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There does not appear to be any explicit rule on the appropriate size of a mount in relation to its rider, however it is frequently implied, and generally assumed, that the mount must be at least one size category larger than its rider.
Medium beast riders can choose a camel or horse mount at 1st level. At 4th level, a Medium beast rider can also choose an allosaurus, ankylosaurus, arsinoitherium, aurochs, bison, brachiosaurus, elephant, glyptodon, hippopotamus, lion, mastodon, megaloceros, snapping turtle (giant), tiger, triceratops, or tyrannosaurus as his mount. Additional mounts might be available with GM approval.
The allosaurus, ankylosaurus, arsinoitherium, aurochs, bison, brachiosaurus, elephant, glyptodon, hippopotamus, lion, mastodon, megaloceros, snapping turtle (giant), tiger, triceratops, and tyrannosaurus are all medium-sized creatures at level 4.
My reading of the RAW gives the following two options:
- a) that a medium-sized beast rider cavalier can ride one of these medium-sized creatures as a mount without penalty upon reaching level 4
- b) that a medium-sized beast rider cavalier can choose one of these creatures to replace its horse or camel at level 4, but will be unable to ride it until level 7, when it becomes a large creature
a) seems to be in the spirit the class was intended, but then there's the problem of load. Even if the medium cavalier can ride the medium creature, a medium lion/tiger (for example) with a Str of 13 can only carry a heavy load of up to 225 lbs.
b) seems to be the strict reading if we are to assume that a mount must be one size larger than its rider, but it seems counter-intuitive to remove a class feature mid-progression, and then return it three levels later.
Can we get a clarification on the appropriate size of a medium Beast Rider's mount at level 4, and whether said mount can be used as a mount prior to level 7?
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Medium characters can indeed ride Medium-sized creatures (appropriate as mounts). Issues of weight and carrying capacity are beside the point. (Real-world example.) If the creature couldn't carry a cavalier and his gear without becoming encumbered, he shouldn't choose that creature as a mount (or he should wait to choose that creature).
Medium characters can indeed ride Medium-sized creatures (appropriate as mounts). Issues of weight and carrying capacity are beside the point. (Real-world example.) If the creature couldn't carry a cavalier and his gear without becoming encumbered, he shouldn't choose that creature as a mount (or he should wait to choose that creature).
Exotic Mount (Ex): At 1st level, a beast rider forms a bond with a strong, loyal companion that permits him to ride it as a mount. This mount functions as a druid's animal companion, using the beast rider's level as his effective druid level. The animal chosen as a mount must be large enough to carry the beast rider (Medium or Large for a Small character; Large or Huge for a Medium character).
Which is fine and good.
Except:
At 4th level, a Medium beast rider can also choose an allosaurus, ankylosaurus, arsinoitherium, aurochs, bison, brachiosaurus, elephant, glyptodon, hippopotamus, lion, mastodon, megaloceros, snapping turtle (giant), tiger, triceratops, or tyrannosaurus as his mount. Additional mounts might be available with GM approval.
And if, as the ability states, the mount functions as a druid's animal companion, then all of the above creatures are medium-sized at level 4 and therefore ineligible as mounts for a medium-sized Cavalier.
Interestingly enough, d20pfsrd is now pointing the links for those animals to the normal bestiary entries and not the animal companions. I believe this is a recent change, and would indicate a difference in how the Cavalier mounts are built.
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Interestingly enough, d20pfsrd is now pointing the links for those animals to the normal bestiary entries and not the animal companions. I believe this is a recent change, and would indicate a difference in how the Cavalier mounts are built.
That would be an error, one which is now corrected. Sorry about that. Our automatic linking script isn't smart enough to know the proper context sometimes.
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At 4th level, a Medium beast rider can also choose an allosaurus, ankylosaurus, arsinoitherium, aurochs, bison, brachiosaurus, elephant, glyptodon, hippopotamus, lion, mastodon, megaloceros, snapping turtle (giant), tiger, triceratops, or tyrannosaurus as his mount. Additional mounts might be available with GM approval.
A beast rider cannot choose a mount that is not capable of bearing his weight, that has fewer than four legs, or that has a fly speed (although the GM may allow mounts with a swim speed in certain environments).
so they can get a t-rex, but then they cant get a t-rex...?
Nope just like Titam maulers can weild bigger weapons but not actually weild bigger weapons.
Oh and don't forget Prone shooter gets rid of that nasty -0 penalty for using a crossbow or gun while prone.
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since the PFS specific question on Beast Rider mounts was cut off.
I'd still like to have the devs eventually resolve the archetype.
the questions, in addition to what redward brings up, above, include whether the mount chosen at any time, must be four legged and be able to support the rider, and not flying. ( fun debate happens when we argue over the grammar of it, so lets just have the devs sort out a proper rephrasing of the archetype and then pick it over ).
its been brought to us from the devs by mike brock that at 4th level, the list of choices are invalid and none of them can be chosen by a medium creature at 4th level since they're not suitable for mounts.
I tried a crack at a homebrew write-up to fix the beast rider. let me know if you think its too lenient or still has problems.
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2papt?Fixing-the-Beast-Rider-Cavalier#1