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I got a dumb Wild Shape question here. I'm sure it's been answered somewhere, but I didn't see it yet.
If a druid is wild shaping into a creature with multiple attacks, can she make those with her full attack action or does it depend on how many attacks she normally gets with her base attack bonus?
I thought you just gained the few qualities listed in Beast Shape, Elemental shape, etc. You might use the damage dice for those natural attacks, but I don't think it grants you more attacks per round. I could be wrong.
Yeah, that sounds about right, but for example, I have a 9th level druid in my group, so she's got 2 attacks/round. If she wild shapes into a dire bear can she get a bite and a claw attack or 2 claws using her regular attack bonuses which are modified by the size differences? That's what's kinda throwing me off a little.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/b/beast-shape
She definitely uses her BAB and her ability scores, modified by the spell "Large animal: If the form you take is that of a Large animal, you gain a +4 size bonus to your Strength, a -2 penalty to your Dexterity, and a +4 natural armor bonus."
I'd assume she uses the raw Damage*edit) dice of the creature, but assumptions are dangerous. Now I have to look up the rules for primary and secondary natural attacks.
Like anything that grants natural attacks, you can use all natural attacks you have.
Secondary natural attacks are at -5 unless you have Multiattack, which the base creature might have but the druid doesn't.
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Secondary natural attacks are at -5 unless you have Multiattack, which the base creature might have but the druid doesn't.
+1
So if you are a Monk/Druid with IUS for 2 attacks, and you take Large Octopus (1 bite and 8 tentacles) your sequence would be:
Base = +5
+5/+5 IUS
+0 Bite/+0 8x Tentacles
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As someone who plays a druid and has searched this forum for a while on druids, let me help explain wildshape rules.
Multi-attack is when the CREATURE has a secondary attack. It has absolutely nothing to do with the number of attacks the druid has in her base form.
If you look at various creatures, some of them make multiple attacks all at their base attack bonus (make sure the creature itself doesn't have the multi-attack feat under it's listed feats), while other creatures makes some attacks at their base attack bonus and some other attacks at a -5 penalty.
If you use your wildshape that transforms into a creature that has additional attacks but at the -5 penalty, you can offset that with the multi-attack feat. But if you transform into a creature that has all of it's attacks at it's base attack bonus, then you don't need multi-attack.
For example, if you look at the Dire Tiger creature, it has 3 attacks: 1 bite at +18 and 2 claws at +18. If you look at the feats for the Dire Tiger, multi-attack is not listed. Therefore, when you wildshape into a dire tiger, you will get all 3 attacks at whatever your attack bonus is, even if you normally would only get 1 attack. This is the main point of your question.
By comparison, if you look at the medium dinasaur Deinonychus, you will notice that it gets 4 attacks: 2 talons +5, bite +5 and foreclaws +0. If you don't have the multi-attack feat, then the foreclaws are at a -5 penalty. If you have multi-attack feat, then you could attack with your foreclaws without the penalty. It's that simple. Notice that Deinonychus also has POUNCE. If you are using the Beast Shape 1 ability to transform to this creature, then you do not get POUNCE ability. You must have access to Beast Shape 2 (usually Druid level 6 or 8, depending on your archetype) to access this ability.
Just be aware that when you look at any animal based creature you transform into to examine its feats. You don't get the feats when you transform, so if the creature has multi-attack and you don't, or if it has improved critical and you don't, then you must make the adjustment to the creature's attack/damage profile. Only the special abilities listed in the Beast Shape spell do you get, and you only get them at the level prescribed in Beast Form.
To be even more clear, let's say you are level 4 and transform into a medium flying animal with a fly speed of 60' (good). You are restricted to a fly speed of 30' (average) per Beast Shape 1. Let's say instead you wild shape into a creature with the POUNCE ability. Under Beast Shape 1, you cannot access the creature's POUNCE ability, you must have access to Beast Shape 2 to get that ability. To figure out which abilities are listed, just look at the different progressions for Beast Shape.
The limitation of course is that you must be familiar with the animal to transform into that animal. How that is handled is up to your DM. Some would say it's just a Knowledge Nature roll, others would say it depends on your back-story and/or campaign.
You should obviously have Natural Spell as a feat ASAP. You get to access the material and divine focus parts that meld into your form.
The two biggest disadvantages for wildshape is that you cannot activate any item that melds with you, so if you carry a wand or a magic item that can do something 3x a day or whatnot that is useless. The other is that you can't talk in common unless you take beastspeech feat, so that limits your roleplaying abilities somewhat (or makes the game session easier if you have a low charisma, depending upon your point of view).
Finally, the best forms to shift into early in the game are the dinosaur (4 attacks with 60' movement! just try running away!) and the dire tiger (charge and pounce every time and enter grapple because each attack has the grab ability - listed as it qualifies for Beast Shape 2) I listed above. When you get access to vital strike feat (requires BAB +6) and combine it with improved natural attacks and strong jaw, the best creature to transform into would be Megafauna, Arsinoitherium. It is only large size, so it fits into most dungeons (or transform into a Huge Hippo as it has similar stats but can also grab/swallow/trample, but it's huge so it doesn't fit indoors). It does 4d8 damage, but with improved natural attack (gore), that would be 6d8. With Strong Jaw spell (4th level spell, so it requires 7 levels of druid to get this and you probably want to save it for really tough boss fights), that would become 12d8. With Vital strike, that would then become 24d8. Yeah, 24d8 + strength bonus. Then of course should you have 1 level of barbarian, you could take the Furious Finish feat, just enter rage right before you attack to deal max damage on your roll, so you should be doing around 200 points of damage in one blow. Booyah.
Yes, you do somewhat top out in melee around level 10, but then you get more spells to cast as well, and the spells at higher level are really good for druid.
Hope that answers most of your wild shape questions. If not, feel free to message me.
Wow! Moondragon Starshadow, thanks a lot. That definitely answers my question above and beyond and also answers questions I didn't even know I had! That's definitely gonna help me clear things up with my druid player.
By comparison, if you look at the medium dinasaur Deinonychus, you will notice that it gets 4 attacks: 2 talons +5, bite +5 and foreclaws +0. If you don't have the multi-attack feat, then the foreclaws are at a -5 penalty. If you have multi-attack feat, then you could attack with your foreclaws without the penalty.
I believe this is incorrect. Having the multiattack feat would reduce the penalties from -5 to -2, not remove them entirely. They would still do 1/2 str damage as well, opposed to the other attacks doing full str (assumning no unarmed strikes or manufactured weapons)
Benefit: The creature's secondary attacks with natural weapons take only a –2 penalty.
Normal: Without this feat, the creature's secondary attacks with natural weapons take a –5 penalty.
Beopere is correct. Multiattack mitigates but does not eliminate the penalties for attacking with a secondary natural attack.