Can a Wish Spell give a character a feat they qualify for or is this too much for a wish? Does it matter if the wish came from a cast spell or Deck of Many Things or creature?
Yes, I guess it can since it's pretty much up to the GM. But be really careful...
PC: "I wish I had an extra feat."
GM: "Your wish is my command."
(the next day, the PC wakes up with an extra left foot)
Or the Extra feat is something totally useless to their class. Or they wish for a specific feat and then they lose one they had. It depends on your DM. I had one who treated all wishes like they were there to screw you. No matter what you said it would do something harmful. I had another who treated them like unlimited wishes...
|
An extra feat is ALMOST within the price range of a wish spell, really. A PFS scenario in season four has an ioun stone that grants a feat of the player's choice when used. The catch? It's cursed and cannot be removed without a remove curse spell, and both detects as and causes the character to detect as evil. It's also such a NASTY item that the mere act of using it shifts your alignment a step towards evil.
Anyway, the cost of that item is 30,000 gp, and the cost of a wish is 25,000 gp, so I would drop that ioun stone off at the charater's feet and let them make the choice. :)
honestly I would think it depends.
I'd rule it may take multiple wishes depending on the feat.
And again, depends on the source. I may be wrong, but I don't think a Deck of Many Things is going to care, and may not mess it up. If it's in a person's interest (IE LG wish granter), they may not mess it up. If it was a devil against the party (because this totally happens...) he may screw it up.
@Coarthios sounds like a bad gm if every wish must fail.
I would word the wish spell similar to "I want the ability to do xyz" and just put in careful wording to replicate the effects of a feat.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
It depends on your DM. I had one who treated all wishes like they were there to screw you. No matter what you said it would do something harmful. I had another who treated them like unlimited wishes...
That's tragic. Unfortunately, I've known them too.
Me, I think of magic, like electricity, as taking the path of least resistance. So the magic called forth by a wish will find the easiest way to fulfill the wish. Often, that is by giving the wisher exactly what they want. Sometimes, not so much.
For example, if the wish is for a beautiful, kind, loving, wife, I think the magical energy to create such a person is much more difficult than to simply summon one from somewhere else - and whoever her current husband, boyfriend, father, brothers, etc., are, they won't be happy that she disappeared.
In fact, I think it's much easier to move things than to create them, and shorter distance is easier than long distance, so if you wish for a million GP, it would probably be teleported from local nobles, merchants, villagers, etc. - the whole community might have chipped in to your wealth. And if they have any left, there will probably be a spellcaster hired to find out who robbed them.
But I make these things known to anyone with enough Knowledge (Arcane) before they begin thinking about their wish. No surprises. Avoiding the above issues simply means wording the wish so that it states to create something new rather than simply transporting something existing.
To the OP, I personally don't think it would be too bad a thing to allow. I think it might be a bit overpowered. On the other hand, when I think about what that 25,000 GP could be spent on from the magic item list, I'm fairly sure that most things that can be done with a feat could be done with a 25,000 GP magic item. If they wished for a feat that could be duplicated by a more expensive item, I would require multiple wishes (just like the core book says for wishing for more than +1 to an ability score).
Obviously, how overpowered this can be is greatly dependent on the wealth level of the game. If your PCs are barely at, or below, the expected Wealth-by-Level chart, they may not be reasonably able to throw around 26,000 GP diamonds every time they dream up a feat they want. But if they're significantly over the WBL chart, then they might grab an extra dozen feats practically overnight - that could be a little unsettling to the GM's campaign.
Characters can't wish for game mechanics.
What sources says so?
And then why wish can grant ability bonuses, if is game mechanic? if you can wish to be stronger and get a +1 to strength I don't see why you cannot wish lets say something like power attack and get the Power Attack feat. Also given that a +1 to an ability score is equivalent to 1 feat I think is totally acceptable to wish a feat.
Here is a little more information. The wishes are from the Deck of Many Things. The character is a sorcerer (13th level) and wants to use the wishes(4) to gain the feats Expanded Arcana(2x) and the feats Eldritch Heritage and Improved Eldritch Heritage. The risk is so great from the Deck that I lean toward the wishes granting the feats. The Deck is also beyond mortal magic. I never had to deal with this in 1st or 2nd edition since feats did not exist like they do in Pathfinder or 3rd edition. There is also the variant Deck of Many Things in Pathfinder that does give feats for draws. I am just needing more opinions on this since getting feats fron wishes is a grey area.
With respects to wish backfiring:
Wish is the caster, himself, bending reality to suit him.
Asking an Efreeti for a wish is likely to get you Jafar'ed.
You may try to use a wish to produce greater effects than these, but doing so is dangerous. (The wish may pervert your intent into a literal but undesirable fulfillment or only a partial fulfillment, at the GM's discretion.)
I don't read this as DM carte blanche to piss in his player's face, with any and all castings of wish.
With respects to the power of level of wishing for a feat.
A basic character gets 5 ability increases over the course of 20 levels. Meanwhile he gets at least 10 feats.
There are items in the game that have feats tied into them, meaning it is possible to enchant an object with the power of a feat.
The Dark Blue Rhomboid Ioun stone and every metamagic rod, just to name some.
There are even items that venture into class-feature territory.
I don't believe that Wishing for a feat is beyond the scope of Wish.
Hell, I don't believe it should even fall within the category of wishes that are too dangerous.
-Nearyn
Nearyn You made some great points. I forgot about all the items that give feats.
pad300 The eldritch heritage feats are from the Arcane bloodline. This would give a familiar and bonus spells at 9th, 13th, and 17th level. The problem with giving the item is that it does not fulfill the wish exactly and there was a lot of danger getting the wishes. I also have never been picky about wish wording if it came from the Deck of Many Things. I always saw it as a reward and there was no force working against you since you took a risk and won a reward. I am picky if it is from just about any other source like a ring or casting the spell.
There is also the favored class bonus for human sorcerers. Instead of a skill point or hit point you can get another spell added that is 1 level lower than your highest level spell.
Thank you everyone for your replies. Anyone else have an opinion?
A GM (I would love to play in her world) has a list of Wish results,and the possible consequences, for the perusal of those who can actually CAST the spell and a much vaguer version for everyone else. Someone also posted a very similar system on these boards this year. Her 'list' had notes that wishing for 'X' would likely incur a drawback of some kind. The one 'feat' related 'chain' I can remember was that if you wished for a feat you didn't qualify for due to level was that it 1) went on your character sheet in ink, so no swapping it out afterwards and 2) it took your next available feat.
BTW, she has differing 'costs' for different feats and you got 'feat points by your levels. Look up the net book of feats for what she initially based off.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Well, I'd allow it, with two caveats.
First, stat bonuses granted by Wishes count against WBL. It seems fair that feats granted by Wishes should do likewise. Not that this is a consideration for the PC and possibly not for the player, but it should be for the GM.
Second, it's not very flavorful or logical to just hand over a feat in exchange for a draw of a card. There are more story possibilies in making HOW the feat is granted important. For instance, perhaps after wishing for Eldritch Heritage, Improved Eldritch Heritage, and Expanded Arcana (x2) the sorcerer involved gains an vial of blood/ichor originally drawn from a the source of a legendary sorcerous bloodline. This vial acts in a fashion similar to an Ampoule of False Blood, except that instead of replacing the sorcerer's bloodline, it adds those two feats and knowledge of the relevant spells.
On the surface, this gives the PC nothing more or less than what he or she wanted, but it opens up story possibilities. Perhaps the PC now has interesting and fragmentary dreams of events long past that can be story hooks. Perhaps this particular legendary bloodline is long extinct because of a hereditary supernatural feud the PC has now inherited. You don't want to screw over the player or PC, but you don't want miracles to feel purely mechanistic either.
Zog I really like your idea. I will use it. Bwang I will try to find the net book of feats you mentioned. Thanks.
I like the way the wish spell is better defined in Pathfinder versus 1st or 2nd edition D&D or for the old timers AD&D. A little more defination would be nice but not crucial. From all the comments I think I will allow the feats but I may impose a limit of 5 feats total for the characters lifetime similiar to the inherent bonus limit of +5 you can gain from wish spells. I don't think it will be a problem since wish spells don't happen very often unless we are using very old characters that are very high level but they are retired for now or probably forever.