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Hello all,
I'm building a mounted Arcane Archer, and I'm trying to decide whether I'll be better off focusing in rapid attacks (Rapid Shot + Many Shot), or in heavy & accurate single attacks (Bullseye Shot + Vital Strike + Deadly Aim). Or taking both. I'm not allowed to take Clustered Shots (GM banned that one with ferver).
Here's the core dilemma: Rapid shots make the most of any damage bonuses added to each attack, but they are less accurate and more vulnerable to DR. Vital Strike and Bullseye Shot will hit more often and get past DR more easily.
I'm mounted on a Heavy Horse with Chain Shirt barding (plus the Mounted Combat feat to mitigate some of the damage it would take). One of my traits is Rich Parents, to afford starting mounted at level 1. He should hopefully survive a while, and using a full-attack or move+attack each round while the horse moves its speed and/or 5-foot steps away from foes is my intent. This will give me some nice mobility. Later flying mounts would be fun.
Other feats I plan on taking include:
*Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Weapon Focus (Arcane archer requirements, and just all-around useful)
*Weapon Specialization
*Deadly Aim
*Improved Precise Shot
*Pinpoint Targeting
*Mounted Combat
*Mounted Archery
*Hammer the Gap?
This character is starting at level 1, so it will be a long time before he hits his stride around level 7 or 8. I have 6 levels of fighter and 1 level of bard before I can start into arcane archer levels (level 8 is the earliest I can figure out for taking AA), and Many Shot and Vital Shot are both BAB6 feats. So I'll need to be moderately competent in the mean time too. I'm planning on 1 level of fighter, 1 level of bard, 5 more fighter levels, then all 10 Arcane Archer levels. Maybe follow up with more fighter at the end of my career.
[u]Notes about the campaign:[/u]
We get a 20 point buy, but the races are all changed from normal. For example, only a couple of races can be Fighters; most haven't developed organized martial warfare and weapons training to the necessary point the specialize the way a fighter does. The variant of human I'm taking (that can be a fighter) doesn't get a bonus feat: instead he gets +1 to AC and +1 to all saves. The bonus to defenses is very nice, but note that I'll be 1 feat behind for a human.
Also, some feats like Clustered Shots have been banned as way over-powered. Sad days. :( I'm wary of many third-party feats for that reason.
[u]Notes on DR:[/u]
I plan on casting Abundant Ammunition with Bard on a quiver holding one of each type of non-magical ammunition that interests me (and that I can afford at the time). These include Cold Iron, Alchemical Silver, Blunt, Raining, and Adamantine arrows. And I'll have spares of each for when I run out of spells per day to do that. Eventually Arcane Archer will add Magic to all my arrows, bypassing that DR too. But I'll still have some DR to deal with on occasion, I'm sure. Especially on long days when I run out of spells and special arrows before I can rest or buy/build more. Or we meet those foes that simply have DR 5/-.
Damage Bonuses I plan on having at level 8 (apply to both single shots and rapid):
Point-Blank: 1
Weapon Spec: 2
Composite Bow: 2
Arcane Archer enhancement: 1
Fighter Weapon Training: 1
Deadly Aim: 6
My Guesstimates
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Rapid
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At level 8, a full-round attack grants 4 shots (2 from BAB, and another 2 from rapid shot + multi shot) using 3 attack rolls (multi shot puts 2 on one attack).
Rapid shots will be made at +11 to attack for the first 3 arrows (2 arrows with first attack using multi shot, 1 arrow from second attack with rapid shot), or +14 without Deadly Aim.
(BAB 7 + 5 dex + 1 wpn focus + 1 point-blank + 1 arcane archer enhancement + 1 weapon training - 2 rapid shot - 3 deadly aim)
The 4th arrow will be at -5 to attack, so +6 (or +9 without deadly aim).
End Result: +11x2, +11, +6 or +14x2, +14, +9
Each arrow that hits will deal 1d8 + 13 damage when using Deadly Aim (or 1d8 + 7 without). This gives a damage range of about 14-84 per round, assuming at least one arrow always hits and there's no DR reducing the damage.
Single
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At level 8, a bullseye shot will have +17 to attack, or +20 without Deadly Aim.
The arrow's damage is 2d8 + 13, or about 15-29 damage each round (I assume this would hit reasonably often).
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Damage-wise, rapid wins out big-time. By spamming shots like that, at least 1 or 2 arrows should hit each round, easily out-pacing single shots.
However, against enemies with high AC, or DR I can't trivially bypass, the single shot method starts to look good too. I'm thinking I should take feats for both paths (rapid shot, many shot, vital strike, bullseye shot, and deadly aim), though maybe I don't need to take Improved and Greater Vital Strike.
Am I figuring this right? What's your take on this?
Vital Strike is garbage. Don't bother. More attacks will always be better, and DR is super easy to overcome with arrows because of how cheap and easy it is to get arrows of various materials, and the number of enemies with high enough ACs to matter or DR X/- are insignificant in the long run.
I am concerned that your composite bow is only adding 2 damage, though. Your Strength should be much higher. In my mind, it should be your second best stat after Dex.
My ability scores are:
Strength 14
Constitution 10
Dexterity 18
Intelligence 12
Wisdom 10
Charisma 13
So yes, it is my second-highest stat. :D We're encouraged to do a wide stat spread instead of focusing too much on core stats in this campaign. Also, I can't dump charisma because I need 13 minimum to be able to cast up to level 3 bard spells (arcane archer will get me up to CL 7 or 8). And I'm always hesitant to dump wisdom, constitution or intelligence because of the will save, HP and skill points tied to those stats. Puts me in a tight spot.
So I shouldn't expect to fight enemies so tough I need to roll a natural 15 or higher to hit. Or at least not often. That was a major draw of vital strike + bullseye shot.
Okay, so vital strike is out.
Mounted Combat: Yea, I'm taking this feat simply to keep my mount alive. Being able to nullify one hit per round could keep me from having to replace my horse every few gaming sessions. ;)
Mounted Archery allows me to chase down a fleeing enemy while pelting it murderously with accurate shots. I have a score to settle with some manticores from our last campaign. ;) But yes, it's not a necessary feat and is reserved for late in the build. It can go.
What's the compelling reason for Eldritch Knight? Is it just martial+arcane padding to keep the class level of both fighter and wizard up while moving toward Arcane Archer? I see the bard levels as a splash of support magic (Abundant Ammunition, Cure Light Wounds, etc) and a requirement to access AA, not as my main focus. I'm an archer with a splash of support magic, not an offensive caster (we have a sorcerer in the party already). But I'm open to suggestions if that's the wrong route to take.
And why wizard over bard? Wizard seemed awkward because it doesn't get free spells with arcane archer and eldritch knight levels (can only spend money grafting found spells into his spellbook), so I shied away from it. Are you recommending Wizard because it has a wider spell selection and is more offense-focused?
I'm not trying to be difficult, just trying to understand things better.
Driver: Cool, thanks. Is it reasonable to combine with Sorcerer instead, or is Wizard the better choice?
I ask because for some strange reason I always end up being the party face, even when I'm playing a charisma-dumped character. More often than not I'm playing emergency clean up, talking the NPCs out of killing my allies after they've done something foolish (or they do something sane but botch it). A charisma caster has great synergy with being a good talker and presence character.
The Bard you posted in the second link also looks fun (and is good for the talker role), though I might have trouble getting permission to take an archetype (they're also on the list of Pathfinder features the GM is wary of).
But Wizard spell schools are so good too... choices.
Three loosely related suggestions:
1) Make sure you can use the longbow while mounted. Under normal longbow, it specifically says you can't use it while mounted. Under composite longbow, it specifically says that you can. I suspect that this is a copy-paste error from composite shortbow that has just persisted, as there is no size-and-unwieldiness difference between any regular bow and its composite equivalent. I'd confirm this with your GM.
2) Add the Adaptive quality to your bow as soon as possible, assuming your GM allows it. You can buff your strength on the fly and the bow auto-adjusts the damage. That saves you wasting points on a high strength score you won't always need. Also, remember that you take minuses to hit on a composite long bow if your str is too low: if you get debuffed by a bad guy, the adaptive bow also compensates for that.
Alternatively, get an efficient quiver, and keep several bows on hand for Str adjustments. My Zen archer carries 4 longbows: 1 normal in case her strength gets debuffed, a +2 as her primary, a +3 for when the transmuter wizard buffs her str by 2, and a +4 for the bull's strength buff. She also carries a +2 composite shortbow for mounted combat or tight quarters, and a normal shortbow as a backup or loaner weapon. Now I need to get her a caddy... :-)
3) Gravity Bow. Best archer spell ever! (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advanced/spells/gravityBow.html#_gravit y-bow-)