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My current PFS rogue:
Male Halfling Rogue (Knife Master, Scout) 7
CG Small Humanoid (halfling)
Init +8; Senses Perception +11
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Defense
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AC 26, touch 19, flat-footed 20 (+6 armor, +6 Dex, +1 size, +1 natural, +1 deflection)
hp 59 (7d8+21)
Fort +6, Ref +13, Will +4; +2 vs. fear
Defensive Abilities blade sense +2, evasion
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Offense
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Speed 40 ft.
Melee +1 Agile Cold Iron Dagger +10 (1d3+11/19-20/x2) and
. . +1 Ghost touch Mithral Dagger +10 (1d3+3/19-20/x2)
Ranged Masterwork Composite shortbow (Str +0) +13 (1d4/x3)
Special Attacks scout's charge, sneak attack +4d8/+4d4
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Statistics
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Str 10, Dex 23, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 8, Cha 10
Base Atk +5; CMB +4; CMD 22
Feats Combat Reflexes (7 AoO/round), Piranha Strike -2/+4, Shadow Strike, Two-weapon Fighting, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus (Dagger)
Traits Indomitable Faith, Reactionary
Skills Acrobatics +16 (+21 to jump, +20 to move through a threatened square or enemy's space, +20 jump), Climb +5, Disable Device +18, Escape Artist +13, Fly +8, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +7, Knowledge (local) +4, Perception +11, Profession (Thief) +3, Sense Motive +3, Sleight of Hand +21 (+24 to conceal a light blade), Stealth +20, Survival -1 (+1 to avoid becoming lost), Swim +4, Use Magic Device +10
Languages Common, Halfling
SQ fearless, ghost touch, glamered, hidden blade +3, rogue talents (finesse rogue, offensive defense, weapon training)
Combat Gear Antitoxin (4); Other Gear +2 Glamered Mithral Chain shirt, +1 Agile Cold Iron Dagger, +1 Ghost touch Mithral Dagger, Masterwork Composite shortbow (Str +0), Amulet of natural armor +1, Belt of tumbling, Boots of striding and springing, Cloak of resistance +1, Gloves of larceny, Handy haversack (19 @ 280.9 lbs), Ioun stone (dusty rose prism), Ring of protection +1, Wayfinder (1 @ 0 lbs), Bedroll, Blanket, Block and tackle, Candle, Chain (10 ft.), Chalk, Crowbar, Earplugs, Everburning torch, Grappling hook, Paper, Silk rope, Thieves' tools, masterwork, Waterskin, Wrist sheath, spring loaded (empty), 12706 GP, 9 SP, 5 CP
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Special Abilities
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Belt of tumbling +4 competence bonus on Acrobatics to move through threatened square or enemy's space.
Blade Sense +2 (Ex) +2 dodge bonus to AC vs. attacks made against you with light blades
Combat Reflexes (7 AoO/round) Can make extra attacks of opportunity/rd, and even when flat-footed.
Earplugs +2 save vs. hearing effects, -5 hearing-based Perception.
Evasion (Ex) If you succeed at a Reflex save for half damage, you take none instead.
Fearless +2 racial bonus vs Fear saves.
Ghost touch Full damage against incorporeal creatures.
Glamered Assumes appearance of normal clothes on command.
Hidden Blade +3 +3 bonus on Slight of Hand checks to conceal a light blade.
Offensive Defense (Ex) Sneak attack grants a +1 dodge bonus to AC for each die rolled vs. that foe.
Piranha Strike -2/+4 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage with light weapons.
Scout's Charge (Ex) Charge attacks deal sneak attack damage as though foe is flat-footed.
Shadow Strike You can deal precision damage against targets with some concealment.
Sneak Attack +4d8/+4d4 +4d8 damage with a dagger-like weapon if you flank your target or your target is flat-footed.
Hero Lab® and the Hero Lab logo are Registered Trademarks of LWD Technology, Inc. Free download at http://www.wolflair.com
Pathfinder® and associated marks and logos are trademarks of Paizo Publishing, LLC®, and are used under license.
He's not optimized, but he's fun.
what the-
my droog you have indomitable faith and reactionary as your traits with Piranha Strike and a dual-archetype build at full mid PFS level range
you can say that is not optimized but I think you what you mean is you are worried that it is not optimized enough for this forum and thread people.
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what the-
my droog you have indomitable faith and reactionary as your traits with Piranha Strike and a dual-archetype build at full mid PFS level rangeyou can say that is not optimized but I think you what you mean is you are worried that it is not optimized enough for this forum and thread people.
can you translate that for dumb people like me?
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can you translate that for dumb people like me?
what the-
my droog you have indomitable faith and reactionary as your traits with Piranha Strike and a dual-archetype build at full mid PFS level rangeyou can say that is not optimized but I think you what you mean is you are worried that it is not optimized enough for this forum and thread people.
Optimization for standard play (what you have done) is different that optimization for the types of people who tend to frequent this forum (the kind of optimization that includes finding every available loophole to get the absolutely best out of a character, and is often called powergaming or min/maxing or one of a ton of other pejoratives, none of which anyone seems capable of actually explaining).
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Optimization for standard play (what you have done) is different that optimization for the types of people who tend to frequent this forum (the kind of optimization that includes finding every available loophole to get the absolutely best out of a character, and is often called powergaming or min/maxing or one of a ton of other pejoratives, none of which anyone seems capable of actually explaining).
Oh.
Is that bad?
I mean, should I have done things differently? He's like ... fun to play. And Stuff. He stabs hard. And hides his daggers well. This one time, in a PFS adventure, none of the characters could bring their weapons along and he TOTALLY hid his daggers.
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No, you've done very well. You've built a character that is pretty close to the best you can expect under normal circumstances. Obviously, the most important part is that you enjoy playing him.
Sadly, I can't bring myself to enjoy playing Rogues, because they just don't jive with what I want from a character. I've done the Roguish type before, but as a Ranger, instead.
Human Diversion if a thread person tells you that loving that character is wrong then you tell them that in that case you do not want to be right
and thank you Seranov
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I'm really bad at optimizing characters for combat/skills because I find much more enjoyment in playing characters that are well ... fun to play. So ... when I actually manage to optimize something, I enjoy basking in the few second glow of someone telling me I did it right.
My PFS cleric is modeled after Gaius Baltar from new BSG (specifically 1st season lecherous, sniveling, lying, horny, PoS Baltar). He's got almost zero melee ability but he can diplomasize/bluff with the best of them. I can't tell you the number of times he's pulled off the line, "Hello, I'm Venture Captain Jorza Wood ... " as an introduction.
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Not a problem.
If I had things my way, Rogues would be a lot Fightier than they are right now. In the most extreme circumstance, they'd axe the class completely and make a sort of archetype for the an existing class that had 8+Int skill points, bonuses to sneaking and such, and generally could both fight and be a skill monkey, instead of one or the other.
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Sneaking, sneak attacking, having lots of skills.
Any Int-based character can have as many or more skills than a Rogue (mostly because any Rogue who focuses on having a good Int score is EVEN WORSE at combat). A Wizard with 18 Int STARTS with 6 skills per level, and it only goes up from there, due to headbands and innate ability score increases. The Rogue, instead, is generally focusing on Str or Dex to help overcome his meh ability to fight, and will want a Wisdom headband to counteract his terrible Will save.
A Vivisectionist, for example, gets 8 skill points per level with 18 Int, which is also the stat his spells are based around. Assuming he has 14 or 16 Int, which may be more likely if he's intending to be a sneaky sneak-attacking fellow, he'd have 6 or 7 skills/level to the Rogue's 8, plus awesome "spellcasting," the Mutagen class feature and other nifty toys, in exchange for Evasion and Uncanny Dodge... and Trapfinding?
Yeah.
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Not a problem.
If I had things my way, Rogues would be a lot Fightier than they are right now. In the most extreme circumstance, they'd axe the class completely and make a sort of archetype for the an existing class that had 8+Int skill points, bonuses to sneaking and such, and generally could both fight and be a skill monkey, instead of one or the other.
If I had things my way, Rogues would get abilities that grant them in-combat applications of their skills. Like, say, weaponizing Disable Device against constructs.
Every time I try to build a decent rogue, I end up staring at the list of rogue talents and hating all of them.
I feel like a Scout/Swashbuckler could be a good idea-- combining the Swashbuckler's Acrobatics bonus with the Scout's love of battlefield mobility. I'd use the Swashbuckler's martial training to pick up a good polearm and turn it into a Power Attack/Combat Reflexes build. Getting to take Combat Trick twice certainly would help, as such a build would need plenty of combat feats.
I can't figure out the details of a solid build, but if somebody wants to use the idea and run with it they're welcome to it.
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If I had things my way, Rogues would get abilities that grant them in-combat applications of their skills. Like, say, weaponizing Disable Device against constructs.Not a problem.
If I had things my way, Rogues would be a lot Fightier than they are right now. In the most extreme circumstance, they'd axe the class completely and make a sort of archetype for the an existing class that had 8+Int skill points, bonuses to sneaking and such, and generally could both fight and be a skill monkey, instead of one or the other.
Things like that are FANTASTIC, but end up being ridiculously situational. Really, Rogues need bonuses to hit (they are the only martial class that gets zippo way to improve their ability to hit things), and a way to do damage that isn't reliant on Sneak Attack (which pushes most Rogues towards the Dex-heavy TWF style, which has problems of its own.).
Every time I try to build a decent rogue, I end up staring at the list of rogue talents and hating all of them.
I feel like a Scout/Swashbuckler could be a good idea-- combining the Swashbuckler's Acrobatics bonus with the Scout's love of battlefield mobility. I'd use the Swashbuckler's martial training to pick up a good polearm and turn it into a Power Attack/Combat Reflexes build. Getting to take Combat Trick twice certainly would help, as such a build would need plenty of combat feats.
I can't figure out the details of a solid build, but if somebody wants to use the idea and run with it they're welcome to it.
I have these problems, too. I want to make a Rogue! But the Rogue class just ain't good at it. The Ranger I made had all kinds of neat skills, with the ability to fight well, and even cast spells, besides!
Both of my Inquisitors have tons of skills, great martial ability and while they are different in flavor, they are much closer to how a Rogue should actually play.
Like some of the STR based builds that posters have presented! Guess I'll give a shot at a rogue build:
Halfling Rogue 12
Small Humanoid (halfling)
Init +7; Senses Perception +17
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Defense
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AC 24, touch 19, flat-footed 17 (+4 armor, +7 Dex, +1 size, +1 natural, +1 deflection)
hp 107 (12d8+50)
Fort +13, Ref +19 (+4 bonus vs. traps), Will +8; +2 vs. fear
Defensive Abilities evasion, improved uncanny dodge (lv >=16), trap sense
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Offense
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Speed 20 ft.
Ranged +3 Lucky Pistol +16/+16/+11 (1d6+10/x4)
Special Attacks sneak attack +6d6
Spell-Like Abilities Major Magic (Vanish) (2/day), Minor Magic (Ghost Sound) (3/day)
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Statistics
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Str 8, Dex 25, Con 18, Int 14, Wis 10, Cha 12
Base Atk +9; CMB +7; CMD 25
Feats Amateur Gunslinger, Deadly Aim -3/+6, Extra Grit, Gunsmithing, Point Blank Shot, Rapid Reload (Pistol), Rapid Shot, Shadow Strike
Traits Child of the Streets, Resilient
Skills Acrobatics +22 (+18 jump), Appraise +7, Bluff +16, Craft (alchemy) +17, Disable Device +26, Disguise +16, Escape Artist +22, Fly +9, Knowledge (arcana) +4, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +7, Knowledge (engineering) +4, Knowledge (geography) +4, Knowledge (history) +4, Knowledge (local) +7, Knowledge (nature) +4, Knowledge (nobility) +4, Knowledge (planes) +4, Knowledge (religion) +4, Perception +17 (+23 to locate traps), Sleight of Hand +23, Stealth +31 Modifiers swift as shadows
Languages Common, Halfling
SQ deed: quick clear, fearless, lucky (1/day), rogue talents (bleeding attack +6, firearm training, grit, major magic [vanish] [2/day], minor magic [ghost sound] [3/day], stealthy sniper), trapfinding +6
Other Gear +3 Quilted cloth armor, +3 Lucky Pistol, Amulet of natural armor +1, Belt of physical might (Dex & Con +4), Cloak of resistance +3, Oil of silence, Ring of protection +1, Stalker's mask (1/day), 150 GP
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Special Abilities
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Amateur Gunslinger Although you are not a gunslinger, you have and can use grit.
Bleeding Attack +6 (Ex) Sneak attacks also deal 6 bleed damage/round.
Deadly Aim -3/+6 Trade a penalty to ranged attacks for a bonus to ranged damage.
Deed: Quick Clear (Ex) While have grit, remove the effects of a misfire. Use 1 grit to do as move action.
Evasion (Ex) If you succeed at a Reflex save for half damage, you take none instead.
Fearless +2 racial bonus vs Fear saves.
Gunsmithing You can use a gunsmithing kit to craft/repair firearms and ammo.
Improved Uncanny Dodge (Lv >=16) (Ex) Retain DEX bonus to AC when flat-footed. You cannot be flanked unless the attacker is Level 16+.
Lucky (1/day) Holds 1 grit point, which is refreshed at the start of each day.
Major Magic (Vanish) (2/day) (Sp) Gain the chosen 1st-level spell as a spell-like ability.
Minor Magic (Ghost Sound) (3/day) (Sp) Gain the chosen cantrip as a spell-like ability.
Point Blank Shot +1 to attack and damage rolls with ranged weapons at up to 30 feet.
Rapid Reload (Pistol) You can reload fast with one type of Crossbow or Firearm.
Rapid Shot You get an extra attack with ranged weapons. Each attack is at -2.
Shadow Strike You can deal precision damage against targets with some concealment.
Sneak Attack +6d6 +6d6 damage if you flank your target or your target is flat-footed.
Stalker's mask (1/day) Take the face of one target in 60 ft, +10 to disguise as them, +2 to weapon att/dam vs them.
Stealthy Sniper (Ex) Sniping is only a -10 penalty, rather than -20.
Swift as Shadows Reduce the penalty for Stealth while moving by 5 and reduce the penalty for sniping by 10.
Trap Sense +4 (Ex) +4 bonus on reflex saves and AC against traps.
Trapfinding +6 Gain a bonus to find or disable traps, including magical ones.
Hero Lab® and the Hero Lab logo are Registered Trademarks of LWD Technology, Inc. Free download at http://www.wolflair.com
Pathfinder® and associated marks and logos are trademarks of Paizo Publishing, LLC®, and are used under license.
and for comparison:
Halfling Gunslinger 12
Small Humanoid (halfling)
Init +9; Senses Perception +19
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Defense
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AC 29, touch 23, flat-footed 18 (+5 armor, +7 Dex, +1 size, +1 natural, +1 deflection, +4 dodge)
hp 106 (12d10+36)
Fort +15, Ref +19, Will +11; +2 vs. fear
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Offense
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Speed 20 ft.
Ranged +4 Pistol +19/+19/+14/+9 (1d6+20/x4)
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Statistics
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Str 8, Dex 25, Con 17, Int 12, Wis 14, Cha 12
Base Atk +12; CMB +10; CMD 32
Feats Clustered Shots, Deadly Aim -4/+8, Dodge, Gunsmithing, Manyshot, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Reload (Pistol), Rapid Shot, Signature Deed (Deed: Bleeding Wound [Signature Deed])
Traits Anatomist, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +24 (+20 jump), Climb +10, Fly +9, Heal +11, Intimidate +9, Knowledge (engineering) +7, Knowledge (local) +8, Perception +19, Sleight of Hand +22, Stealth +11, Survival +11, Swim +8
Languages Common, Halfling
SQ deed: bleeding wound (signature deed), deed: covering shot, deed: dead shot, deed: deadeye, deed: expert loading, deed: gunslinger initiative, deed: gunslinger's dodge (+2 ac), deed: lightning reload, deed: pistol-whip, deed: quick clear, deed: startling shot, deed: targeting, deed: utility shot, fearless, grit, gun training +7 (double-barreled pistol), gun training +7 (pistol)
Other Gear +4 Quilted cloth armor, +4 Pistol, Amulet of natural armor +1, Belt of physical might (Dex & Con +4), Cloak of resistance +3, Ring of protection +1, 150 GP
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Special Abilities
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Anatomist +1 to confirm critical hits.
Clustered Shots Total damage from full-round ranged attacks before applying DR
Deadly Aim -4/+8 Trade a penalty to ranged attacks for a bonus to ranged damage.
Deed: Bleeding Wound (Signature Deed) (Ex) Use 1 grit to deal Dex bleed dam, or use 2 grit to deal 1 Str/Dex/Con bleed.
Deed: Covering Shot (Ex) Use 1 grit, entangle missed foe for 1 round.
Deed: Dead Shot (Ex) Use 1 grit, all att rolls vs 1 foe, hit if any of them do, higher dam with more hits.
Deed: Deadeye (Ex) Use 1 grit per extra range increment to make a touch attack beyond the first.
Deed: Expert Loading (Ex) Use 1 grit, prevent broken gun from exploding due to misfire.
Deed: Gunslinger Initiative (Ex) While have Grit, can use a free hand to draw a non-hidden firearm as part of the initiative check.
Deed: Gunslinger's Dodge (+2 AC) (Ex) Use 1 grit, immediately move 5 ft/drop prone to gain 1x/2x bonus to AC vs ranged attack.
Deed: Lightning Reload (Ex) While have grit, reload 1 barrel as a swift action with no AoO, or free with Rapid Reload.
Deed: Pistol-Whip (Ex) Use 1 grit, melee attack with firearm gains enh. bonus and free CMB check to knock prone.
Deed: Quick Clear (Ex) While have grit, remove the effects of a misfire. Use 1 grit to do as move action.
Deed: Startling Shot (Ex) While have Grit, standard action to make attack that makes flat-footed until next turn but no dam.
Deed: Targeting (Ex) Use 1 grit, full rd action to choose body part to hit for specific effects.
Deed: Utility Shot While have grit, gain a variety of useful tricks with a firearm.
Fearless +2 racial bonus vs Fear saves.
Grit (Ex) Gain a pool of points that are spent to fuel deeds, regained on firearm crit/killing blow.
Gun Training +7 (Double-barreled pistol) (Ex) On a misfire with chosen firearm type, misfire value only increase by 2 (instead of 4).
Gun Training +7 (Pistol) (Ex) On a misfire with chosen firearm type, misfire value only increase by 2 (instead of 4).
Gunsmithing You can use a gunsmithing kit to craft/repair firearms and ammo.
Manyshot You can shoot two arrows as the first attack of a full attack action.
Point Blank Shot +1 to attack and damage rolls with ranged weapons at up to 30 feet.
Precise Shot You don't get -4 to hit when shooting or throwing into melee.
Rapid Reload (Pistol) You can reload fast with one type of Crossbow or Firearm.
Rapid Shot You get an extra attack with ranged weapons. Each attack is at -2.
Signature Deed (Deed: Bleeding Wound [Signature Deed]) Pick a deed that you have access to and that you must spend grit to perform. You can perform this deed for 1 fewer grit point (minimum 0). If the amount of grit needed to perform the deed is reduced to 0, you can perform this deed for the normal acti
Hero Lab® and the Hero Lab logo are Registered Trademarks of LWD Technology, Inc. Free download at http://www.wolflair.com
Pathfinder® and associated marks and logos are trademarks of Paizo Publishing, LLC®, and are used under license.
Both are about 10k under wealth by level, I didn't account for the cost of ammunition. If my costs are unreasonably, they could both save a bundle by having +2 stat belts instead of four! The gunslinger used his signature dead on bleeding wound since it kept the builds similar. After putting them together, the gunslinger is probably better, but the rogue has some perks, and sniping at no penalty (swift as shadows + stealthy sniper) is kinda cool!
You know, even if they suck I at least have fun building Rogues.
I'll make 3 characters later on. A Rogue, a Ninja, and a Vivisectionist, and see which one comes out on top.
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Sneaking, sneak attacking, having lots of skills.Sneak attacking isn't a job, it's a tool. Other classes have their own tools for dealing damage. Alchemists have mutagen and the self-targeting polymorph spells. Bards have inspire courage and their buffing spells. Clerics have divine favor, divine power, and righteous might. And so on. All of them are things that allow the class to deal better damage. All of them are just as valid as sneak attack and most of them are better.
I agree with you. But Sneak Attack is the Rogue's thing, even if they've given it to other classes. Sadly, it's nowhere near enough on its own.
Rogues should get more abilities, like trapspotter for free at some point of level etc. Also full BAB or something else adequate as well as medium armor proficiency. And last but not least some more feats ( not as much as fighters, but close). Or at least some rogue talents that are similar to some good combat feats or perhaps better, taking shortcuts etc.
The rogue has lost his original role as the trapguy and skillmonkey, because like it was shown abundantly, there are plenty of other classes who can do that as well and even better. So what´s the rogue without that? A tactical and weaker fighter with no magic backup, but a lot of social skills and talents.
So there are other fighters with similar ability roles, like the Paladin and the ranger. Smite evil and favored enemy are features comparable to sneak attack, the difference is though that both other classes can do a lot of damage without sneak attack too, because they are full BAB and have more proficiencies with weapons and armor. Besides that they can buff themselves with their magic.
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I agree with you. But Sneak Attack is the Rogue's thing, even if they've given it to other classes. Sadly, it's nowhere near enough on its own.
Reading this thread has given me an idea for a new house rule I'm gonna start using:
1/2 the rogue's level to attack and damage when attacking something that can be crit/snuck.
On a more general note, I'd also like to see more done with in-combat traps/snares and rogues.
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I'm amused by how this thread has sort of declined into a "why we don't like rogues" thread.
Personally I don't think they're that bad. Yes, 3/4 BAB is a handicap, but remember-- they're intended to be hitting either flanked or flat-footed AC.
What I really wish is that rogues got whip or net proficiency. Then they could go for a build that trips or entangles enemies and then sneak attacks the tar out of them.
Actually, there's a half-orc option that starts with whip and net proficiency isn't there? That might be an idea for a rogue build...
I was rooting for Team Synthesist Debate myself.
Entangled and tripped do not trigger sneak attack. Also with medium BAB you will have quite a lot of problems doing that maneuvers after some time.
It´s nice to be flanking and/or hitting flat-footed AC, but you need to come there first and also you need some means to survive somehow if you don´t down your oponent in the first round. The still wide-spread GM miscnoception of "oh you´re doing sneak attack, the foe turns to you" all the while the two-handed fighter or barbarian are swinging their greatswords for crazy damage on the other side, the alchemist is throwing nuclear nukes and all sorts of other crazy stuff are going on doesn´t help.
Here is a rogue build at level 12 without an archetype. While it does benefit from the scout archetype, it isn't absolutely necessary.
Half Orc Rogue
Str 17 (20 at 12th), Dex 14, Con 13, Int 13, Wis 10, Cha 12
Feats and Rogue Talents:
level 1: Combat expertise
Level 2: RT: combat trick (Improved Feint)
level 3: shadow strike
level 4: RT: weapon trick (Greataxe)
level 5: Power Attack
level 6: RT: Offensive defense
level 7: Furious Focus
level 8: RT: Trapspotter
level 9: Vital Strike
level 10: ART: Entanglement of blades
level 11: Greater Improved Feint
level 12: ART: Opportunist
Traits: Armor Expert, Legacy of Sand
Skills at 12th: Acrobatics +17, Bluff +27, Diplomacy +21, Disable Device +17 (+23 vs traps), Perception +15 (+21 vs traps), Stealth +17, Use Magic Device +16, 24 skill points scattered among other skills
Gear at 12th: Greataxe +4, Belt of Giant Strength +4, Mithril Breatplate +3, Cloak of Resistance +4, Ring of Protection +2, Amulet of Natural Armor +1, Quick Runner's Shirt, Boots of Striding and Leaping, Mulberry Penatcle Ioun Stone, Wayfinder, Handy Haversack, Approximately 1500 gold in potions and other gear
melee attack with greataxe at 12th using power attack and feint: +21 to hit vs. target denied dex, 2d12+23+6d6
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Let's see... Inorc, a Half-Orc Inquisitor who wants Rorc's job. Please, note that Inorc here could have dumped Cha and still be just as good at Bluff, Intimidate and Diplomacy.
He also makes no use whatsoever of Monster's Lore.
Half-Orc (Mystic) Inquisitor 1
NG Medium Humanoid (human, orc)
Init +4; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +6
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Defense
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AC 20, touch 12, flat-footed 18 (+6 armor, +2 shield, +2 Dex)
hp 10 (1d8+2); judgement of sacred healing 1
Fort +5 (+4 vs. hot or cold environments and to resist damage from suffocation), Ref +3, Will +5; +2 trait bonus vs. charm and compulson
Defensive Abilities judgement of sacred protection +1; DR judgement of sacred resiliency 1: magic; Resist judgement of sacred purity +1, judgement of sacred resistance 2 (fire)
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Offense
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Speed 20 ft.
Melee Heavy Shield Bash -1 (1d4+3/x2) and
. . Longspear +3 (1d8+4/x3) and
. . Scimitar +3 (1d6+3/18-20/x2)
Special Attacks judgement of sacred destruction +1, judgement of sacred justice +1, judgement of sacred piercing +1, judgement of sacred smiting (magic)
Inquisitor Spells Known (CL 1):
1 (2/day) Protection from Evil, Litany of Sloth
0 (at will) Read Magic, Create Water, Detect Magic, Guidance
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Statistics
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Str 16, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 10
Base Atk +0; CMB +3; CMD 15
Feats Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round), Endurance (Shaman's Apprentice)
Traits Birthmark, Reactionary
Skills Acrobatics -5 (-9 jump), Bluff +6, Climb -4, Diplomacy +6, Escape Artist -5, Fly -5, Intimidate +7, Knowledge (arcana) +4 (+6 to identify the abilities and weaknesses of creatures), Perception +6, Ride -5, Sense Motive +7, Stealth -1, Swim -4 (+0 to resist nonlethal damage from exhaustion) Modifiers monster lore
Languages Common, Orc
SQ domains (conversion inquisition), judgement (1/day)
Combat Gear Alchemist's fire (2); Other Gear Four-mirror armor, Heavy wooden shield, Longspear, Scimitar, 28 GP
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Special Abilities
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Birthmark +2 save vs. charm & compulsion
Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round) Can make extra attacks of opportunity/rd, and even when flat-footed.
Darkvision (60 feet) You can see in the dark (black and white vision only).
Endurance (Shaman's Apprentice) +4 to a variety of skill checks. Sleep in L/M armor with no fatigue.
Inquisitor Domain (Conversion Inquisition) Deities: Any deity.
Granted Powers: You are a powerful persuader. A honeyed tongue empowered by divine argumentation sways the indifferent and adversarial to your side.
Judgement (1/day) (Su) Variable bonuses increase as the combat continues.
Judgement of Sacred Destruction +1 (Su) Weapon Damage bonus.
Judgement of Sacred Healing 1 (Su) Fast Healing
Judgement of Sacred Justice +1 (Su) Attack bonus
Judgement of Sacred Piercing +1 (Su) Concentration and vs. SR bonus
Judgement of Sacred Protection +1 (Su) AC bonus
Judgement of Sacred Purity +1 (Su) Save bonus
Judgement of Sacred Resiliency 1: Magic (Su) DR/magic
Judgement of Sacred Resistance 2 (Fire) (Su) Energy Resistances
Judgement of Sacred Smiting (Magic) (Su) DR bypass
Monster Lore +2 (Ex) +2 to Knowledge checks when identifying the weaknessess of creatures.
At 1st level, survivability is more important than raw damage, luckly, unlike Rorc, Inorc can wear medium armor and carry a shield without any problems. Endurance means he gets to sleep in that armor too.
His spells are nothing incredibly awesome, but Detect Magic and Protection From Evil can save his life.
Once per day he can boost either his AC, attack, damage or saves. Alternatively, eh can choose to bypass DR/magic or grant himself fast healing 1 or energy resistance 1. Not bad.
Having 2 less skill points than Rorc, Inorc doesn't take UMD because he has the spells most commonly found in wands in his spell list, CLW and lesser restoration. He also doesn't invest in Disable Device because, honestly, who cares?
xoxoxoxoxoxoxoxox
Half-Orc (Mystic) Inquisitor 3
NG Medium Humanoid (human, orc)
Init +6; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +8
--------------------
Defense
--------------------
AC 21, touch 12, flat-footed 19 (+7 armor, +2 shield, +2 Dex)
hp 23 (3d8+6); judgement of sacred healing 2
Fort +6 (+4 vs. hot or cold environments and to resist damage from suffocation), Ref +4, Will +6; +2 trait bonus vs. charm and compulson
Defensive Abilities judgement of sacred protection +1; DR judgement of sacred resiliency 1: magic; Resist judgement of sacred purity +1, judgement of sacred resistance 4 (fire)
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 20 ft.
Melee Heavy Shield Bash +1 (1d4+3/x2) and
. . Cold Iron Scimitar +5 (1d6+3/18-20/x2) and
. . Silversheen Scimitar +6 (1d6+3/18-20/x2)
Ranged Masterwork Composite longbow (Str +3) +5 (1d8+3/x3)
Special Attacks judgement of sacred destruction +2, judgement of sacred justice +1, judgement of sacred piercing +2, judgement of sacred smiting (magic)
Spell-Like Abilities Detect Alignment (At will)
Inquisitor Spells Known (CL 3):
1 (4/day) Divine Favor, Shield of Faith, Protection from Evil, Litany of Sloth
0 (at will) Stabilize, Read Magic, Create Water, Detect Magic, Guidance, Light
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 16, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 10
Base Atk +2; CMB +5; CMD 17
Feats Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round), Endurance (Shaman's Apprentice), Lookout, Weapon Focus (Longspear)
Traits Birthmark, Reactionary
Skills Acrobatics -3 (-7 jump), Bluff +8, Climb -2, Diplomacy +8, Escape Artist -3, Fly -3, Intimidate +9, Perception +8, Ride -3, Sense Motive +9, Spellcraft +6, Stealth +3, Survival +2 (+3 to track), Swim -2 (+2 to resist nonlethal damage from exhaustion) Modifiers monster lore
Languages Common, Orc
SQ domains (conversion inquisition), judgement (1/day), solo tactics, teamwork feat (change 2/day), track
Combat Gear Alchemist's fire (3), Holy water (3); Other Gear +1 Breastplate, Heavy wooden shield, Cold Iron Scimitar, Masterwork Composite longbow (Str +3), Silversheen Scimitar, 13 GP
--------------------
Special Abilities
--------------------
Birthmark +2 save vs. charm & compulsion
Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round) Can make extra attacks of opportunity/rd, and even when flat-footed.
Darkvision (60 feet) You can see in the dark (black and white vision only).
Detect Alignment (At will) (Sp) Detect chaos, evil, good, or law at will.
Endurance (Shaman's Apprentice) +4 to a variety of skill checks. Sleep in L/M armor with no fatigue.
Inquisitor Domain (Conversion Inquisition) Deities: Any deity.
Granted Powers: You are a powerful persuader. A honeyed tongue empowered by divine argumentation sways the indifferent and adversarial to your side.
Judgement (1/day) (Su) Variable bonuses increase as the combat continues.
Judgement of Sacred Destruction +2 (Su) Weapon Damage bonus.
Judgement of Sacred Healing 2 (Su) Fast Healing
Judgement of Sacred Justice +1 (Su) Attack bonus
Judgement of Sacred Piercing +2 (Su) Concentration and vs. SR bonus
Judgement of Sacred Protection +1 (Su) AC bonus
Judgement of Sacred Purity +1 (Su) Save bonus
Judgement of Sacred Resiliency 1: Magic (Su) DR/magic
Judgement of Sacred Resistance 4 (Fire) (Su) Energy Resistances
Judgement of Sacred Smiting (Magic) (Su) DR bypass
Lookout Act in the surprise rouns if an adjacent ally with this feat can act in the surprise round.
Monster Lore +2 (Ex) +2 to Knowledge checks when identifying the weaknessess of creatures.
Solo Tactics (Ex) Count Teamwork feats as if your allies had the same ones.
Teamwork Feat (change 2/day) Swap your most recent Teamwork feat for another
Track +1 Add the listed bonus to survival checks made to track.
3rd level... Defense is still better than raw damage, IMO. So Inorc is still using his scimitar and shield. He will focus more on offensive tactics soon enough.
Right now, Inorc can detect every allignment ever and he adds half his level to all Sense Motive and Intimidate checks. He's already a better party face than Rorc.
He also adds his Wisdom to initiative, giving him a good advantage, oh and he got a Look Out from his bonus teamwork feats (why do Inquisitors get this anyway? I think Paizo just pidgeonholed those feats here so someone actually uses them.)
He has more combat focused spells now, including Divine Favor and Shield of Faith.
xoxoxoxoxoxoxoxox
Half-Orc (Mystic) Inquisitor 6
NG Medium Humanoid (human, orc)
Init +6; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +11
--------------------
Defense
--------------------
AC 22, touch 12, flat-footed 20 (+8 armor, +2 shield, +2 Dex)
hp 42 (6d8+12); judgement of sacred healing 3
Fort +9 (+4 vs. hot or cold environments and to resist damage from suffocation), Ref +6, Will +9; +2 trait bonus vs. charm and compulson
Defensive Abilities judgement of sacred protection +2; DR judgement of sacred resiliency 2: magic; Resist judgement of sacred purity +2, judgement of sacred resistance 6 (fire)
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 20 ft.
Melee Heavy Shield Bash +4 (1d4+4/x2) and
. . +1 Silversheen Longspear +10 (1d8+7/x3) and
. . Masterwork Cold Iron Longspear +10 (1d8+6/x3) and
. . Silversheen Scimitar +9 (1d6+4/18-20/x2)
Ranged Masterwork Composite longbow (Str +4) +7 (1d8+4/x3)
Special Attacks bane (+2 / 2d6) (6 rounds/day), judgement of sacred destruction +3, judgement of sacred justice +2, judgement of sacred piercing +3, judgement of sacred smiting (magic, good)
Spell-Like Abilities Detect Alignment (At will), Discern Lies (6 rounds/day)
Inquisitor Spells Known (CL 6):
2 (4/day) Restoration, Lesser, Knock, Silence (DC 14), Invisibility
1 (5/day) Divine Favor, Shield of Faith, Protection from Evil, Litany of Sloth
0 (at will) Stabilize, Read Magic, Create Water, Detect Magic, Guidance, Light
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 19, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 10
Base Atk +4; CMB +8; CMD 20
Feats Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round), Endurance (Shaman's Apprentice), Lookout, Outflank, Power Attack -2/+4, Weapon Focus (Longspear)
Traits Birthmark, Reactionary
Skills Acrobatics -3 (-7 jump), Bluff +11, Climb -1, Diplomacy +11, Escape Artist -3, Fly -3, Intimidate +14, Perception +11, Ride -3, Sense Motive +14, Spellcraft +9, Stealth +8, Survival +2 (+5 to track), Swim -1 (+3 to resist nonlethal damage from exhaustion) Modifiers monster lore
Languages Common, Orc
SQ domains (conversion inquisition), judgement (2/day), solo tactics, teamwork feat (change 2/day), track
Combat Gear Wand of cure light wounds, Wand of Restoration, Lesser; Other Gear +2 Breastplate, Heavy wooden shield, +1 Silversheen Longspear, Masterwork Cold Iron Longspear, Masterwork Composite longbow (Str +4), Silversheen Scimitar, Belt of giant strength +2, Cloak of resistance +1, Masterwork tool (Stealth), 463 GP
--------------------
Special Abilities
--------------------
Bane (+2 / 2d6) (6 rounds/day) (Su) Make the weapon you are holding a bane weapon.
Birthmark +2 save vs. charm & compulsion
Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round) Can make extra attacks of opportunity/rd, and even when flat-footed.
Darkvision (60 feet) You can see in the dark (black and white vision only).
Detect Alignment (At will) (Sp) Detect chaos, evil, good, or law at will.
Discern Lies (6 rounds/day) (Sp) Discern Lies at will
Endurance (Shaman's Apprentice) +4 to a variety of skill checks. Sleep in L/M armor with no fatigue.
Inquisitor Domain (Conversion Inquisition) Deities: Any deity.
Granted Powers: You are a powerful persuader. A honeyed tongue empowered by divine argumentation sways the indifferent and adversarial to your side.
Judgement (2/day) (Su) Variable bonuses increase as the combat continues.
Judgement of Sacred Destruction +3 (Su) Weapon Damage bonus.
Judgement of Sacred Healing 3 (Su) Fast Healing
Judgement of Sacred Justice +2 (Su) Attack bonus
Judgement of Sacred Piercing +3 (Su) Concentration and vs. SR bonus
Judgement of Sacred Protection +2 (Su) AC bonus
Judgement of Sacred Purity +2 (Su) Save bonus
Judgement of Sacred Resiliency 2: Magic (Su) DR/magic
Judgement of Sacred Resistance 6 (Fire) (Su) Energy Resistances
Judgement of Sacred Smiting (Magic, Good) (Su) DR bypass
Lookout Act in the surprise rouns if an adjacent ally with this feat can act in the surprise round.
Monster Lore +2 (Ex) +2 to Knowledge checks when identifying the weaknessess of creatures.
Outflank Flanking bonus increases to +4 if the other flanker also has this feat, and ally gets an AoO if you score a critical hit against the target.
Power Attack -2/+4 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Solo Tactics (Ex) Count Teamwork feats as if your allies had the same ones.
Teamwork Feat (change 2/day) Swap your most recent Teamwork feat for another
Track +3 Add the listed bonus to survival checks made to track.
Invisibility, Knock and Silence. His spell list alone make him a great infiltrator. Admitedly, he doesn't have many spells per day, but even without them, he's on par with Rorc. Actually, he might be better, because Guidance can be cast at-will and gives him a +1 bonus. He can also use Discern Lies at will. Now he's an even better party face.
On the combat front, he now can sue Judgement twice a day (its effects increased considerably and it lasts the whole encounter, BTW) and use the Bane ability for 6 rounds a day. While he uses his longspear most of the time, Inorc can also use the good old scimitar and shield combination whenever he feels more AC is needed.
xoxoxoxoxoxoxoxox
Half-Orc (Mystic) Inquisitor 10
NG Medium Humanoid (human, orc)
Init +7; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +16
--------------------
Defense
--------------------
AC 24, touch 14, flat-footed 22 (+9 armor, +2 Dex, +1 natural, +2 deflection)
hp 78 (10d8+30); judgement of sacred healing 4
Fort +13 (+4 vs. hot or cold environments and to resist damage from suffocation), Ref +8, Will +13; +2 trait bonus vs. charm and compulson
Defensive Abilities judgement of sacred protection +3 / +6; DR judgement of sacred resiliency 3 (evil); Resist judgement of sacred purity +3 / +6, judgement of sacred resistance 8 (fire)
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 20 ft.
Melee Heavy Shield Bash +8/+3 (1d4+5/x2) and
. . +1 Cold Iron Longspear +14/+9 (1d8+8/x3) and
. . +1 Silversheen Scimitar +13/+8 (1d6+6/18-20/x2) and
. . +2 Silversheen Longspear +15/+10 (1d8+9/x3)
Ranged +1 Adaptive Composite longbow (Str +4) +10/+5 (1d8+6/x3)
Special Attacks bane (+2 / 2d6) (10 rounds/day), judgement of sacred destruction +4, judgement of sacred justice +3 / +6, judgement of sacred piercing +4, judgement of sacred smiting (magic, good, adamanti
Spell-Like Abilities Detect Alignment (At will), Discern Lies (10 rounds/day)
Inquisitor Spells Known (CL 10):
4 (1/day) Invisibility, Greater, Freedom of Movement
3 (4/day) Protection from Energy, Heroism, Dispel Magic, Burst of Speed
2 (5/day) Restoration, Lesser, Knock, Tongues, Silence (DC 15), Invisibility
1 (6/day) Divine Favor, Shield of Faith, Protection from Evil, Comprehend Languages, Litany of Sloth
0 (at will) Stabilize, Read Magic, Create Water, Detect Magic, Guidance, Light
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 20, Dex 14, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 10
Base Atk +7; CMB +12; CMD 29
Feats Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round), Defensive Combat Training, Endurance (Shaman's Apprentice), Escape Route, Lookout, Lunge, Outflank, Power Attack -2/+4, Weapon Focus (Longspear)
Traits Birthmark, Reactionary
Skills Acrobatics -1 (-5 jump), Bluff +16, Climb +2, Diplomacy +16, Escape Artist -1, Fly -1, Intimidate +21, Perception +16, Ride -1, Sense Motive +21, Spellcraft +13, Stealth +14, Survival +3 (+8 to track), Swim +2 (+6 to resist nonlethal damage from exhaustion) Modifiers monster lore
Languages Common, Orc
SQ domains (conversion inquisition), judgement (4/day), solo tactics, swaying word (1/day) (dc 18), teamwork feat (change 3/day), track
Combat Gear Wand of cure light wounds, Wand of Restoration, Lesser; Other Gear +3 Breastplate, +1 Heavy steel shield, +1 Adaptive Composite longbow (Str +4), +1 Cold Iron Longspear, +1 Silversheen Scimitar, +2 Silversheen Longspear, Amulet of natural armor +1, Belt of physical might (Str & Con +2), Cloak of resistance +2, Headband of inspired wisdom +2, Ring of protection +2, Masterwork tool (Stealth), 735 GP
--------------------
Special Abilities
--------------------
Bane (+2 / 2d6) (10 rounds/day) (Su) Make the weapon you are holding a bane weapon.
Birthmark +2 save vs. charm & compulsion
Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round) Can make extra attacks of opportunity/rd, and even when flat-footed.
Darkvision (60 feet) You can see in the dark (black and white vision only).
Detect Alignment (At will) (Sp) Detect chaos, evil, good, or law at will.
Discern Lies (10 rounds/day) (Sp) Discern Lies at will
Endurance (Shaman's Apprentice) +4 to a variety of skill checks. Sleep in L/M armor with no fatigue.
Escape Route You do not provoke attacks of opportunity when moving through spaces adjacent to allies
Inquisitor Domain (Conversion Inquisition) Deities: Any deity.
Granted Powers: You are a powerful persuader. A honeyed tongue empowered by divine argumentation sways the indifferent and adversarial to your side.
Judgement of Sacred Destruction +4 (Su) Weapon Damage bonus.
Judgement of Sacred Healing 4 (Su) Fast Healing
Judgement of Sacred Justice +3 / +6 (Su) Attack bonus
Judgement of Sacred Piercing +4 (Su) Concentration and vs. SR bonus
Judgement of Sacred Protection +3 / +6 (Su) AC bonus
Judgement of Sacred Purity +3 / +6 (Su) Save bonus
Judgement of Sacred Resiliency 3 (Evil) (Su) DR/magic
Judgement of Sacred Resistance 8 (Fire) (Su) Energy Resistances
Judgement of Sacred Smiting (Magic, Good, Adamantine) (Su) DR bypass
Lookout Act in the surprise rouns if an adjacent ally with this feat can act in the surprise round.
Lunge Can increase reach by 5 ft, but take -2 to AC for 1 rd.
Monster Lore +3 (Ex) +3 to Knowledge checks when identifying the weaknessess of creatures.
Outflank Flanking bonus increases to +4 if the other flanker also has this feat, and ally gets an AoO if you score a critical hit against the target.
Power Attack -2/+4 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Second Judgement (4/day) (Su) Variable bonuses increase as the combat continues.
Solo Tactics (Ex) Count Teamwork feats as if your allies had the same ones.
Swaying Word (1/day) (DC 18) (Sp) Spoken word of divine wisdom dominates one person for 1 min (Will neg).
Teamwork Feat (change 3/day) Swap your most recent Teamwork feat for another
Track +5 Add the listed bonus to survival checks made to track.
Oh, come on! That's just mean! Inorc's lists of spells known now include Greater Invisibility, Freedom of Movement, Dispel Magic, Tongues and Heroism. And of course, the ones he already had, like Knock and Silence. He could have gotten Find Traps too, but that would be too cruel to Rorc.
Now he can use two judgements at once! Which means he could boost his to-hit by 3 and his damage by 4. Or, if defense is more important at the moment, boost his AC by 3 and get sacred healing . Among other things.
Since Inorc doesn't have to boost his saves as badly as Rorc does, he could use the money to improve his good ol' Breast Plate.
Only his Ref save is lower than Rorc's, but by now, Reflex is not nearly as important as Fort and Will. Besides, he invested just 1/3 of the money in his Cloak of Resistance and didn't have to spend a trait. Not to mention he actually benefits from his Headband of Wisdom! Not only it boosts his will save, initiative and spells, it also makes him better at Diplomacy and Bluff.
xoxoxoxoxoxoxoxox
If it's up to me... Rorc just lost his job.
Neither Rorc nor Inorc is too optimized.
Rorc could have gone the Dex-based TWFer route, but I feel that would hurt him more than help.
Then again, Inorc could have gotten the Travel domain and/or made better use of his scimitar and falchion proficiency, but I gave him a longspear for the sake of fairness.
Inorc is a better scout, party-face and warrior.
The only advantage Rorc has is his Sneak Attack, which is not a bad trick, but it gets more and more situational, since enemies with crazy senses like blindsight and/or immunity to precision damage appear more often.
+2 skill points and situational damage boost is not enough to be on par with 2/3 spell casting, swift-action self-buffing, very useful and flavorful at-will abilities and much better saves.
My conclusion is:
Compared to other classes, Rogues can certainly be that bad.
Took a look at least one of the builds. You guys forgot something.
Give the Rogue a heavy mithral shield. Doesn't matter that Rogues aren't proficient, there's no penalty. Then enchant the bejeezus out of it. Costs a mere 1020gp.
If you want to get mean about it, make sure the race you take is Goblin. At first level, without dexterity bonuses added in, you have a +12 Stealth. Then if you want to be really mean, grab a standard Medium dagger, use the Knife Master archetype, Dodge, Mobility, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus, Outflank and some poison (there's even a poison sheath/sponge you can get in Ultimate Equipment). Enjoy your brutal flanking attacks, especially since you can see in the dark and therefore don't need a torch to give away your location.
????
Is there something going on I should know about?
Took a look at least one of the builds. You guys forgot something.
Give the Rogue a heavy mithral shield. Doesn't matter that Rogues aren't proficient, there's no penalty. Then enchant the bejeezus out of it. Costs a mere 1020gp.
If you want to get mean about it, make sure the race you take is Goblin. At first level, without dexterity bonuses added in, you have a +12 Stealth. Then if you want to be really mean, grab a standard Medium dagger, use the Knife Master archetype, Dodge, Mobility, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus, Outflank and some poison (there's even a poison sheath/sponge you can get in Ultimate Equipment). Enjoy your brutal flanking attacks, especially since you can see in the dark and therefore don't need a torch to give away your location.
A medium sized light weapon in the hands of a small character is no longer a light weapon. You can't use it with weapon finesse.
And you're a goblin. The roleplaying penalties for that are not quite as bad as for being an antipaladin, but if your GM plays NPCs as people you'd be kicked out of most towns.
So? Disguise. Stuff yourself into a backpack. Slap a pair of bunny ears on and make like a rabbit. Do I seriously have to come up with schemes around this? Ain't hard, you can do it yourself.
The dagger thing, I'd want to see an official ruling on that, especially since the dagger only weighs a pound anyway, and is made for thrusting, so no balance issues.
This thread got me to dig up my 3.0 rogue and convert him to Pathfinder. He's your basic city boy/trap monkey. Goals for 1st level: find and disarm traps, be able to sneak attack without a flanker, and bask in the glow of not having a stat below 12 (seriously). . .
Male human rogue 1
CG Medium humanoid (human)
Init +5 Senses Perception +6 (+7 vs. traps)
Languages Common, Goblin
DEFENSE
AC 15, touch 13, flat-footed 12 (+3 Dex, +2 armor)
CMD 14
hp 10 (1 HD)
Fort +1 Ref +5 Will +2
OFFENSE
Spd 30 ft. (6 squares)
Melee rapier +1 (1d6+1/18-20)
Melee sap +1 (1d6+1/x2)
Ranged sling +3 (1d4+1/19-20), range 50 ft
Special Attack sneak attack 1d6
Base Atk +0; CMB +1
Combat Gear 10 bullets
Other Gear rapier, sap, sling, leather armor; backpack, bedroll, chalk, cold weather outfit, explorer's outfit (worn), flint and steel, sack, thieves' tools, trail rations (1 day), waterskin, winter blanket; 1 gp, 4 sp
Encumbrance medium 44 - 186 lbs, heavy 87 - 130 lbs; Weight Carried
STATISTICS
Abilities Str 12 (+1), Dex 16 (+3), Con 13 (+1), Int 13 (+1), Wis 14 (+2), Cha 12 (+1)
Favored class rogue
Special Qualities trapfinding +1
Traits Canter, Reactionary
Feats Combat Expertise -1/+1, Improved Feint
Skills Acrobatics +7, Bluff +5, Climb +5, Diplomacy +5, Disable Device +7 (+8 vs. traps), Knowledge (local) +5, Perception +6 (+7 vs. traps), Sense Motive +6 (+11 discern secret message), Stealth +7, Use Magic Device +5; Armor Check Penalty -0
My original rogue was somewhat jumpy. He ended up with lightning reflexes, combat reflexes, and improved evasion. I had no idea what an attack of opportunity was. Ah, youth. This time around, I'll shore up some of weak saves. Fun Fact: I didn't take UMD way back when. I thought it was "cheesy". It's easy to say that when your back up consists of clerics, wizards, and druids. . .
Male human rogue 3
CG Medium humanoid (human)
Init +5 Senses Perception +8 (+9 vs. traps)
Languages Common, Dwarven, Goblin
DEFENSE
AC 17 (18 vs traps), touch 13 (14 vs traps), flat-footed 14 (+3 Dex, +3 armor, +1 shield)
CMD 16
hp 24 (3 HD)
Fort +5 Ref +7 (+8 vs. traps) Will +4; (+1 resistance)
Special Defenses evasion, trap sense +1
OFFENSE
Spd 30 ft. (6 squares)
Melee masterwork rapier +6 (1d6+1/18-20)
Melee sap +5 (1d6+1/x2)
Ranged light crossbow +5 (1d8/19-20), range 80 ft
Ranged sling +5 (1d4+1/19-20), range 50 ft
Special Attack sneak attack 2d6
Base Atk +2; CMB +3
Combat Gear 10 bolts, 10 bullets; oil of magic weapon, wand of detect magic (50 charges)
Other Gear masterwork rapier, sap, masterwork buckler, masterwork studded leather armor, light crossbow, sling; cloak of resistance +1, masterwork backpack, bedroll, chalk, cold weather outfit, explorer's outfit (worn), flint and steel, masterwork thieves' tools, sack, trail rations (1 day), waterskin, winter blanket
Encumbrance medium 51 - 100 lbs, heavy 101 - 150 lbs; Weight Carried
STATISTICS
Abilities Str 12 (+1), Dex 16 (+3), Con 13 (+1), Int 13 (+1), Wis 14 (+2), Cha 12 (+1)
Favored class rogue
Special Qualities rogue talents (finesse rogue), trapfinding +1, trap sense +1
Traits Canter, Reactionary
Feats Combat Expertise -1/+1, Great Fortitude, Improved Feint
Skills Acrobatics +9, Appraise +5, Bluff +7, Climb +5, Diplomacy +5, Disable Device +11* (+12* vs. traps), Escape Artist +9, Knowledge (local) +6, Linguistics +5, Perception +8 (+9 vs. traps), Sense Motive +6 (+11 discern secret message), Stealth +9, Use Magic Device +7; * using mwk thieves' tools; Armor Check Penalty -0
Yes, Stefan is 100% rogue. No fillers. He saw his share of monsters (e.g. purple worms, buggery gnomes, a talking weasel named Tourette) but most of career happened around dishonest folk with the decency to have discernible anatomies. . .
Male human rogue 6
CG Medium humanoid (human)
Init +6 Senses Perception +11 (+14 vs. traps); trap spotter
Languages Common, Dwarven, Elven, Goblin, Undercommon
DEFENSE
AC 21 (23 vs traps), touch 14 (16 vs traps), flat-footed 21 (+23 vs traps) (+4 Dex, +4 armor, +2 shield, +1 deflection)
CMD 19
hp 50 (6 HD)
Fort +8 Ref +10 (+12 vs. traps) Will +8 (resistance +2)
Special Defenses evasion, trap sense +2
OFFENSE
Spd 30 ft. (6 squares)
Melee +1 mithral rapier +9 (1d6+2/18-20)
Melee sap +8 (1d6+1/x2)
Ranged masterwork light crossbow +9 (1d8/19-20), range 80 ft
Special Attack sneak attack 3d6
Base Atk +4; CMB +5
Combat Gear 10 bolts
Other Gear +1 mithral rapier, +1 darkwood buckler, mithral shirt, sap, masterwork light crossbow, sling; belt of incredible dexterity +2, cloak of resistance +2, ring of protection +1, masterwork backpack, bedroll, chalk, cold weather outfit, explorer's outfit (worn), flint and steel, masterwork thieves' tools, sack, trail rations (1 day), waterskin, winter blanket
Encumbrance medium 51 - 100 lbs, heavy 101 - 150 lbs; Weight Carried
STATISTICS
Abilities Str 12 (+1), Dex 18 (+4), Con 14 (+2), Int 13 (+1), Wis 14 (+2), Cha 12 (+1)
Favored class rogue
Special Qualities rogue talents (finesse rogue, offensive defense +3, trap spotter), trapfinding +3, trap sense +2, uncanny dodge
Traits Canter, Reactionary
Feats Combat Expertise -2/+2, Great Fortitude, Improved Feint, Iron Will
Skills Acrobatics +13, Appraise +5, Bluff +10, Climb +5, Diplomacy +6, Disable Device +15* (+17* vs. traps), Escape Artist +13, Knowledge (local) +9, Linguistics +7, Perception +11 (+14 vs. traps), Sense Motive +8 (+13 discern secret message), Stealth +13, Use Magic Device +10; * using mwk thieves' tools; Armor Check Penalty -0
Well, he's pretty much how I imagined him: Able to draw, cock, and fire a crossbow in a surprise round. Doesn't have to search for traps (he's got his trap spotter "spider sense" for that). Owns a badass longcoat (and matching vest). Hard to hit in a duel (when he can feint). Absolutely clueless in the wild.
Male human rogue 10
CG Medium humanoid (human)
Init +11 Senses Perception +15 (+20 vs. traps); trap spotter
Languages Common, Dwarven, Elven, Goblin, Undercommon
DEFENSE
AC 27 (30 vs traps), touch 17 (20 vs traps), flat-footed 27 (+30 vs traps) (+5 Dex, +6 armor, +1 dodge, +3 shield, +1 deflection, +1 natural armor)
CMD 25
hp 78 (10 HD)
Fort +10 Ref +15 (+18 vs. traps) Will +10 (+3 resistance)
Special Defenses evasion, improved uncanny dodge, trap sense +3
OFFENSE
Spd 30 ft. (6 squares)
Melee +2 mithral rapier +14/+9 (1d6+3/18-20)
Melee +1 cold iron dagger +13/+8 (1d4+2/19-20)
Melee sap +12/+7 (1d6+1/x2)
Ranged +1 light crossbow +13/+8 (1d8+1/19-20), range 80 ft
Special Attack sneak attack 5d6
Base Atk +7; CMB +8
Combat Gear 10 bolts
Other Gear +2 mithral rapier, +2 mithral shirt, +2 darkwood buckler, +1 light crossbow; amulet of natural armor +1, belt of incredible dexterity +4, boots of elvenkind, badass longcoat of resistance +3, handy haversack, ring of protection +1, vest of escape, bedroll, chalk, cold weather outfit, explorer's outfit (worn), crow bar, flint and steel, grappling hook, silk rope (100 ft), masterwork thieves' tools, sack, small steel mirror, trail rations (1 day), waterskin, winter blanket, 602 gp
Encumbrance medium 44 - 186 lbs, heavy 87 - 130 lbs; Weight Carried
STATISTICS
Abilities Str 12 (+1), Dex 21 (+5), Con 14 (+2), Int 13 (+1), Wis 14 (+2), Cha 12 (+1)
Favored class rogue
Special Qualities rogue talents (combat trick (2), finesse rogue, offensive defense +5, trap spotter), improved uncanny dodge, trapfinding +5, trap sense +3, uncanny dodge
Traits Canter, Reactionary
Feats Combat Expertise -2/+2, Dodge, Great Fortitude, Improved Feint, Improved Initiative, Iron Will, Rapid Reload, Quick Draw
Skills Acrobatics +23, Appraise +5, Bluff +14, Climb +6, Diplomacy +10, Disable Device +22 (+27 vs. traps), Escape Artist +24, Handle Animal +2, Knowledge (local) +10, Linguistics +7, Perception +15 (+20 vs. traps), Sense Motive +15 (+20 discern secret message), Stealth +18, Swim +5, Use Magic Device +14; Armor Check Penalty -0
Yes it can (be that bad).
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Goldberg Rubenstein, contraption specialist extrordinaire
Male Gnome rogue 10
None small humanoid (gnome)
Init +6; Senses Low-light, Perception +15,
Languages Common, Gnome, Sylvan
AC 24, touch 17, flat-footed 24
hp 59 (10HD)
Fort +4, Ref +11, Will +3, +2 vs. illusion spells or effects, +3 Reflex to avoid traps
Defensive Abilities Evasion, Improved Uncanny Dodge, Trap Sense +3, Uncanny Dodge,
Speed 20 ft. (4 squares)
Melee dagger +1 (small/adamantine/returning) +13 (1d3/19-20)
Ranged dagger +1 (small/adamantine/returning/thrown) +13/+8 (1d3/19-20)
Melee rapier +2 (small/adamantine) +14/+9 (1d4+1/18-20)
Ranged shortbow +1 (composite/small) +13/+8 (1d4/x3)
Face 5 ft. Reach 5 ft.
Base Atk +7; CMB +5; CMD 21
Atk Options Sneak Attack 5d6,
Special Actions
Innate Spell-Like Abilities: dancing lights ( 1/day) ghost sound ( DC 13, 1/day) mage hand ( 1/day) prestidigitation ( DC 10, 1/day) prestidigitation ( DC 13, 1/day) speak with animals ( DC , 1/day) Abilities Str 8, Dex 18, Con 12, Int 22, Wis 10, Cha 16
Special Qualities Bonus Disable Device & UMD (Writings) (10x), Cunning Trigger, Defensive Training, Frugal Trapsmith, Gnome Magic, Hatred, Illusion Resistance, Keen Senses, Low-Light Vision, Obsessive, Quick Disable, Quick Trapsmith, Trapfinding, Trap Spotter, Weapon Familiarity, , , , , , , , , ,
Feats Armor Proficiency, Light, Gnome Trickster, Go Unnoticed, Improved Steal, Master Craftsman (Craft (Traps)), Simple Weapon Proficiency, Weapon Finesse
Skills Acrobatics +15, Acrobatics (Jump) +11, Appraise +17, Bluff +14, Climb +12, Craft (Locks) +19, Craft (Traps) +23, Craft (Untrained) +6, Diplomacy +12, Disable Device +29, Disguise +3, Escape Artist +4, Fly +6, Intimidate +3, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) +11, Knowledge (Engineering) +20, Knowledge (Local) +11, Perception +15, Perception (Trapfinding) +20, Perform (Untrained) +3, Ride +4, Sleight of Hand +13, Stealth +21, Swim -1, Use Magic Device +16,
Possessions headband of vast intelligence +4; dagger +1 (small/adamantine/returning); rapier +2 (small/adamantine); ring of protection +2; belt of incredible dexterity +4; mithral shirt +2 (small); amulet of natural armor +1; goggles of minute seeing; masterwork thieves' tools; Dog (Riding) [ Barding (Chain Shirt) (Small); ]; Handy Haversack [ Shortbow +1 (Composite/Small); Arrow (Sizzling) (Small) (x5); Arrows (20) (Small); Arrows (Smoke/20) (Small); Case (Map or Scroll) (x6); Ink (1 oz. Vial); Masterwork Artisan's Tools (Traps); Parchment (Sheet) (x50); Wand of Cure Light Wounds (x3); Wand of Detect Magic; Wand of Grease; Wand of Invisibility; Wand of Mage Hand; Wand of Mirror Image; Wand of Reduce Person; Wand of Summon Swarm; ]; Case (Map or Scroll) ; Shortbow +1 (Composite/Small) ; Bonus Disable Device & UMD (Writings) (10x) Gnome rogues gain a +1 bonus on Disable Device and Use Magic Device checks related to glyphs, symbols, scrolls, and other magical writings each time they gain a level of rogue.
Cunning Trigger (Ex) A rogue with this talent can use a swift action to set off any trap within 30 feet that she constructed.
Defensive Training (Ex) Gnomes get a +4 dodge bonus to AC against monsters of the giant type.
Evasion (Ex) You can avoid damage from many area-effect attacks. If you make a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that normally deals half damage on a successful save, you instead take no damage. Evasion can only be used if you are wearing light armor or no armor. If you are helpless, you do not gain the benefit of evasion.
Frugal Trapsmith (Ex) When a rogue with this talent constructs a mechanical trap, she only pays 75% of the normal cost.
Gnome Magic (Sp) Gnomes add +1 to the DC of any saving throws against illusion spells that they cast. Gnomes with a Charisma of 11 or higher also gain spell-like abilities.
Hatred (Ex) Gnomes receive a +1 bonus on attack rolls against humanoid creatures of the reptilian and goblinoid subtypes due to special training against these hated foes.
Illusion Resistance (Ex) Gnomes get a +2 racial saving throw bonus against illusion spells or effects.
Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex) You can no longer be flanked. This defense denies a rogue the ability to sneak attack you by flanking you, unless the attacker is a rogue of at least level 14.
Keen Senses (Ex) Gnomes receive a +2 bonus on Perception skill checks.
Low-Light
Low-Light Vision (Ex)
Mathematical Prodigy (Knowledge (Engineering)) Mathematics has always come easily for you, and you have always been able to "see the math" in the physical and magical world. You gain a +1 trait bonus on Knowledge (Arcana) and Knowledge (Engineering) checks, and Knowledge (Engineering) is always a class skill for you.
Obsessive (Ex) Gnomes receive a +2 racial bonus on a Craft or Profession skill of their choice.
Quick Disable (Ex) It takes you half the normal amount of time to disable a trap using the Disable Device skill(minimum 1 round).
Quick Trapsmith (Ex) As a full-round action, a rogue with this talent can set a simple trap with a CR no greater than 1/2 her rogue level. To do this, she must purchase the components, spend the required time constructing the trap in advance, and have its components at hand. The type of trap that can be constructed in this way is subject to GM discretion.
Reactionary You were bullied often as a child, but never quite developed an offensive response. Instead, you became adept at anticipating sudden attacks and reacting to danger quickly. You gain a +2 trait bonus on Initiative checks.
Sneak Attack (Ex) If you can catch an opponent when he is unable to defend himself effectively from your attack, you can strike a vital spot for extra damage. Your attack deals 5d6 points of extra damage anytime your target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC, or when you flank your target. Should you score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra damage is not multiplied. Ranged attacks can count as sneak attacks only if the target is within 30 feet. With a weapon that deals nonlethal damage, you can make a sneak attack that deals nonlethal damage instead of lethal damage. You cannot use a weapon that deals lethal damage to deal nonlethal damage in a sneak attack, not even with the usual -4 penalty. You must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot. You cannot sneak attack while striking a creature with concealment.
Trapfinding (Ex) You add +5 to Perception skill checks made to locate traps and to Disable Device skill checks. You can use the Disable Device skill to disarm magical traps.
Trap Sense (Ex) You gain a +3 bonus on Reflex saves made to avoid traps, and a +3 dodge bonus to AC against attacks made by traps.
Trap Spotter (Ex) Whenever you come within 10 feet of a trap, you receive an immediate Perception skill check to notice the trap. This check should be made in secret by the GM.
Uncanny Dodge (Ex) You can react to danger before your senses would normally allow you to do so. You cannot be caught flat-footed, nor do you lose your Dexterity bonus to AC if the attacker is invisible. You still lose your Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized. You can still lose your Dexterity bonus to AC if an opponent successfully uses the feint action against you.
Weapon Familiarity (Ex) Gnomes treat any weapon with the word "gnome" in its name as a martial weapon.
He avoids direct combat like the plague, preferring to play with traps of all sorts. If he has to go into combat, he'll go in with any advantage he can think of...often, Mirror Image from his wand, and he'll flank and throw his dagger from 15 or 20 feet.
I like your choice of avatar :D