Goblin Squad Member
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Ninja harvesting could be economically dangerous, but I'm not sure it will ever thrive at the levels we're worrying about.
Combat PVP has the instinctive rush of swinging or shooting a weapon at your enemies and seeing them fall down. It's exciting and tense, even at the snail's pace that EVE combat sometimes moves. It's an unpredictable contest against a human opponent.
Economic PVP could be effective, but it probably won't be satisfying. It's unlikely to get anyone pumped up and cheering or cursing over voice comms. It's repetitive and very predictable. The only suspense will be wondering whether anyone on the defensive side is willing to risk the reputation loss to drive you away.
I predict that people who want to fight will be bored to tears by gathering. I think they'll be willing to pay to declare feuds and wars, because combat will simply be more satisfying than ninja harvesting.
Edit: I totally support calling this activity "ninja harvesting". Great naming idea, Bluddwolf.
You mean you don't allow people to ruin others' game experience for free? Shame!
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@Karlbob
The people "scorching the earth" probably won't be groups just out to pvp for fun, they'll be rival groups vying for every small advantage they can. Will people be willing to strip-mine dozens of hexes around a settlement to gain an advantage? You better believe it.
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Goblin Squad Member
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To stop the unaffiliated gatherers, how about limiting them to how much they can harvest in claimed hexes. If a gatherer needs bulk or a lot of materials he is likely to belong to a settlement, company or something, otherwise why does he need all that material? Belonging to one of those should get you the ability to use PvP to protect your resources. That limited can be lifted next to the starting settlements to allow gatherers to start working on their skills before heading out into the world.
Scarlette, just because the character is unaffiliated, doesn't mean the player is.
Does it really matter if the player is affiliated? Rep isn't based on the player, its based on the character and their in game actions.
Bottom line is, you as the settlement controlling the hex, either losing an amount of resources to these Ninja Harvesters or you turn your settlement into NBSI. That will open your settlement up to more corruption and more PVP.
Some of us have played in alpha now, so think about the answers to these questions:
1. Can anyone really control who is harvesting nodes in their lands?
Given the proper tools we can try.
2. How many players do you really think will be willing to take rep losses, now that they realize the extreme cost of low reputation?
Not many, which is why I said limited the amount the unaffiliated gatherer can harvest. That way he can't do enough harvesting to cause a problem.
3. Every harvester, even if criminal flagged, may be bait just waiting for an attack. How long do you figure before the NBSI turns a settlement's controlled lands into a PVP playground?
If gatherers must be affiliated to do enough harvesting to cause your settlement a problem, and they come and do that, it is an act of sabotage and your settlement should declare a feud/war.
Ninja Harvesting is Risk and Consequence free banditry, just in a new form. Even if you limit the amount, that will have a timer on it and Ninja Harvesters can rotate out. Besides, I don't think GW has the money, time or wants to devote the effort to stopping this emergent game play that their own system creates.
And once again, if they are affiliated you can take action. If they aren't, then they can't harvest enough to worry about.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I never said anything about the reputation system not working.
I have actually come up with several scenarios now, depending on how nodes respawn, that could actually lead to stunting the server economy.
Will it cause less materials to enter the server economy, if it is not so utterly boring that some people do it regularly?
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Goblin Squad Member
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This is the latest "bogeyman" and argument that the reputation system won't work?
Ok.
If by not working you mean, working so well that it leads to other behaviors that are equally damaging but using the fear of the reputation loss as a shield to protect your behaviors, then you are both correct and incorrect.
You are incorrect in you dismissive suggestion that this is just a bogeyman argument. It will be very much real. Players will often prove their ingenuity in breaking a system, finding loopholes in a system or using a system in a different way than anticipated.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Why do we assume that some simple tweaks would not be coded in (if this became an issue unsolvable with current tools) to make combating it possible?
It is not bad to bring it up. I just don't think that it will be all that easy. I have a little faith in the GW team.
How much do feuds cost?
How easy is it to earn Influence?
What factions will cover some of these locusts?
If they are unaffiliated in anything, will they be able to get tier 2 and 3 resources? Will they just separate the dirt from the gold for me?
If you are running an unaffiliated toon, how much influence are you racking up for a Company?
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think the issue Bringslite, is that until we fully see the system functioning no balances will be implemented. I have faith in the GW team though, I think everyone knows this of me.
Here is what I see...
I want to preface this by saying that all of these are hypothetical situations, and that GW may have measures in place to counter act them.
If I wanted to stunt the growth of my enemy, I would get 10-15 people with throw away accounts/characters. It would take about 4 days to get them all to level 7 Gatherers (which is the fastest way possible) and then I would just go around their area, strip mining everything, locking them out of everything but T2 materials. Essentially, they would have to have a minimum of 8 to get those materials, which means their gatherers would have to refocus to 8, and even then they might need higher since some of the nodes would be filled with higher level materials. It might actually lock them out of using the Hex for awhile.
Now, all I would have to do, is bring along 1 low reputation character, I put all of the resources on one character, remove all his gear, and kill him. Each time I kill him, it destroys 25% of what ever he has. Meaning we don't even have to leave to take the resources back, just put it on a dummy and kill him over and over again destroying everything we got, no supplies lines necessary.
If you want to screw the whole server, take the plan a few steps further, wait a few more days, maybe a week getting higher level gatherer, systematically move from Crater Hex to Crater Hex farming and destroying everything you find, strip mining all 9 Hexes.
Depending on how GW does loot tables for nodes, and if said nodes are stuck after respawning and have to be farmed before respawning with more resources....you could have just screwed the whole server out of any T2 Crater Resources until they were able to start farming T3 stuff.
Anyways, you all can see my line of thinking and exploitation of the current systems in place. Eventually were going to have to some systems in place to make sure that strip mining is a less viable tactic.
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Goblin Squad Member
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| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
I do think we need to take a deep breath. GW isn't CCP - if the reputation turns out to be flawed in some fashion (be it the way it is described here, or another way) I believe that GW will fix it, and it won't take multiple years for it to happen.
I have faith.
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Goblin Squad Member
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To stop the unaffiliated gatherers, how about limiting them to how much they can harvest in claimed hexes. If a gatherer needs bulk or a lot of materials he is likely to belong to a settlement, company or something, otherwise why does he need all that material? Belonging to one of those should get you the ability to use PvP to protect your resources. That limited can be lifted next to the starting settlements to allow gatherers to start working on their skills before heading out into the world.Scarlette, just because the character is unaffiliated, doesn't mean the player is.Does it really matter if the player is affiliated? Rep isn't based on the player, its based on the character and their in game actions.
Bottom line is, you as the settlement controlling the hex, either losing an amount of resources to these Ninja Harvesters or you turn your settlement into NBSI. That will open your settlement up to more corruption and more PVP.
Some of us have played in alpha now, so think about the answers to these questions:
1. Can anyone really control who is harvesting nodes in their lands?
Given the proper tools we can try.
2. How many players do you really think will be willing to take rep losses, now that they realize the extreme cost of low reputation?Not many, which is why I said limited the amount the unaffiliated gatherer can harvest. That way he can't do enough harvesting to cause a problem.
3. Every harvester, even if criminal flagged, may be bait just waiting for an attack. How long do you figure before the NBSI turns a settlement's controlled lands into a PVP playground?If gatherers must be affiliated to do enough harvesting to cause your settlement a problem, and they come and do that, it is an act of sabotage and your settlement should declare a feud/war.
Ninja...
Simple solution to your idea.
Be affiliated, until a feud is declared, then become unaffiliated. You waste their DI and you risk nothing.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If we suspend or ban you, we're not going to issue you a refund.Would you like to elaborate on the conversation at all?
Lisa didn't say "give you a refund", she said "stop taking your money".
ie, GW would lose your subscription fee in the future, but not give back whatever you paid to get access in the first place.
Also, it was a statement of intent and indicator of how seriously they take griefing, not a formal contract or terms of service.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Is the 10,000 the number of resources units of that type, or is it a "factor" such as a regeneration multiplier or some other thing that is not the actual quantity. Gaskon's post called it a factor, so it could be quantity, or anything else.
The impression I got was that the "rating" was just a comparative number. It could just as easily have been 1% to 100%.
I do not think the rating directly correlates to a specific amount of resources.
I think over-harvesting a hex will take weeks, not hours.
Remember, if it takes 10,000 harvests to completely strip a hex, that doesn't mean there are 10,000 nodes just sitting in the hex waiting for you to take them.
You still have to wait for the respawn of the nodes.
If the big bad evil groups want to spend hundreds of hours of man-time grinding out resource nodes, instead of declaring war and actually participating in PVP, that's fine with me. They essentially just turned themselves into carebear gatherers, and we already had plenty of those and weren't worried they would break the game somehow.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think that much of the conversation, and the considerations behind them, are inadequately factoring the influence factional conflict will have.
Alignment is not the only behavioral tool that will be in the game. Hellknights are one faction but there are several others, including the Pathfinders.
Alignment is only one of the matrices that will influence rep gains and losses.
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Goblin Squad Member
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3. Every harvester, even if criminal flagged, may be bait just waiting for an attack. How long do you figure before the NBSI turns a settlement's controlled lands into a PVP playground?
I don't quite follow. If the harvesters are unaffilated, how many players could you end up in combat with? (ie what is the max "party size"?) Five? You don't get to say "me and THIS army" if you are unaffilated.
Giving ninja harvesters the criminal flag lets defenders pick the fight if they want to, and might even (?) have npc guards respond. If you see "getting the criminal flag cheaply so you can bait defenders" as an advantage, we see it differently. Settlements can obviously legalize it if they prefer.
Blue blocking requires collision detection between non-hostiles. Is that in the game? (if so, blocking building access will be more annoying than mushroom guarding). Also, blue blocking isn't very successful at protecting from ranged attacks in a tab-target game.
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Goblin Squad Member
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3. Every harvester, even if criminal flagged, may be bait just waiting for an attack. How long do you figure before the NBSI turns a settlement's controlled lands into a PVP playground?
I don't quite follow. If the harvesters are unaffilated, how many players could you end up in combat with? (ie what is the max "party size"?) Five? You don't get to say "me and THIS army" if you are unaffilated.
Giving ninja harvesters the criminal flag lets defenders pick the fight if they want to, and might even (?) have npc guards respond. If you see "getting the criminal flag cheaply so you can bait defenders" as an advantage, we see it differently. Settlements can obviously legalize it if they prefer.
Blue blocking requires collision detection between non-hostiles. Is that in the game? (if so, blocking building access will be more annoying than mushroom guarding). Also, blue blocking isn't very successful at protecting from ranged attacks in a tab-target game.
Each harvester has 4-5 PVP "guards" in the group. Doesnt mean you see them either. So sure, defenders can pick the fight, doesnt mean the fight they pick will be what they thought.
NPC guards... Meh
If they legalize it, then they lose the hex of resources and its a victory anyway.
Ranged attacks will still make you hostile with someone.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think the issue Bringslite, is that until we fully see the system functioning no balances will be implemented. I have faith in the GW team though, I think everyone knows this of me.
Here is what I see...
I want to preface this by saying that all of these are hypothetical situations, and that GW may have measures in place to counter act them.
If I wanted to stunt the growth of my enemy, I would get 10-15 people with throw away accounts/characters. It would take about 4 days to get them all to level 7 Gatherers (which is the fastest way possible) and then I would just go around their area, strip mining everything, locking them out of everything but T2 materials. Essentially, they would have to have a minimum of 8 to get those materials, which means their gatherers would have to refocus to 8, and even then they might need higher since some of the nodes would be filled with higher level materials. It might actually lock them out of using the Hex for awhile.
Now, all I would have to do, is bring along 1 low reputation character, I put all of the resources on one character, remove all his gear, and kill him. Each time I kill him, it destroys 25% of what ever he has. Meaning we don't even have to leave to take the resources back, just put it on a dummy and kill him over and over again destroying everything we got, no supplies lines necessary.
If you want to screw the whole server, take the plan a few steps further, wait a few more days, maybe a week getting higher level gatherer, systematically move from Crater Hex to Crater Hex farming and destroying everything you find, strip mining all 9 Hexes.
Depending on how GW does loot tables for nodes, and if said nodes are stuck after respawning and have to be farmed before respawning with more resources....you could have just screwed the whole server out of any T2 Crater Resources until they were able to start farming T3 stuff.
Anyways, you all can see my line of thinking and exploitation of the current systems in place. Eventually were going to have to some systems in place to make sure that strip mining is a less viable tactic.
The problem with that tactic is that it would not work. 25% destroyed and 75% on the ground with his corpse.
If the game is not going to do this, I would like to know as to me the real consequences to PVP is losing my stuff. Your equipment is time spent in game grinding for it (unless your a successful PVPer)and if I cannot lose my stuff or take others junk... then the game completely loses interest for me.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If encumbrance is active, I wonder how many characters trips it will take to remove the entire amount of a resource available in a hex? If I remember correctly, as a node becomes depleted, the amount you gather will get heavier. I think encumbrance will put severe practical limits to "ninja gathering".
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Goblin Squad Member
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If encumbrance is active, I wonder how many characters trips it will take to remove the entire amount of a resource available in a hex? If I remember correctly, as a node becomes depleted, the amount you gather will get heavier. I think encumbrance will put severe practical limits to "ninja gathering".
Yes sir it will.
My only thought on that is, if you do not really care about the resources in the first place. If your only point of it is to hurt your enemy, you will still accomplish that.
The other thought is to have people who are crafters do the hauling back to friendly territory. Have done this while harvesting all the high end resources from an enemy territory, hoping that they would try to stop us.
I am sure we have some people that would happily haul the loot back to town since it would take as long to gather it themselves in the first place.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If we suspend or ban you, we're not going to issue you a refund.Would you like to elaborate on the conversation at all?Lisa didn't say "give you a refund", she said "stop taking your money".
ie, GW would lose your subscription fee in the future, but not give back whatever you paid to get access in the first place.
Also, it was a statement of intent and indicator of how seriously they take griefing, not a formal contract or terms of service.
No she said give you your money back, but they ninja edited or deleted that post. Apparently Ryan and Lisa were not on the same page.
Maybe you didn't see her original post, but Ryan's was a retraction of it.
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Goblin Squad Member
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On the issue of encumbrance helping to limit ninja harvesting, not exclusively so. All harvesters will have the same limitations and so that does nothing to prevent it.
I saw another post that brought up group size. I can foresee Ninja Harvesting operations being conducted by quite large groups. I would suggest 24+ characters. Then there could be a number of "runners" to transport harvested resources to the nearest settlement, excluding the settlement exploited (obviously).
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Goblin Squad Member
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Then, I want to know... If I have a character that is going to be Low Rep its entire career (after its trained up), is it going to be banned? Since things are being changed around, I want to know from Ryan, Lisa, or Bonny what their intention here is.
If so then I will get rid of my alt account and let someone else get in with a Pioneer account.
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Goblin Squad Member
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| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
If we suspend or ban you, we're not going to issue you a refund.Would you like to elaborate on the conversation at all?
I believe threads like this are the ones Goblinworks like best. We're not just throwing ideas or wishlists at them; we're discussing player and character actions, their causes, their alternatives, their outcomes, and we're interacting peacefully in the discussion.
This is where we're Crowdforging, without paying attention to the fact that's what we're doing. Goblinworks gold: they stay away and let us talk.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If we suspend or ban you, we're not going to issue you a refund.Would you like to elaborate on the conversation at all?I believe threads like this are the ones Goblinworks like best. We're not throw ideas at them, we're discussing player and character actions, their causes, their alternatives, their outcomes, and we're interacting peacefully in the discussion.
This is where we're Crowdforging, without paying attention to the fact that's what we're doing. Goblinworks gold: they stay away and let us talk.
I agree mostly.
My question involves more of what they already stated they will be doing. I am looking for a confirmation from them on what that intent is. It seems we have two opinions on what was said at Gencon, and then again here in this thread that had a ninja edit.
I will go with, you do not get your money back. But what about the rest of it? Ryan has said several times, that people will play low rep and they will be fine with it. Now it seems that if you play low rep, you are going to get banned.
Which is it?
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Goblin Squad Member
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Well, the most productive conversations are not monologues, but participants contribute when they have content to share. I don't think input by GW would quell productive communal discussion I think it would enhance productive discussion so long as it was contributory rather than censure.
I should hope that in our crowdforging we aren't left without benefit of foresight, and only they have a lamp in the darkness. If we stray we should be given at least clues, a length of twine on the dungeon floor, or at least drips of wax and tallow fallen from their candles to follow.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Each time I kill him, it destroys 25% of what ever he has.If your intent is to destroy the materials, wouldn't it make more sense to just delete them from inventory? Is that functionality not available?
I think he was saying that the other 75% would show up in town and that it would be worth losing the 25% to save the travel time.
I certainly hope it drops on the ground when you are killed.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If we suspend or ban you, we're not going to issue you a refund.Would you like to elaborate on the conversation at all?Lisa didn't say "give you a refund", she said "stop taking your money".
ie, GW would lose your subscription fee in the future, but not give back whatever you paid to get access in the first place.
Also, it was a statement of intent and indicator of how seriously they take griefing, not a formal contract or terms of service.
No she said give you your money back, but they ninja edited or deleted that post. Apparently Ryan and Lisa were not on the same page.
Maybe you didn't see her original post, but Ryan's was a retraction of it.
The business about a refund did not come from a post that Lisa wrote. Here's the original statement:
On that Note - Lisa Stevens doubled down on low reputation characters, doing what low reputation characters do. The initial consequence of participating in non consensual pvp is the reputation dump. If you continue to that thing and become an issue for the less pvp enthused players they will refund your money and ban you from the game.
I suspect -Aet- Charlie was paraphrasing, not transcribing every word of Lisa's statement. Gaskon was also in the room.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The idea can't be that low rep play will generally lead to banning; there's a bunch of design we already know about in which low rep characters are intended content for other systems (Enforcer, Champion, Bounty Hunter, LE-as-PKKs, etc). If low-rep is made actually unplayable then none of those other systems will have anything to do.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Each time I kill him, it destroys 25% of what ever he has.If your intent is to destroy the materials, wouldn't it make more sense to just delete them from inventory? Is that functionality not available?I think he was saying that the other 75% would show up in town and that it would be worth losing the 25% to save the travel time.
I certainly hope it drops on the ground when you are killed.
Materials can't be threaded, so I agree they'd end up on the ground. Cheatle talked about killing the carrier repeatedly, so I assumed he was planning on destroying the materials through a series of diminishing-effect loops. If that's the goal, as a step in crashing the world's economy, why not do it all at once?
I believe if GW saw this happening, we'd magically see more nodes popping up than could be ninja-destroyed--even at the cost of flooding the economy temporarily--and the ban-hammer would come down with the wrath of several gods.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Cheatle, you keep talking about T2 nodes. Are you sure the system works that way?
I never got high enough in any Gathering skills to get T2 resources, but Decius did. As I recall, he just started getting T2 resources out of the same resource nodes he used to only get T1 resources out of, while continuing to get T1 resources out of them as well. I was under the impression any resource node could be harvested by anyone, but what you got out of it would be determined by your Skill and the drop tables for the hex.
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Goblin Squad Member
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When you gather, you get the Achievements immediately when the window pops up, not when you move the resources into your inventory. I expect the system reduces the rating at the same time. If you don't take the resources out of the node, they probably just disappear when the node despawns.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If we suspend or ban you, we're not going to issue you a refund.Would you like to elaborate on the conversation at all?I believe threads like this are the ones Goblinworks like best. We're not just throwing ideas or wishlists at them; we're discussing player and character actions, their causes, their alternatives, their outcomes, and we're interacting peacefully in the discussion.
This is where we're Crowdforging, without paying attention to the fact that's what we're doing. Goblinworks gold: they stay away and let us talk.
Yup, yup, yup. Crowdforging has never needed to be a formal system of voting on alternatives or making proposals in a dedicated app. We've been actively crowdforging PFO for years now. It's been a lot of fun, too.
Edit: Nothing against Ideascale. It's crowdforging, too. I'm just agreeing that conversations like this one are every bit as much crowdforging as voting to include gnomes before halflings, or proposing a plan on Ideascale.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The idea can't be that low rep play will generally lead to banning; there's a bunch of design we already know about in which low rep characters are intended content for other systems (Enforcer, Champion, Bounty Hunter, LE-as-PKKs, etc). If low-rep is made actually unplayable then none of those other systems will have anything to do.
Last I looked, most of those systems are off the table as of now. Even SAD that got those rolling is not in the forseeable future.
Although, I can see each of those still being usable with low rep being unplayable.
As of right now, low rep is unplayable unless you invest a couple years in the game before going low rep. At 100x speed, rep repair still takes 20+ hours after only killing two characters. I am gong to assume that in EE they will remove 100x speed. So what took 20 hours will take 83 days. That is unplayable, especially for only a couple character kills.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The idea can't be that low rep play will generally lead to banning; there's a bunch of design we already know about in which low rep characters are intended content for other systems (Enforcer, Champion, Bounty Hunter, LE-as-PKKs, etc). If low-rep is made actually unplayable then none of those other systems will have anything to do.Last I looked, most of those systems are off the table as of now. Even SAD that got those rolling is not in the forseeable future.
Although, I can see each of those still being usable with low rep being unplayable.
As of right now, low rep is unplayable unless you invest a couple years in the game before going low rep. At 100x speed, rep repair still takes 20+ hours after only killing two characters. I am gong to assume that in EE they will remove 100x speed. So what took 20 hours will take 83 days. That is unplayable, especially for only a couple character kills.
I'm willing to bet that the final rate of reputation repair will fall somewhere in between the rates we've seen so far.
Fine tuning between "free for all murder simulator" and "non-sanctioned PVP gets you banned" will probably be a work in progress, too. The message does seem a little vague right now, though.
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Goblin Squad Member
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What makes low rep unplayable now is the fact that Thornkeep guards will attack you and trainers will reject you if you are low rep. That dynamic changes if you have a player-run settlement to go home to that is willing to tolerate your charming foibles.
We haven't been told where the tradeoffs are between training caps and settlement rep thresholds, but I suspect you'll be able to get at least up to the top of T1/start of T2 even with no threshold at all.
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Goblin Squad Member
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@ Xeen, Jazz
I meant a loop in destroying 25% by killing a person over and over, there is currently no way to destroy anything from your inventory in game.
@ Nihimon
I regularly encounter nodes that say "Your skill is not high enough to harvest this node" or something like that. Not sure what that means then? Also, Nihimon, if you completely harvest a node out of all T1 materials with low level gatherers, what happens to the nodes then?
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Goblin Squad Member
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The idea can't be that low rep play will generally lead to banning; there's a bunch of design we already know about in which low rep characters are intended content for other systems (Enforcer, Champion, Bounty Hunter, LE-as-PKKs, etc). If low-rep is made actually unplayable then none of those other systems will have anything to do.
There are many who will see that as "working as intended". They dobt look at PFO as being a game revolving around conflict. They see PFO as an opportunity to cooperate in building a peaceful settlement, and the only real conflict is controlling the escalation cycles.
Sure, they will say they want PvP (because they know the label they will get if they don't), but they never push back on any idea that severely limits PvP. Only two of us wre actually vocal about the problems involved with unintentional rep loss during the Adventures with Bonny debacle. That tells me they are mostly ok with the collateral damage if done innocents losing the ability to train for weeks, if it also means that the intentional low rep will suffer unplayable characters
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Goblin Squad Member
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Cheatle, you keep talking about T2 nodes. Are you sure the system works that way?
I never got high enough in any Gathering skills to get T2 resources, but Decius did. As I recall, he just started getting T2 resources out of the same resource nodes he used to only get T1 resources out of, while continuing to get T1 resources out of them as well. I was under the impression any resource node could be harvested by anyone, but what you got out of it would be determined by your Skill and the drop tables for the hex.
Nodes do not deplete based on what tier resources have been depleted. Of a T1 harvester depleted a node, it is inaccessible to everyone until it recovers. So even if you can extract T2 resources a T1 harvester can block you by depleting the node first.
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Goblin Squad Member
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| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
No she said give you your money back, but they ninja edited or deleted that post. Apparently Ryan and Lisa were not on the same page.
Maybe you didn't see her original post, but Ryan's was a retraction of it.
I did not see Lisa post in this thread.*EDIT: except about the attendance numbers.
What she said at the seminar was approximately, "If you keep griefing people we'll ban you and stop taking your money." That is not an exact quote, its a paraphrase. At the seminar, no one used the term "refund".
The statement was made in the context of spawn-camping newbies. That is the specific behavior Lisa mentioned as being ban-worthy.
This is not some new policy or change in how reputation or banning works.
I feel that GW has been sending a perfectly consistent message:
If you do things that make you low reputation, your character will be penalized by losing access to high end settlements and training.
If you do things that are considered by GW to be griefing, your account will be penalized by suspensions or banning.
Some of the things that are griefing may also make you low reputation, but the two categories are largely distinct.
There has been no change in GW's attitude that a low-reputation, non-griefing character will be playable and unbanned, they will just have to accept the various mechanical penalties imposed by their low-reputation status.
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Goblin Squad Member
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@ Nihimon
I regularly encounter nodes that say "Your skill is not high enough to harvest this node" or something like that. Not sure what that means then? Also, Nihimon, if you completely harvest a node out of all T1 materials with low level gatherers, what happens to the nodes then?
I have encountered that message in two situations:
1. I was still technically in a Settlement hex because I hadn't been fully handed off to the wilderness hex server yet. The hex type icon next to my mini-map showed the pyramid with the light at the top on a yellow background. If I moved further into the wilderness hex until that icon changed, then went back to the same resource node, I was able to harvest it.
2. The resource node was bugged. One of my friends on TS was asking why he couldn't harvest some mining nodes just outside of Sotterhill. I made a new char and ran out there with no skill because that didn't sound right. When I got there, I too was unable to harvest. However, when I ran further up into the mountains, I was able to harvest the mining nodes there with no problem. I logged in Nihimon to go get the "bugged" nodes, and got low-level T1 resources out of them.
Again, I'm not sure how they're supposed to work. I just had the impression that any node could be harvested by anyone, and that the resources in it would be determined when the harvesting was complete.