Need eight non-standard races

[Indagare]

I've tried the world-builder race thing, but I thought I might ask around. I don't want any of the standard races to exist, but I'm worried about it becoming a furry world (not that I'd mind a furry world, but I know it can turn some people off). I don't want races with more than 12 RP, but I am willing to create my own.

There are going to be no enemy races here. Nations may fight or have peace, but the dynamics are fairly close to real life ones. No race is intrinsically evil (even if they normally are considered to be). Some may undergo some cosmetic changes or even more drastic ones.

To give an example of something I might do:

Hobgoblins

Physical Description:

Hobgoblins stand around 6 or 7 feet tall, with powerful builds and tan skin that can darken to a red-brown mahogany color. Their hair tends to be some variety of brown with shades of red and, occasionally, blond mixed in. Their eyes are often copper, yellow, hazel, or brown. Though males and females tend to be roughly the same height, they are otherwise dimorphic: males tend to have well-trimmed beard and abundant body hair while females prefer long hair but are otherwise hairless. Both genders have ears that are long and pointed with males (and sometimes females) sporting lynx-like tufts on the tips.

Hobgoblin Racial Traits:

(10 RP)

+2 Constitution, +2 Wisdom, -2 Intelligence: Hobgoblins are hardy and possess uncommon sense, but they are not particularly intellectual. (Standard Traits: 0 RP)
Medium (0 RP): Hobgoblins are Medium creatures and have no bonuses or penalties due to their size.
Normal Speed (0 RP): Hobgoblins have a base speed of 30 ft.
Darkvision (2 RP): Hobgoblins can see in the dark up to 60 feet.
Skillful (4 RP): Hobgoblins gain Skill Focus in a skill of their choice as a bonus feat at 1st, 8th, and 16th level.
Villager (4 RP): Hobgoblins gain a racial bonus equal to half their character level to any one Craft or Profession skill, and once per day they may ignore an effect that would cause them to become fatigued or exhausted.
Languages (0 RP): Hobgoblins begin play speaking Common and Goblin.
Weapon Familiarity (0 RP): Hobgoblins treat any weapon with the word “hobgoblin” in it as a martial weapon.

Alternate Traits

Seafarer (4 RP):

Hobgoblins who work on or live by the sea gain a +2 racial bonus on Profession (sailor) and Swim checks, and these are always class skills for them. They can hold their breath twice as long as normal, and spellcasters gain a +4 racial bonus on concentration checks when attempting to cast spells underwater. This trait replaces villager.

Forager (4 RP):

Hobgoblins who live in tribes of hunter-gatherers gain a racial bonus equal to half their character level on Survival checks. They also gain a +4 racial bonus on Constitution checks and Fortitude saves to avoid fatigue and exhaustion, as well as any other ill effects from running, forced marches, starvation, thirst, and hot or cold environments. This trait replaces villager.

Survivalist (4 RP):

Hobgoblins who live in tough conditions gain a +2 on skill checks made with the Survival skill. They also gain a +5 racial bonus on Constitution checks to stabilize when dying and add half their character level to their Constitution score when determining the negative hit point total necessary to kill them. This trait replaces skillful.

Ferocity (4 RP):

Hobgoblins who live in areas of strife gain the following extraordinary ability: If their hit points fall below 0, but they are not yet dead, they can continue to fight. If they do, they are staggered, and loses 1 hit point each round. They still die when their hit points reach a negative amount equal to its Constitution score. This trait replaces skillful.

Thoughts? Suggestions on races?

[Avon Rekaes]

I would have given you a link to my Eberron-themed website where I put up some pathfinder-ized versions of some races, but they're in the 14-19 RP range, so a little more powerful than you're looking for.

But I will give you some suggestions on non-standard races:

Doppleganger-kin (Eberron calls them changelings, but that name is used for "hag-kin" in Pathfinder)
Dragonborn
Lizardfolk (small or medium)
Shifters (lycanthrope-descended humanoids without the curse, but animalistic traits)
Gnolls
Minotaurs (Medium sized)
Goblins
Bugbears
Kobolds
Orcs

and, if it doesn't completely ruin your day, Warforged (constructs)

For the Gnoll, Bugbear, and especially Minotaur, ignore their racial hit dice. Just make no-HD PC-playable versions of them from the ground up. If you need an "in world" flavor reason for the different types, the monster versions with racial hit dice could be seen as savages or prehistoric versions of these races. (Like a "dire gnoll" or something.)

[Ambrosia Slaad]

There's my skindancers in the bestiary of Wayfinder #7 (free).

[Artemis_Dreamer]

Hi,

If you're still looking, I designed two races a while back that you may be interested in.

Note that these races are very region-specific. The first is a cold-climate race, the second is an aquatic race. So, if you're looking for something a bit more "universal", please disregard the following.

Also note that their appearances are... Unique and distinctive to say the least.

Leavians (Chaotic Humanoids):
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2prxd?More-New-Races-Critique-Wanted#14

Vodni (Aquatic Humanoids):
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2pr4t?Custom-Race-Critique-Wanted#1

The fluff for them is within the threads, but I've pointed to the posts with the Racial Traits. Of course, all the fluff can be easily disregarded if it doesn't fit your setting.

Sorry for the lack of hyperlinks - I'm typing from my phone.

Hope I could help a bit.

[Indagare]

Avon Rekaes wrote:

I would have given you a link to my Eberron-themed website where I put up some pathfinder-ized versions of some races, but they're in the 14-19 RP range, so a little more powerful than you're looking for.

But I will give you some suggestions on non-standard races:

Doppleganger-kin (Eberron calls them changelings, but that name is used for "hag-kin" in Pathfinder)
Dragonborn
Lizardfolk (small or medium)
Shifters (lycanthrope-descended humanoids without the curse, but animalistic traits)
Gnolls
Minotaurs (Medium sized)
Goblins
Bugbears
Kobolds
Orcs

and, if it doesn't completely ruin your day, Warforged (constructs)

For the Gnoll, Bugbear, and especially Minotaur, ignore their racial hit dice. Just make no-HD PC-playable versions of them from the ground up. If you need an "in world" flavor reason for the different types, the monster versions with racial hit dice could be seen as savages or prehistoric versions of these races. (Like a "dire gnoll" or something.)

Oh, I have nothing against higher RP races, but there is the potential power creep when it gets into "well, this is just a bit more powerful" so I wanted to put a very definite cap even if it's arbitrary. The races you suggested are quite doable, and the suggestion you make for the lack of racial HD makes sense.

Ambrosia Slaad wrote:

There's my skindancers in the bestiary of Wayfinder #7 (free).

Okay, thanks!

Artemis_Dreamer wrote:

Hi,

If you're still looking, I designed two races a while back that you may be interested in.

Note that these races are very region-specific. The first is a cold-climate race, the second is an aquatic race. So, if you're looking for something a bit more "universal", please disregard the following.

Also note that their appearances are... Unique and distinctive to say the least.

Leavians (Chaotic Humanoids):
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2prxd?More-New-Races-Critique-Wanted#14

Vodni (Aquatic Humanoids):
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2pr4t?Custom-Race-Critique-Wanted#1

The fluff for them is within the threads, but I've pointed to the posts with the Racial Traits. Of course, all the fluff can be easily disregarded if it doesn't fit your setting.

Sorry for the lack of hyperlinks - I'm typing from my phone.

Hope I could help a bit.

They are certainly very interesting!

To be honest, I'm trying to find inspiration for a new world. I'm really tired of humans and their doppelgangers (no relation to the race of the same name). Unfortunately, if it doesn't look like a human (dwarves and halflings) with funny skin-color (gnomes), ear-shape (elves) or cooler dental work (orcs) it ends up looking fairly fugly (goblins) or like an anthropomorphic animal. I'm not opposed to using some of the almost-humans that tend to be in the 'enemy races' category having a staring (and heroic) role for a change, but I'm not sure if I should keep the looks of races like hobgoblins and goblins in Pathfinder or do something else.

Out of curiosity, did you get a chance to look at my take on hobgoblins? I'm not sure if anyone would be interested in playing a race like that...

[Avon Rekaes]

Indagare wrote:

Oh, I have nothing against higher RP races, but there is the potential power creep when it gets into "well, this is just a bit more powerful" so I wanted to put a very definite cap even if it's arbitrary.

oh, well in that case, Here's the link to my homebrewed Eberron races

I understand your worry about power creep. I very intentionally "crept" the power for all races up to the 14-19 range, because the Advanced Races Guide already divides races into three power groups, "standard" at 0-10 RP, "advanced" at 11-20 RP, and "monstrous" at 21-30 RP (and even gives an example of Drow Nobles that are off the scale at 41 RP).

The standard core races all fall into the "standard" category... except for Dwarves which clock in at 11 and are "advanced". This... bothered me, so I added abilities to all the core races to get them into the "advanced" range, targeting 16 RP and going less or more depending on how much flavor of the race I felt I had to maintain.

There is even a sidebar that tells you how different power levels for races impact the game. You're supposed to take the average RP value for all races in the party, and then see where they lie in the "standard/advanced/monstrous" spectrum. If the average is "advanced" then you treat the party as 1 level higher when determining what's challenging to them in an encounter, until they reach actual level 5, at which case their starting advantage is negligible.

I didn't feel like doing the math of averaging all the RP in the party, so I just made sure *every race available* was in the 11-20 range.

Oh, as for your Hobgoblins, I like them. Very balanced for a "standard" race. Although if you're okay with drawing the line at 12 Race Points, I would give them the "real" version of Weapon Familiarity for 1 more RP, and give them automatic proficiency with longswords (or other thematically appropriate weapon) and treating "hobgoblin" weapons as martial.

[Indagare]

Avon Rekaes wrote:

oh, well in that case, Here's the link to my homebrewed Eberron races

Thanks! I'll be looking at your races and see if they will work for me or not. At the least I'm sure they'll help inspire me, which is what I need right now.

Quote:

I understand your worry about power creep. I very intentionally "crept" the power for all races up to the 14-19 range, because the Advanced Races Guide already divides races into three power groups, "standard" at 0-10 RP, "advanced" at 11-20 RP, and "monstrous" at 21-30 RP (and even gives an example of Drow Nobles that are off the scale at 41 RP).

The standard core races all fall into the "standard" category... except for Dwarves which clock in at 11 and are "advanced". This... bothered me, so I added abilities to all the core races to get them into the "advanced" range, targeting 16 RP and going less or more depending on how much flavor of the race I felt I had to maintain.

I'm well-aware that the dwarves are a bit of outliers, so I think your decision makes a lot of sense. I may do the same thing here since I'm willing to go into the advanced territory even if it's mostly dipping my toes in...

Quote:

Oh, as for your Hobgoblins, I like them. Very balanced for a "standard" race. Although if you're okay with drawing the line at 12 Race Points, I would give them the "real" version of Weapon Familiarity for 1 more RP, and give them automatic proficiency with longswords (or other thematically appropriate weapon) and treating "hobgoblin" weapons as martial.

Thanks a lot! I really wasn't sure if the idea of hobgoblins as farmers would seem too strange or not (even though 'hobs' tend to be more domestic types in real legends and certainly their orderly society would lend itself well to agriculture). Since I'm willing to dip into the 'advanced' area, I could probably add the "real" version. I might actually do some weapon based on farming or fishing implements like flails and scythes or things like spears or similar...

Thanks again for all your help so far!

[Avon Rekaes]

Indagare wrote:

Thanks! I'll be looking at your races and see if they will work for me or not. At the least I'm sure they'll help inspire me, which is what I need right now.

Great :)

I should note that I made alternate-alternate versions of advanced humans, half-elves, and half-orcs for campaigns that don't use Eberron's Action Points. I liked giving Humans the niche of "awesome with Action Points" as their advanced traits, but in a game without Action Points, it makes no sense.

The non-Eberron advanced humans, half-elves, and half-orcs get +2 in TWO ability scores of their choice. I costed this at 4 RP, using the Static Bonus Feat and Flexible Bonus Feat racial traits to guesstimate that adding versatility doubles the cost of a racial trait. (So since the "Flexible" ability score trait grants +2 in two ability scores, but which ability scores are static for every member of the race, I doubled it's trait-cost from 2 to 4 to get the "Versatile Flexibility" racial score trait, to let every member choose where each of their +2s go into). Also note that they cannot double up and pick one ability score to get +4, it needs to be two different scores. This "Versatile Flexibility" replaces the Heroic racial trait for half-elves and half-orcs, and the Paragon racial trait for humans.

I then also changed the human's region-based weapon familiarity, since in a non-Eberron game, weapon familiarity based on Eberron regions also makes no sense. Replace it with "Versatile Weapon Training: Pick one weapon; if it is simple or martial you are automatically proficient with it; if it is exotic, you treat it as martial", which is basically a "Versatile Weapon Familiarity", which I costed at 2 RP.