With basic firearms, once you roll a 1 or 2, you run the risk of completely destroying your gun on your next shot. Gunslingers have a nice little deed that fixes that issue at first level that a fighter just won't get at all.
Otherwise, what are your stats and gold going be like?
Might want to look in the Ultimate combat at the Spellslinger Archteype. Pick up the Amateur gunslinger feat and pick Quick Clear as your deed. this way you can make your own magic items and what not.
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Is there a restriction on Races? Are you looking for up close pistols or far away muskets? If you go pistols are you okay with a 2 level alchemist dip to grow an extra arm so you can dual wield?
I'd build you a Gunslinger...its not worth not having the strong abilities you get as one.
No race restriction; I was looking at musket master myself, but I have no bias, musket master seemed easier to build; yes I am fine with the dip.
Any help is greatly appreciated, I am woefully unfamiliar with the UC rules compared to the other books.
The only restriction is that there is no dipping into the smaller books allowed. We're sticking with Core, APG, UC, UM, and ARG
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Hmm 9th level eh...
Here is just a quick run down and you can run from my outline because I am at work and its nearing the end of the day.
I'd personally go Human straight Musket Master Gunslinger for the extra feat.
Str-10
Dex-16+2=18
Con-14
Int-10
Wis-14
Cha-10
Put all your levels into Dex since that will be how you do damage AND hit. Make sure to use Paper Cartridges so you reload as a free action.
Levels:
1-Rapid Reload (Musket), Feat=Point Blank Shot, Human Feat=Precise Shot
2-Nimble +1
3-Feat=Rapid Shot
4-Bonus Feat=Deadly Aim, +1 Dex
5-Musket Training, Feat=Weapon Focus
6-Nimble +1,
7-Feat=Clustered Shots
8-Bonus Feat=Snap Shot, +1 Dex
9-
Thats a basic outline of what I'd do. I don't know how your GM will play double barrel weapons, but if he treats them as ONE weapon then the first thing I'd do is get a double barrel rifle (the distance is a typo) and put the Distance enhancement on it. Shooting at a far distance and shooting BOTH barrels at the same time (-4 penalty per bullet) you can pump out a lot of shots per round since you are reloading as a free action (as long as you keep 1 grit in your pool).
Just make sure you put a few points in your Craft Alchemy so you can make your own bullets and it shouldn't even be that expensive.
Without adding in magic items (belt of dex is a must) or enhancements to your gun (+1 and bane if you know what you are fighting) your shooting rotation should be around +9/+9/+9/+9/+4/+4 on a full attack doing an easy 1d12+5 per shot and you don't calculate damage reduction for the enemy until you roll ALL of the damage.
I think you can take it from there.
Definitely take 5 levels of gunslinger. Nothing helps a primary gun-user more than dex to damage.
After that, it's whatever you want.
More gunslinger gives you more deeds and stuff.
Weapon master fighter will get you more damage and to attack, and much needed feats.
Splashing some urban barbarian can help too. Dex rage will increase your damage and to attack, and the 2nd level of barbarian gives you uncanny dodge.
Or, splash some spellcasting class and go eldritch knight.
The possibilities are pretty wide open.
if you know generally what type of baddies you'll be fighting I'd go 5 levels of musket master for the dex to damage and basic grit use, then switch to ranger for stacking favored enemy bonus's up. if your looking at any reasonably high gameplay you can then use instant enemy spell to apply that extra damage on any important fights also. You wont start getting 3rd level spell slots for it until 15th-16th level with that build though so dont count on it till you get to end game.
Asta
PSY
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Gnome with Master Tinkerer alternate racial trait. The trait will allow you to be prof. with any gun you make. Gnomes have spell-like abilities with caster level = to Hit Dice which means you can take the Craft Arms and Armor feat without taking Master Craftsman. Vital Stike will save you Ammo. You already have Gunslingers Init, and high dex no need for Improved Init. Don't take Point Blank Master just tumble away and Vital Strike, your a ranged fighter if your in melee your not doing it right.
"At 13th level, a musket master never misfires with a two-handed firearm. "
This is why I like Musketeer Master.
straight musket master is deffinatly viable and not underpowered at all. Fighter brings alot of bonus feats and hit/damage bonus's to the table in pretty short order, ranger to me brings skills while not complrimising combat ability. Dipping into an arcane casting class for eldritch knight would add another flavor of flexibility with arcane spells. But straight gunslinger has some neat tricks and doesn't really lack in the damage front. Hey maybe you can even talk your GM into letting you invent your own rifle for better late game fun.
Asta
PSY
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you would need to take rapid reload double barrel musket if you plan on going the double barrel musket route. it is different then the rapid reload you get as a musket master as a free feat. maybe gm would let you start with double-barrel though instead of the normal...
I disagree.
Musket Master gives you "Rapid Reload(Muskets)" and the firearms are listed as "Musket, Blank" and in the discription they all say "this Musket..." so to me it seems like they are all muskets.
double barreled versions of the same gun are still the same gun. It's the same loading method just twice for a full load instead of once. If you have a GM that is that much of an ass that he makes you take seperate weapon feats for a double barreled musket then you should really look into alternatives.
Asta
PSY
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Here is what I built
Stats
STR: 7
DEX: 24 (16 Base, +2 Human, +2 Level, +4 Enhancement)
CON: 14
INT: 11
WIS: 13
CHA: 18 (14 Base, +4 Enhancement)
AC 26, touch 19, flat-footed 18
hp 103 (9d10+30)
Fort +10, Ref +15, Will +9
Skills
Acrobatics: 9 Ranks
Climb: 4 Ranks
Craft(alchemy): 1 Rank
Knowledge(local): 9 Ranks
Perception: 9 Ranks
Survivial: 9 Ranks
Swim: 4 Ranks
Feats
Bonus(Human): Point-Blank Shot
Bonus(Musket Master): Rapid Reload (Musket)
Bonus(Gunslinger): Gunsmithing
1: Precise Shot
3: Rapid Shot
4: Deadly Aim
5: Extra Grit
7: Clustered Shot
8: Iron Will
9: Weapon Focus
Special Abilites
Grit: 6
Nimble 2
Musket Training 2
Weapon
+1 Distance Musket +18 (1d12+9|x4) 80ft Range, Misfire 1-3 (100 Paper Cartridges)
Full Round Attack: 13/13/8 (1d12+15|x4)
Gear
Belt of Dexterity +4
Headband of Charisma +4
Handy Haversack
Bag of Holding 1
+2 Mithral Chain Shirt
+2 Cloak of Resistance
Ring of Feather Fall
Ring of Protection +1
Amulet of Natural Armor +1
Well, how does that look?
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Here is what I built
** spoiler omitted **
Well, how does that look?
Going to need muleback cords to walk around without encumbrance, unless your GM ignores encumbrance rules. But that's fine as mulebacks don't take up a slot and only cost 1000gp. Why are you focusing on CHA as a secondary stat instead of CON or WIS?
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Going to need muleback cords to walk around without encumbrance, unless your GM ignores encumbrance rules. But that's fine as mulebacks don't take up a slot and only cost 1000gp. Why are you focusing on CHA as a secondary stat instead of CON or WIS?Here is what I built
** spoiler omitted **
Well, how does that look?
Because Musket Master uses Charisma instead of Wisdom for grit.
And we ignore encumbrance as long as people don't go too crazy with gear.
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you would need to take rapid reload double barrel musket if you plan on going the double barrel musket route. it is different then the rapid reload you get as a musket master as a free feat. maybe gm would let you start with double-barrel though instead of the normal...I disagree.
Musket Master gives you "Rapid Reload(Muskets)" and the firearms are listed as "Musket, Blank" and in the discription they all say "this Musket..." so to me it seems like they are all muskets.
believe me, I wish it werent so, and I'd be happy to be proven wrong, but if you search for rapid reload double pistol it brings up multiple posts like this one:
http://paizo.com/forums/dmtz50ly?Another-Rapid-Reload-question#1
it does seem like something that gms might over look, but I think PFS-wise, that is the way it is...
truth be told, for pistoleros at least, it isnt that big a deal, if you take it at 3rd lvl you should be fine (even 5th level is maybe fine...). you aren't going to be doing multiple attacks first two levels anyway. it gets a bit crunchy with moving and shooting two rounds in a row, but it is doable, and if anything builds good practice with learning to move as little as possible for when you do have more attacks and want to take a full round attacking..
as for musketeers, it is maybe tougher, and again, I dont know how you'd deal with starting off with rapid reload feat. I play a pistolero so...
While Pistolero has its adherents, I dislike it because I find it far too grit intense and close range in the early levels. That said, you can use the Dragon pistol, which is nice.
Just you you're aware, in ARG, the core races have favoured bonuses to gunslingers:
Dwarf: This is my favourite. You reduce the misfire chance of a single firearm by 1/4. You can put 8 levels into that and only misfire on a 1. (You can't reduce it below that.) Then, if you have a Lucky firearm, you sit pretty. (Distance is your preferred enhancement, of course.)
Granted, you miss out on skill points when you get to 13th level, but getting to thirteen is reward in and of itself.
Still, Human and Half-Elves get 1/4 grit point, so you can ignore the Extra Grit feat and instead take your favoured bonus. Spend that feat on something big, like Improved Critical on your pet musket.
Gnomes get a rather poor class bonus; reduce the time to fix the gun by 5 mins. Silly, really. At best it's the same as casting Mending.
Halflings get the interesting bonus of adding 1/4 dodge to their nimble trait. This means your nimble would go up every other level. Dodge bonuses, man! This is neat if you plan to go Pistolero, because you are up close so often you'll be in the danger zone.
Elves improve their critical odds. Same as goblins. To a max of +5 at 15th level. Critting with a gun gains grit and drops baddies, but it's not all that necessary.
As a COMPLETE alternative, you can go Cavalier- Musketeer/Luring Cavalier. Carry your bonded Pistol rather than ride a mount, and a few times per day you get to add YOUR LEVEL to damage on touch AC. If you're prone to facing single baddies, this is a decent choice. If you aren't, stick with Gunslinger proper.
If you are prone to facing lots of baddies in close proximity, pick up a scatter weapon. Scatter weapons can do some impressive things against hordes; hitting touch AC with dex to damage against a 15' cone's worth of creatures. Its not difficult as a Musket Master to pick up a blunderbuss, take a single feat of Rapid Reload (Blunderbuss) and go to town. You can use some of the alchemical cartridges to debuff in conjunction with the Targeting grit ability (disarm and/or blind using the flare shot, for example). If your spellcaster can get you to fly, you can hover at the fifteen feet cone range above the baddies and rain gunfire down upon them like the smiting god you are. It also completely ignores concealment, so you can fight blind.
Pistolero gets its aces when it hits 11th level. Then you take deft shootist and get sneak attack like dice on every hit. It takes a lot of grit to get that kind of damage out before hand, but afterwards very little will stand in your way. The Dodge, Mobility, Deft Shootist chain will be downright NECESSARY so you don't provoke AOOs on either reloading or firing (although there is a magic weapon ability in UE that negates it, though I think it's a +3 or +4 cost to apply and doesn't stop reloading from provoking.)
I'm rather fond of the Mysterious Stranger as it gets Charisma to Grit, Damage, and determine the number of misfires you can ignore in a day. It makes it into a single stat class. Granted, that stat doesn't have as much mechanical value as Dexterity. It does allow you to use scatter weapons and Dragonsbreath cartridges, and with that you don't even need to worry about rolling to hit. It's a reflex save instead. You can play more like a debuff/blaster spellcaster class overall, which is fascinating for a full BAB character.
In terms of ease of play, Musket Master is your friend. You're never disappointed from level 3 onwards.
Pistolero will eventually outshine everyone else, but you still have to get in close and live to get to 1lth level.
Mysterious stranger is a spellcaster in disguise, not limited in spells per day or even per round, but rather by what gold you can spend.
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Here is what I built
Human Musket Master Gunslinger:
StatsSTR: 10
DEX: 24 (16 Base, +2 Human, +2 Level, +4 Enhancement)
CON: 14
INT: 11
WIS: 18 (14 Base, +4 Enhancement)
CHA: 10AC 26, touch 19, flat-footed 18
hp 103 (9d10+30)
Fort +10, Ref +15, Will +11
Skills
Acrobatics: 9 Ranks
Climb: 4 Ranks
Craft(alchemy): 1 Rank
Knowledge(local): 9 Ranks
Perception: 9 Ranks
Survivial: 9 Ranks
Swim: 4 RanksFeats
Bonus(Human): Point-Blank Shot
Bonus(Musket Master): Rapid Reload (Musket)
Bonus(Gunslinger): Gunsmithing
1: Precise Shot
3: Rapid Shot
4: Deadly Aim
5: Extra Grit
7: Clustered Shot
8: Iron Will
9: Weapon FocusSpecial Abilites
Grit: 6
Nimble 2
Musket Training 2Weapon
+1 Distance Musket +18 (1d12+9|x4) 80ft Range, Misfire 1-3 (100 Paper Cartridges)
Full Round Attack: 13/13/8 (1d12+15|x4)
Gear
Belt of Dexterity +4
Headband of INSPIRED WISDOM +4
Handy Haversack
Bag of Holding 1
+2 Mithral Chain Shirt
+2 Cloak of Resistance
Ring of Feather Fall
Ring of Protection +1
Amulet of Natural Armor +1Well, how does that look?
Changes are in bold.
Another thing to look into would be complete fireball and lightning bolt resistance. 1 good hit from one of these spells could shut you down ammo wise but, that chance is small.|
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Going to need muleback cords to walk around without encumbrance, unless your GM ignores encumbrance rules. But that's fine as mulebacks don't take up a slot and only cost 1000gp. Why are you focusing on CHA as a secondary stat instead of CON or WIS?Here is what I built
** spoiler omitted **
Well, how does that look?
Muleback Cords take up the shoulder slot which takes away from your precious Cloak of Resistance.
Oh and in regards to the Single Barrel and Double Barrel crap...If you choose Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Pistol you get all the pistols. I did my search and in no way is there a comment from SKR or JJ in regards to Rapid Reload and Double Barrel weapons unless its hidden VERY well.
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Here is what I built
Human Musket Master Gunslinger:
StatsSTR: 10
DEX: 24 (16 Base, +2 Human, +2 Level, +4 Enhancement)
CON: 14
INT: 11
WIS: 18 (14 Base, +4 Enhancement)
CHA: 10AC 26, touch 19, flat-footed 18
hp 103 (9d10+30)
Fort +10, Ref +15, Will +11
Skills
Acrobatics: 9 Ranks
Climb: 4 Ranks
Craft(alchemy): 1 Rank
Knowledge(local): 9 Ranks
Perception: 9 Ranks
Survivial: 9 Ranks
Swim: 4 RanksFeats
Bonus(Human): Point-Blank Shot
Bonus(Musket Master): Rapid Reload (Musket)
Bonus(Gunslinger): Gunsmithing
1: Precise Shot
3: Rapid Shot
4: Deadly Aim
5: Extra Grit
7: Clustered Shot
8: Iron Will
9: Weapon FocusSpecial Abilites
Grit: 6
Nimble 2
Musket Training 2Weapon
+1 Distance Musket +18 (1d12+9|x4) 80ft Range, Misfire 1-3 (100 Paper Cartridges)
Full Round Attack: 13/13/8 (1d12+15|x4)
Gear
Belt of Dexterity +4
Headband of INSPIRED WISDOM +4
Handy Haversack
Bag of Holding 1
+2 Mithral Chain Shirt
+2 Cloak of Resistance
Ring of Feather Fall
Ring of Protection +1
Amulet of Natural Armor +1Well, how does that look?
Changes are in bold.
Another thing to look into would be complete fireball and lightning bolt resistance. 1 good hit from one of these spells could shut you down ammo wise but, that chance is small.
But that build would leave me with only 2 Grit because the Musket Master's Grit is Charisma based, not Wisdom.
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Oh! And something you may not have considered: the Alchemist can make for a darn good gunslinger as well.Howso?
Eh you dip 2 alchemist for an extra arm because you need a free hand to reload 1H firearms.
If you want more than a dip you can infuse your bombs into your bullets but I find that to be slow and rather disappointing when you compare the regular full blwo gunslinger. Its a fun flavor build though.
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Oh! And something you may not have considered: the Alchemist can make for a darn good gunslinger as well.Howso?Eh you dip 2 alchemist for an extra arm because you need a free hand to reload 1H firearms.
If you want more than a dip you can infuse your bombs into your bullets but I find that to be slow and rather disappointing when you compare the regular full blwo gunslinger. Its a fun flavor build though.
Can you post that alchemist 3rd arm build with the 2 pistols? I'd like to look at that. I've heard about it before, but I've never seen the mechanics.
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For the most part take the build I gave you earlier and make these changes
Level 1-Gunslinger
Level 2-3-Alchemist with Vestigial Arm Discovery
Level 4-9-Gunslinger
You'd have to drop Weapon Focus and Snap Shot for your TWF feats. Keep in mind you will be 2 levels behind on Gunslinger, you will be paying double for guns and enhancements (TWF does that to ya), and you have to be within 20 ft of the enemy.
Not a bad build, but I like the Musket Option more.
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Thanks! So just so I'm clear with this, I can fire both musket barrels with each attack of an iterative attack if I can reload as a free action right? Also, you said the range of 10ft was a typo, is it supposed to be 20?
Yea you should per RAW be able to reload your Musket as a Free Action as long as you are using Paper Cartridges. The range is a typo its supposed to be 40 ft. just like the regular single barrel musket.
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Ok, so I took into account the stat corrections and changed my dump to Charisma. I also swapped out the Musket for a Double Barreled Musket. I also changed the +2 Mithral armor to +1 and added a +1 Buckler since you don't have a penalty with them and firearms. I also forgot we get one trait, so I gave him Indomitable Will.
Stats
STR: 11
DEX: 24 (16 Base, +2 Human, +2 Level, +4 Enhancement)
CON: 14
INT: 13
WIS: 18 (14 Base, +4 Enhancement)
CHA: 7
AC 27, touch 19, flat-footed 19
hp 103 (9d10+30)
Fort +10, Ref +15, Will +12
Skills
Acrobatics: 9 Ranks
Climb: 4 Ranks
Craft(alchemy): 1 Rank
Knowledge(local): 9 Ranks
Perception: 9 Ranks
Sleight of Hand: 9 Ranks
Survivial: 9 Ranks
Swim: 4 Ranks
Feats
Bonus(Human): Point-Blank Shot
Bonus(Musket Master): Rapid Reload (Musket)
Bonus(Gunslinger): Gunsmithing
1: Precise Shot
3: Rapid Shot
4: Deadly Aim
5: Extra Grit
7: Clustered Shot
8: Weapon Focus
9: Iron Will
Trait
Indomitable Will
Special Abilities
Grit: 6
Nimble 2
Musket Training 2
Weapon
+1 Distance Double-Barreled Musket +18 (1d12+9|x4) 80ft Range, Misfire 1-3 (100 Paper Cartridges)
Full Round Attack: 9/9/9/9/4/4 (1d12+15|x4)
Full Round Attack(Hasted) 10/10/10/10/10/10/5/5 (1d12+15|x4)
Gear
Belt of Dexterity +4
Headband of Wisdom +4
Handy Haversack
Bag of Holding 1
+1 Mithral Chain Shirt
+1 Buckler
+2 Cloak of Resistance
Ring of Feather Fall
Ring of Protection +1
Amulet of Natural Armor +1
No. The Musket Master uses Wisdom for grit. Only the Mysterious Stranger archtype uses Charisma for grit and you can't combine Mysterious Sranger with Musket Master or Pisolero (and its a crumby archtype IMO).
Why can't you combine mysterious stranger with pistolero? I don't see any conflicts. Maybe my book is out of date or I just haven't had enough sleep.