passed since the first episode, but I'm going to hazard a guess at 'not a lot'. So, in roughly the span of a month, he's learned enough about air bending to be able to defeat people that have been bending their whole lives, one of which we know to be a very capable warrior and bender (Zuko) and the other can be safely assumed to be very skilled considering her parents (Kya).

[Snorri Nosebiter]

True, but Zuko is a senior citizen, and Kya isn't a warrior as far as I know...

compare those facts to the fact they're fighting a guy that was a threat even before he had bending... I'm willing to believe it ;)

[Tels]

Snorri Nosebiter wrote:

True, but Zuko is a senior citizen, and Kya isn't a warrior as far as I know...

compare those facts to the fact they're fighting a guy that was a threat even before he had bending... I'm willing to believe it ;)

You know who else was senior citizen?

King Bumi (this guy is over 100 years old by the way)
Uncle Iroh
Jeong-Jeong the Deserter
Master Piandao
Master Pakku

You know what these guys did? Overthrew the Comet-enhanced Firebenders holding the Earth Kingdom capital of Ba Sing Se.

Being old in the Avatar world doesn't make you weak, it makes you a bad ass.

[Edit] GET OFF MY LAWN!!!

[Snorri Nosebiter]

nope, it doesn't. those are exeptions to the rule. or are all elderly people in the avatar world superpowered?

[Tels]

Snorri Nosebiter wrote:

nope, it doesn't. those are exeptions to the rule. or are all elderly people in the avatar world superpowered?

The only old bender I know of that wasn't really powerful was the leader of the raiders that killed Katara's mother. But even then, he was up against Katara, so we don't know how powerful he really was.

But we're talking about a firebender powerful enough to tame a dragon. Zuko isn't going to be some push over like the White Lotus guys were, and Kya was trained by Katara, her mother, one of the most powerful and skilled water benders alive.

When you start listing off all of the old people that are benders in the Avatar series that we've seen, you'll find that, more often than naught, they are very powerful and very skilled.

Old age or not, neither Zuko nor Kya should have been so easily defeated, especially by a guy who'd only learned to airbend a couple of weeks previous!

If he had been using his martial arts to defeat them like the Chi Blockers, like Ty-Lee, like Jet, that'd be one thing. But he wasn't, he fought using his air bending and won. In fact, he even over-powered Kya in a straight air bending vs water bending clash and the knocked her out.

That is the part that is really annoying the hell out of me. These a noted benders who are very powerful, but this guy has become as powerful, or more so, in the span of a few weeks, then they have in their entire lifetime.

[DM_aka_Dudemeister]

I suspect he's been practicing the Air-Bending forms for years before he actually gained the power to Airbend.

[Kalshane]

DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:

I suspect he's been practicing the Air-Bending forms for years before he actually gained the power to Airbend.

That's been my assumption. He's come across very much as an Airbender otaku prior to actually gaining the power.

I don't remember Zahir going toe-to-toe with Zuko in the prison break. He was busy fighting Korra's father. (Of course, the fact that the Earth Bender guy whose name I can't recall was able to take out Zuko is a little surprising.)

And I thought Kya smacked Zahir around pretty good. It felt like the fight was pretty evenly matched, but he managed to dodge her big attack and hit her with his at the end.

And really, other than Zuko (and likely Kya, since she was raised by and alongside Airbenders) no one in the current age has any experience fighting an Airbender. So a lot of Zahir's bending prowess is he's throwing out attacks most of his opponents have never seen.

[Grey Lensman]

Kalshane wrote:

(Of course, the fact that the Earth Bender guy whose name I can't recall was able to take out Zuko is a little surprising.)

Not really, sadly. I don't think Zuko has ever won a single fight that was actually important against a quality opponent.

[Kalshane]

Grey Lensman wrote:

Kalshane wrote:

(Of course, the fact that the Earth Bender guy whose name I can't recall was able to take out Zuko is a little surprising.)

Not really, sadly. I don't think Zuko has ever won a single fight that was actually important against a quality opponent.

Bwah! I never really thought about it that way, but yeah, he does get his butt kicked a lot in A:TLA.

[Orthos]

Yeah, I gotta give Zahir the benefit of the doubt. I'm guessing he wasn't a bender at all before, and yet he was considered one of the most dangerous criminals in the world, on par with the three benders in his party. So he's probably already an accomplished martial artist - if he'd been dangerous because of a particular weapon he'd used, I imagine his first priority after breaking out would have been getting himself armed, THEN going to free his pals, but since he didn't do that I think it's safe to assume he's used to beating people senseless with his bare hands and feet.

If his combat style already was particularly suited to airbending, and then suddenly he gains that power, he'd be a near-instant natural. Combine that with him getting in all the practice time he can in between traveling from prison to prison, I could see him putting himself back on top of the heap pretty fast.

[Tels]

I bet at some point Zaheer and Tenzin get into an Airbending fight and Tenzin loses. Because, you know, a solid month of practice > a lifetime of mastery.

[Orthos]

I would find it more believable if they would emphasize Zahir fighting dirty and using cheap tricks, and getting the upper hand that way, but yeah I'd have to agree you're probably right that it'll happen and it'll happen that way.

[Kalshane]

Tels wrote:

I bet at some point Zaheer and Tenzin get into an Airbending fight and Tenzin loses. Because, you know, a solid month of practice > a lifetime of mastery.

If that happens, without some serious extenuating circumstances, I'd be very disappointed.

That being said, it sounds like it took all the surviving members of the Aang Gang, plus members of the second generation (Tenzin, Tonraq, Unalaq, Lin) to originally take these guys down the first time around, when Zahir was a non-bender. So they're serious business.

[Orthos]

I really, really enjoyed the two Lin-focused episodes (The Metal Clan and Old Wounds). That was a lot of fun and a lot of welcome exposition and elaboration on Toph's family.

[Dragon78]

I really like that this season is showing a lot of character's family and/or backstory.

[LazarX]

Tels wrote:

I bet at some point Zaheer and Tenzin get into an Airbending fight and Tenzin loses. Because, you know, a solid month of practice > a lifetime of mastery.

Tenzin is also not really much of a fighter. In most cases this doesn't matter because he DOES AirBend very well. But against a real fighter who is a natural talent at bending as well, he's going to be used as a floor mop.

[LazarX]

Grey Lensman wrote:

Kalshane wrote:

(Of course, the fact that the Earth Bender guy whose name I can't recall was able to take out Zuko is a little surprising.)

Not really, sadly. I don't think Zuko has ever won a single fight that was actually important against a quality opponent.

He won his first fight against Katara. He outlasted her during a full moon and took her out when the sun rose. He would have won against Azula in their Agni Kai, save that he chose to save Katara's life instead, when his sister decided to cheat.

[Kalshane]

I actually enjoyed this week's episode quite a bit. The fight between the Red Lotus and everyone else was fantastic.

ION, starting next week, Korra will no longer be broadcast via TV, moving to digital distribution only.

New episodes will show up on Nick.com at noon on Friday.

The creators have said this should not have any effect on the production of season 4, which has already been turned over to Studio Mir for animation.

Also, episodes 1-8 of this season should be available on Nick.com as of now.

[Tels]

Kalshane wrote:

I actually enjoyed this week's episode quite a bit. The fight between the Red Lotus and everyone else was fantastic.

ION, starting next week, Korra will no longer be broadcast via TV, moving to digital distribution only.

New episodes will show up on Nick.com at noon on Friday.

The creators have said this should not have any effect on the production of season 4, which has already been turned over to Studio Mir for animation.

Also, episodes 1-8 of this season should be available on Nick.com as of now.

I wonder if they're going to have a 'counter point' theme for Korra series as a whole? Dark Avatar/Light Avatar, White Lotus/Red Lotus etc.

[Sharoth]

What tha?!? It is not going to be on TV?!?! WTF are they thinking?

[Snorri Nosebiter]

tv ratings tell us nothing about how popular the show really is, since people stream more often than not, so we'll just provide it for free through streaming, get our money from advertising on those sites, and acualy have credible numbers for a change?

[Tels]

Sharoth wrote:

What tha?!? It is not going to be on TV?!?! WTF are they thinking?

They're taking it off TV because, while the viewings have been good (when you count DVR), ultimately, online views of Korra have blown the TV out of the water. Korra has had a stronger following on Nick.com than it does on Nick TV.

The other reason is that Avatar, and Korra especially, has always been hard to fit into their programming block because it's a very different show than anything else Nick tends to broadcast. This way, they don't have to worry about fitting it into the wrong programming block, and people will still get to watch it.

Nick is trying to switch over to a hybrid cable/digital company, so they both run online, and offline. So you might see them start releasing shows entirely online, while still advertising it on their normal channel.

[Sharoth]

oh well. I guess I will wait until it comes out on DVD to finish watching it.

[Tels]

Are you unable to stream it? If so, that's unfortunate. I think the reason they're doing it with Korra is because they know that Korra performs so well online, that any flare ups and backlash the results from their 'flagship' should be able to be weathered by the loyalty of the shows fans.

[Freehold DM]

Indeed, Sharoth- I am the only person I know of who watches Korra who watches it on TV as opposed to online. I didn't watch more than half of the last season on TV.

[Sharoth]

~shrugs~ I CAN watch it online, but I PREFER to watch it on my 40" TV. I am also annoyed by the fact that they did this mid-season. If they had said that season 4 would have been online, then I would not have minded as much. But Mid-Season?!?! WTF?!?

Besides, I am on the computer all day at work. I have a TV for a reason.