Goblin Squad Member
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Here's a thread to post ideas for Add-ons that the GW folks can add to help the war effort! :)
I intend for this to be a consolidated place that Ryan, Mark, Lisa and the team can see all of our ideas. To that end, I scoured the forums to find other people's ideas (and included mine as well).
In my experience (having backed 90 Kickstarter projects, many games), add-ons have contributed much to the success of projects more often than not.
-Inspire This (Matthew Kovich on Kickstarter)
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Inspire This
1) Start the game with some cool utility, non combat item.
2) Special mount/familiar/animal companion only available as a Kickstarter Add-on?
3) Something special for building construction – either some gold/construction materials to start with, or a special thing only available as a Kickstarter Add-on?
4) Lightly discounted additional months of gameplay.
5) Discounted additional 6 months of Early Enrollment playtime for Crowdforger tiers.
6) PDF Strategy Guide.
7) Autographed poster?
8) T-Shirt
9) $15 add-on to get all daily deals that you missed?
That's high enough of a price to make the people who backed early still feel like they get a good deal, but then allows later backers (including the $450,000K of backers we need to get) to not feel remorse or feel like they're unable to get the full rewards
That way it rewards everyone, and makes the earlier daily deals still more exclusive in a sense.
9b) Or maybe make the add-on include all daily deals but the Goblin Dogslicer -- to make that an exclusive reward for the earliest backers (and make it a super exclusive fluff item)?
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TracerGod Goblin Squad Member Dec 4, 2012
Lapel pins:
Production cost is around $1.
Addon for $10.
Shipping difficulty: easy
Mugs:
Production cost around $2
Addon for $20.
Shipping difficulty: hard
Koozies:
Production cost around $1.5
Addon for $10.
Shipping difficulty: easy
Cloth Map:
Production cost ?
Addon for $20-$30
Shipping difficulty: easy
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Myzmar Wed, Dec 5, 2012, 08:37
What we need is purchasable add-ons for people who have the money and would be willing to support this above the 100$ package, but are not really interested in having the higher tiers consisting basically in "x times the game". People like me. There is a reason why almost 60% of your backers purchased the 100$ tier.
Some ideas for add-ons:
- limited edition ingame items. No pay 2 win, just little things, time savers or cosmetics. Mounts immediately come into mind. Clan / group logos. Someone suggested some basic crafting materials, sounds like a good idea. Maybe a starter pack: slightly better weapon, slightly better amour than what you will normally get. A potion giving a limited boost to learning skills. This is by far the easiest way to make money, people want such things and are ready to pay now.
- collector's items. Signed game boxes, figurines, and yes, t-shirts. Check out other kickstarter projects: if they can offer t-shirts for 25$ and still make money on it, so can you. This works. You have almost 2000 backers already!
- discounted future game time. Get the money now, deliver your product later for a discount. Please, don't start a discussion that this "can't do". Yes it can, anyone with a basic knowledge of how cash flow works will understand.
- possibility to shape the game. Help design a quest. Name an npc or an item. Name and help design an NPC settlement. This costs you virtually nothing, and can get quite a few more bucks. No overpay though, as star citizen recently showed, even a game with almost 100k devoted backers could not find anyone to pay 5000$ for naming a star system.
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WampaX
An add on for a Gargantuan Green Dragon.
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Mourn Blackhand
$1 each for every Daily Deal you missed (as an add-on).
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Tharkune
Possible add ons should be things that don't give a "pay to win" advantage. Any in game items should really be cosmetic or very insignificant such as things like guild banners for your castle, a statue of with your guild name as a founding company or something like this. These types of things make cool additions that are unique, give identity but don't give an unfair advantage or take a lot of resources.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I have already pledged at the $175 level. I would pay money now for some extra game time if it would help this kickstarter get off the ground.
How about extra minitures? 1 or another set of them.
Extra copy of the daily deals so another character can have also.
Stuff like this would get me spending more money on the kickstarter.
Goblinworks Executive Founder
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These aren't as much addon's but additional tiers.
I think these would be low-cost, high-value and could really provide a boost to the campaign.
1) PnP Death - Get all the mini's and the print pack, and also have a location in the super dungeon where a character you detail died
2) PnP NPC - As above except have an NPC that you help create that lives at Fort Inevitable.
3) PnP Owner - As above except have a location detailed in the emerald spire that you help create.
Here are a couple of mid/high-cost, high-value ideas:
1) In-game player skin - Get a skin for your character that looks like you or description you provide.
2) Role-play emote - Help create an emote for the game.
3) In-game symbol - Get your custom symbol in the game to apply to gear, banners, etc.
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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The problem with additional tiers is that those of us that got in early would lose our place in the beta line when we switch tiers.These aren't as much addon's but additional tiers.
It depends on how they structure it. For example, the new $400 tier they added:
Crowdforger Geography Buff – Patrons at this level get all the Pioneer level rewards, including month one access to the Beta through the Early Enrollment process.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The game is based on Pathfinder, but I don't know to what degree the character creation process will be the same. I would pay more for additional feats or skill points.
Ideas: $25 for a get an extra feat at character creation (like a human), +2 to your preferred stat, +5 to a class skill like pick lock or disable device.
The reward needs to be big enough to be buzz worthy and to create demand enough to make paying more today worth the year long wait. But I think you can do it in a way that allows backers who want to help fund more to get stronger by a small margin and not disrupt the game.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The problem with additional tiers is that those of us that got in early would lose our place in the beta line when we switch tiers.You won't lose your place in line; they've made that very clear. The only way you might lose your place in line is if you zero out your pledge.
You do not loose any daily deals but he is talking about early access for beta.
The first 2000 for the $100 tier get into month 1 beta, the next 2000 get into month 2. For the $175 level you get 2 accounts but only the first 500 of this level gets in month 1, the next 500 get in on month 2.
If you switch tier levels with early access you loose your place in line and move to the new line. Right now the $100 level is sold out of month one access but the $175 level still has some spots left.
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Goblin Squad Member
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... he is talking about early access for beta.
So am I :)
Vic -- Any official word yet on increasing pledge amount to get the print add-on and/or to change tiers changing "your place in line?"
From Possible incentives to get more people backing!:
I have verified that our backer reports give the timestamp of your original pledge, even if you adjust your pledge later. (I can't guarantee that holds true if you reduce your pledge to $0 and then increase it, though.)
They have made it clear that you will be getting the rewards of your final pledge level as if you had pledged at that level the first day you made your pledge - with the simple caveat that if you zero out your pledge, you might lose your place in line.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Sorry, here's the better quote to directly address this concern.
From Possible incentives to get more people backing!:
Vic - thanks so much, and sorry to be a bother, but one more question.
What if, at the end when most of the slots are filled, I finally convince my Pathfinder party to join in, and I change my pledge from to Guild? Do I retain my first month place in line,and my buddies get in at the later.month? Do we all get in at my original timestamp place in line? Do I then get in later like my buddies?
Thanks!
Sorry—missed that post until now.
The info we'll get from Kickstarter will have the time and date of your original pledge, and your final reward level; it doesn't tell us your initial pledge level, or anything about increases or decreases to your pledge level. So you and your buddies would all get in at the place in line that you staked out with your initial pledge.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Awesome - I'm so glad there's good conversation going on (and thanks Nihimon for digging out those posts!) :)
I think people on KS love add-ons because it allows them some more choice about their rewards (while allowing the project creator to respond to the needs of the project flexibly).
For instance, the only extra reward you get for going from $35 to $50 is the soundtrack download. Which I think is cool, but I'm already in for $225. And 73 people right now think it's cool enough to back at the $50 level. However, I'm sure many of the $35 backers have $50 to spare, they're just not into music soundtracks.
But a $15 add-on of a different flavor might convince some of the currently 1049 $35 backers to bump up to $15.
Or it might convince some of the $50 backers who aren't interested in the pdf novel and flipmats (but can't afford/aren't interested in Crowdforger) to increase their pledge.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Also, add-ons which Crowdforgers would be interested in could be beneficial as well.
As it stands, a person in for $100 who has no buddies to go in on the Buddy or Guild levels only has big-ticket increases. I bet a bunch of the Pioneers would gladly increase to $125 if there was a flavorful/cool $25 add-on. Or, if they're already in on the Print Pack add-on, increase to $225.
In for a penny, in for a pound (but jumping from $100 Pioneer to $400 Geography Buff is too much of an increase for most to afford).
So -- any more ideas for Add-ons? We know the GW team is reading these forums carefully, they'll be sure to see your ideas! :)
CEO
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Hey y'all:
Thanks for brainstorming these ideas. Some of you have already done this, but it would be great if you could attach a dollar figure that you feel you would pay for a particular add-on. Sometimes people are interested in something until they find out that they have to pay more than they thought they would have to, and then they lose interest. But there are some great ideas here. Rich Baker, Ryan and I are going to talk about these later today (Thursday) and hopefully we can have something to announce Friday (cross my fingers that everything comes together).
-Lisa
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Goblin Squad Member
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Awesome to see you guys so in touch with the community, I cannot overstate how amazing that is.
Here's my contribution for the <$100 tier.
For $10, invitation to the last month of early access, does not include Crowd Forger benefits, just a chance to get into the game a little earlier.
A couple packages could really benefit just from lowering the cost. Or perhaps by adding more value specifically to those levels.
Example being.. drop the Geography Buff tier down to $300 or so, that's a really great reward package, but damn, that's a lot of money just for notoriety.
You may want to feel out who would be willing to jump to the Tavern level if it were a bit cheaper as well. As it stands, dropping it to $4k would be recouped in a single extra donation at that level.
Aside from lowering tier prices, what individual ideas from higher tiers can you draw on?
How about $500 for that 'use your own avatar on the message boards' piece.
Or $500 to get your own art in the game, upon approval of course, as a painting (like the 10k tier, but as fillers for various buildings, or as purchasable decorations by players to add to their houses eventually. The same could be done for a couple of user created weapon designs and the like. It doesn't even have to be a 3D model, just a few sketches from various angles.
As much as people want rewards for the money, there are many who really just want to contribute in any way they can and appreciate the extras that come along with it.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Maybe something like some special areas that need a special key that you can buy at a pledge level or something? Nothing game changing, just stuff like bonus mini dungeons, an extra little area in a dungeon, the occasional secret passage that uses the key. No special monsters, no special loot, just a bit extra.
After a few months after the release maybe they could become a cash shop item. But for a while, just the backers have them, making them desirable party members.
Maybe some exclusive crafting patterns? no physical advantages, just cosmetic variants. Maybe some brocade cloth designs, some gold leaf work on metal... that kinda thing, in some design that is otherwise not available except through backers.
A reskinned mount, perhaps some exotic horses or something from some far off land which explains why they can't be found in the river kingdoms.
Perhaps some special imported materials that are rare but mostly fluff, you know... an exotic spice that gives some unique minor effect when added to food
exotic silks and the like which just work as a cloth but come in a different set of textures/colours. Obtainable in other ways at a later stage, but early on only limited supplies from backers.
As for prices? I don't really know. I'd say somewhere between 5 and 20 dollars depending on things like quantities, limits of use (if any). How do mounts work? are they attackable things that can be killed? can they be resurrected? stolen? all that kinda thing factors in.
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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How about offering Skymetal Bits at a significant discount, perhaps $100 worth of SkyMetal Bits for an additional $35 on the pledge?
Think that is a bit much of a discount but a good idea maybe only mark it down 25-50%
Edit - I would also only make that available to the $100 and up levels.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Think that is a bit much of a discount but a good idea maybe only mark it down 25-50%
If they do the same kind of thing Turbine does - and there's no reason to expect they won't model the successful business practices of their competitors - then they'll be offering 20% discounts routinely.
There will be an extremely high margin on sales made with SkyMetal Bits, so I don't think a 65% discount is very steep at all.
Most people seem to intuitively think that if you buy something for $100 and sell it for $200, then that's 100% profit. That's not the way retail sales are analyzed.
Retail sales are analyzed by Margin, which is how much of the sale price is profit. So, your calculation is (Price - Cost) / Price. For an item that cost $100 and sold for $200, that's a 50% Margin.
Because the things that are bought with SkyMetal Bits will likely be virtual items, I'm guessing their Cost is somewhere remarkably close to 0, which means the Margin is approaching 100%.
I find it extremely unlikely that $35 won't at least cover their costs :)
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Goblin Squad Member
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Adventurer (or higher)
$50 - prepaid subscription of 12 months
$100 - prepaid subscription of 24 months
Crowdforger Pioneer (or higher)
§150 - prepaid subscription without time limit
In the absolute worst case (if you hate the concept) you would now have around 24k prepaid subscribers onboard, but the pain might be soothed a bit by the fact that you just managed to raise in excess of $6,000,000. Considering how much those funds would speed up the overall revenue generation (by accelerating the public launch) it would seem to be a fairly easy decision.
In the best case (if you hate the concept) -nothing happens.
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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These aren't as much addon's but additional tiers.
I think these would be low-cost, high-value and could really provide a boost to the campaign.
1) PnP Death - Get all the mini's and the print pack, and also have a location in the super dungeon where a character you detail died
2) PnP NPC - As above except have an NPC that you help create that lives at Fort Inevitable.
3) PnP Owner - As above except have a location detailed in the emerald spire that you help create.Here are a couple of mid/high-cost, high-value ideas:
1) In-game player skin - Get a skin for your character that looks like you or description you provide.
2) Role-play emote - Help create an emote for the game.
3) In-game symbol - Get your custom symbol in the game to apply to gear, banners, etc.
Prices for my tier ideas:
PnP Death - $400
PnP NPC - $600
PnP Owner - $1500
Player Skin - $350
Roleplay Emote - $250
Game Symbol - $300
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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Adventurer (or higher)
$50 - prepaid subscription of 12 months
$100 - prepaid subscription of 24 monthsCrowdforger Pioneer (or higher)
§150 - prepaid subscription without time limit
In the absolute worst case (if you hate the concept) you would now have around 24k prepaid subscribers onboard, but the pain might be soothed a bit by the fact that you just managed to raise in excess of $6,000,000. Considering how much those funds would speed up the overall revenue generation (by accelerating the public launch) it would seem to be a fairly easy decision.
In the best case (if you hate the concept) -nothing happens.
I would totally pre-pay some game time now to help the project get funded. Again though I think the prices you quote are a bit low. That is only $4 a month. If you look at the normal bulk subscription model it's usually at least $12/month. So I would adjust the prices slightly as such:
Prepaid 12 month $108
Prepaid 24 month $216
That gives you about a 25% discount assuming $12/month for a normal bulk sub price.
Also, I don't see the harm in putting up a lifetime if it is actually priced correctly. ~$1200 (again assuming the $12/month bulk sub)
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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Just thought of another tier -
Crowdforger Settlement - Basically the same as Crowdforger Guild except you get 10 X Crowdforger Pioneer and all the daily deals for all the accounts no matter when they were backed, access to month 1 of early enrollment, and 3 extra months of sub time.
Price $1200
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Goblin Squad Member
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A mount for say $20, but make sure it is a good mount not some cheap nag who doesnt go all that fast. If people are going to pay money for it they want it to be nice.
Game time cards, let us prepurchase game time. If a month subscription is going to cost say $14.95 a month then let us prepurchase them at say $12-13 a month. Or for 6 months of game time say for $60-65. My only request would be to allow us to split the 6 month one up. I am pledgeing at the $175 level for 2 accounts, and would buy the 6 months for sure if I could share that with my wifes account also.
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Goblin Squad Member
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A simple additional reward would be to give backers extra Skymetal Bits for the game store, probably something like an amount equal in value to about 1/2 of their backer level.
Perhaps also/or a permanent price reduction for items in the the store, like 15%-25% off, forever. You could give bigger discounts to higher backer levels.
Also, for the higher level backers, like $500+, instead of a few months free I'd say to just give them full lifetime subscriptions (if you aren't already, I'm not clear on that).
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Goblin Squad Member
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Idea crowd forger pioneer is 100 pledge
the next up is crowd forger buddy 175
next is Crowd forger geography buff for 400
how about an add on to this that for additional 75-100 you make the geography buff an buddy pack.
I like the offer for this pledge but would lose what I now have for the forger buddy pledge.
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Goblin Squad Member
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A simple additional reward would be to give backers extra Skymetal Bits for the game store, probably something like an amount equal in value to about 1/2 of their backer level.
Perhaps also/or a permanent price reduction for items in the the store, like 15%-25% off, forever. You could give bigger discounts to higher backer levels.
As much as I would love these myself I do not think they are practical. The game has to be profitable, they cannot give too much stuff away for free.
The Destinys Twin for the $35 level and higher is already a HUGE savings. It basically makes it so you can train a second character for free FOREVER! Normally a subscription gets you 1 months training time you can train 1 character for 1 week and another for 3 weeks etc. Or buy additional training time so you can train a second character for 1 month also. This addon basically gives you an extra characters training time for every month you subscribe forever. Anyone not in the kickstarter will always have to pay for that time.
That is why when I made the suggestion in the comments of the kickstarter about more stuff to buy, Inspire This took the initiative and made this tread. We need more things that we can spend money on to help the kickstarter. I have pledged at the $175 level but what are some little things they could add that might make me spend another $10 or $20?
I feel that getting some of these extras to buy will be essential for the success of this kickstarter.
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Goblin Squad Member
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As much as I would love these myself I do not think they are practical. The game has to be profitable, they cannot give too much stuff away for free.
I'm just posting idea's here, let's leave the judgement on how viable they are up to Goblinworks and Paizo.
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For another possible add-on reward, as bit of an artist myself I would be glad to be able to contribute in some to meaningful way to the game's look. Perhaps designing an NPC or monster or location/building. This might not be doable though because you won't want to guarantee a design will be used if you don't know how good it will be.
That gives me another idea for another high level reward though, the chance to come into the studio and record some voice work for a character or the like. Even if it's bad you can probably find some use for it.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Armored Wagon (Add-on to Pioneer or greater only: $150)
In-game item exclusive to KS that is the same as the in-game enclosed wooden wagons, but comes with a hard point for a ballista or self-defense weapon. Could be variants...some made out of iron-wood, etc...collect them all. It's a great item that provides some minor game-play advantage, but doesn't overpower (it's just a wagon, after all, and a player character is likely to be much more powerful than the mounted weapon they must man...but it looks cool.) Guilds and trade groups will eat it up.
Minor Ring of Calling (Add-on to Pioneer or greater only: $15)
In-game item exclusive to KS that allows any one personal item to be bound to it to recall that item from storage after a small ritual. Binding breaks if ring is removed. Convenience item, essentially.
Thread Rings (Add-on to Pioneer or greater only: $50 each, max two per character)
Additional KS exclusive Soul Threads rings to lock equipment to your character. Must be worn to lock items. You can only wear two rings...so the decision between wearing rings to lock items rather than wearing stat/ability boosting rings is not an advantage..it is a choice.) Basically the same as Star Citizen's Long-Term-Insurance...no in-game short-term advantage in combat, but lowers the pain of PvP loss a bit by replacing a bound item if it is taken from you. The Long-Term Insurance Ships were the primary drivers of the high pledge amounts for Star Citizen.
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Goblin Squad Member
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It's hard to come up with add-on's that people will really go for that don't offer a mechanical boost in-game.
You could add special goblin squad member emotes, like a secret handshake. Or an emote where all your backer swag falls out of your character's pack and they scramble to pick it up. I don't think many people will pay for emote's though.
Pet's are probably one of the better bets for add-on's, and the more pets backer's are able to buy the more likely someone's going to buy one. Special appearance options are good too, like special haircuts and glowing eyes and the like.
If you're going to have a character background trait system like Pathfinder, then perhaps allow backers to buy a slot for a third trait. This offers a mechanical boost, but a very minor one. You could also add a special backer-only trait for them to select.
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Goblin Squad Member
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You could also add some fun visual options for backers-only that they can turn on and off in-game, like a party mode where defeated enemies explode into confetti or a big head mode. I'd definitely enjoy that.
And how about character slots, sounds like there are going to be limited slots anyways, so why not make the option to buy additional ones for cheap available to backers now? You'll probably have to finalize and reveal how many players will actually start off with first though...
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Goblin Squad Member
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So other pets and prices
I'll assume these come with pioneer and above.
Pet $125: Owl Detect hostiles, messenger
Pet $125: Lynx Detect Hostile, messenger
Pet $125: Stag Detect Hotile, messenger
(messenger delivers one text message once per day anywhere unenclosed, and without need of mailbox)
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Goblin Squad Member
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Crafters Chest (Add-on to Pioneer or greater only: $100)
Storage Chest that provides additional crafting material storage, allowing NPC crafters to work 25% longer between shift changes. I'm totally making that up, but some convenience item for crafters that doesn't make them more powerful, but helps the *player* during crafting.
Spouse (Add-on to Pioneer or greater only: $100)
KS Exclusive-- One PC on the account can gain a spouse 'pet' which is essentially an NPC that lives in their domicile (once they get one) and putters around the house cutting wood, cooking, saying inane things, pestering you to wear warm gloves, etc.
Traits (Add-on to Pioneer or greater only: $15 each, two max.)
Buy a trait. Just like in Paizo, traits are small advantages that are balanced by negatives, allowing specialization without unbalancing the game. Needs to be KS Exclusive or people will say "I'll just wait to see the game, I can always add that then."
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Goblin Squad Member
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Ooh, this idea's quite a stretch, but the ability to play as a dragon or some other awesome beast. It'd be mostly preset, and have limited if any ability to improve or gain from it, but the backer would just get like a Dragon slot on their character list and then they can drop into the fringe areas of the world and wreck things up as a dragon.
If that were an add-on I'd have to link a meme involving Fry and a wad of cash.
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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Ooh, this idea's quite a stretch, but the ability to play as a dragon or some other awesome beast. It'd be mostly preset, and have limited if any ability to improve or gain from it, but the backer would just get like a Dragon slot on their character list and then they can drop into the fringe areas of the world and wreck things up as a dragon.
If that were an add-on I'd have to link a meme involving Fry and a wad of cash.
They already have this for anyone that is at the Alpha level.
From an update post:
All Crowdforger Alpha backers will be given the opportunity to take part in monster casting for Pathfinder Online. Monster casting is a pool of players from which we will draw participants in various monster-based events in the campaign. Participants will be able to play the roles of the monsters needed for the campaign event and will be given direction by the Goblinworks staff on playing these monsters. Being in the monster casting pool is currently the only way that players will be able to play monsters while playing Pathfinder Online. This is a special privilege and not a right—if it is abused by a member of the monster casting pool, this privilege will be taken away.
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Goblin Squad Member
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That idea gives me an another idea, templates. Give backers the ability to use certain +0 to +1 CR templates on character creation. Though, thinking about it, if I weren't a backer and other people had this option and I couldn't get it I'd probably get ticked off enough to cease playing the game all together. So, maybe not such a good idea...
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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That idea gives me an another idea, templates. Give backers the ability to use certain +0 to +1 CR templates on character creation. Though, thinking about it, if I weren't a backer and other people had this option and I couldn't get it I'd probably get ticked off enough to cease playing the game all together. So, maybe not such a good idea...
I would assume anything they offer to backers will at some point be purchasable as a micro transaction.