I think I will move stunning fist to an option instead of a guarantee,, I mostly kept it to help balance out that until lvl 3 they still don't and bonus to hit with their preferred method of attackingTo steal a simple solution that's always been part of my houserules since before I was DMing, 'A monk's body is a masterwork weapon, and can be magically enhanced as such.' There's your bonus to hit. If you're concerned about dippers put it at level 2 (I wouldn't, but it is an option.)
Yeah I was thinking about that, as it stands you automatically get a bonus to attack and damage equal to 1/3rd your level, intended to free up cash for other things, who else agrees with Ryder?
i wanna plug this sucker into a champion of irori to see if it isn't too much. Also wouldn't it be cool if players had the choice of the twf line or the vital strike line?
i wanna plug this sucker into a champion of irori to see if it isn't too much. Also wouldn't it be cool if players had the choice of the twf line or the vital strike line?
oh? whats the Champion of Irori? and actually that might be kinda cool lol, stagger it like the ranger combat styles and have something like Open Palm be for TWF (fast multiple strikes and flurry) and closed fist for vital strike (one big blast in the chest, maybe stuff about moving around since you only do one attack?)
i wanna plug this sucker into a champion of irori to see if it isn't too much. Also wouldn't it be cool if players had the choice of the twf line or the vital strike line?oh? whats the Champion of Irori? and actually that might be kinda cool lol, stagger it like the ranger combat styles and have something like Open Palm be for TWF (fast multiple strikes and flurry) and closed fist for vital strike (one big blast in the chest, maybe stuff about moving around since you only do one attack?)
btw I agree with the others about armored in life is just way too much. I think using the normal ac increments (+1 for every 4 levels for a total of +5 at 20) is more than enough for the monk. especially since you allow enhancement bonuses on clothing. especially since then you could end up with +5 monks robes and start getting ridiculous.
btw I agree with the others about armored in life is just way too much. I think using the normal ac increments (+1 for every 4 levels for a total of +5 at 20) is more than enough for the monk. especially since you allow enhancement bonuses on clothing. especially since then you could end up with +5 monks robes and start getting ridiculous.
Hmmm...I kinda see your point, but at the same time it still feels like their AC would suffer, since normally +4 from Armored life at 1st level, then +1 clothing, and assuming a max of 18 dex would be a lvl one AC of 19 (10 + 1 cloth + 4 AIL + 4 dex), which honestly looks what a front line SHOULD have for being in melee. With how it is would their AC get higher faster then armor which it's meant to mostly replace? if so I can just reduce how fast it increases, or since it's meant to replace armor, I could just take out the line about clothing enhancment bonuses stacking, but allow actual 'enhancements' like benevolent to work with it, or maybe cap out the enhancement bonus clothes can add to it?
14 (4 +1 every even level) Ac + 5 enhancement = + 19 without any stat boosting items to boot and no dex limit and not factoring in spell-like buffs from the ki power class feature. Thats basically even with (before factoring in the other stuff I didn't add in )fighters armor training and plate armor, which should represent the high end of ac tanking not the standard. The monk is in turn granted better saves and resistances, evasion, a free action lowerable spell resistance, and fast healing, which are far more valuable at high levels anyway. A skirmisher type character like your monk doesn't need a massive ac anyway, they can land the heavy blows in earlier and typically will finish of weAker enemies. to look at this another way, rangers make perfectly reasonable frontliners, despite using medium armor.
edit:and 19 ac at level 1 is excellent not average.
how about +1 for every 3 levels? That's +6 at level 18, and let the clothing thing stand. more than reasonable with all the other buffs the monk can pick up for himself with ki powers. especially with no dex limits.
14 (4 +1 every even level) Ac + 5 enhancement = + 19 without any stat boosting items to boot and no dex limit and not factoring in spell-like buffs from the ki power class feature. Thats basically even with (before factoring in the other stuff I didn't add in )fighters armor training and plate armor, which should represent the high end of ac tanking not the standard. The monk is in turn granted better saves and resistances, evasion, a free action lowerable spell resistance, and fast healing, which are far more valuable at high levels anyway. A skirmisher type character like your monk doesn't need a massive ac anyway, they can land the heavy blows in earlier and typically will finish of weAker enemies. to look at this another way, rangers make perfectly reasonable frontliners, despite using medium armor.
edit:and 19 ac at level 1 is excellent not average.
Alright you have a point in that it's a bit too much with everything else, I suppose I was comparing it to our games which are pretty optimize heavy lol around 20 AC at lvl 1 has been standard for our fighter types (I don't know how but one of our rogues got a 20 AC at lvl 1 once, though he might have been using some 3.5 material for it), which aren't usually 'skirmish' types, since our rogue tends to just follow the fighter and use his pretty good AC as well to just sit in flanking position all day if possible, and since they don't really need to pay money for a good weapon it would free up gold to enhance the clothing. Maybe cut it in half so it's +2 at the start and then increase it by 1 every three to start (so max of +8 at 19). and after testing if thats still to high just knock it all down a number
Lol, slowly but surely things are shaping up and coming together
ooh how about +4 and +1 every 4 levels the monk possesses. A respectable starting ac, even for strength focused monks, and it doesn't overscale in the long run (a +9 total at 20th, same as plate)
ooh how about +4 and +1 every 4 levels the monk possesses. A respectable starting ac, even for strength focused monks, and it doesn't overscale in the long run (a +9 total at 20th, same as plate)
Aha the elegant solution shows again. this is why I post things on here lol, for some reason a simple solution eludes me
I try
Allllright, now then, about that TWF or Vital Strike line...who else likes that idea and how do you think we could add it?
totally bumping for interest.
This isn't really a complaint as such, but you've sort of made the monk overwhelmingly powerful in combat by giving it this kind of swiss army knife of abilities. In general that's fine, I'd always rather buff players to bring them up to the level of the rest of the group than nerf them down to it.
There is one game-breaker I'm noticing, though: Feathered step. It's not at all unreasonable in its final form for a level 15/17 ability, and you're giving the most powerful parts of it to the Monk at level 4, which is going to mean they're dominating the battlefield without even trying until 10 or so.
My recommendations would be:
1. Swap the basic and improved abilities. Water-walking is significantly less powerful than casually wandering over a castle wall in a single move action, assumedly whilst whistling a jaunty tune. Remember that water is primarily a natural hazard but barriers are intentional, constructed hazards.
2. Tie the distance you can feather-step in a round to something that gradually scales. Easiest is your basic bonus move (not counting ki power), so at level 4 you can ignore water/falling for 3 squares, at 8 you can ignore water/falling/vertical motion for 5 squares, etc. So you end up in the same place at the end, but you don't own the map from absurdly low levels.
3. Make "ignore difficult terrain for a move action" part of feathered step a ki power. Again, this is absurdly powerful and needs some sort of limit. Since it's blatantly supernatural spending a magic resource is appropriate.
4. On the other end, pimp that stuff out at 15 when the casters are getting truly out of hand. Add a third level of scaling for the ability at level 15, making it apply to full instead of just bonus movement, include ki movement, and not require a wall for the slow-fall effect. Honestly, shove something else interesting on there, like being able to run five feet above the terrain to provide more options.
5. Invincibility, even as limited as "can always get away" is bad. Make it so that if someone prepares an action to hit a monk during movement (or lands an attack of opportunity) there is a chance or guarantee that they can't feather-step. Basically, a thoughtful enemy should have some recourse against anything (beyond I guess forcing the monk to carry armor or a medium load somehow) a player can do, just to differentiate intelligent enemies from animals and so on.
This isn't really a complaint as such, but you've sort of made the monk overwhelmingly powerful in combat by giving it this kind of swiss army knife of abilities. In general that's fine, I'd always rather buff players to bring them up to the level of the rest of the group than nerf them down to it.
There is one game-breaker I'm noticing, though: Feathered step. It's not at all unreasonable in its final form for a level 15/17 ability, and you're giving the most powerful parts of it to the Monk at level 4, which is going to mean they're dominating the battlefield without even trying until 10 or so.
My recommendations would be:
1. Swap the basic and improved abilities. Water-walking is significantly less powerful than casually wandering over a castle wall in a single move action, assumedly whilst whistling a jaunty tune. Remember that water is primarily a natural hazard but barriers are intentional, constructed hazards.
2. Tie the distance you can feather-step in a round to something that gradually scales. Easiest is your basic bonus move (not counting ki power), so at level 4 you can ignore water/falling for 3 squares, at 8 you can ignore water/falling/vertical motion for 5 squares, etc. So you end up in the same place at the end, but you don't own the map from absurdly low levels.
3. Make "ignore difficult terrain for a move action" part of feathered step a ki power. Again, this is absurdly powerful and needs some sort of limit. Since it's blatantly supernatural spending a magic resource is appropriate.
4. On the other end, pimp that stuff out at 15 when the casters are getting truly out of hand. Add a third level of scaling for the ability at level 15, making it apply to full instead of just bonus movement, include ki movement, and not require a wall for the slow-fall effect. Honestly, shove something else interesting on there, like being able to run five feet above the terrain to provide more options.
5. Invincibility, even as limited as "can always get away" is bad. Make it so...
Feather step is the thing that's 'game breaking'?...I'm not really sure how to reply to this at all, but I'll do my best.
1: How is going up a wall at all powerful? a regular fighter would just get a grappling hook...or as Ryder said- wizard, just...wizard.
2: As Ryder said, it scales off a monks movement speed as something like that should, and the monk is the ONLY class to get more bonus speed then 10, so they rightfully should own the map at all levels, or be equal to a barbarian in ability to do so at level 1.
3: I'd honestly like to know why this is 'absurdly powerful' when normal abilities to ignore difficult terrain are simple filler abilities and or very cheap, and it IS using a magic resource, your a MONK.
4: umm...15 as in level 10 plus 5? what kind of class waits till level 15 to do something just 'interesting, occasionally useful'. I kinda agree with the no wall part, but Abundant step at 12 lets you Air walk for a round so you could use that for a similar effect while falling, and falling is capped at 20d6 anyway I thought, which at level 15 is hardly something to be afraid of.
5: I have to agree with Ryder, no offence meant at all deblin, but it really sounds like you want melee's to be weaker then they already are since a melee could have DR, fast healing, tons of AC, and be able to 2 shot monsters of it's CR, and they will never be invincible simply by casters existing.
Alright I've been looking over some things for separating the monks skills with their fists into Open palm (flurry in the form of Two Weapon fighting and maaaybe multiweapon at high levels) and Closed Fist (Vital strike like in a one big punch style), and I'm trying to separate the style options that each would have access too, the problem is that they seem really leaning toward the Vital strike line in what would fit best. From just looking at it this is how it looks in favor of each and then either-
TWF: Boar, Dragon, Monkey, Snake style
Vital: Elemental Fist (with Janni, efreeti, marid, and shaitan styles), Crane, Mantis, Tiger style
Any: Kirin, Kobold, Panther, Snapping Turtle, Archon
Any ideas on what else to give the flurry option more meat?
let me share some advice my editor at little red gave me. Don't unduly restrict options to encourage optimization, let optimization guide them instead. there is no reason to restrict the style to choice because their choice might be the option they use when NOT using their style. Something to consider.
1: Wizards have been casually floating over a castle wall for a level by level 4 (Levitate)
Up and down only, hard-capped at 20 feet/round, and essentially impossible to use for tactical motion unless your DM is specifically building a "levitate-fight" map in a cave with 5x5 holes drilled in the ceiling or something. And you have to expend a magical resource to get it.
Versus tactical movement in any direction where you can simply skip past any barrier with any kind of attached obstacle ("difficult terrain") without rolling anything. If you're looking for a spell equivalent, that's essentially fly with perfect maneuverability and infinite duration.
Even if you're saying that the relatively tame limit of needing to start and end more or less on the ground accounts for the infinite duration aspect, un-counterable (i.e. silent-still) fly requires caster level 9 and the expenditure of one of the more expensive magical resources at that level.
It's reasonable enough for its out-of-combat applications, but in combat terms you're handing a level 4 character an ability with a balance in the same tier as an at-will cloudkill. It needs to start slower and scale harder in the later levels.
let me share some advice my editor at little red gave me. Don't unduly restrict options to encourage optimization, let optimization guide them instead. there is no reason to restrict the style to choice because their choice might be the option they use when NOT using their style. Something to consider.
Well I'm not nessisarly wanting to needlessly restrict, I'm just thinking on which options he has now for styles and such are more supportive of each tactic lol, since the 'one big shot' actually ends up with more in it's favor tactically, I'm just curious about some other feats in a similar vein that support a flurry style.
In the end I'm thinking that giving one of these 'build' path options, might let people have more freedom of play if I do it right
It's reasonable enough for its out-of-combat applications, but in combat terms you're handing a level 4 character an ability with a balance in the same tier as an at-will cloudkill. It needs to start slower and scale harder in the later levels.
umm...what?...
not to sound rude, but thats such an inaccurate statement it's almost painful...at level 4 a melee character is fully expected to be able to either A: reach a target of equal challenge regardless of postion and be able to attack it, B: use a ranged option if available and A is impossible, or C: run away.
The monks movement speed at lvl 4 is 45ft or 90ft if doing nothing else, which while respectable is nothing compared to bows, half the list of spells, and in many cases, the height of some walls. Not to mention that your comparing an ability that while useful and practical, takes an action to do NOTHING but move into a position or run away, to a melee combatant the mere need to move is detrimental to them because the more used up actions the more they suffer, Monks are just very good at making the most out of that move action because unlike a fighter/rogue/bard/, they have very little incentive to actually invest in ranged combat since all their abilities assume their in your face and punching you...in a game where punching you (regardless of how hard) is considered the last viable option of assault.
Moving up a wall and generally being practical about an action is not "mustard gas on everyone and likely killing/horribly maiming half the encounter" at will, and Fly STILL has more uses (like going literally anywhere unrestricted instead of just "I can always pass a climb check"). Hell if you want to talk about movement being broken, oppose the Strix race, not something like this lol
So the idea is to add to each individual method? I thought you were restricting their bonus feat class feature. That in addition to being able to pick up style feats as bonus feats is overkill.
So the idea is to add to each individual method? I thought you were restricting their bonus feat class feature. That in addition to being able to pick up style feats as bonus feats is overkill.
Well I don't want to restrict as much as I think your thinking lol. the idea is that while I added flurry into the Ki pool, it might be cool to do either kind of monk, so intead at level 1 you could choose either a flurrying monk, or a one hit wonder monk, and Get two weapon fighting feat for free, or Vital strike for free (or if thats too strong maybe stunning fist) and they would upgrade in the tier so many levels, and each would have a selection of feats that you could choose as bonus feats without meeting prereqs other then needing to have the first feat in a chain, or you could choose from the 'any' pool which would include more then style feats. I'm not dead set on adding it, but I was thinking the choice of how you damage and play could be nice. As is they can just pick any style feats they want though of course, so it makes no 'real' difference, and was just a idea that got tossed around to open some options up for possible unique abilities in each one
That's actually one principle I'd like to see considered.
The old 3.5 monk (and his 3.0 precursor in a different way) had something unique/interesting about his flurry, it wasn't just 'two-weapon fighting' and could in theory be stacked with TWF if desired.
As a refresher course if you didn't play 3.0, the 3.0 monk got a -3 penalty attack every 3 BAB after the first. (So, for example, at +7 BAB a monk's Flurry routine went +7, +4, +1)
Obviously on a 3/4ths BAB chassis that wasn't all that great, but something similar could be interesting on a full BAB monk revision. (And of course a flurrying monk who wished to dual-wield would have the option to do so by taking the feat[s].)
Alternatively, 3.5's flurry which was essentially rapid-shot for monk weapons with declining penalties and eventually an extra attack was pretty distinct as well. (I've also seen houserules which allowed a 'flurry' as a standard action, without the iteratives.)
Hmm, that could be really interesting actually, I was thinking originally the flurry style with the new idea would be about stacking the power of getting out more attacks (like Boar, dragon, and monkey styles,) and maybe chaining that with combat maneuvers if you wanted, While the other would be a more skirmishing "move in to combat- BIG HIT- move out" by stacking vital strike with things like Elemental fist, Tiger style, and Stunning fist
One thing that occurs to me, you should not be calling Armored in Life an Armor Bonus. A quick reading of that section implies Armor Bonus, when in truth it's an Insight Bonus (which normally apply to Touch Attacks.)
Also, Armor Bonus and Insight bonuses naturally stack, so if you clean the wording up properly you don't need the special clause about stacking enhancement bonuses from armor onto it.
(In fact, I would probably go so far as to permit monks to wear Light Armor that has 0 Armor Check Penalty [for example, a Haramaki or Armored Kilt, but not both combined because that would be Medium Armor), but that's just me.)
Alright how would you word it more properly?
Harmony of Body and Mind (Ex): When unencumbered, the monk gains an Insight Bonus to his AC and CMD. This bonus starts at 4 points and increases by 1 point for every 4 levels of Monk.
This bonus to AC applies even against touch attacks or when the monk is flat-footed. He loses these bonuses when he is immobilized, when he is affected by an Armor Check Penalty, when he wears medium or heavy armor, or when he carries a medium or heavy load.
Something like this. If you want to keep monks 100% unarmored, adjust accordingly.
Hmm, I can see this is a bit more concise lol, though honestly with how it is I'm wary of letting them have armor (other then enhanced cloth) mostly due to it not being hard to get some pretty beastly armor at mid level when you don't have to pay for a weapon lol
What's the best armor they could get with no ACP? Mithral Kikko Armor for +5 Armor +5 max dex? Masterwork Studded Leather for +3 Armor +5 max dex before that's affordable?
It's a non-trivial amount, and I can see the concern some might have regarding allowing armor even with ACP prohibited. It's an easy change to make.
lol, I thought there were a couple enhancements that reduced ACP is why I was a little concerned, and an unarmed monk could probably afford armor more then most classes since they have don't have to buy/enhance a weapon. I'm not opposed to letting them buy armor, just unsure about the math on how much sooner they could afford it
lol, I thought there were a couple enhancements that reduced ACP is why I was a little concerned, and an unarmed monk could probably afford armor more then most classes since they have don't have to buy/enhance a weapon. I'm not opposed to letting them buy armor, just unsure about the math on how much sooner they could afford itWhat's the best armor they could get with no ACP? Mithral Kikko Armor for +5 Armor +5 max dex? Masterwork Studded Leather for +3 Armor +5 max dex before that's affordable?
It's a non-trivial amount, and I can see the concern some might have regarding allowing armor even with ACP prohibited. It's an easy change to make.
That's incorrect. Unarmed Monks have to purchase an Amulet of Mighty Fists, which costs twice as much as a magical weapon. An unarmored Monk has to purchase Bracers of Armor, which also costs more than normal armor. For example, +5 studded leather (a +8 armor increase) costs 25,000 gp and some change, while a +8 bracers costs 64,000 gp. +5 full-plate costs 26,650 gp, I believe, and gives a +14 AC increase, while Bracers cop out at +8 and still costs well over twice the price of the +5 full plate.
This monk doesn't need to purchase the aomf at all, with 1/3 level as a bonus to hit and damage and bypassing adamantine at 16th level. Mighty fists are just gravy now.
This monk doesn't need to purchase the aomf at all, with 1/3 level as a bonus to hit and damage and bypassing adamantine at 16th level. Mighty fists are just gravy now.
also naoki is allowing enhancement bonuses on clothes which, when combined with the automated ac bonus, equal +5 full plate with no dex limit at a fraction of the cost. Then there's the ki powers, which don't cost material components or require a minimum ability score to use, which reduces MAD and allows him to easily use ac boosting spells of a caster of his monk level -1.
This monk doesn't need to purchase the aomf at all, with 1/3 level as a bonus to hit and damage and bypassing adamantine at 16th level. Mighty fists are just gravy now.also naoki is allowing enhancement bonuses on clothes which, when combined with the automated ac bonus, equal +5 full plate with no dex limit at a fraction of the cost. Then there's the ki powers, which don't cost material components or require a minimum ability score to use, which reduces MAD and allows him to easily use ac boosting spells of a caster of his monk level -1.
And thus why I'm not sure about letting them have Light armor lol
The problem is that the Monk can take a level in a class like fighter, gain all armor and shield proficiencies, then run around using armor.
The problem is that the Monk can take a level in a class like fighter, gain all armor and shield proficiencies, then run around using armor.
oh of course they can, if they don't mind losing their armored in life bonuses, the MONK has to be proficient and the armor give 0 ACP, the CHARACTER can have whatever proficiency they want but it won't stack with Armored in Life
If that needs more clarification, not to hard to fix
The problem is that the Monk can take a level in a class like fighter, gain all armor and shield proficiencies, then run around using armor.oh of course they can, if they don't mind losing their armored in life bonuses, the MONK has to be proficient and the armor give 0 ACP, the CHARACTER can have whatever proficiency they want but it won't stack with Armored in Life
If that needs more clarification, not to hard to fix
You need to be aware of some methods of reducing ACP.
For example, Masterwork reduces ACP by 1.
Armor Training (from 3 levels of Fighter) reduces ACP by 1 (more if you keep with Fighter).
Mithral Armor reduces the ACP by 3.
Celestial Chain/Celestial Plate reduces the ACP by 3.
The Comfort magic armor ability reduces ACP by 1.
So a 3rd level Fighter/X level Monk can wear a Mithral Breatplate since it has an ACP of 0. Alternatively, he could wear +1 Mithral Field Plate of Comfort since it has an ACP of 0. Later on, he can get Mithral Celestial Full Plate of Comfort if he so chooses.
The problem is that the Monk can take a level in a class like fighter, gain all armor and shield proficiencies, then run around using armor.oh of course they can, if they don't mind losing their armored in life bonuses, the MONK has to be proficient and the armor give 0 ACP, the CHARACTER can have whatever proficiency they want but it won't stack with Armored in Life
If that needs more clarification, not to hard to fix
You need to be aware of some methods of reducing ACP.
For example, Masterwork reduces ACP by 1.
Armor Training (from 3 levels of Fighter) reduces ACP by 1 (more if you keep with Fighter).
Mithral Armor reduces the ACP by 3.
Celestial Chain/Celestial Plate reduces the ACP by 3.
The Comfort magic armor ability reduces ACP by 1.So a 3rd level Fighter/X level Monk can wear a Mithral Breatplate since it has an ACP of 0. Alternatively, he could wear +1 Mithral Field Plate of Comfort since it has an ACP of 0. Later on, he can get Mithral Celestial Full Plate of Comfort if he so chooses.
to be fair a 3rd level fighter ANYTHING can also do that, though it seems a little excessive, that puts you 3 levels into something thats mostly meant to go better as long haul class, and while Mithral on light is somewhat cheap on anything else it's not, and Celestial chain is nearly 23k (not to mention a +3 item in itself)and I've never even heard of the comfort enhancement honestly. So while I can understand adding a "doesn't care what proficiency you have" clause to it, it also seems a little restricting to prevent multiclassing entirely as the trade offs are pretty harsh for the monk, so maybe just reducing what you get if you happen to gain proficiency and use armor
Ok, whatever. I'm just going to withdraw from this thread entirely as you really don't seem to have an eye for what's 'balanced' at all.
couldn't we just just say that armored in life doesn't stack with the armor bonus of armor worn on the body slot? this monk doesn't at all need that as bonus for armor anyway, just the enhancement bonus, and possible armor enchantments.
Ok, whatever. I'm just going to withdraw from this thread entirely as you really don't seem to have an eye for what's 'balanced' at all.
I respect your opinion and thank you for your input regardless, hope you have more fun elsewhere on the forums, but feel free to check back in for the finished product, it might still be something you like in the end :)
couldn't we just just say that armored in life doesn't stack with the armor bonus of armor worn on the body slot? this monk doesn't at all need that as bonus for armor anyway, just the enhancement bonus, and possible armor enchantments.
Hmm, how about "if you gain proficiency with and wear armor that remains with a 0 Armor Check Penalty, you still cannot apply your armors base armor bonus to your AC, but you may add any enhancement bonus it may have."
couldn't we just just say that armored in life doesn't stack with the armor bonus of armor worn on the body slot? this monk doesn't at all need that as bonus for armor anyway, just the enhancement bonus, and possible armor enchantments.Hmm, how about "if you gain proficiency with and wear armor that remains with a 0 Armor Check Penalty, you still cannot apply your armors base armor bonus to your AC, but you may add any enhancement bonus it may have."
perfect, reduces bracers of armor dependency for those that don't allow enhancement bonuses applied to clothes.
Alright, armored in life updated with that new clause, and what do you think of this for it's capstone instead of the current one?
Perfect Self, Perfect Balance: Reaching 20th level the monk can choose to be counted as his original race, or an outsider for the purpose of spells or abilities, and may switch between them as a free action at any time, the monk also becomes truly attuned to one of the four elements that define the nature of balance in the world, or to the forces of good or evil.
The monk may Choose to gain either the Elemental-Infused Template (however monks who gain the template in this manner never suffer ability score penalties from it), or a Good monk may choose to gain the Half-Celestial template, or Evil monk may choose to gain the Half-Fiend Template."
Use the current wording for perfect body, since that still allows you to be affected by spells as if you were still humanoid, as long as its beneficial. Not sure about the templates yet.
Use the current wording for perfect body, since that still allows you to be affected by spells as if you were still humanoid, as long as its beneficial. Not sure about the templates yet.
Alright that works lol, and I just never liked the existing one, or a lot of capstones I guess since I figure your lvl 20 ability should give you something above and beyond anything you could likely buy or replicate in many other ways, with the normal Outsider or human bit cool but situational, the DR nice but easy to have gotten some other way, and being ressurectable is awesome, but you r lvl 20 and miracles are getting tossed around while at least 2 gods owe you favors for the last time you saved reality lol. I like permanent, intrinsic power stuff heh.