Need Real Life Examples for Possible Paladin Code

[Terquem]

To dream the impossible dream
To fight the unbeatable foe
To bear with unbearable sorrow
To run where the brave dare not go

To right the unrightable wrong
To love pure and chaste from afar
To try when your arms are too weary
To reach the unreachable star

This is my quest
To follow that star
No matter how hopeless
No matter how far
To fight for the right without question or pause
To be willing to march into hell for a heavenly cause

And I know if I'll only be true to this glorious quest
That my heart will lie peaceful and calm when I'm laid to my rest

And the world will be better for this
That one man scorned and covered with scars
Still strove with his last ounce of courage

To Reach the Unreachable Star

[beej67]

Load up on guns, bring your friends
It's fun to lose and to pretend
She's over bored and self assured
Oh no, I know a dirty word
I'm worse at what I do best
And for this gift I feel blessed
Our little group has always been
And always will until the end
And I forget just why I taste
Oh yeah, I guess it makes me smile
I found it hard, it's hard to find
Oh well, whatever, never mind
With the lights out, it's less dangerous
Here we are now, entertain us
I feel stupid and contagious
Here we are now, entertain us
A mulatto
An albino
A mosquito
My libido
A denial !!

[Better_with_Bacon]

Terquem wrote:

Impossible Dream

That is one of my favorite pieces of music. And I really think the Man of La Mancha would make a great paladin. :D

Very Respectfully,
--Bacon

[Charlie Bell]

beej67 wrote:

...

wut

[CalebTGordan]

beej67 wrote:

Load up on guns, bring your friends

It's fun to lose and to pretend
She's over bored and self assured
Oh no, I know a dirty word
I'm worse at what I do best
And for this gift I feel blessed
Our little group has always been
And always will until the end
And I forget just why I taste
Oh yeah, I guess it makes me smile
I found it hard, it's hard to find
Oh well, whatever, never mind
With the lights out, it's less dangerous
Here we are now, entertain us
I feel stupid and contagious
Here we are now, entertain us
A mulatto
An albino
A mosquito
My libido
A denial !!

Is that the Muppet's version?

[The Shaman]

Nah, notice the distinct lack of the "mimimimi" line.

[Kryzbyn]

Some great stuff Here

I played a paladin like a Sikh. Worked out rather well.

[Chris Lambertz]

Removed a post and the replies. Please revisit the messageboard rules.

[CalebTGordan]

Mosaic, your post about jihad was very helpful and was something I wanted to include. It was deleted. Could you repost that? Of course we want to be respectful to the source but I feel you are able to do that.

[aboniks]

Ashtathlon wrote:

...the NCO creed will haunt my dreams until I die.

Seconded.

CalebTGordan wrote:

I am writing a guide that goes over how to set up, play, and challenge a paladin's code of conduct...

The following are not literal codes, per se, just some things that highlight values that particular deities might want their champions to aspire to, but that would seem abnormal if applied to the standard paladins "smash things real good in the name of an ersatz Jesus/Lucifer" trope.

The heroic code within The Iliad

Furusiyya code

The Sangha

Se Sok O Gye

Finally, if you're writing about how to build a code for an order, it's worth taking a look at the sort of qualities displayed by existing sub/cultures. The scale is different, obviously, but distilling some of the noteworthy traits of a whole people down into that of an order is good practice for making the same sort of scalar leap...distilling the portfolios and qualities of a deity down into a code for puny mortals to follow.

Without passing any judgements on who did this classifying, or the people that were classified, here's a good list of cultures to start with if you want to give it a shot: Tribes and groups designated as Martial Races by the British Crown

Any paladins ethical system likely covers martial and social aspects in roughly equal measure. Using real cultures to fill in the deity-specific social gaps in any code you're constructing is worth thinking about, if you want the pally to really reflect the god/s they follow, rather than being yet another rehash of the modern-interpretation-of-a-crusader.

I'll be interested to read your guide, when it's finished. Happy writing.

[beej67]

Charlie Bell wrote:

beej67 wrote:

...

wut

It's the creed of the Aromatic Halfling Spirit Paladin.

[Silent Saturn]

When in doubt, there's always the Golden Rule.

You might also look up Hammurabi's Code.

[Xanotos]

CalebTGordan wrote:

I am writing a guide that goes over how to set up, play, and challenge a paladin's code of conduct. One section of it will have real life codes that can be used to build custom ones for play.

What are some possible codes of conduct I can include in this guide?

Chivalry and Bushido are already going to be included. Nothing is too small or unusual to be considered, and fantasy codes are also welcome.

Please, do not dismiss other poster's suggestions or argue against them. Let me decide if something shouldn't be included. [/QUOTE ]

The militant religious fanaticism characteristic of Paladins almost inevitably implies a Utilitarian Calculus which favors the interests of their deity (as he or she understands them)above any others. That is why the most enjoyable Paladins are often those that push the boundaries of their code of conduct; making rash, quixotically insane decisions... all the time. When Paladins' code of conduct is implicated by a given situation, their reasoning should always reflect a comparison between 2 distinct values: 1) The value of promoting or preserving one or more of their deity's core interests (as defined by the deity's domains and interpreted by the player) and 2) The value of promoting or preserving one or more other interests that may or may not conflict with the deity (sometimes this includes other goals of that deity)(Ie, Respecting legitimate authority or stopping slavery). If a player is considering a possible strategy, in game, that is motivated by their code of conduct (or in conflict with it) it is important to have a coherent analysis of the competing values that avoids excessively sacrifing one of the deity's core principles for another. If your reasoning doesn't make sense or if it is offensive or even uninteresting to the GM, then you may have some alignment issues.

To avoid such problems, you should have an explanation that references the specific goals of your deity and emphasizes the superior value of one or more of your deities interests in comparison to others. The following basic formula can be used to support any proposed action:

1: This action promotes a certain core interest(s) of my deity.
2: The particular core interest(s) is/are more important to my deity than competitors because ...
3: Therefore: this action is consistent with my code of conduct.

If your duty to protect the weak supercedes your duty not to lie, then you can lie in order to protect the weak.

In order to correctly identify the most relevant and material conflict of interest at hand, any good Paladin must negotiate the tension between what he must do and what he must not. Day-to-day decision making always includes two types of moral constraints: prohibitions, and affirmative duties. Some of the paladins duties constrain his behavior by prohibiting certain acts: Ie, lying, disregarding legitimate authority, harming innocents, committing an evil act, etc.) Other duties entail the affirmative performance of good acts (ie, protecting the weak, fighting evil). Usually, potential conflict emerges when a Paladin considers committing a prohibited act that happens to fulfill one of his affirmative duties. (Ie, torturous interrogation of an evil enemy who has surrendered and is unarmed, Speaking half truths, littering when you are in a hurry to save lives) The best resolutions of these conflicts are those that reflect value systems that are consistent with the deity's goals, the party's goals, your goals, and most decisively, the GM's goals (preferably, to have fun and not be a a-hole).

In contemplating your Paladin's value system, it is helpful to consider that there are infinite possible opinions concerning which of a deity's values should predominate. Although the code of conduct lists the Paladins duties specifically, its wording is very broad. (Ie, "Good" "Evil") Making accurate comparisons between values in a paladins code of conduct can thus be almost as technically complex as making such judgments in reality. Simply put, no single value system is or ever was officially, universally recognized as correct in the real world. Therefore, there is no official authority concerning what is good or evil in the Pathfinder Universe, apart from the GM's discretion and the "most important rule." Sometimes we want to bring justice to the unclean in a way that weak-bellied comrades find "inhumane." Sometimes, that would be very fun for everyone involved. Thats when you remind them that a Deity's core values can sometimes be interpreted in ways that compel its followers to compromise some of the its values in favor of others. (Ie, the crusades, suicide bombers, and many soldiers) There are abundant logically valid (if unsound) arguments that can and have been used to justify apparently evil and irrational acts by reference to religious duty. Paladins everywhere can usually have more fun by remembering that in Pathfinder (as in life) they can be anything from a christ figure to a pedantic psychopath without explicitly violating their religion's core values, as written.

[blahpers]

The Knights of Solamnia from the Dragonlance campaign setting abide by the Oath and the Measure. The writers took the idea of a paladin code and did two quite interesting things with it. (Note: Mixed in with this are some of my own evaluations based on a hazy memory and a couple of Google'd references).

The Measure took the idea of a strict paladin code and ran with it to its logical conclusion. It was a 11,000-page encyclopedia explicitly enumerating proper behaviors for a Knight in every conceivable situation that might come up, intending to be an exhaustive instruction manual for living up to the Solamnic Orders' standards in peace and wartime, diplomacy and conflict, formal and informal settings, and so on. The Measure was so rigid that eventually only a few dozen Knights existed, and while they were generally good in character, they utterly lacked the imagination to deal with specific situations in any manner not foreseen by the original writer of the Measure (Vinas Solamnus). After the settings's world-shattering event, the Measure was rewritten to be more flexible and realistic; it only mandated behavior in extreme situations and provided general suggestions of proper conduct in others.

The Oath was a simple statement: Est Sularus Oth Mithas ("My Honor is My Life"). It was arguably more important than the entirety of either Measure, in that a Knight that often disregarded the Measure but adhered to the Oath could still be considered to uphold the ideals of the Knighthood, while a Knight that strictly followed the Measure but forsook the Oath was but an empty shell.

While the Solamnic Knights weren't strictly paladins, they serve well as examples of how such a code can go wrong, right, and everything in between.

[Brad McDowell]

Hippocratic Oath on the healy side.

[Xanotos]

based on system for analyzing alignment issues that I have detailed above, I propose a general alignment type that allows a paladin to select a particular domain from his deity's list that is considered exclusively in determining the morallity of any act. It could be called "Radical"