I'm currently GMing a Kingmaker game and one of my PCs has written a really great backstory for his character that involves a Hellknight. I was fairly familiar with Hellknights before okaying his character concept but, after reading more in depth about them, specifically in the appendices in Council of Thieves, I'm worried that I may have allowed a slightly "incorrect" portrayal of the Hellknights.
Basically, a Hellknight was repsonsible for the murder of the PC's sister who was apparently the lover of the Hellknight (are even Hellknights capable of love/intimacy?) The murder was somehow blamed on the PC's mother who was hung for the crime. Given the way that Reckonings and losing their powers work, would it even be possible for a Hellknight to get away with all of this somehow? At this point, it's so crucial to the PC's backstory that I'd rather alter the ethos of the Hellknights slightly just for our campaign than make him change it for the sake of Golarion canon.
Does anyone have any suggestions?
Important NPCs:
Father-Kolemat Charthagnion
Kolemat's first wife (mother to first 3 kids)-Sarnelle
Hadak's mother-Tesess
Charthagnion siblings (oldest to youngest)
-Jalmates (male)
-Lakera (female)
-Ilandria (female)
-Hadak (male)
Hadak attended an Asmodeus inspired boarding school in Westcrown. He was never very bright and was picked on because of his stutter. Lived in the shadow of Jalmates's impressive academic achievements from years past. Kolemat eventually had him pulled out of school early because he was "tired of paying for a dullard to stutter the wrong answer again and again." He was assigned to deal with the household slave's most trivial matters.
Lakera's strangled corpse is found behind The Gemmed Goblet, a fine Westcrown Inn. Hellknights arrest Tesess and she is sentenced to hang. To save face, Kolemat divorces her and makes Hadak a legal bastard at 14. She is buried in a pauper's grave.
Hadak wanders the streets of Westcrown until the gunman Athyr takes the boy in and teaches him the ways of Aroden. He takes great interest in the boy and makes him clean the man's treasured musket and learn his letters. The next few years are spent hunting down bounties with Athyr. As he reaches adulthood, Athyr initiates him into the priesthood of Aroden by teaching him the sacred mantras of healing and the names of the high priests of Aroden's church in Cheliax.
Armed with a crossbow, a knife, and a fistful of silver, Hadak eventually goes out to solve the mystery of Lakera's death. Through connection's in the church of Iomedai he learns that Savage Sir Sura Kadvok, a Hellknight, was his sister's spurned lover and killer. Against Athyr's will, Hadak tracks Kadvok down and demands that he turn himself in. Kadvok beats him and arrests him for false witness against a knight. Sir Jalmates Charthagnion, now a Hellknight as well, is commanded to bring his half brother to the Egorian dungeons to rot. His brother does so out of duty but still treats him like any other prisoner and makes the journey.
Inside of the Egorian Dungeon, Hadak lives better than most prisoners with the care packages and money sent by Ilandria. He soon becomes known by the other inmates as the Westcrown Dude. He gains the friendship of several other inmates through his generosity and protection, his gnomish cellmate Tawnteir becoming a best friend. Though resigned to their destiny in prison, Tawntier teaches Hadak to make alchemical creations. The gnome also helps him work out the majority of his stutter. The make a pistol from scrap they find and stash away several rounds in the wall of their cell. After completion, this gathers dust in the wall until Ilandria's letters stop- and Kadvok pays him a visit.
Kadvok reveals that he had purchased Ilandria from the aged Kolemat and was planning on claiming her maidenhead shortly after the meeting. He proceeded to have his men beat Hadak for tarnishing his name and on the way out he whispered a confirmation of his guilt into the bleeding man's ear. Hadak grabbed the rigged pistol and he and his prison posse fought their way through the guards to Kadvok's retreating carriage. Sir Kadvok was gunned down by the escapees and they retreated east with Ilandria towards Andoran. In Piren's Bluff, Jalmates and his men catch up with the fugitives and their families. There is a stand off but Jalmates can't catch his bastard brother. They escape, wounded, to cross the mountains.
Hadak spent many years chasing bounties in the mountains with Athyr and Tawnteir under the W.C.D. Every week he sends a letter and bank notes to Ilandria and her new child to pay her back for the love she showed while he was locked up. The years passed and age brought worries of the Knights attempting to find Ilandria and Hadak's nephew to torture Hadak's location out them. Hadak decided to go into retirement and the Green Belt seemed like the best place. Packing up his trusty, clunky pistol, he left with a group of Erastil's followers, spreading the tale along the way of his death. He asks Osma (another PC) to continue his letters to his sister as a friend of Hadak's, who watched him "die honorably in the eyes of his god", continuing to send gold in Hadak's name.
Questions and Answers:
Q) What happened with Kolemat's first wife?
A) Sarnelle died shortly after giving birth to Ilandria.
Q) Have Ilandria and Jalmates ever been in contact after Piren's Bluff? I assume not in order to keep her location secret and whatnot.
A) No. They were actually pretty close, especially since they mourned the loss of their only other full sibling together, and shared love for each other but they both know Jalmates would turn her over in a heart beat.
Jalmates and Kadvok were likely in the same order. Kadvok was older and from Westcrown, like our family, so Jalmates has had interaction with the man.
Piren's Bluff was bloody. Many Hellknight squires and lesser knights fell to a bullet that day and it became even more heated when some of the Andoran villagers joined in against the Hellknights that weren't technically in Cheliax jurisdiction. More than likely, Athyr, Tawnteir and Hadak were out of bullets and had to rely on primitive weapons to finish the battle. The way I imagined it originally, Jalmates only backed off when he realized the civilian casualties would be too great.
1. Fortunately, you're the DM. Canon doesn't matter in your world, so you can alter the ethos.
2. Define Hellknight. Does it have to be someone with the Hellknight prestige class? Or does any sufficiently tough guy, working in the order, wearing the regalia qualify to outsiders. Don't confuse a mechanic (a class) with an organization in the game world.
If I remember correctly you need to be 6th level to qualify for the PrC. That is a lot of power and experience right there. It's likely the orders are composed predominatly of lower level aspirants to Hellknighthood.
An armiger on the verge of taking his trial (for example 6th level fighter/1st level aristocrat) to become a full-fledged Hellknight looks an awful lot like a real Hellknight to a commoner.
His crime might even be the reason Kadvok didn't take the full orders. He feared the reckoning that would follow once he submitted fully to the Measure.
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So (a)Kolemat fell in love with Tesess, (b) Kadvok fell in love with her daughter Lakera, (c) Kadvok killed Lakera, (d) the Hellknights blamed Tesess, and (e) they executed her .
(a) and (b) are no problem. Hellknights are people, too.
(c) there are all sorts of possibilities. He may have understood that she was corrupt, or guilty of some other offense. He may be Lawful Evil and decided to entrap her in a little-known "crime" that's punishable by death. Or he may have grown wroth with rage and sought an atonement.
(d) is a little bit tricky. Generally speaking, a Hellknight order has the means for finding these things out. But it may be an open-and-shut case. Or, as sometimes happens, a Hellknight or two fall to corruption and take bribes. It seems possible that Kadvok might have framed Tesess, in order to embarrass Kolemat.
(e) is pretty straightforward.
You can have Lawful Good hellknights... heck Paladins can become hellknights. Yes, they can have love/intimacy.
Be that as it may... hellknights definitely can commit crimes. As very strict and lawful people, they would need justification for it (if only to themselves). Although it might be murder to us, some crimes are arranged so that execution is justified. Also, they are not automatons, and can certainly slip up along the way.
- Maybe the hellknight felt justified and it was more of an execution (could be a number of reasons, including reading illegal materials, like true histories of House Thrune, helping a Halfling slave escape a life of torment, maybe she wqas set up to take the fall for the Actions of someone in the Bellflower Network, etc.)
- maybe the hellknight has a less principled squire (NE) who arranged a mugging to help his/her master with a now troublesome lover
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Paladin Hellknights were retconned out and I think it's also generally been determined that a LG Hellknight is more than a stretch.
The rest of your post is spot on.
When were paladin hellknights retconned out? From all the flavor material I've read on hellknights, there's no reason for eliminating paladins or other LG characters from being hellknights.
The only major thing retconned out of the Council of Thieves material are the LG servants of Asmodeus which was an error that slipped by James Jacobs. That may be what you're confusing this with. In fact, there are high-ranking LG Hellknights within the cannon who have never been retconned out and who continue to be mentioned. While there may not be many (or any) Paladin Hellknights, there most certainly are LG Hellknights.
As for the OP's questions, Chris Mortika covered it pretty well but I'd like to elaborate a but on that. The trickiest part here is the fact that the Hellknight orders have access to Discern Lies at a reasonably early level(2nd level in the Prestige Class which would be around 7th or 8th level for most NPCs). If an official investigation was opened at any point then an actual Hellknight or two (not just Armigers) would probably get involved and then it becomes difficult to frame someone. There are certainly many ways to get around Discern Lies (both magical or just creative) but that is an issue that needs to be considered.
Also, as for the framing itself. This really comes down the Hellknight's motivation and just how corrupt he's become. One non-lawful act isn't enough for a Hellknight to fall, slip in alignment (to NE or N), and lose his powers. Obviously, being willing to frame someone leaves no doubt that this particular Hellknight is LE and not LN. So if this type of corruption is not a typical day-to-day or week-to-week behaviour for the Hellknight than he can certainly remain LE no problem. The trickier issue is that IF the rest of the Hellknight Order were to find out about the framing then he most certainly would be excised from his Order. The occasional Hellknight here or there may be bribed or corrupted (though even then the lore seems to indicate that bribing a Hellknight is much harder than most make it out to be) but the Orders on the whole are primarily LN and don't take kindly to framing or being led astray.
You can have Lawful Good Hellknights... heck Paladins can become Hellknights. Yes, they can have love/intimacy.
Be that as it may... Hellknights definitely can commit crimes. As very strict and lawful people, they would need justification for it (if only to themselves). Although it might be murder to us, some crimes are arranged so that execution is justified. Also, they are not automatons, and can certainly slip up along the way.
- Maybe the Hellknight felt justified and it was more of an execution (could be a number of reasons, including reading illegal materials, like true histories of House Thrune, helping a Halfling slave escape a life of torment, maybe she wqas set up to take the fall for the actions of someone in the Bellflower Network, etc.)
- Maybe the Hellknight has a less principled squire (NE) who arranged a mugging to help his/her master with a now troublesome lover
Paladin Hellknights were retconned out and I think it's also generally been determined that a LG Hellknight is more than a stretch.
The rest of your post is spot on.
Quote an official source. I have not seen one and until I do, I will not believe this claim.
In regards to LG and Paladins, the only things I'm really seeing on it are that page 266 of the Inner Sea World Guide states that Hellknights can be of "LG, LN, LE (strongly skewed toward LN)" and Council of Thieves #3 lists an NPC Hellknight (who is only an Armiger without the PrC) that has Paladin levels, in the Order of the Godclaw. If they can be LG, I can't see any reason why they couldn't be a Paladin unless, of course, their "Good" ends up getting in the way of their "Lawful" in-game.
Back on topic, though, THANK YOU guys for all the suggestions. I think I've more of less figured out how I'm going to play it. I've run it by the PC and I think it might work for the best this way. When Kadvok killed the daughter, Lakera, and then somehow "framed" the mother for the crime, he was merely an Armiger, giving him a little more breathing room as to what he can get away with.
To explain the minimal investigation that would have taken place, I'm going to say the mother's husband, who was already described as divorcing her over the accusation to save face, actually turned on her the moment he heard the allegations and assured the Hellknights that she was a terrible mother, attesting to her guilt in an attempt to be as "helpful" as possible.
The PC was in prison for, I believe, a number of years which would have given Kadvok the opportunity to pass his final trial and become a full Hellknight. Being Lawful Evil, he felt as that "what is done is done" and there would be no sense atoning for a crime that took place before he had fully committed to the Measure and Chain. Clearly having a grudge against the PC from his earlier actions, he saw no reason to implicate himself in order to free the wrongly imprisoned, either.
Anyway, again, thank you guys so much! The suggestions were extremely helpful! I've got some really great (imho) ideas in mind for what I want to happen later in this PC's personalized storyline. I'll post a follow up if anyone is interested. I'd do it now but it's late and I'm tired :)
I hope it all works out for you, Brad!
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One of theseason 4 PFS scenarios: Fortress of the Nail has the players enter into diplomacy with high ranking Hellknights inside their fortress to free a prisoner whome is wrongly accused. As it is only a 3.99 PDF, it would alsobe a good reasource for both names and reactions of the officials the group might meet due to this....
Sidenote: It is Paladins of Asmoedus that James Jacobs "retconned;" not Paladin Hellknights.
Correct. My mistake. The paladin of Asmodeus is what I was thinking of when I posted previously.
I still have a hard time seeing how, according to the Hellknight article in Cot3, part 3, a paladin can be a Hellknight when paladins are concerned with "righteousnes and decency" and Hellknights "care nothing for goodness or evil". Since paladins can only be LG, I'm not sure how you can be a Hellknight paladin that doesn't care about good. However, officially, yeah a paladin can be a Hellknight. Good luck with that, amigo, especially if you play at a table run by some of the folks who post here that find it VERY easy for a paladin to fall from grace.
It's easy for a Paladin to fall when he has the rest of the party AND the GM ganging up to throw him off the battlements.
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Good day to you all. Feel free to sit and help yourself to some cognac, as we enjoy each other's company and engage in this diverting discussion. As we are free men I wait for no-one to introduce us. I am Gennadi.
I have found it ... delicate at times to stand as both a paladin of Torag and a Companion of the Scourge, but the two commitments are natural allies in my spirit. The Sourge fights corruption and chaos, along with all our Hellknight brethren, but we have a particular call to rout out those who use their power or station to unlawfully oppress their rightful charges. Torag demands that his forces protect a comunity, and it is not hard to see
BPorter, you speak aright, when you observe that some Hellknights, perhaps most, care far more for the rule of law rather than the purity of spirit. At times, I have myself borne the ... privilege of serving under a commander whose view of good and evil varied with mine. But all my companions know of my standing as a paladin, and that giving me an order in conflict with my vows to Torag would cause me to either quit the order or lose my paladin powers. No commander with half a brain would weaken his own forces that way, and no Hellknight lictor would issue such an ... unpredictable command.
(Well, except for the Order of the Rack. There are some truly scary zealots over there. I do my best to stand clear of their command.)