Dabbler wrote: 3.5 Loyalist wrote: DrDeth wrote: Dark Immortal wrote: Last Wednesday we had a session that devolved into minor pvp. There is a LG Order of the Tome, low wis Cavalier. He confiscates every thing we find, particularly scrolls. Our party is a gunslinger, him and my summoner. We found a scroll of summon monster 2 at one point. He deemed it unsafe and shredded the scroll. Wednesday we defeated a necromancer who had a book of summoning on her, a wand of cure light wounds and a scroll of something or other. I didn't bother identifying the scroll because I knew he would take it (which he did).
He made efforts to take the book and no social skills worked on him. This resulted in the npc we had along with us trying to stop him but he attacked the npc. Then the gunslinger attacked him but he ignored the gunslingers attack and readied himself to charge at my gnome summoner. Now, if you've ever seen a cavalier on a charge (I had just seen it kill the boss) then you know where this was going.
I gave him the book, scroll and wand, just like he wanted. The gunslinger, feeling the whole thing was wrong, shot the book, destroying it. So party wealth by level? Wonderful low thanks to the cavalier. It's frustrating but I role played it. I mean, I could have fought back, greasing the terrain in front of me to spoil his charge, or grease his lance, etc. But being mature and taking everything in stride is a better approach. Besides, now I have PLENTY of reasons to craft otherwise underused magic items like Bookmark of Deception and Bookplate of Recall.
Boy that’s simple: “Sir Knight, the gunslinger, the xxxx, and I took a vote. You are not longer wanted as a member of this party. We thank you for your past contributions and wish you all the luck in the future.” Then simply walk off without him. If he insists on coming along , dodge into small sewers and alleys or say “OK, we’ll just sit here in the tavern sucking beers until you stop.” Exactly. Firing can actually get rid of "that ... Some groups I've known would have just slit the character's throat. Letting him leave is letting him off easy (with plenty that he has taken from the party). Either way, stop it, or stop the offending char's heart for beating (ah good old -10, you never let me down).
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Dabbler wrote palidin lG order of the tome....destroys everything he deems wrongfull knowledge...and he never checked the spellbook of said summoner....(if hes going so far as destroying a scroll of summon monster 2 which 1 benefits his party, 2 could be used for great good making a ally more powerfull,) yes
this sucks for party cohesion and needs too be addressed, asap since its robbing the party of the reason they are a party, but if it was a scroll of animate dead...that could be construed as in charcter. "However whats more herioc than when in lord of the rings, the return the king, a group of undead,traitiors, turned the tide...and then despite the advantage, he kept his word and freed them."
However, have your summoner act, "you seem too find me a worthy, friend and fellow adventurer, have you ever doubted my motives", ply on his honor after all if he dosen't find them honorable enough associates...then well he is dishonered for even aiding them. twist his words, knowledge of the sword can be used for evil yet you still haven't ended your own, pursuit of that knowledge....A book can be destroyed, only knowledge obscured by truths/and 1/2 truths can really be destroyed...
Simply put, as a summoner your charcter most likely wouldn't want too be associated with him anymore...and you could "fire" him...or could put him into a dilema where the destruction of said knowledge could actually aid them see lord of the rings example above.
Player vs player conflict can actually be used as classic story telling, its up too the players too let it become A pvp
Lol, wronged players present the destroyer with a writ of debts. Yep, you have taken this from the party and hoarded everything for yourself. Yes you destroyed it and you had your reasons but boyo you owe us some serious gp. Now how are you going to repay us? Because you owe a lot of money pal.
Debt collectors: the game.
If guy goes violent, debt is cancelled but he longer adventures with the party due to his threats and violence, if he pays, all good. Maybe he has learned a lesson.
There are a lot of intricacies in Pathfinder, this is one of them that isn't explained much and it's probably because it is up to the DM ultimately what he wants to do about PvP. As for me, I allow PvP. Players need to think about what other players will do in response to their actions. If a warrior were to execute an innocent person due to a feud, a paladin could not sit and watch. That being said, I'd allow them to do damage as either lethal or non-lethal damage. Pathfinder IMO is a game where you are able to do anything, and killing another player because your character feels as though they need to should be allowed. That being said, I'm not going to let a player pursue PvP based on a something OOC such as they stole 5 dollars from them IRL or something like that.
In regards to the other topic, numbers on your skills are there for a reason. If a player uses diplomacy on another player, I leave it up to the players to role play it out. So, for instance, someone may desire a ring of protection because they are the ones who generally are being hit, if he uses a diplomacy on another player who doesn't get hit much and succeeds, I'm not going to tell either player what they have to do and will simply say, your character is influenced by the diplomacy check. This basically means I leave it to the players do decide and they have to take into account their characters and what is being said. It opens up room for people to metagame in a way, but it is what I have found to be most affective.
The only times I ever considered PvP was when one party member was a traitorous jerk, and the GM wouldn't let us just kick him out of the party.
I allow PvP.
I think it's a necessity to have a healthy RP. My players don't use it often but it can happen from time to time. I also expect them to really play their char and they do it quite well.
One time they left a dying teammate alone. His char led them to two near-TPK and they didn't want another. He also "knew too much". What would have you done ?
Another time, a war oracle (a mercenary leader) was paid to stop a riot. He slaughtered them all. Only to find out later that killing people antagonize their family a bit. Another player had two of his siblings killed which led to a really interesting cold war.
Yesterday a swarm attacked the (lvl 2) players. Two of them had burning hand available. One of them fled (a sorcerer). The other was put unconscious by the bugs and died later. A third tried to help him and finally died. The team fall back. A player punched the sorcerer for his cowardice that doomed two teammates. Scared, the squishy sorcerer casted burning hands on him. A fight started with other players trying to stop them which ended with another death (thanks to a lone monster that spotted them). Both players were satisfied, having plaid their char.
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