baalbamoth |
Hi all
First off I am totally new to 3.5/PF and I'm not great at math or min/maxing that said, I’m just entering an 8th lev PF game and they need a fighter, pretty much every character in the party is human (one half elf, and one min/maxed lizardman barbarian) so I wanted to bring in a non-human.
I don’t like elves, the DM has a rep of being brutal to half orks, and with my “find it, smash it, sell its stuff” play style I like it kinda limits me to the gruff dwarf, but I really hate all the short jokes you get when you play a dwarf.
So I endeavored to find a way to make a dwarf fighter who uses Enlarge Person potions, and a viable way to make this very combat effective (because with the falchion swinging crit all the time lizard man, the DM is having to throw obscene melee at us and I don’t want to feel like the most pathetic fighter in the group).
Enter the Enlarged sheild-bashing pole arm tripping dwarf.
So I found this “tripping fighter alchemist of doom” build (scroll down to see the final version)
http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/paizoPublishing/pathfinder/pathfinderR PG/advice/trippingFighterAlchemistOfDOOOM
and for a better explanation here…
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Kj_ppmS2m5Z4MNaSzW48rH9wTE72HihX_7s52u5 gsbs/edit?hl=en_US&pli=1#
“For this build to be optimised, you need a potion of heroism (the higher the level the better). Then you are using the 2nd level alchemical allocation formula (you can use this formula twice per day at 4th lvl Alchemist) to allow use of the potion without expending it. The Extend Potion discovery then doubles the duration. You also have 4 uses of 4 minutes of Enlarge Person per day from your 1st level Alchemist Formulae.”
So though I don’t exactly understand how mechanically this works, its clear he can suck up a massive heroism potion, and 4 times per day be giant sized for 4 rounds (most major encounters in a given session.)
Now the author of this is using “Pole Arm Mastery” to get his massive amount of trips in a 30 ft enlarged circle, but he’s using both hands and cant shield bash…. Which is something I’d like to be able to do if it won’t cut back on the effectiveness too much.
So I’m wondering what would be most combat effective.
1) Should I ditch the pole arm mastery and get phalanx mastery? I assume this would give me the ability to still use the 2 handed pole arm for reach and trips and let me shield bash… but at what cost? I’ve read some of the “shield fighter” builds on here, and I think I would run into a feat problem… namely that I could shield bash and trip, but not at all on a level that the tripping alchemist is at, and couldn’t shield bash very well.
2) OR should I just go with shield mastery (to slam constantly) and just use a short spear or something for an occasional trip?
3) OR should I just stick with the tripping alchemist of doom build and forget the shield?
How would you build it?
As a side note… is there a way that an 8th level character can get to gargantuan size? I just think that would be pretty amusing.
MC Templar |
If you want shield bashing pole-arm user, phalanx fighter is your best mundane option.
A quick read of the boards will put you on the path of the 'vestigial arm' benefit for the alchemist, which is one way to get around the 'not enough arms' problem. I personally soured on the Trip builds, and was glad to see the clarification that nullified 'trip locking' a character that stands up from prone, but if this is the style of beatdown you are looking forward to putting on someone, more power to you.
Be prepared to swap out short jokes for overcompensation jokes when you make enlarge person your thematic power
(once daily power for natural dwarven enhancement, if your enlarge mutagen lasts for more than four hours, please consult your alchemist immediately)
baalbamoth |
Problem with Duergar is that the DM likes to discriminate greatly in his campaign, wandering into a city as a Duergar, drow, or even half ork will get you picked on, shunned, maybe imprisoned etc. but I'll take a look.
MC TEMP- well I dont wanna pull too much cheesy with this, I mean an occasional trip is fine but even if its possible, I dont wanna use a total rule rape to make it impossible to fight me etc and make the game un-fun.
But more specifically... how would you build the feats? what lets you sheild bash, bull rush, or trip or all the best?
MC Templar |
In fairness to the DM "the DM has a rep of being brutal to half orks" 'could' just mean he enforces roleplaying penalties on the race that is a half-breed with what most people would consider a 'monster' race.
If 'brutal' means the half-orc characters are met less favorably in towns and less welcomed by NPCs I would consider that fair.
If 'brutal' means all the enemies arbitrarily target any half-orc at the outset of any combat, just because the GM inherently dislikes them, I'd agree with you that he is being too harsh
MC Templar |
"can be" isn't backed up by the fluff in the Race description. I'd say that a GM is more than a little bit within his right to make a half-orc character feel unwelcome in rural areas. That is part of the theme of playing a mixed monstrous race is living down the reputation of your people...
From Races in PRD
Half-orcs
Half-orcs are monstrosities, their tragic births the result of perversion and violence—or at least, that's how other races see them. It's true that half-orcs are rarely the result of loving unions, and as such are usually forced to grow up hard and fast, constantly fighting for protection or to make names for themselves. Feared, distrusted, and spat upon, half-orcs still consistently manage to surprise their detractors with great deeds and unexpected wisdom—though sometimes it's easier just to crack a few skulls.
Physical Description: Both genders of half-orc stand between 6 and 7 feet tall, with powerful builds and greenish or grayish skin. Their canines often grow long enough to protrude from their mouths, and these “tusks,” combined with heavy brows and slightly pointed ears, give them their notoriously bestial appearance. While half-orcs may be impressive, few ever describe them as beautiful.
Society: Unlike half-elves, where at least part of society's discrimination is born out of jealousy or attraction, half-orcs get the worst of both worlds: physically weaker than their orc kin, they also tend to be feared or attacked outright by the legions of humans who don't bother making the distinction between full orcs and halfbloods. Still, while not exactly accepted, half-orcs in civilized societies tend to be valued for their martial prowess, a....
baalbamoth |
well I kinda agree with the DM here, I mean, how do you think half-japanise in America were treated durring WWII? or half African-American just after the cival war in the southern states? so I accept the discrimination against half orks, half ogres, drow, etc as completely justified. also... most of these monster races give some pretty amazing feats and racial abilities (turn invis at lev 1, really?) so wheres the trade off for all that extra power?
MC Templar |
It's not about how a character looks... and I wouldn't disagree that your dwarf is taller than most or your half-orc is downright sexy.
The player character can be as exceptional as you want, but this isn't about the player character, this is about how unexceptionally racist the average yokel is, and I think the book support commoners giving the half-monster races some grief.
MC Templar |
I'm not trying to insert my opinions on your setting, or the way you run golarion, I was simply refuting your "..just because the DM feels like being a jerk" comment with the RAW citation that in core rulebook backs up a negative reaction to half-orcs. It isn't a GM being "racist" or "intentionally harsh on character concepts" it is a core concept to the half-orc race that a half-orc PC is heroically overcoming the negative prejudice he faces everyday. (or not so heroically if you prefer)