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Ok, just ran this 2 weeks ago and... it did not go as well as planned...
1) "Asian/Tien" name of NPCs. My players had a really hard time getting over the naming of the NPCs.
Being all asians, we just had a hard time keeping a straight face as some of the NPCs are introduced.
Case in point, when spelled out for the players the name of the Temple Leader, one of players pointed out that the name literally means something like "Big Hole" in Hokkien (a Chinese dialect), with the the word itself meaning big mouth or talkative.
It is a less then flattering name, which made my players immediately became suspicious of him.
2) One of my players, the Cleric (who is the party's "face") have a hard time understanding what is going on.
I tried to impress that they are on a mission, but there just don't seems to be anything I can use to "push" the players to complete their given tasks and therefore pick up more clues.
The party just seems to take their own time with things, with the Cleric player keep asking "why is his character even here?", stating that the mission feels "off". Basically he don't see why his character would want to do any of the task given the fishyness of the temple.
And then once the naming problem (1) appears, the party tried to rush to confront the boss.
That said, I believe there is some fault on the Cleric player, who seems to expect a more homebrew, anything goes, kinda play style. He just doesn't seems to understand that the party members are Pathfinders, who look for knowledge all the time.
3) The haunt. Being new to GMing, I had a hard time with the haunt. I'm just not sure how to make it interesting. Once it trigger once, the party immediately goes into "get out! don't go back in there" mode, which makes any further interaction impossible.
4) The final boss. The boss fight was a long drawn out fight that seems to goes ever so slowly. The entire party just can't hit him once he is on the ceiling and even when they did, they barely hurt him.
I had to make him try to escape, to justify him coming to the ground and allowing the party to get some blows on him.
His AOE attacks are also excessive, as he can effectively kill any party by just standing on the ceiling and blast everyone with aoe damage. *which can heal him as he does it.
How successful the scenario is, seems to depends heavily on what are the party players' attitude towards the mission.
With this group, their paranoid nature, means that things went slow and clues were difficult to be handed out to the party.
By the time they got to the end the scenario broke down into a mess... :(
*Played this as a player before, and had a great time then. Fellow players focused more on getting things done and took things in stride. VERY different attitude to the mission compared to the group I GMed.
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His "AoE" is Mass Cause Light Wounds, cast at caster level 3. At this level, it can only effect three people per casting. As per his tactics, he uses it to heal himself and hurt two PC's. The cause spells also allow one to make a will save for half.
This fight is a frustrating one, but not a super-dangerous one. Typically, he has to come down and start attacking with his staff after running out of ranged options.
I agree, but only if you have enough healing to keep tempo with his damage. Even a single cleric is enough. I've run this scenario more times than any other than First Steps due to GMing it a bunch of times last Gencon, and I saw a single cleric hold back the tide quite admirably (and with two clerics who kept enough channels on them, you basically cannot lose this fight, considering how wimpy he is when he runs out of area effects). But if you follow the online wisdom that "healing is useless", you'd better have a way to hit him up there quickly, as you'll drop pretty fast.
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I agree, but only if you have enough healing to keep tempo with his damage. Even a single cleric is enough. I've run this scenario more times than any other than First Steps due to GMing it a bunch of times last Gencon, and I saw a single cleric hold back the tide quite admirably (and with two clerics who kept enough channels on them, you basically cannot lose this fight, considering how wimpy he is when he runs out of area effects). But if you follow the online wisdom that "healing is useless", you'd better have a way to hit him up there quickly, as you'll drop pretty fast.His "AoE" is Mass Cause Light Wounds, cast at caster level 3. At this level, it can only effect three people per casting. As per his tactics, he uses it to heal himself and hurt two PC's. The cause spells also allow one to make a will save for half.
This fight is a frustrating one, but not a super-dangerous one. Typically, he has to come down and start attacking with his staff after running out of ranged options.
If you have means of getting somebody up to threaten him, it shuts the ability out as an option pretty quick as well. Needs a 17 or better on either tier to cast his Mass ILW defensively due to his racial SLAs being Charisma driven.
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I think the biggest problem I had with the boss, is the fact that an ill equipped party takes forever to kill him.
He can keep healing himself and have a ton of heals and hp. My players really lose interest in the fight after 6 rounds of constantly TRYING to hit him, with any damage done, wiped during his turn where he can just channel heal or cast MCLWs.
As Will mentioned above, the fight is just so frustrating, and not in a good way.
If I run this again, how can I keep up the level of interest?
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Thread Necromancy!
I get to run this again this weekend. I hope to finally get to the last fight against Dakang this time around. I wanted to see if there has been additional sessions of this and how others have handled the haunt. Has the discussion up thread helped?
I have a good feel for the RP aspect but am always open to new approaches (I can't wait to play the meditation master. I love that guy. "You have embarrassed your ancestors with such a pitiful display! Again!" And Gastidem. Oh, Gastidem.).
I also look forward to writing a new AAR. I really want to write one that has the party succeed. I really do. Alas, the table is tier 4-5 and after reacquainting myself with the ju-ju zombies all I can say is, "Shoo, I took it easy on that last group. Those poor, poor players...."
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When I ran this, I couldn't justify the Aasimar bodyguards showing the party how to use the fountain, then standing still as Dakang spiderclimbs out onto the cieling and sheds his disguise just over them.
Add on that the party had uncovered every piece of evidence AND aced a diplomacy check, and I had the bodyguards throwing their javelins at the demon every other round (then spending the next round to retrieve them).
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One additional thing as well (I thought I read it in this thread, maybe it was another); even if the players convince the Aasimars to let them face Dakang, and use the holy spring, they might still be reluctant to try and face Dakang. He's apparently been lying to and manipulating them for decades now, and they may fear that their ability to resist his manipulations would be too weak (not entirely untrue, given how low their Wisdom is from the poisons). Also, keep in mind they have no idea that he's a demon, or if he's an evil cleric, or what - the players shouldn't either. The players are going in to confront Dakang about what's going on, and get some answers, they shouldn't be going in there to outright kill him, and shouldn't be aware that he's just going to demon out and try to kill them (although, they should be prepared for that, 'coz adventuring).
When I ran it, I had the Aasimars gather up the people and take them to the meditation room, in case things turned violent, while the PCs engaged Dakang; they can provide a backup force if the PCs look to be getting overwhelmed (one of the players ran to the room to get them mid-fight because of how bad it was looking - of course, I knew Dakang was almost out of spells, but they didn't have to know that ;) )
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Can players with an animal companion, such as a horse, bring the horse with them in to the tapestry?
I've seen GMs say yes, and GMs say no. Personally I have trouble picturing a horse being ridden into the basement of the grand lodge and loaded onto a platform and moved out over the tapestry to just the right spot. But I also really hate to deprive people of their class features.
On the other hand, I let one player bring his horse for this one and he just flat out refused to dismount. Demanded the right to ride his horse all through the temple. So if I had that to do over again ...
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Thanks PH. I also had trouble picturing getting a horse to the basement and touching the symbol to get into the tapestry. However, I thought of some spells that might make this doable, and since Zey is the Master of Spells, I assumed he would want characters to have the tools they thought they needed for the mission and could assist with the process. So, I decided to give the player the choice to take his horse or not.
We'll see how he plays it. (Currently GMing this scenario for a play-by-forum game).
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However, I thought of some spells that might make this doable, and since Zey is the Master of Spells, I assumed he would want characters to have the tools they thought they needed for the mission and could assist with the process.
I would not count on too much help from Zey. There is a season 5 scenario in which it mentions that you are the 17th group he has briefed for the tapestry that day. Between the meetings to determine which Pathfinders are sent where, preparing his own spells, and sending off the PF teams that seems like a full day.
I have used the rule if you can carry it you can take it.
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Another quick question....
The characters are currently in the refectory. Our oracle is casting 'Purify Food and Drink' on her food and the other PC's food before they eat it.
My assumption: PCs who eat the food would still get a Heresy Point. For those with no Heresy Points, the food would still taste like scorched dirt and they would need to make the DC 10 fort save or be sickened. However, the 'Purify' spell would negate the poison and they would not have to make the DC 12 Fort save to resist Wis damage.
Am I doing this right?
Thanks!
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Read that section again. The food flavor is affected by points but I don't see them getting a point there.
The spell should remove the poison, but I would leave the different flavoring in.
If you wanted you could use the second part of the spell to have the food they purify spoil and rot in front of them. That may cause some fun RP as the worshipers wonder why the visitors just did horrible things to their food.
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@0time,
Sorry for necroing this thread.
I had re-ran The Temple of Empyreal Enlightenment 2 twice more to great fun.
The ideal is to be creative with how you present the temple to the players.
In my re-ran, I present the temple inhabitants and the temple itself as place inhabited by a bunch of health/exercise freaks.
The ideal is to not spill the beans on the temple too early. The food would taste horrible to the player characters no matter if they happen to have a Heresy Point or not
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The difficulty I find myself in with this one is that I am "obligated" to run it for people that I only know online as part of PbP Game Day 2, so I am starting to have the concerns expressed earlier about the suicide and the potential forced 'suicide' of a player.
Unfortunately, I lost a family member to suicide a little over a year ago. While this is mostly just a story in a game to me, I know that my wife, for example, would be absolutely devastated by having such an encounter sprung on her. (I have been trying to get her into gaming, so she would be new to PFS, PF, and gaming. But, she is just a hypothetical example.)
While my wife is, fortunately, not playing, I am wondering about the other players about whom I know almost nothing. Have any of them had a suicide among their family or friends? Are any of them very depressed themselves? (I have also struggled with severe depression, "Major Depressive Disorder, Recurrent".)
I thought I had read a fair amount about this scenario, but missed mention of the specific nature of the haunt, and I probably relied too much on the rating. It is, by most accounts, a very good scenario - one of the best - and even the nature haunt does make perfect sense given the influence of a demon lord of heresy and suicide.
But, how PFS Game Days are set up, "You are obligated to run the scenario that you're put down for, unless you cannot make a legal table running that specific scenario." From what I've read, it also seems that just about the worst sin in PFS is doing anything to change the game "mechanics".
Ironically, I had asked about the possibility of running different scenarios if I wasn't happy with the ones I chose sight unseen. At the time, I was concerned about quality and whether my players would have a good time with the scenario. (I've purchased several times as many scenarios as I've run since I tend to be choosey.)
Now, though, I seem to be "obligated" to run a particular scenario, with a potentially very objectionable element, and have to run it 'as is' with a group of people I don't really know. I'm trying to figure out if there is a good way to even ask if this element is a sensitive issue for any of the players.
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I'd suggest you just ask.
Alternatively, you could change the flavor of that encounter, and instead of making the Haunt force someone to hurt themselves, maybe have a ghost like figure simply attack them or possibly try a grapple-like maneuver and attack with a knife, then fade away, (much more like a battle than a compulsion).
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*Raise thread*
We ran this fairly impromptu last evening (We had played a game of Twilight Imperium and the GM mentioned he was going to run this upcoming thursday and was willing to give it a go for us as a way to introduce one of the players to PFS)
Party consisted of:
Human (urban) barbarian 1, Grand Lodge
Half-elf rogue (some wacky archetype that I can't recall) 1, Scarni
Tiefling rogue 2, Osirion, brandishing a Adventurer's Armory scorpion whip
Pre-gen Kyra (for the new player)
Most of it was a blast, lots of roleplay oppertunities and all characters having some form of social skills helped.
A few mistakes were made (mostly due to the impromptu nature of playing, the GM had only half-prepared it) as near as I can figure from this thread, but we all survived.
The Haunt, it was stopped when Kyra had channeled enough. The PC who got affected was the half-elf rogue who was stopped from suicide by the combined effords of my whip-brandishing rogue (disarmed him from a distance, so no attack of opperunity, take that stupid haunt) and the barbarian who prevented the other rogue from trying to attack me until Kyra channeled it away. 3 channels were used due to bad rolls the first two times (1, 1, third channel a 5)
Dakang hitting all 4 of us and himself with the mass inflict light wounds. Though it hurt (and once brought the half-elf rogue to 0 HP, thanks to having rested before confronting him Kyra's channels and converted cure lights kept everyone alive)
Lots of investigating and trying to figure out what kind of prank is being played here.
Sneaking around while the others are having dinner to explore the crypt. Finding (and disarming) the trap and getting the jump on the skeletons. The barbarian (powerattacking with an Earthbreaker) vaporising the skeletons, after my rogue tripped them.
Gathering a lot of the clues that something is really really off, and after a "secret" meeting deciding to confront the gnome (forgot his name) into either helping us or telling what the hell is going on. A few very succesful intimidates/sense motives/diplomacies later he's spilling the beans, even showing how the statue works. Then first my rogue tries to use it as a prank on the girl in the library, using a stick to prove it can be safe or unsafe. After unsuccesfully trying to show how the trick works so she can play the prank on the rest we get confronted by the three guards. Cue in another round of succesful diplomacy and some clue exposition, resulting once again in the showing of how the statue worked and that their leader knew about this con, they showed us to the bless weapon fond and we got permission to confront Dakang.
The fight with Dakang. We tried to sneak in, only to have Kyra botch her steal roll, my rogue identified his spellcasting and told the barbarian to avoid power attacks at first, we enter the room only to see him cast something and walk up the wall to the ceiling. Here it got really wacky. The half-elf rogue had only 1 weapon with him, a starknife, so he spend most of his time throwing, walking to the knife, next round pick up and throw, then walk to knife and pick it up, throw and walk to it.
The barbarian got some leeway and was allowed to attack with a -4 penalty using the bed/staircase depending on where Dakang was trying to avoid getting hit. After the first mass inflict light wounds the cleric realized that channeling to heal would be better compared to trying to use the sling and starting hurting it occasionally, using up all channels over the course of the fight while keeping us healed.
My rogue was assisting the barbarian with her whip to make the attacks easier. Then disaster struck, the barbarian got hit by a fear effect, dropped out of rage and ran.
My rogue by a lucky streak managed to disarm Dakang (I figured it'd be better to try something like that then to hit him, it seemed important at the time), and a few more rounds spellcasting vs attempted thrown knife/whip misshits and nice channels the barbarian (panting, as she dropped out of rage and thus was fatigued for a bunch of rounds) showed back up and my rogue finally managed to trip Dakang to get him back down.
A few rounds of actual melee combat ensued with Dakang walking back to the ceiling and my rogue managing to trip him down again (needed a 15+ on the roll to do this, so got really lucky) the fight finally ended after he used the single image mirror image on him while once again on the ceiling, which got removed by my rogue failing to hit him but hit the image and the barbarian who finally was no longer fatigued raged again and rolled a 20 which was auto confirmed because of the bless weapon and dealt and impressive 48 damage, killing Dakang
Even though the final fight lasted for like 2 hours realtime (which is really long at level 1-2 :P) we had an awesome time.
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Thread necro! Played low and everyone seemed to have a good time although we ran long. Was happy I overprepared... they asked a lot of questions about stuff the scenario didn't go into any detail on.
They were also very incurious about some things, like why they were taking Wisdom damage ("I guess we shouldn't sleep overnight in the crypt again!") or the Kiss of Korada statue ("Hell no I'm not putting my hand in there. You're weird. Let's go play in the crypt. Can we borrow your tools to clean up the shrubbery?")
They totally ignored the kitchen until the very end, after defeating Dakang, so they didn't get the suicide haunt. I did give them a bit of the flavor but it had no mechanical effect.
Hilariously the dretch successfully feared the poor L5 u-monk, who dove back through his eddy and got smacked upside the head with a dispel magic by a very displeased Aram Zey.
MVP: the level 2 cleric, who rocked a ton of religion checks AND also gave the monk a potion of spider climb. Dakang didn't stand a chance, really.
10/10 would GM again. Also I made a bunch of stuff up for the background on PFSprep and you can steal it if you want. Someone probably already did but if they did, it might've gotten lost in one of the various purges.
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Hmm, potion of spider climb. Wouldn't be the first scenario where that comes in handy. Longer duration and cheaper than fly.. maybe not a bad one for the hotlist of low level gear.
It was darned expensive for that cleric. Even so, if it happens to negate the BBEG's primary advantage in what's already a difficult final encounter, it might be worth it!
Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden
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I remember us having a single cold iron spear that we all kept picking up and throwing at him again and again. We basically brute-forced that encounter with CLW wands, he was getting close to running out of attack spells and spider climb duration so he would've had to come down to us.
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I remember us having a single cold iron spear that we all kept picking up and throwing at him again and again. We basically brute-forced that encounter with CLW wands, he was getting close to running out of attack spells and spider climb duration so he would've had to come down to us.
That sounds so painful!
For what it's worth, that dude has three of those per day... if you can't stop him from casting, he can stay up there almost indefinitely. Until he runs out of stuff to do besides laugh at you...