To start with, me and the group I DM have different expectations on how to play pathfinder. We all knew this when the campaign started and have a gentleman's agreement to each take a step towards the other's style, and see if it works out or crashes and burns.
Now they historically played that character death is permanent, or involves a literal Saving Private Ryan trip into the abyss. I want them to be comfortable using the raise dead mechanics once they start facing save or die spells, focused fire smart enemy tactics, assassination tactics and so forth.
To make them comfortable with raising I'm brainstorming a few ways to gently introduce the idea to them, ways that are once removed from the players so there are not strong meta or emotional responses (i.e. 'we already killed that villain, stupid raise dead', 'I died to a fluke double critical, I'll just roll a new character. Oh raise dead? Is that a pity move or a shoe in to save your plot? are you railroading this story?')
My ideas to desensitize the players to life after death:
- they meet a tribal war chief with a valkyrie bound to be his shieldbearer in battle and cast breath of life should he fall.
- a LG church leader they are amiable with begs them to rush to the old monastery and retrieve the body of a Paladin after his squire returned to town alone with his broken sword, riderless mount, and the tale of his death.
- after a blotched attempt to save the King's seer from assassination, they see him up and at the Kings side again. But the King needs them to perform an urgent mission because the seer will not be able to scry for him until he has recovered from the shock (level drain) of death.
Any more ideas to introduce the idea that death is no barrier to those with the will and the wealth, while avoiding anything with a personal attachment to the player that may agitate existing biases?
The Osirion supplement for Golarion has an order of Pharaoh's bodyguards whose membership requirements include having died (and been raised) in the Pharaoh's service.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
This is a shameless bump:
-A professional burglar was caught and executed by a zealous guard captain. The thieves guild decided he has many more years of useful service and has tasked you to recover his remains from the graveyard.
I think all of these work, you don't really need our help. Just make sure you drive home that this isn't something done willy nilly for everyone. Maybe they've got to not only retrieve the body, but track down the costly material component. Or maybe a stranger commissions them to acquire the 10,000g diamond, without stating the purpose, then he pulls out a body and shazam they're back!
Make sure to use the right lingo though, Raise Dead makes zombies, Resurrection brings back people. Don't want them to get mixed up and Raise Dead their fighter only to find they should've read the spell description, lol.
ANIMATE Dead makes zombies.
As someone who agrees death should be permanent, most of those ideas are a screaming reminder of why I think it should be that way.
I'd like to better understand your perspective Zhayne, will you elaborate?
What I would do is find a balance with them. Meet in the middle. Make raise dead and similar spells expensive enough that the party is going to have to pool in and sell off a few of the dead guys things to pay for it. Make reincarnate a bit more common, it's risky. Feels like it's not safe. Then on occasion, throw them a few bones.
The two I've used in my most recent game are the following:
Belt of Devil Dealing: Looks like a +4 belt of dwarvenkind, reads as one with a simple spellcraft check. Has a secondary effect. If you have been wearing the belt for at least 24 hours, and die, you are revived an hour later, but owe a specific devil a debt that he can call in at any time (ala geas)
Soul Spike: Doesn't raise the dead, but if you can jam it in the body of a recently dead companion within 1D4+1 rounds of their death, it pins the soul in their body enough so that they can be healed back up. If they do not receive said healing within an hour, they are dead as normal. Either way, the soul spike is done for and is now just a pointy piece of silver. Might have a permanent level for it.
They prefer to play in a world where death is permanent. You prefer to play in a world where death is overcome with reasonably accessible spells. Compromise and play in a world where death can be beat, but it always comes with a cost, a sacrifice or a gamble.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I'd suggest that you split the difference.
Have the kings popular heir die in a tragic accident and the king beg the party to travel to x great temple where a great miracle was said to have been performed and x hero was brought back from the dead.
When the party travels there the high priest agrees to come back with them and try... In the groups travels back to the king role play out the high priest explaining that such spells don't always work, but rather are dependent on the favor the Soul being raised had with the power the spell is being asked from.
Then have the priest fail in his raising of the prince.
Oh and I would make it a ritual of some type that could call on any great power (god demon lord, arch devil, great primal spirit, etc) rather then just another spell of x level.
Shows that such a thing is possible but sets the bar high and leaves it up to the characters to decide if they want to do the work needed to earn an entities favor for the spell.