RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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As 6th level spells, the mass versions of the ability enhancement spells (bull's strength, cat's grace, bear's endurance, fox's cunning, owl's wisdom, and eagle's splendor) are very weak. By the time you can cast these spells, most of the targets you'd cast the spells on will already have items that grant an enhancement bonus.
I can think of two options to fix these spells:
1) lowering them to 5th level would make them more likely to get some use.
2) have them grant a +6 enhancement bonus to the ability score, which would often be greater than the ability enhancing items in the party - this option should probably be renamed Bull's Strength, Greater instead of Mass.
In the high level campaign (average 15th level) we use Mass Bears Endurance on an almost daily basis. The extra hit points and Fort save are too good to pass up. In addition to both of the changes you suggest I would add give it a duration of 10 minutes per level or back to the original 1 hour per level. In this campaign we do not have the option of purchasing magical items nor the down time to create anything other than items which can be created in a week.
Doug
I think limiting stat buff items to 2 slots (head and belt) helps the utility of these spells. Until they can afford more items to buff 2-3 stats, they'll face more choices in what to keep on and probably leave more stats unbuffed and subject to the mass spells.
I'd increase the durations of all buff spells to 10 min/level, though. The current duration is too short.
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I think limiting stat buff items to 2 slots (head and belt) helps the utility of these spells. Until they can afford more items to buff 2-3 stats, they'll face more choices in what to keep on and probably leave more stats unbuffed and subject to the mass spells.
I'd increase the durations of all buff spells to 10 min/level, though. The current duration is too short.
The only mechanic I like in 4e is the Duration:encounter mechanic...buffs spells should fall into encounter durations.
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The only mechanic I like in 4e is the Duration:encounter mechanic...buffs spells should fall into encounter durations.I think limiting stat buff items to 2 slots (head and belt) helps the utility of these spells. Until they can afford more items to buff 2-3 stats, they'll face more choices in what to keep on and probably leave more stats unbuffed and subject to the mass spells.
I'd increase the durations of all buff spells to 10 min/level, though. The current duration is too short.
i agree in that buff duration is too short
its useless outside combatwhere a cleric would need to impress the king of a different nation (eagle's explendor) so he let him put his chuch in their country even when local churches don't like the idea... or when the wizard really needs to rpepare a tactic against their enemies so they can scape the sigue in front of their home city, etc
before buffs could beused to enchance roleplay...now you need magic items :S
and we move to the path of Chistmass tree character's syndrome i so much hate
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I think limiting stat buff items to 2 slots (head and belt) helps the utility of these spells. Until they can afford more items to buff 2-3 stats, they'll face more choices in what to keep on and probably leave more stats unbuffed and subject to the mass spells.
I'd increase the durations of all buff spells to 10 min/level, though. The current duration is too short.
Yeah, definitely! I'd say that 10 min./level or even 1 hour/level is badly needed, because the game rules clearly expect you to have them on in several encounters per day, and yet I've never played a combat in 3.5 in which:
1) The party actually had time to "react" to danger before encounter begins, i.e. they'd have these spells on
2) The cleric would bother to spend several rounds (or even one) in combat doing nothing else but "buffing" his fellows (usually, in my experience, they cast their strongest "buff" on themselves, and then enter melee, *or* use 'Blade Barrier' or other high-level damage spell on the bad guys)
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I think limiting stat buff items to 2 slots (head and belt) helps the utility of these spells. Until they can afford more items to buff 2-3 stats, they'll face more choices in what to keep on and probably leave more stats unbuffed and subject to the mass spells.
I'd increase the durations of all buff spells to 10 min/level, though. The current duration is too short.
Yeah, definitely! I'd say that 10 min./level or even 1 hour/level is badly needed, because the game rules clearly expect you to have them on in several encounters per day, and yet I've never played a combat in 3.5 in which:
1) The party actually had time to "react" to danger before encounter begins, i.e. they'd have these spells on
2) The cleric would bother to spend several rounds (or even one) in combat doing nothing else but "buffing" his fellows (usually, in my experience, they cast their strongest "buff" on themselves, and then enter melee, *or* use 'Blade Barrier' or other high-level damage spell on the bad guys)
true
but sadly that is because the game EXPECTS thatyou have LOTS of Magic Items to be functional as a characetr of your level... that is sad...|
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I think limiting stat buff items to 2 slots (head and belt) helps the utility of these spells. Until they can afford more items to buff 2-3 stats, they'll face more choices in what to keep on and probably leave more stats unbuffed and subject to the mass spells.
I'd increase the durations of all buff spells to 10 min/level, though. The current duration is too short.
Yeah, definitely! I'd say that 10 min./level or even 1 hour/level is badly needed, because the game rules clearly expect you to have them on in several encounters per day, and yet I've never played a combat in 3.5 in which:
1) The party actually had time to "react" to danger before encounter begins, i.e. they'd have these spells on
2) The cleric would bother to spend several rounds (or even one) in combat doing nothing else but "buffing" his fellows (usually, in my experience, they cast their strongest "buff" on themselves, and then enter melee, *or* use 'Blade Barrier' or other high-level damage spell on the bad guys)
true
but sadly that is because the game EXPECTS thatyou have LOTS of Magic Items to be functional as a characetr of your level... that is sad...
Yeah, that's true.
A couple of simple "fixes" that wouldn't be game-breaking, I think:
1) +1 to *ALL* stats at 8th and 16th level (i.e. this would encourage "odd" stats with point-buy, and raise your weakest stats by 2)
2) +4 to all saves in a revised saving throw progression (at least to Will saves)
3) "Buffs" and protection spells would last 1 hour/level -- it's not that you get too many spell slots anyway
For example, if your 'Shield of Faith' lasts 10 hours, you don't *need* a Ring of Protection. Still, I would prefer that the game would make no such "assumptions" in its mechanics, and even magic-less parties would stand at least a reasonable chance against monsters and NPCs.
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Yeah, that's true.
A couple of simple "fixes" that wouldn't be game-breaking, I think:
1) +1 to *ALL* stats at 8th and 16th level (i.e. this would encourage "odd" stats with point-buy, and raise your weakest stats by 2)
2) +4 to all saves in a revised saving throw progression (at least to Will saves)
3) "Buffs" and protection spells would last 1 hour/level -- it's not that you get too many spell slots anyway
For example, if your 'Shield of Faith' lasts 10 hours, you don't *need* a Ring of Protection. Still, I would prefer that the game would make no such "assumptions" in its mechanics, and even magic-less parties would stand at least a reasonable chance against monsters and NPCs.
i agree whole heartedly with this suggestions
that is why i liked the old 3.0 buffs that gave you 1d4+1 to your attribute (youwill get always at least +1 attribute modiffier then, and with some luck even +3) for 1 hour/level that worked fine for me and my partyalso ring of protection and many armors don't mix well with spells that give either AC or Shield bonus...
and i agree i would prefer nosuch asumptions that if you don't have this "many" magic items, then you are useless... i like the idea that players can fend by themselves... spells is one of this ways