
LankyOgre |
My wife is playing a barbarian and just hit level 4. Its her 3rd or 4th character, but only her first that has actually leveled up at all (multiple false starts of campaigns). She has taken combat reflexes, lesser animal totem, and knockback in addition to power attack and raging vitality. She has commented that she has not been able to use the first three at all so far. We are playing Rise of the Runelords
A lot of the encounters so far have been in enclosed spaces, so 1 or 2 PCs have been able to block hallways and doors and prevent monsters from surrounding them. She also likes the higher damage of the earthbreaker over a longspear.
She really enjoys the massive hitpoints, raging, and DR (invulnerable rager), but she does become a little bored at the lack of options. I've told her that there will be a big pay-off soon. I've also tried telling her to use her animal totem to make two attacks, but she isn't fond of the lower damage.
What kind of advice should I give to her? I think the biggest might be, "use a longspear more." She is playing a Shoanti barbarian, and has so far tried to stick to the RP of tribal type weapons, so she hasn't been interested in a lot of the polearms.
I tried to suggest having the party wizard know enlarge person but then he never cast it. I could suggest or allow her to find an item that casts enlarge person a set number of times per day (or does one already exist?) or start carrying enlarge person potions.

Claxon |

Combat reflexes is all about how the enemies move. It's a great feat, but requires them to provoke. Wait until she can pick up Come and Get Me. It's many levels later (level 12) but every time someone attacks her she gets an attack of opportunity that resolves first.
She right that Lesser Beast Totem power is lackluster, she has to be in it again for the long haul. At level 10 the barbarian gets to pounce on a charge, which means full attacking every time she charges. Which should be always.
As far as weapon choice goes, RP is a valid way to go with it. However, if she's looking for something more "optimal" she should consider the Nodachi or Greatsword. The Greatsword deals 2d6 and has 19-20/x2 critical range and multiplier versus the Nodachi's 1d10 18-20/x2. There was a thread somewhere around here comparing the two, but after you get up to +27 static damage modifier (which isn't difficult with power attack and two hand damage bonus alone) the extra crit range of Nodachi helped give it an edge above the Greatsword, assuming your character hit on a 15 or higher. As far as the Earth Breaker is concerned, it also deals 2d6 but only has a x3 crit multiplier. The lack of expanded critical range just makes it not as good generally speaking, but that is just a decision that has to be made (RP vs Optimization).
Barbarian starts to pay off in a few levels, there just isn't much interesting she can do at this point. If allowed, ask if she can swap Beast Totem out for Superstition and take the Beast Totem line later. She should take Spell Sunder at level 6, and she will be able to destroy any buffed enemies that appear by ripping the magic from their hide.

LankyOgre |
Thanks for the responses. She is aware of pounce and come and get me, which is why she took lesser beast totem and combat reflexes. She is just frustrated that her only option is still "attack" and not that creatively either. She has looked at superstitious, but she is worried about saving vs friendly spells too. In addition, it doesn't help that the cleric and rogue are both racing her to the front line. She cant really find a spot to protect or jam up.
I don't think a greatsword or nodachi is so much better than the earthbreaker that it is a must. I will continue to encourage her towards a reach weapon.
Like I said earlier I think I will encourage her to carry potions of enlarge person, since those should help out her reach and damage.

Grizzly the Archer |

Nodachi is really good to have. The thing about crit ranges for a barbarian is that because they use static damage more than the actual weapon for main damage, the higher crit range, for more chances to crit, is always better. A keen or improved critical for a weapon can make it 15-20 crit range, and when your doing +30 points of damage, likelihood of you getting a crit is 25% of the time. Getting those odds on all of your attacks is amazing, especially when you have come and get me, giving you more attacks.
As for utility, spell sunder will be a huge bonus for the party.
Darkness in the room preventing you all to see? spell sunder it.
There is a monster with geas on it preventing you to getting towards the treasure? Spell sunder the geas.
Anti magic field ruining your party? You betcha, spell sunder it.
There are probably less than a handful of spells that have durations, since you can't spell sunder instantaneous spells, unless on a readied action I believe. Not sure. One of which is wall of force. Although DM ruling about how spell sunder would allow wall of force to be gone. Prismatic wall get nuked by spell sunder?
Party member under a spell causing confusion or some other ailment? Spell sunder it.
Outside of spell sunder, at level 11 the feat dazing assault, is going to be a huge boon to the party when you daze every enemy in your reach. Using a reach weapon and enlarged, you hit anything within 15'-20'. 5'-10' you need to threaten with something else like a bladed boot.
Also, for damage, have your wife do a weapon comparison. A few rounds with her earthbreaker. Compared to a higher crit weapon. Like a nodachi, falchion, or even great sword. Shell notice she might get a more powerful crit with the earthbreaker, but the more crits coming from the other weapons will balance that out and even surpass those damage totals. Reach weapons in general will be better for her,mbe abuse as a barbarian your going to take hits, so your AC doesn't fully matter. As such, taking less hrs is always better. And when she does get hit, come and get me will let her retaliate even further.

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The things that make a barbarian "fun" for most people who playy them is doing damage and the ability to take damage. If she isn't enjoying those aspects of the barbarian, maybe she should try a caster class, perhaps something like a magus? Less raw power, but much more flexible in combat, with enough stuff (class abilities, spells, melee options) to keep things interesting.

awp832 |

I find myself often a little bored when I play martial classes too, for the same reason, a lack of options.
Right now I'm playing a barbarian, I tried to get around this by taking the Dirty Trick line of feats. You could pick grapple or trip if you prefer, whatever. Is it the route to the most powerful character? NO. But it gives you some options and helps spice up combat and makes things more interesting, so I like it. Maybe your wife would like it too.

RotBot |
Thanks for the responses. She is aware of pounce and come and get me, which is why she took lesser beast totem and combat reflexes. She is just frustrated that her only option is still "attack" and not that creatively either. She has looked at superstitious, but she is worried about saving vs friendly spells too. In addition, it doesn't help that the cleric and rogue are both racing her to the front line. She cant really find a spot to protect or jam up.
I don't think a greatsword or nodachi is so much better than the earthbreaker that it is a must. I will continue to encourage her towards a reach weapon.
Like I said earlier I think I will encourage her to carry potions of enlarge person, since those should help out her reach and damage.
If you're the dm you could try to make less bottlenecked spaces. Theres also really no reason a rogue should be racing her to the front lines(and moreso winning against someone with improved move speed) as opposed to trying to set up flank with her or the cleric.
To a certain extent it just doesn't make sense that she wants to be a barbarian but also wants to be able to do more than just attack... barbarians are some of the best attackers as is. Has she considered multiclassing if she wants more shamanistic powers? Does she know that multiclassing is always an option when she gets a level up? What exactly is she expecting to be able to do that she's annoyed she cannot do?

LankyOgre |
The rogue is winning initiative, so commonly gets in front of her by going first.
We are playing Rise of the Runelords, so some of the bottlenecks are written in. I do plan to add in some side-quests that are more open and see what happens.
She loves dealing damage and attacking. I think her main complaint is that everything she has taken so far is for something cooler at 10th-12th level and not really useful now. She complained that she doesn't get to use combat reflexes much and lesser beast totem is not as useful as straight attacking with a weapon.
I think some of the problem is that the cleric is a crusader and so makes a point of trying to get to melee quickly as well. Right now, since the barbarian does not have iterative attacks and goblins die quickly anyway, the cleric is making her feel extraneous.
I think her big complaint is that each time we level up, everybody else gets cool new toys, when she is picking toys that will open up other choices later, but aren't that great by themselves.

awp832 |

um... well then tell her not to do that anymore. Or, maybe more to the point: Don't do that anymore. It sounds like you're building her character. Listen to what she wants, or let her build it herself.
5th level is next, right? How about Improved Initiative as her feat choice? Get a chance at going before the rogue, and even if she doesn't, it's still a noticeable instant-benefit. Toughness could be a contender too. If all you're fighting is goblins, how about Cleave?
6th level Reckless Abandon, or Lesser Elemental Rage. Both have instant benefits.

Kazaan |
If you didn't want to be stuck just melee attacking all the time...
You shouldn't have picked a primary melee attacking class.
And what, exactly, is going in, delivering a solid hit, and making the other guy take a dirt nap? "Hit them and make them fall over dead" is no more or less of a tactic than "flank them with another teammate, disarm, trip, then attack while he's prone". If she doesn't have too bad of a Charisma penalty, she can train up Intimidate and pick up Intimidating Glare rage power along with Intimidating Prowress as a feat. She can spend a move action to give someone the stink-eye so hard that they piss themselves and have to fight with wet, saggy trousers.

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My Tribal barbarian also limited himself to spears and the like. He shies away from swords, using only weapons that could feasibly be useful tools, also. (Like skinning a deer or putting food on the table.)
In any event, I gave him all the throwing stuff. He chucks said spears at people, and when he runs out of spears, he picks up chunks of rock and throws them instead. Perhaps she'd like throwing things at other things? She could even throw the dead goblins at the not dead goblins to make them dead goblins, replenishing her ammo!

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um... well then tell her not to do that anymore. Or, maybe more to the point: Don't do that anymore. It sounds like you're building her character. Listen to what she wants, or let her build it herself.
5th level is next, right? How about Improved Initiative as her feat choice? Get a chance at going before the rogue, and even if she doesn't, it's still a noticeable instant-benefit. Toughness could be a contender too. If all you're fighting is goblins, how about Cleave?
6th level Reckless Abandon, or Lesser Elemental Rage. Both have instant benefits.
I think this might actually be the best advice, the toys she'll get at 10th+ are great but if she hates the journey there and gives up before even reaching it it's all wasted.
You've said this is one of her first times playing and the only character she has had who leveled... so draw her into the game. Give her a new toy each level, Imp. Init as suggested, Cleave, Lunge (letting her strike past the party members who go first). Give her rage powers like Auspicious Mark, Intimidating Glare, Powerful Blow or Swift Foot.
Judging by what you say she clearly wants to make more choices, be more involved in the game and think more about what to do for combats, so help her! Save the optimised CAGM barbarian build for another game when she's learned all there is and is happy to wait for a payoff.