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I am presently working on this for my next campaign after I finish my present one. It will involve a Hero Lab file, so I am looking to remain close (not exact) to the original. That said, I will be changing things based on new rules in Pathfinder. Some things might be changed due to balance conflicts, such as making a Dragonfolk race (see SGG's Kobold Kings) as the replacement for most half-dragons in the game.
I have begun by making "Imperial" archetypes for all classes. Basically this will be a tech savvy version of each class, as appropriate. These archetypes will not preclude using any of the standard archetypes, provided they make sense for the character. More on classes later.
Races are tricky. I am thinking of making the new racial abilities into alternate racial abilities. I think that it is too much to add stuff on top of what everybody gets. Also I am thinking of modifying the Soulmech. As written, it is a full construct, which is too powerful an option for characters. I was thinking of maybe the half-construct racial trait as part of rebuilding the race. The background can be that they are the first attempts at truly artificial life.
Most equipment may need a complete overhaul. This can be to adapt d20 Modern stuff. I also need to take into account the damage ranges of firearms, as well as Pathfinder mechanics for firearms. That pesky touch AC attack, which I actually agree with. I am thinking that armor will just emulate their fantasy equivalents. The differences will be in armor qualities. Say like, ballistic and ablative. Ballistic can give DR, representing the new approach to armors over the "old" way. Ablative, though the word doesn't mean exactly this, could still allow the full AC vs modern weapons. This may involve having to repair such armor between encounters.
That is a start to my thinking. What parts do you guys think may, or may not work?
One issue you will need to work around is that the "Big Bad" for the setting is a "non-open content" monster. Fortunately, Pathfinder provides several good choices to replace that creature.
You idea should work, but will all the conversion be worth it?
The big bad for dragonstar is a red dragon as i recall.
You can make some adjustments to existing armors. Tech heavey worlds will likely have advanced alloys and whatnot Just add some money to an item to give it "Anti Balsitic " Quality which means it adds ac to guns. that way you dont have to make a bunch of new rules.
The big bad is a red dragon. I'm not publishing, so I can reference whatever I wish. But I plan on keeping away from Mind Flayers and Beholders, anyway. The writers made as much as possible Open Content, on purpose. The mind flayers were in an early draft of the OGL is the only reason they are in the original setting.
Adding DR to armor isn't new. Adamantium does that already. I agree that the key for what I am doing is to not add new stuff, but to model changes off of existing Pathfinder conventions.
The big bad for dragonstar is a red dragon as i recall.
Nay! The Big Bad were the Mindflayers.
But, I have already reported you disrespect of our beloved Emperor to the ISP.
Mindflayers were barely mentioned. As written, the big bad was Mezzenbone, the Emperor. He is the main protagonist. Illithids are rumored to be in the Dark Nebulae, but nothing more was ever put out about them.
Mindflayers were barely mentioned. As written, the big bad was Mezzenbone, the Emperor. He is the main protagonist. Illithids are rumored to be in the Dark Nebulae, but nothing more was ever put out about them.
That would be because the setting kind of died off. :(
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Dragonstar reloaded on Facebook give a look
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Dragonstar reloaded on Facebook give a look
Don't have to. I am the owner of that page. :P
I was thinking about stating out mezzenbone but i didnt just want him to be generic red great wyrm. My answer would be class levels. But what class would you say he was? I was thinking either bard for leadership abilities but there was so little published on him its hard to say what he might qualify for.
it would just be for fun the players can still be dead :P Still i wonder what class he might be.
it would just be for fun the players can still be dead :P Still i wonder what class he might be.
Since he secretely worships the Destroyer, he may actually be a cleric. He could be an Oracle as well.
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Ohh antipaladin dedicated to the destroyer Hmmm @u@
Ohh antipaladin dedicated to the destroyer Hmmm @u@
I would see antipaladins as more of his minions. The main "voice" of the Destroyer may be better represented as a Cleric/Oracle. That is unless you want to make a shadow power that really has been controlling him all of these years.
I think maybe an oracle is in order.
I think maybe an oracle is in order.
I think Oracle, as well. The Oracle is more along the lines of a divine sorcere. Given that the Empire puts more stock into natural caster, the Oracle would be the perfect fit. Funny, though, I never really meant to think of this aspect of converting the setting.
I did mean to discuss things like this. A big problem area for the conversion is the way Pathfinder redefined the Teleport spells. Greater Teleport is no longe truly unlimited in range, just anywhere on a given planet. Interplanetary Teleport is limited to the solar system. ai have an idea for Starcaster mechanics, which steals from many novels and games with jump drives. You have to be outside the star's gravity well. That would create a bubble around solar systems looking like a flattened bubble. athe quickest point to get to in order to achieve this would be the Zenith or Nadir points of a star.
The second way is just make the astral plane into fantasy hyperspace. The precedance in the game ist tey do list an astral drive as an alternate FTL drive in the Guide to the Galaxy. That way you can figure routes just like in a Star Wars game.
well someone may have already mentined this but Interplanetary Teleport can still make stardrives viable.
well someone may have already mentined this but Interplanetary Teleport can still make stardrives viable.
Reread my post about teleport. I already mentioned it. Its range is limited to a single solar system. My solution would just mean that in order for interstellar ranges to be achieved, you have to go beyond a certain limit. Think of it as being similar to an invisible Crystal Sphere from Spelljammer. Instead of a physical barrier, it is a physics barrier. Once beyond that limit, teleport spells achieve much greater distances. The end result would make that part of the game feel a bit like Battletech, lol.
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I'd be interested in seeing how this works out. I saw Dragonstar when it first came out, but at the time I thought it was a tad bit cheesy. Regardless, I'm interested in seeing a Pathfinder setting that was somewhat futuristic. I've thought about getting D20 Modern and converting it, but I don't have the time or the will. Good luck and post your results.
A long time ago I thought of d20 Modern, but that doesn't fit with the high fantasy feel of the setting. I had started to take things from d20M to update it, though. I still may.
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Where does it say limited to a solarsystem. I dont see anything in the spells description that suggests that. in the spells description it says "This spell functions as teleport, except there is truly no range limit and you do not need to have seen your destination."
Where does it say limited to a solarsystem. I dont see anything in the spells description that suggests that. in the spells description it says "This spell functions as teleport, except there is truly no range limit and you do not need to have seen your destination."
i remembered wrong from a previous discussion on the boards. Anyway, the main concern, for the average PC, is that it is a 9th level spell. That puts a cramp on the established way of FTL travel in Dragonstar. They relied on the 3e definition of Greater Teleport.
ok so only someone with the resources of an evil pan galactic empire can afford to instantly move their troops instantly to any spot in the universe :D It much slower astral drives for everyone else :P
Also, if my conversion went with Astral Drives, it wouldn't use the Starcasters at all. The reasoning would be it is a 9th level spell. The range is unlimited, but not the mass. So making a one would be equal to an artifact. That alone would make it where there were be VERY few of them around. Certainly not enough to give anybody a major tactical advantage.
I am leaning to using my theory that outside of major gravitational force, the starcasters have a superior range, even with a lower level teleport. Basically, making travel more like in the Battletech universe. It takes Interplanetary Teleport for a mage to travel to the red Dragon Homeworld, but a ship with a starcaster that travels to the Teleport Limit (needs a better name), can travel the same distance with a regular teleport spell.
The other change would be to actually have trained mage navigators that actually cast the spell. trained to be able to visualize galactic locations from navigational data.
Quite frankly for a Dragonstar setting, I'd consider ditching Interplanetary Teleport from the setting or reading it literally as it is... Interplanetary, not Interstellar. Ships should be the primary means of exploring and travel, because that's what's more true to the tone of the setting.
I actually agree. Even though I was wrong, I did originally think that Interplanetary Teleport was limited to a solar system. I was thinking, since it would be artifact level & limited to the Dragon Capitols, that the Long Highway could just be based on the Gate Spell. Then all FTL travel becomes Astral/Hyper travel.
Remember that the Interplanetary Teleport was written for a game setting which really only consisted of one single solar system. (it appeared in a setting book, not a rules book) It wasn't built with Dragonstar in mind. And effectively if you really don't have a destination that you know something about outside your solar system, you're implicitly limited to your known planets anyway.
Which is my original take on it. I seem to remember when the spell first was discussed on these boards that somebody from Paizo did say something to that effect, anyway. That was the basis of my two ways of possibly handling FTL travel. I actually like both of my ideas, lol. Seeing how my campaign is paying some homage to Star Wars for the plot, I think I will
go ahead and add a little BattleTech into the mix with the Teleport Spells having a greater range when used outside the Star's gravity, like at the Zenith & Nadir points. That actually plays into one free adventure where they were warning there was a danger activating a Starcaster inside a planetary gravity well.
Is there any Dragonstar stuff (rules or crunch) available on-line? I missed it somehow when it first came out, but I'm looking for a more sensible approach to fantasy-cum-sci-fi space-travel than the Spelljammer rules.
The wikipedia article on Dragonstar has these 3 excellent external links:
Fantasy Flight Games' Dragonstar homepage in the internet archive
Dragonstar: Dark Star
Knightfall's Realmsian Dragonstar
Also check out check out Brutorz Bill's Dragonstar Page - Angelfire
Thanael: thank you for the links!
As for Distant Worlds, it is probably my absolute favourite mostly-flavour-based sourcebook for (ironically) the Golarion setting. (There are other, more crunch-based Golarion books which are also favourites.) But there is not much crunch on physical means of interplanetary transportation (as opposed to spells, gates, mounts, etc.), and basically nothing on interstellar travel. And since I'm still using TSR/WotC settings like Toril (though not 4e versions), I'm interested in stitching together the background of the settings so that I can present an underlying logic/consistency to my players. Which is the long way of saying that Distant Worlds is great, but not quite what I need in this (interstellar) context.
In the old Yahoo group for Dragonstar, I learned about Factory and Arsenal, both from Perpetrated Press. Those who had seen them raved about the applications to Dragonstar. I've actually managed to get a copy of each of these for myself, but haven't looked at them in detail. They are—like Dragonstar—for 3.0.
It looks like those were the only two products that company created. I'll have to dig them up and take a look.
Oh, and I've joined the Facebook page.
I've created a hybrid of Dragonstar and Spelljammer for my current campaign. Noone in my group has ever cared for the tech aspect of Dragonstar though we love the setting concept. Thus, we have spelljamming and crystal spheres with the Dragon Empire being the main government in Wildspace. We've played this game for 3 or 4 years now, and my players have loved it. It helps that all of us played 2nd Edition AD&D and some 1st Edition.
Aku, do you have a pdf of what you've created?
This. I am also interested.
I've been working on my own custom campaign setting trying to utilize some of the stuff from Dragonstar, in between all the million other campaign settings I keep thinking of.. >.<
+1 for getting a PDF of that, please! :)
+2 even :)
I'll combine my notes into a PDF and hook you guys up. I apologize for taking so long to get back to you.
google mistfinder
I have went from looking at new archetypes to using SGG's Anachronistic Adventurers classes.
All my notes for this are hand written in notebooks. Typing this is going slow, I type memos into databases for a living. People are interested in this so I want to do it, but it feels a bit too much like work. Sorry to say I'll most likely need another month to finish this.