First thing the take out is the kinect and they say how good it looks. Still trying to say having a camera that will spy on you is a good thing.
If by "will spy on you" you mean "won't spy on you", sure.
I understand you don't care Scott, but other people do care about camera's in their home that are hooked up to the internet. No computer, program or hardware, is immune to hacking. There are some interesting videos about things being done with the current gen Kinect, Imogen Heap has turned her's into part of her digital instrument set (courtesy of some people at MIT).
I understand you don't care Scott, but other people do care about camera's in their home that are hooked up to the internet.
Like your laptop, tablet, or smartphone, right? All of which feature both microphones and cameras, all of which sit in your home or on your person, and all of which are internet-accessible.
So it's cool if you really do have a problem with having a potential recording device like that, but I don't think very many people do. I think most people (and by most I mean very nearly everyone) has accepted that recording devices are more or less ubiquitous and that getting hung up on their mere presence is pointless.
So, sure, if you eschew laptops, cell phones, tablets, and webcams, I guess it's not hypocritical of you to criticize Microsoft for sticking a camera on their console (though still paranoid). But, come on. Are you really one of those people? Any of you?
There comes a point when healthy caution crosses over into unhealthy paranoia.
You really have to ask yourself: What would Microsoft even GAIN from spying on you? Information on what kind of underwear you buy?
If you can't answer that question, or the answer is "Nothing", it's a safe bet that they won't do it.
Businesses are predictable that way. They can be relied on to do whatever will make them the most money for the least trouble. No more, no less.
Assuming they could even make money off of "Spying" on you, it's too much trouble for what it's worth.
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
There comes a point when healthy caution crosses over into unhealthy paranoia.
You really have to ask yourself: What would Microsoft even GAIN from spying on you? Information on what kind of underwear you buy?
It's not Microsoft people are worried about. It's the NSA forcing Microsoft and other tech companies to hand over data about their customers that people are up in arms over. Which, uh.. has been done en masse.
It's not Microsoft people are worried about. It's the NSA forcing Microsoft and other tech companies to hand over data about their customers that people are up in arms over. Which, uh.. has been done en masse.There comes a point when healthy caution crosses over into unhealthy paranoia.
You really have to ask yourself: What would Microsoft even GAIN from spying on you? Information on what kind of underwear you buy?
Not to mention TV webcams already have issues with being used by hackers to case houses or extorting people who do naughty things in their living room, now we are adding a camera detailed enough to detect a heartbeat.
Of course MS will say the the kinect won't spy on you. No company would admit that one of there products would say a product spys on you.
...Facebook, Microsoft, and Google have all been as forthcoming as they can about how they collect information on you, especially as it relates to the recent NSA scandals. In fact, they banded together to try and get the federal government to allow them to disclose the volume of requests they receive - something they normally would not have been allowed to do.
Of course, this is easily debunked on day 1 by using a traffic monitoring utility on your router to see how much data is being sent upstream from your Xbox One. Video files are not small, and uploading them requires massive bandwidth that would be easily noticed against a backdrop of otherwise relatively small game state updates being sent back and forth (or just idling). So if Microsoft is secretly spying on people with the Kinect, there will be proof on the internet the day it's released.
But what you're basically saying is that Microsoft will claim to not be spying on you whether or not they are actually spying on you, and therefore they are spying on you.
Which is a lot like me saying, "You'd claim to not be a murderer even if you were a murderer, so therefore you must be a murderer."
Not to mention TV webcams already have issues with being used by hackers to case houses or extorting people who do naughty things in their living room,It's not Microsoft people are worried about. It's the NSA forcing Microsoft and other tech companies to hand over data about their customers that people are up in arms over. Which, uh.. has been done en masse.There comes a point when healthy caution crosses over into unhealthy paranoia.
You really have to ask yourself: What would Microsoft even GAIN from spying on you? Information on what kind of underwear you buy?
Source, please. I am not aware of any cases where a home burglar has hacked into a "TV webcam" to case a house.
now we are adding a camera detailed enough to detect a heartbeat.
Plenty of cameras are "detailed" enough for that. In fact, many of them are much more detailed than that. The actual innovation here is in the software that is capable of determining heartbeat.
If the government shows up at MS headquarters with a court order for them to hand over all data received from everyone with a XBone.....
Then Microsoft will probably have some bits of usage data to turn over. But, since Microsoft will not be storing audio or video streams from Kinect users, they won't be turning over any full HD video of your latest Dance Central performance.
Just to be clear, do you actually believe that Microsoft receives and stores a stream of everything you do in front of a Kinect? Is that something that you believe is taking place?
Other companies that run email and other services keep track of everything you sent and received. So it would not surprise me if MS kept records of what people do.
Could you be clear about "records of what people do"?
In your paranoid fantasy, is Microsoft storing video? Audio? Pictures? Usage data/metrics? Do you have proof for any of this? If so, could you show us? If not, why not? Gathering that proof should be trivial.
|
Maybe trivial for you. But I have no idea where to look for data lime that. Plus I'm posting from my phone at work. I know how companies can be. Just being safe in my own home. Only way I'd be happy with an xbone is if when I got it home and opened the box, there would be a ps4 inside.
ps4 is better in every way plus you don't have to pay extra to use things like Netflix on it like you do with xbone.
Not to mention TV webcams already have issues with being used by hackers to case houses or extorting people who do naughty things in their living room,It's not Microsoft people are worried about. It's the NSA forcing Microsoft and other tech companies to hand over data about their customers that people are up in arms over. Which, uh.. has been done en masse.There comes a point when healthy caution crosses over into unhealthy paranoia.
You really have to ask yourself: What would Microsoft even GAIN from spying on you? Information on what kind of underwear you buy?
Source, please. I am not aware of any cases where a home burglar has hacked into a "TV webcam" to case a house.
Looking into it more, I stand corrected. I see lots of articles from when Samsung TVs were first hacked last year that then went into rants about what has been happening with laptop cameras for a while and hysteria about what could happen with TV cameras. So the possiblity exists, has been used for similar devices, but I cannot find a case of it being true for these devices. I wouldn't be suprised if lack of addoption is a strong reason why.
I wouldn't be suprised if lack of addoption is a strong reason why.
I would expect that the real reason is that home burglaries are typically low-sophistication crimes, and that hacking into a home television webcam is a high-sophistication tactic.
|
|
I would expect that the real reason is that home burglaries are typically low-sophistication crimes, and that hacking into a home television webcam is a high-sophistication tactic.I wouldn't be suprised if lack of addoption is a strong reason why.
I've actually had it happen to my neighbor. Idiot never locked his router, even though i repeatedly told him that people would steal his bandwith. In the end a guy who fixed his computer remotely used his info to hack into his webcam, look around, break in when the dude was at work and clean him out.
As for the Xbone, there is now a possibility that i might want to buy it, but only as a secondary console to a PS4 that i will be buying first.
I've actually had it happen to my neighbor. Idiot never locked his router, even though i repeatedly told him that people would steal his bandwith. In the end a guy who fixed his computer remotely used his info to hack into his webcam, look around, break in when the dude was at work and clean him out.
Pretty cool that they caught the guy, though.
I would expect that the real reason is that home burglaries are typically low-sophistication crimes, and that hacking into a home television webcam is a high-sophistication tactic.I wouldn't be suprised if lack of addoption is a strong reason why.
I've actually had it happen to my neighbor. Idiot never locked his router, even though i repeatedly told him that people would steal his bandwith. In the end a guy who fixed his computer remotely used his info to hack into his webcam, look around, break in when the dude was at work and clean him out.
As for the Xbone, there is now a possibility that i might want to buy it, but only as a secondary console to a PS4 that i will be buying first.
Router security does seem to be the key from what I am reading, on both the TV hack and standard webcam hacks.
It's not Microsoft people are worried about. It's the NSA forcing Microsoft and other tech companies to hand over data about their customers that people are up in arms over. Which, uh.. has been done en masse.There comes a point when healthy caution crosses over into unhealthy paranoia.
You really have to ask yourself: What would Microsoft even GAIN from spying on you? Information on what kind of underwear you buy?
Like they wouldn't do that anyway?
They already have plenty of info on you. Anything "extra" the NSA could get from it would be from recorded messages...and there's no evidence or reason that anything would actually be recorded and saved except for this possible "rainy day" scenario.
That ship has sailed. It sailed loooong ago.
|
|
And to be honest, do you REALLY think that Microsoft has enough storage to put everything that the kineckt records in it? That would be petabytes of data. And they have so many better things to do with their money.
Thats why there are server shortages everytime a major multiplayer shooter comes out. The servers are used for the data. ;)
If people want to keep buying Microsoft junk, then go right ahead
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
If people want to keep buying Microsoft junk, then go right ahead
Did you have something worthwhile to contribute to the thread? Or is this just another drive-by flame?
|
|
And to be honest, do you REALLY think that Microsoft has enough storage to put everything that the kineckt records in it? That would be petabytes of data. And they have so many better things to do with their money.Thats why there are server shortages everytime a major multiplayer shooter comes out. The servers are used for the data. ;)
You do realize that server shortages and memory storage are two COMPLETELY different things that have nothing to do with each other?
You do realize that server shortages and memory storage are two COMPLETELY different things that have nothing to do with each other?And to be honest, do you REALLY think that Microsoft has enough storage to put everything that the kineckt records in it? That would be petabytes of data. And they have so many better things to do with their money.Thats why there are server shortages everytime a major multiplayer shooter comes out. The servers are used for the data. ;)
I think he was joking.
I hope he was joking.
|
|
You do realize that server shortages and memory storage are two COMPLETELY different things that have nothing to do with each other?And to be honest, do you REALLY think that Microsoft has enough storage to put everything that the kineckt records in it? That would be petabytes of data. And they have so many better things to do with their money.Thats why there are server shortages everytime a major multiplayer shooter comes out. The servers are used for the data. ;)I think he was joking.
I hope he was joking.
Yes I was joking.
But a big pet peeve of mine is when a game company hypes up a big multiplayer game for a year before release. You see ads on TV, ads online, in magazines, ect.. They say pre orders are through the roof and its the companies biggest seller, ect..
Then when launch day comes and everyone that buys the game plays online they can't because the servers are jammed. The companies excuse "we had NO IDEA the demand for the game would be this big". *SIGH* You have the pre order numbers, you know what the demand is, make sure you supply the servers to handle the load.
I'm looking at you, Simcity, Diablo 3, WOW first couple of months.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
WoW really was a surprise when it first released, Everquest topped out around 500,000 and Blizzard didn't think they'd blow past that number like they did.
It's also kind of a catch-22. Consumer demand is going to be highest during the first 3-4 days after a release and taper off after that. It would be ridiculous to invest in massive infrastructure that you only use for 3-4 days. You can't just rent server space, everything has to be set up in the correct ways, plus once you start closing servers you'd have to migrate people's characters to other servers.
Either customers are mad that you don't have enough servers, or you paid for too many servers and are wasting large amounts of money. 95% of games require less server space after 1 month, so companies have learned to avoid over investing.
The solution as a consumer is to just wait 4-5 days. Yes, you might be behind the curve briefly, but over a month or so it won't be noticeable.
MMOs sometimes die on release because they have too many servers and not enough people, particularly if they were hyped and tried to fit in as many as they could but no one stuck around to pay the sub.
If the government shows up at MS headquarters with a court order for them to hand over all data received from everyone with a XBone.....
They don't need a court order...
I understand you don't care Scott, but other people do care about camera's in their home that are hooked up to the internet.Like your laptop, tablet, or smartphone, right? All of which feature both microphones and cameras, all of which sit in your home or on your person, and all of which are internet-accessible.
So it's cool if you really do have a problem with having a potential recording device like that, but I don't think very many people do. I think most people (and by most I mean very nearly everyone) has accepted that recording devices are more or less ubiquitous and that getting hung up on their mere presence is pointless.
So, sure, if you eschew laptops, cell phones, tablets, and webcams, I guess it's not hypocritical of you to criticize Microsoft for sticking a camera on their console (though still paranoid). But, come on. Are you really one of those people? Any of you?
I do recall a story about a government agency taking snapshots with citizens cell phones. But that was a couple years ago. I'll attempt to search for the actual article, but my point is that it's entirely plausible, and has been actually done before.
IMO, it's no longer paranoia. It's the reality.
That being said. I don't really care that much. My "give a crap" broke after actively trying to do something about it, and everyone shrugged it off as pointless. Seeing the futility, I stopped caring.
I see a bleak future. And I can't wait for it to happen. It's already started.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
So now you don't even have to have kinect plugged into XBone.
Another reversal. Wow. So now that Microsoft have basically done a total 180 on the XBone, how do we know we can trust them with anything they say in the future? ;) They might change there minds again.
Good news, but I'm sticking with PS4. Better hardware and cheaper.
I do recall a story about a government agency taking snapshots with citizens cell phones. But that was a couple years ago. I'll attempt to search for the actual article, but my point is that it's entirely plausible, and has been actually done before.
That's precisely my point. The Kinect is really no different than your cell phone's camera/microphone, except for the fact that, unlike your cell phone, the Kinect can only monitor you while you're in front of the TV.
IMO, it's no longer paranoia. It's the reality.
The fact that it is possible and has occurred before does not mean that these fears are suddenly not paranoia. The belief that a peripheral attached to your game console will be used to actively record audio and video of you on a constant basis and send that data to a megacorporation where it will be actively shared with the government in order to infringe upon your rights is a highly irrational belief that takes something relatively benign (a game console's camera) and turns it into something threatening (a government surveillance device that monitors everyone all the time) by injecting enough conspiracy theory to make WorldNetDaily jealous.
So now you don't even have to have kinect plugged into XBone.
Another reversal. Wow. So now that Microsoft have basically done a total 180 on the XBone, how do we know we can trust them with anything they say in the future? ;) They might change there minds again.
Good news, but I'm sticking with PS4. Better hardware and cheaper.
Except for the Kinect, obviously. Which is a) hardware that the PS4 doesn't have, and b) more than explains the cost discrepancy.
If people want to keep buying Microsoft junk, then go right aheadDid you have something worthwhile to contribute to the thread? Or is this just another drive-by flame?
Just your good buddy checking in. ;-)
And is hardware most gamers don't particularly give a damn about.
You have a source on that, I'm assuming.
Oh, and you have a non-arbitrary set of criteria for determining whether someone qualifies as a "gamer" or not, right? We all know how well separating people into "real gamers" and "fake gamers" goes over.
I'll do your homework for you, though. I don't mind.
There have been 78 million Xbox 360 consoles sold. There have been 24 million Kinect sensors sold. Even based purely on sales numbers, we already know without a doubt that 30% of Xbox 360 owners give something of a damn about Kinect. These numbers ignore anyone who a) hasn't tried Kinect, b) stopped using their 360 any time in the last three years, c) can't afford a Kinect, d) wanted to wait until the tech improved, e) doesn't have the space that a Kinect requires, f) likes the tech but hasn't found any interesting games yet, and so on.
In fact, I'd say it's nearly impossible to make a claim like "Most gamers don't give a damn about Kinect," given that it's almost certain that a majority of Xbox 360 owners have at least some interest in the Kinect technology. The only way that you could reduce that number to a size that makes it look like the Kinect is unpopular with gamers is by making the label of "gamer" so restrictive that it more accurately describes an angry internet person than it describes someone who enjoys video games.
And is hardware most gamers don't particularly give a damn about.You have a source on that, I'm assuming.
Possibly its just an opinion. I know I don't care for it.