Am I getting this right?
A goblin has a CR of 1/3 and XP of 135.
I have a party of 4 - 1st level adventurers
Their APL is 1 and I want an equal challenge rating.
Looking at the chart I see that CR 1 equates to 400 total XP so I would set 3 Goblins against them. (135x3=405)
Similarly if I wanted to put them up against Gnolls - Gnolls have a XP of 400 so they would have to face only one for a CR 1 encounter. Right?
If thats correct then what part does the individual CR of the monster play? It seems you are only using XP. (It seems pretty odd too that 4 player characters, even at 1st level, are considered the equivalent of 3 Goblins or just 1 Gnoll)
Also, do the XP amounts under "Individual XP" refer to that awarded to each party member based on the CR and their group size?
Sorry if this is really basic but I want to make sure Im getting it right.
The cr of the monster sets the value it has in xp and gives a common number for people to look at. You could say goblins are 135xp monsters instead of cr 1/3 but that is harder to remember and harder to keep track of. The CR number gives you are clear picture (when you get used to it) of how challenging a monster ought to be against a typical party. So I can say, that monster is CR 3, it by itself might be an average fight for a 3rd level party of 4, but a couple of them might be a good challenge for a 5th level party. I then use that basic picture as a starting point for adding up the xp.
So you dont need the CR number, it would work just fine with the xp values, but the number helps you eyeball it as you are setting up the encounter, or if you have to make one up on the fly and dont want to do xp math untill later.
Thanks, I kind of thought it was a redundant factor but I can see where it will be helpful. Im just a bit suprised how vulnerable low level characters are in relation to typical monsters.
3 x 1/3 = CR1 is easier than 3 x 135 = 405 = CR1
You can calculate with CR or with the EXP value. It should be the same.
Thanks, I kind of thought it was a redundant factor but I can see where it will be helpful. Im just a bit suprised how vulnerable low level characters are in relation to typical monsters.It's important to know what CR is really trying to do as well:
CR = APL encounters (like 3 goblins and a party of 4 level 1 characters) are meant to use up some party resources, but the PCs are meant to have the odds stacked in their favor - this facilitates a party being able to face down multiple encounters between times they need to rest and replenish their resources.
Basically, if it seems like a combat is "easy" unless you use a CR higher than the APL that means everything is working as it is intended to.
Yep, it's an easy way to get a rough idea of encounter appropriateness.
rgrove, you're not necessarily wrong that it's a little redundant, though. CR and XP interaction was a little more nuanced in 3.5 because XP to CR wasn't static like it is in PF. In PF, CR1 is worth 400 XP, regardless of just about anything else (excepting GM adjustments for relative difficulties, etc.). In 3.5, CR1 encounters gave out an amount of experience determined by the level of the party members, so it actually changed depending on who was involved in the encounter (a CR1 encounter gave out less XP to the level 2 PC than the level 1 PC). They streamlined things in PF and in so doing took out an aspect of the interaction between CR and XP. I think it's for the better, though. Certainly makes XP calculations much easier.
There are multiple ways to calculate the CR of multiple creatures, and adding their CR is not one of them.
You can add their XP and see what CR equivalent that XP is. Or you can follow the chart for 2 CR X creatures is CR X+2, etc.
Also note a CR of the party level is a pretty easy fight, especially if you have a point buy higher than 20. APL +1 or +22 is an interesting fight, but safe if they aren't too foolish. APL +3 is dangerous, and APL +4 is "epic", and can be difficult to balance depending on environment and monster count.
Beopere has great points, but is a bit off on the actual numbers according to the book.
Curses. I thought about getting the book out, but I was like nah I got this.
Am I getting this right?
A goblin has a CR of 1/3 and XP of 135.
I have a party of 4 - 1st level adventurers
Their APL is 1 and I want an equal challenge rating.
Looking at the chart I see that CR 1 equates to 400 total XP so I would set 3 Goblins against them. (135x3=405)
Similarly if I wanted to put them up against Gnolls - Gnolls have a XP of 400 so they would have to face only one for a CR 1 encounter. Right?
If thats correct then what part does the individual CR of the monster play? It seems you are only using XP. (It seems pretty odd too that 4 player characters, even at 1st level, are considered the equivalent of 3 Goblins or just 1 Gnoll)
Also, do the XP amounts under "Individual XP" refer to that awarded to each party member based on the CR and their group size?
Sorry if this is really basic but I want to make sure Im getting it right.
A gnoll can KO that 1st-level party's fighter or barbarian with a single lucky roll. Give it a greataxe instead of a spear and it could kill them with that roll. Seems pretty dangerous to me.