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It's largely up to the players, but if you gather a random sample of pathfinder society players, you'll end up with a roll-play heavy group, where non-combat focused characters will be left in the dark.
If, however, you tend to play within a small, local group of whom you know all or most, you could bring up the issue. The scenarios do offer a lot of role-playing situations, but the players and their characters must make good of it. Silent players just rolling the dice won't do a difference.
Though you must not forget the scenarios do (almost?) always include combats, so gimping a character to make nigh useless in battle isn't wise.
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Most scenarios are combat orientated, although some are now featuring a lot more roleplaying. There are some that are almost all roleplaying also.
You can inject roleplaying into most scenarios though, if you try. It's really up to the GM and other players whether it works or not. I'm always going to do it, because I think some of the best moments can come from it.
I tried to have this discussion here, but as you can see from the lack of response, not many people really care. Which is what I've found in general, most people don't really roleplay and some people are turned off by it. It depends on your group and region of course.
I'd keep roleplaying though, or find a group or players that will at least tolerate it. Eventually they'll get into it as well, or at least your GM will.
Regarding skills, all skills get used sooner or later, I wouldn't worry about that. If you're playing a bard, you'll be loved if you can help PCs complete their faction missions.
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In my experience, roll vs role is (nearly) entirely decided by the amoint of time available to complete the scenario. Four hours? Everyone wants to hear dice hitting the table. Six? Eight? Indulge away.
Still, organized play does come with the expectation that more players (however marginal the majority) are interested in the dice/wargame/mechanics aspect than the storytelling/socializing aspect.
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I think the roleplaying aspect often has to do with the players as well as a RP friendly scenario and GM willing to go with it. For example, my best session ever as a GM included a full blown romance between what is on paper a minor NPC/faction mission target and PC played by a 14 year old girl (a self described 'huggy elf') This was possible because the other players were willing to go with it, I as a GM was willing to go with it and the scenario left room for such things.
And yes, it was a four hour con slot.
It's truly up to the GM if for example, Grand Master Torch makes a pass at a character doing the talking or a the NPC's sing in character during an Opera scene and if the players respond. Some will and some will not. It also take place when a player chooses to eat from the serving spoon, roles a 20 on a diplomancy role and chooses to seduce the guard rather than kill him or do anything that just throws a new wrinkle in how the NPC's react and how the GM responds to the 'going off script'.
Modules that are particularly roleplay friendly IMHO include the 51-52 City of Strangers, 2-01 Bloodcove Disguise(huggy elf territory), 2-13 Murder on the Throaty Mermaid, 2-25 You Only Die Twice, 3-01 Frostfur Captives, 3-16 the Midnight Mauler.
They also tend to be my favorite type of modules.
Roleplay unfriendly modules tend to be pure dungeon delves.
Still, its up to you as a GM and a player to make the best of what you get.
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Haven't played enough PFS organized play to make a properly informed comment on this-- but as a supposition, considering that I definitely prefer, and manage to achieve a lot of, role-playing (not roll-playing) in home games--
the perceived lack probably has quite a bit to do with the convention environment and pick-up groups of players + GM who are usually not that familiar with each other?
BTW, Kerney--
diplomancy
?
Sounds like a cool new school of magic.... :P
RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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@Snapdragon: No one can take your roleplaying away from you. It doesn't matter whether they join you or not. Just remember a few things:
1. Be mindful of time constraints. If you try to spend so much time on dramatic dialogue that just finishing the scenario becomes difficult, then that's inconsiderate to your GM (and fellow players).
2. Be inclusive. I've met some people who like to hog the spotlight with their diva monologues and labeled any player who also wanted to play the game as a "rollplayer". Not saying that's you, but if you're not careful you can give this impression without realizing it (especially if you're very experienced at roleplaying) and that could lead to the negative reaction you experienced.
3. Don't forget that you can roleplay during combat without taking up much time. Reacting to getting hit hard with an "is that all you've got?", versus an "OH GODS MY SPLEEN", versus a teakettle scream - they all take only seconds but can go a long way toward establishing your character's... er, character.
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Modules that are particularly roleplay friendly IMHO include the 51-52 City of Strangers, 2-01 Bloodcove Disguise(huggy elf territory), 2-13 Murder on the Throaty Mermaid, 2-25 You Only Die Twice, 3-01 Frostfur Captives, 3-16 the Midnight Mauler.
After running them this weekend, I'll add 3-10 Immortal Conundrum to that list. Also, if there's time for it, 3-13(?) Defenders of Nesting Swallow has the potential to be one as well, if the GM is game.
And We Be Goblins. We Be Goblins has the potential to be the most RP-heavy module I've seen in a long time, if it's the right group at the table. It's a module, technically, but it's free and it only runs four hours or so.
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I don't necessarily agree that a 4 hour time constraint prevents roleplaying. Players / GMs can choose to respond (to questions and dialog) as themselves, or their PC. GMs can choose to give missions briefings or dialog as themselves... or the NPC. No extra time is needed, just the decision to be someone different from yourself.
Jiggy has a really good point, about being inclusive. Some of the best fun is when you interact with other PCs. It's both inclusive, doesn't hog the GMs time, and gets people into the game. It also allows players to "show off" their PCs.
Also, the in-combat comments make it a lot more fun as well. So +1 Jiggy.
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Yeesh. This is becoming an issue of increasing concern for me...and it's not just roleplaying, it's also the lack of story. There is a *STRONG* correlation between the two. I find the lack of connection of PCs to any interesting storyline or NPC is a problem.
On roleplaying:
It's possible if you and your play group promote it. You can see my thoughts on Jason S's excellent recent roleplay post. You can do both...it requires a group that works to support it. Some scenarios are definitely more roleplaying or combat focused than others.
However, a contributing factor to the lack of roleplaying is lack of story. PCs lack connection to the world around them. Something that players can really care about within Society play. As the point of most scenarios is mostly nihilistic (recovery mission of something, giving that something to the Society almost guaranteed never to be seen or used again), PCs don't have any core upon which to establish beliefs or motives that would encourage real roleplay.
There just isn't much incentive to roleplay when the solution to almost every problem is combat and choices don't matter.
Remember the Geoff campaign? Or the 'core' story for LG? Or the Rary vs. Tenser vs. Greyhawk vs. The Pomarj Orcs? Or Lady Karistyne?
Whether you hated or loved Karistyne, each one of your characters probably had a feeling about her and a connection to the world because at least there was an interesting conflict and story that was built over time that concerned her...and through the modules you played, connected you to it.
And I loved that. I miss it.
What is like any of that in the Pathfinder Society? The VCs? (No. Not even close.) The Ruby Tournament storyline? (No.)
Roleplaying needs story and meaningful in-character choices to support it. Without a good story and choices that matter, roleplaying is going to be tough within Society play.
I am hopeful that Season 4 will be change in direction towards such (now that Mark and Mike are established and can build something more engaging). Because I miss having a good story to promote conflict, tension, and choices that matter between our PCs, the Pathfinder Society, and Golarion.
I kind of wish these boards were filled with more fun RP discussions rather than small-minded and tedious rules discussions. These boards might be a friendlier and funner place to be if the focus wasn't all on combat/rules and instead had some sunshine on character and story.
Wouldn't some of you like to argue the merits of NPC/choice X vs NPC/choice Y once in a while?
-Pain
p.s. It would be remiss of me to not point out some (admittedly limited in scope) samples of good story and choice opportunities within our current scenario pool:
The trade contract in the katana. Does it go to Amari Li or the Qadiran guy? Holy smokes! There is no "best" answer.
Uhm...are there more that I'm missing? (I have played everything.)
This one almost hinted at a choice...what to do with the cultists. This module had a ton of potential for meaningful character-building decisions. But alas, the PCs don't have to make any important decisions. They just have to kill people.
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Well, if we're going to list scenarios with heavy role playing, we'd be remiss if we left out the excellent Feast of Ravenmoor. It's a module, not a scenario, but it's very much worth playing. My group had tons of fun with this one.
And Painlord, our group actually had lots of fun with the role playing in the Dalsine Affair.
And my barbarian went nuts interrogating the guy for information after we beat him down. My barbarian was pissed that the guy had tried to hurt one of his friends, so he decided to chop the guy's foot off as an interrogation technique (in front of the mortified cultists we were protecting).
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And Painlord, our group actually had lots of fun with the role playing in the Dalsine Affair.
Good story, Fromper. :)
However, don't mistake the point of my post (I'm *not* arguing that it's impossible to roleplay in any particular PFS scenario) in that story and character decisions enhance and facilitate roleplay and that there are very few scenarios that have those presented...and those that could, choose not to explore them.
Maybe I would love to see more boons tied into some in-character decisions in a scenario...that characters would/could struggle to make.
-Pain
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At this point, what I'm trying to figure out is whether organized play is something I should avoid in general due to the way the scenarios are written and how they're usually run....
Looking at what you're describing, it sounds as if you're in a group mismatch rather than a problem with organized play. In that case, if you want to be involved in organized play, I'd look around at other options in your area or go about creating them. Go to local conventions and meet like minded people. Consider going to a different store or GMing.
I'd love to hear what you have in your local area so I could get a feel for what to suggest.
I don't think it's the scenarios, though if you're in a position to influence what is played next suggesting the mentioned scenarios might be an option.
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You know, not to disagree with Painlord but there is a lot of role playing opportunities in PFS many more then I ever had in LG. One issue I've seen a lot, is many characters are tanked out for combat and despite the fact that many encounters could be role played around without combat most players just draw swords and attack. Stop your party from always running in swinging and you might find more chances to role play your character. Could there be more, and would I like a story that is interwoven through each season a bit more, probably, but I know my home players love that not every fight is just a strait up hack and slash scenario.
Where are you from? Perhaps we can get you hooked up with your Venture Captain and into a better run game.
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You know, not to disagree with Painlord but there is a lot of role playing opportunities in PFS many more then I ever had in LG.
Please don't mistake the point of my post (I'm *not* arguing that it's impossible to roleplay in any particular PFS scenario). I believe that story and character decisions enhance and facilitate roleplay. And I believe that there are very few PFS scenarios that have good continuous story and offer in-character choices...and those that could, choose not to explore them.
-Pain
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At this point, what I'm trying to figure out is whether organized play is something I should avoid in general due to the way the scenarios are written and how they're usually run. It's sounding like I've run into the classic DM style/player style mismatch again.
Yes, you have. Personally, you sound like the kind of player I would like to play with. I don't think it's a problem with organized play but a problem with the local group.
I'm also curious: what levels are these modules y'all are mentioning? How evenly are the more-role-playing modules distributed across levels and "seasons"?
I was looking over things and I'd say around 25% heavy roleplaying, 25% pure dungeon delve, and the other 50% depends on how you play it.
As for the ones I mentioned, all were 1-7 to 1-5 to 3-7 scenarios.Hmmm. In a VERY roundabout way, I guess what I'm asking is "What's y'all's campaign like? How much role-playing vs roll-playing? How much 'charge in and kill it to get the treasure' vs. 'if you play it well, you won't even need weapons to get the treasure'?" That kind of stuff.
I varies greatly. I've played/run tables where everyone is 'in character' and doing all sorts of crazy/innovative things. There have also been games where I've shown up after a long stressful day at work and have not brought my A-game or GMed players who need to be led hand and foot and expect to be led by the GM.
The one thing I've noticed helps is setting the tone yourself by roleplaying characters which have to be responded to in character. For example, I have a half orc alchemist who is the 'king' of orcish barbaque. He will offer to marry his sisters off to fellow characters, quote a code of 'Orcish Barbacue' (do not eat anyone you converse with, bad hospitality) and makes his bombs from the gases rising from the septic tanks of his resturaunt back in Absalon. Another player has a summoner who is a 'mother' who has an eidolon 'child' who says things like 'I'm not sure the sewer would be a good play enviroment for my little girl' and 'hugs' when the Eidolon rends people. Another has a bone oracle whose 'gifts' are Zyphus' way of telling her that he loves her...and she is really creeped but doesn't know what to do about creepy stalker diety.
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RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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But in other scenarios, the group missed rewards because they didn't kill the NPC, even though the NPC was peaceful and the scene had no "Combat Occurs Here" signs, except for the fact that suddenly, a map was pulled out.
Here the GM actually did something wrong. The Guide specifically says that if a group manages to roleplay past an encounter (thereby missing the loot), the GM is supposed to fabricate a way for you to still find that loot (like adding a treasure chest somewhere). It's in the section titled "Reward Creative Solutions", and that's exactly the type of example given.
Due to things like that in your posts, it sounds more like a bad experience than a clash with the whole OrgPlay campaign. I suggest giving it another shot. :)
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But in other scenarios, the group missed rewards because they didn't kill the NPC, even though the NPC was peaceful and the scene had no "Combat Occurs Here" signs, except for the fact that suddenly, a map was pulled out.
The DM is supposed to find a way to throw you the treasure anyway when that happens.
If, for example, your
players manage to roleplay their way through a combat and
successfully accomplish the goal of that encounter without
killing the antagonist, give the PCs the same reward they
would have gained had they defeated their opponent in
combat. If that scene specifically calls for the PCs to receive
gold piece rewards based on the gear collected from the
defeated combatants, instead allow the PCs to find a chest
of gold (or something similar) that gives them the same
rewards.