@Gancanagh, so is the nightmare not evil or black enough for you?
The Nightmare isn't a horse, just a creature with a horse form.
And there is too much D&D roots in the Nightmare, the Shadhavar is from Persian Myth and so gets my preference.
@Gancanagh, so is the nightmare not evil or black enough for you?The Nightmare isn't a horse, just a creature with a horse form.
And there is too much D&D roots in the Nightmare, the Shadhavar is from Persian Myth and so gets my preference.
fair enough, I've just always viewed it as the evil counterpart to unicorn. Different strokes for different folks.
The nightmare is probably based on the Mare/Mara from Germanic mythology/folklore. It has a hore form among others but is more like a creature from your nightmares and less horse.
So I see the Karkadann and the Shadhavar more as neutral and evil counterparts of the Unicorn cuz they both have the same horns as Unicorns.
Nightmare are just silly name monsters, like sea lions and tarentella spiders. Mythological nightmares, in the European sense, are actually night hags.
I can't see any reference to the Night Hag in the Wiki page of the Mara/Nightmare. They do have the nightmare-ride ability.
In my belief Night Hags are made up by D&D.
Probably because the designers of that game also wanted to make them a little more interesting from the gameplay perspective.You do know the statblocks for Cthulhu mythos entities in Call of Cthulhu (and Arkham Horror) aren't like that either, aside from a few exceptions?That's very true, if it weren't that way a lot of cthulhu mythos creatures would have a statblock only consisting of the line "You go insane and die."Phooka is a lot more accurate than ManitouThat's the thing though... they're ALL accurate as Pathfinder monsters.
Whether they're accurate representations of the original inspirational myths (who themselves are not always interested in being canonical with themselves) is an entirely different story. And since a Pathfinder Bestiary isn't intended to ever be an accurate and scholarly representation/report on real-world myths but instead a game resource INSPIRED by myths... it's unfair to say that they're inaccurate.
If we go by canon, Cthulhu's statblock includes a great weakness against boats. He lost to one before, after all.
Gancanagh, I think the Night Hag has some basis in folklore about nightmares, but does have the D&D flavor to it as you say.
The only Hag that really comes straight from folklore is the Annis Hag, which is called Black Annis in myths, the others (green, sea and night hags) are D&D products me thinks.
Maybe the Sea Hag has some roots in some old fairytail tho.
The only Hag that really comes straight from folklore is the Annis Hag, which is called Black Annis in myths, the others (green, sea and night hags) are D&D products me thinks.
Maybe the Sea Hag has some roots in some old fairytail tho.
I always assumed the Green Hag was based on Jenny Greenteeth and/or Peg Powler.
I always thought the Green Hag was just the all-around-kitchen-and-home-hags you see in most movies/stories but with a new name D&D gave them.
From the PRD about Green Hags:
Terrifying crones known to haunt foul swamps and tangled forests, green hags harbor an intense hatred for all beauty and purity. Making use of their varied deceptive abilities, these crones delight in murdering innocents, unhinging noble minds, and debasing the pure of heart. They are particularly fond of using disguise self to assume the forms of alluring young maidens and then seducing young men away from their lovers or families.
Emphasis is mine. So we have green skinned/haired hags who hang around swamps and lure young men from their families/lovers. Now admittedly the targets are different, as Jenny Greenteeth was a cautionary tale for kids, but we're still talking about a green haired/skinned hag who steals people away and lives in or near water (yes, Green Hags also live in forests, but it does specifically call out swamps). The element of taking the form of alluring maidens also fits some versions of the story (particularly modern re-interpretations). Peg Powler is also described as a hag with green skin, sharp teeth and long hair who lives in water and drags people to their deaths.
I'd say there's a fair case to be made for those stories being the inspiration.
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If we go by canon, Cthulhu's statblock includes a great weakness against boats. He lost to one before, after all.Probably because the designers of that game also wanted to make them a little more interesting from the gameplay perspective.You do know the statblocks for Cthulhu mythos entities in Call of Cthulhu (and Arkham Horror) aren't like that either, aside from a few exceptions?That's very true, if it weren't that way a lot of cthulhu mythos creatures would have a statblock only consisting of the line "You go insane and die."Phooka is a lot more accurate than ManitouThat's the thing though... they're ALL accurate as Pathfinder monsters.
Whether they're accurate representations of the original inspirational myths (who themselves are not always interested in being canonical with themselves) is an entirely different story. And since a Pathfinder Bestiary isn't intended to ever be an accurate and scholarly representation/report on real-world myths but instead a game resource INSPIRED by myths... it's unfair to say that they're inaccurate.
I think it wan't so much of a weakness as it was a bad morning.
I mean, you know this, right? You get up in the morning, you slept way too long so you're still completely tired and then some jerk rams his boat into your knee. At that point, wouldn't you too think, it's probably better to just go back to bed?
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No. If I were Cthulhu (and as strong as you claim him to be), I would have let out a sound most similar to an insanity-inducing alien laugh and then eat the boat and any idiots on said boat. Bad mornings usually just make me angry, and I can't really go back to bed when I'm ticked off by some moron biting my ankle. This is something I've had to teach my brothers (one older and one younger) the hard way when they don't let me get some sleep.
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You do know the statblocks for Cthulhu mythos entities in Call of Cthulhu (and Arkham Horror) aren't like that either, aside from a few exceptions?That's very true, if it weren't that way a lot of cthulhu mythos creatures would have a statblock only consisting of the line "You go insane and die."Phooka is a lot more accurate than ManitouThat's the thing though... they're ALL accurate as Pathfinder monsters.
Whether they're accurate representations of the original inspirational myths (who themselves are not always interested in being canonical with themselves) is an entirely different story. And since a Pathfinder Bestiary isn't intended to ever be an accurate and scholarly representation/report on real-world myths but instead a game resource INSPIRED by myths... it's unfair to say that they're inaccurate.
There's very little difference, given that all the Great Old Ones and Outer Gods are given stats that make it all but impossible for anything else to happen.
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If we go by canon, Cthulhu's statblock includes a great weakness against boats. He lost to one before, after all.
If a vampire takes mist form to avoid the inconvenience of wading through 20 warriors, do we say that the vampire has a great weakness to warriors?
The boat had nothing to do with Cthulhu returning to R'lyeh. The stars were only right for a very brief period. Lovecraft makes this very plain in the story.
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I mean, you know this, right? You get up in the morning, you slept way too long so you're still completely tired and then some jerk rams his boat into your knee. At that point, wouldn't you too think, it's probably better to just go back to bed?
I used to be an eldritch abomination from beyond the stars like you, but then I took a schooner to the knee.
I assume Green Hags owe a lot of inspiration to the Wizard of Oz.
The first hag I saw in my life (from an old red fairytail collection book) was also green skinned (not wiz of Oz)so I always assumed Green Skin was something most hags shared.
In Kings Quest/Quest For Glory most hags also have green skin if I remember correctly.
I can't see any reference to the Night Hag in the Wiki page of the Mara/Nightmare. They do have the nightmare-ride ability.
In my belief Night Hags are made up by D&D.
A mare or nightmare (Proto-Germanic: *marōn; Old English: mære; Old Norse: mara; German: Nachtmahr; Dutch: nachtmerrie; Swedish: mara; Icelandic: mara; Faroese: mara; Danish: mare; Norwegian: mare/mara; Proto-Slavic *mara "ghost") is an evil spirit or goblin in Germanic folklore which rides on people's chests while they sleep, bringing on bad dreams (or "nightmares")...The mare is often similar to the mythical creatures succubus and incubus, and was likely inspired by sleep paralysis...
The mara was also believed to "ride" horses, which left them exhausted and covered in sweat by the morning. She could also entangle the hair of the sleeping man or beast, resulting in "marelocks", called marflätor "mare-braids" or martovor "mare-tangles" in Swedish or marefletter and marelokker in Norwegian...
In their metamorphosed form they could fly through the night, walk on or hover above water and travel in a sieve. Dead mora witches were said to return as ghosts.
Female nonhuman creature that preys on the sleeping and can go just about anywhere by transforming its form, and is said to "ride" creatures. In a nutshell. The main D&D-isms seem to be combining it with Gothic witchcraft and diabolic imagery.
Black annis hags are, as noted above, Black Annis, and the green hag is just Green Jenny, crossed with the usual gingerbread house business.
The Sea Hag is a villain from the Popeye cartoon and comic strip. Prior to that version, the term would be mainly associated with mermaids, nixies and such, including some non-specific appearances in Hans Christian Anderson's stories. Another D&D monster that owes more to its name than anything specific gleaned from existing mythology.