Maybe from another angle the PCs come on NPCs attacking the noncombatnts with warriors nowhere to be found?
Maybe from another angle the PCs come on NPCs attacking the noncombatnts with warriors nowhere to be found?
Now that's comedy!
Insert a female goblin into My Fair Lady and enjoy the resulting train wreck! Not to mention the potential of PCs having to teach valuable life lessons. Perhaps they'll go to the town library and check out childrens' books with titles like Mr. Fire Belongs In The Stove, Flies Are Not Toys, and Brooms Are For Sweeping.
Of course, begin with Stop burning all the Books
Depending on the party they could be left alone, taken for slaves in the mines, brought to the nearest city and brought to the workhouse. Perhaps a good helm of opposition alignment, headband of Intelect, and then teach them to read. Then give them a book that enhances their IQ permanently. You could teach them to be mages...
Two words: Goblin Burger.
....what?
I think fast food restaurants run by goblins would be a great employment opportunity, what did you think I meant?
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My last campaign I had a goblin PC. We decided that goblins aren't so much evil as dim-witted, obsessed with fire, and too short-sighted to grasp the consequences of their actions.
We also had the PCs raid a goblin encampment (the goblins were from another tribe, so the goblin PC had no problem with it), and we just ruled that the noncombatants had all ran away or barricaded themselves into their huts while the warriors were fighting.
@Interzone
thanks for the explanation on Goblin Burger, or I would have taken it a whole other way, as an alternative to a Beef Burger.
It reminds me on a card game based on running a fast food restaurant full of zombies.
But honestly, I can't imagine that Goblins are good cooks, they will only kill horses and grill them to coal.
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I remember back in 91 I was running a 2nd eddition "pools of Radiance" game set in Phlan, in the forgotten realms. The players, my collage buddies, had to "clear the slums" of undesirable evil humanoids : all of the goblins orcs and hobgoblins to clear the way for human settlement. Now back then, i suppose we didn't know nor care where orcs or goblins or hob goblins came from (the rest of the tribe's non combatants) .....we only cared where we found them....in a 10'x10; room, often packed six deep, and we killed them where ever we found them and looted their corpses....as an after thought we might have burned their corpses.
One of my players cam up with what I thought was a clever idea. After killing ever goblin in the room, he went back to town and purchased a Cauldron and a sheet of iron. He then build a fire and filled the cauldron with water.....he opened a "goblin burger stand".......and butchered the now dead goblins, and served them up grilled or boiled.......
The smell of cooked meat of course drew in the other humanoids in, and after feeding them, the party set upon them and killed them....and tossed them into the stew pot for the next batch of humanoids.
After 10 "random" encounters, with the monsters coming to the PCs, i decided that the "slums" were cleared.
And at the time i thought this was a clever means of monster disposal.
Goblin burger.....goood times.
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I scrolled through an old thread lamenting the old, old problem of what good-aligned PCs are supposed to do with the elderly, pregnant, blind and half-grown members of all those evil tribes.
The notion of this ever happening in a traditional game has always seemed silly to me, as there would rarely ever be any of those things in a goblin tribe for any real length of time.
The elderly, half-grown, and blind would be either be eaten or beaten to death by the tough meaner representatives of goblin society while the pregnant members would most likely be hidden away inside some barrow somewhere until they are suitable to be raped again. The only reason goblins likely even survive as a race is due to their prolific breeding.
The only time you will ever find goblin non-combatants in any traditional campaign is when the GM wants to screw with the players (especially if there is a paladin). It's very poor form if you ask me.
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The only time you will ever find goblin con-combatants in any traditional campaign is when the GM wants to screw with the players (especially if there is a paladin). It's very poor form if you ask me.
And now that Dork has passed sentence on everyone who plays the game wrong, we can all give him a around of applause and thank him from coming down off his high pedestal to deliver the verdict on our gaming.
Everyone please thank Dork for deigning to pass judgement on us, it's rather difficult for one as illustrious as he to stoop to such a low place as us dirt dwellers to tell us how we play the game wrong.
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You are all quite welcome! :P
Keep your blood money. If you will not bear the responsibility before you, that alone we shall take. I credit you only with not kneeling entirely before the altar of convenience; you spared their lives. We will ensure these, how did you put it, "vermin" have a future.
Wait, so you want to pay us to take on a bunch of thralls? Sure!
Suckers!
Oh yes, they'll be rigorously civilized, I assure you. I daresay the final product might even turn a profit in my favor if I were playing you. Do drop by again if more stock finds its way into your hands.
I scrolled through an old thread lamenting the old, old problem of what good-aligned PCs are supposed to do with the elderly, pregnant, blind and half-grown members of all those evil tribes.The notion of this ever happening in a traditional game has always seemed silly to me, as there would rarely ever be any of those things in a goblin tribe for any real length of time.
The elderly, half-grown, and blind would be either be eaten or beaten to death by the tough meaner representatives of goblin society while the pregnant members would most likely be hidden away inside some barrow somewhere until they are suitable to be raped again. The only reason goblins likely even survive as a race is due to their prolific breeding.
The only time you will ever find goblin non-combatants in any traditional campaign is when the GM wants to screw with the players (especially if there is a paladin). It's very poor form if you ask me.
Regardless it is the most likely scenario.
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Goblin tribes are massive right? So 4 pc's or npc's, low to mid level, could in the course of one adventure clear out, let's say, roughly 20 combatant goblins per level.
Every time I've ever had a true "goblin lair" type scenario I've used one of 2 tactics to remove this problem altogether: 1) the dungeon being explored is a forward location, like a fort or gatehouse to the ACTUAL lair on the natural cavern levels below. There's a bunch of goblins up here in the ruin/worked stone caves/gothic dungeon etc. who rally around their leader and defend this outpost in shifts so that daily life for the rest of the tribe goes on undisturbed. Or 2) the party is only encountering a portion of the tribe while they "cleanse" the lair. For example in one scenario the party found a kennel for the tribe's worgs. They'd encountered one worg with a hunting party on the way up to the mountain caverns, then one in the dungeon near the kennels; once they got there they saw chains hooked to pitons meant to hold 7 of the beasts. That meant that 5 more were out there somewhere assisting more teams of goblins.
In either case you have anywhere from a handful of combatants to half the tribe surviving by sheer luck of being in the right place at the right time. But, like Luke stumbling upon the smoldering remains of uncle owen, aunt veru and the moisture farm, this is how real vengeance is born...
As for the pc's babysitting ALL the remaining non-combatants; that's a logistical nightmare. I think it'd be more fun to just give them a couple: a mommy goblin that never wanted to be part of the tribe (neutral good or something) who's now in love with one of the PC's and 3 little brats that are OBSESSED with all things bad; think of Huey, Duey and Luey, Donald Duck's rotten nephews, only as goblins. The pc's are creeping silently through the woods and suddenly the kids light a bush on fire. While the cleric casts create water they tie the fighter's boots together. The rogue goes to pull a dagger only to find all his weapons stuck in place by dried tree sap. And now the kids are rolling in the mud, making all kinds of noise, and obnoxiously taunting the PC's; all the while the mommy goblin is cooing to the pc she loves "don't mind them; they're really GOOD kids once you get to know them..."
And now that Dork has passed sentence on everyone who plays the game wrong,...
The only time you will ever find goblin con-combatants in any traditional campaign is when the GM wants to screw with the players (especially if there is a paladin). It's very poor form if you ask me.
Sorry mdt, but RD did specify traditional campaign. If you play with alignment as presented in the rules, each goblin is a psychotic ax murdering rapist and arsonist. They are not doing what they think is Good, or at least best for their society in the long run. They are committing Evil acts that bring them favor with their Evil societies and Evil gods. Allowing one to go free is like releasing a deadly disease or plague.
Many campaigns play alignment very differently, or don't include it at all. If that is the way you do it, there are numerous great role playing opportunities and all kids of ways to deal with "evil non-combatants".
I personally enjoy an alignment system that is non-subjective in my games. Other people enjoy something more realistic. Neither is better or worse, but the default assumption is that Evil is evil, not just in need of a little love and care.
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List of vile racists whom shall be visited by Anklebiter kommandos later tonight:
1--Lord Fyre
2--Brambleman
3--Interzone
4--Elyas Ravenwood
5--Ravingdork
6--Karkon
Their leaders should have thought about that before sending every last one of them against the Paladin. So not only is the tribe led by evil, but they are also weak and dumb.
Leave em. Nature is harsh, but it's honest and unbiased. Everyone dies, it's a question of when, how, and what you did before croaking. They still have their chance to accomplish something (albeit a smaller chance).
Thanks Fergie.
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Geas the goblins to be civilized?
Bahahah... Hey, I was only offering "Legitimate Employment Opportunities"......
But by all means send your filthy Gobbo's to my lair, the blood on the wall is drying and it could use another coat....
-Azami Lantza, Disciple of Nyarlathotep
List of vile racists whom shall be visited by Anklebiter kommandos later tonight:
1--Lord Fyre
2--Brambleman
3--Interzone
4--Elyas Ravenwood
5--Ravingdork
6--Karkon
It's okay. Once they find out you read something, they won't care what you tell them.
[Creeps silently into Lord Fyre's boudoir, leading the Stinking Buzzards Assault Team]
I think this is an awesome notion. Great opportunities for roleplaying, comedy and some serious consideration of the ethical dimensions of adventuring.
Uh, no, officer, I haven't seen Lord Fyre since last night. No, he seemed fine then. He didn't report to work? You don't say...
That would make for some interesting allies in the future if the PCs succeed. They might be seen as goblin saviors. Imagine a schism in the Goblin mentality as one group devotes themselves to peace and order and the other to chaos and war.
I think this sounds like loads of fun.
Honestly I don't understand why inherently evil humanoids have to be presented as having an actual life-cycle or anything like that if they are just there to be killed without a thought. One idea I had was to make it so that goblins and such are really just mortal shells formed by evil spirits for the purpose of having a "good time" (i.e. tormenting mortals). They have no non-combatant-types because they're only purpose in this world is combat. A personal addition would be when you kill them their bodies dissolve (into money ;) ) and the spirit floats out visibly ranting all the way so you can tell you aren't really "killing" them.
So now not only do you have guilt-free killing but the monsters' purpose in the world (to be an enemy to the PCs) lines up with their game purpose (to be an enemy to the PCs).
[Crosses Lord Fyre off the list; adds SilvercatMoonpaw]
Sleep tight, Brambleman!
[Sets up mobile command base down the street from Brambleman's home; deploys Stinking Buzzards.]
I scrolled through an old thread lamenting the old, old problem of what good-aligned PCs are supposed to do with the elderly, pregnant, blind and half-grown members of all those evil tribes.The notion of this ever happening in a traditional game has always seemed silly to me, as there would rarely ever be any of those things in a goblin tribe for any real length of time.
The elderly, half-grown, and blind would be either be eaten or beaten to death by the tough meaner representatives of goblin society while the pregnant members would most likely be hidden away inside some barrow somewhere until they are suitable to be raped again. The only reason goblins likely even survive as a race is due to their prolific breeding.
The only time you will ever find goblin non-combatants in any traditional campaign is when the GM wants to screw with the players (especially if there is a paladin). It's very poor form if you ask me.
100% agree, besides should there be any "noncombatants" I'd kill them even if I was good aligned.
The only time you will ever find goblin non-combatants in any traditional campaign is when the GM wants to screw with the players (especially if there is a paladin). It's very poor form if you ask me.
From the Bestiary:
Organization gang (4–9), warband (10–16 with goblin dogmounts), or tribe (17+ plus 100% noncombatants; 1 sergeant
of 3rd level per 20 adults; 1 or 2 lieutenants of 4th or 5th
level; 1 leader of 6th–8th level; and 10–40 goblin dogs,
wolves, or worgs)
What would Conan do?
To crush your enemy.
To see him driven before you.And to hear the lamentations of their women.
That is what is Good in life.
My thought is that Conan would just leave the women and children in disgust and continue on his journey. But when he was responsible for his own kingdom, he would give orders to kill ALL the goblins.
Note: I don't speak for Conan, so he shouldn't be on any lists they may be floating around.
[Settles himself in some camouflage among the bushes in Interzone's yard]
You guys are going about this the wrong way. There is always buyers for unwanted sentients, if goblins can be called that. The poor, starving illithids or neh-thalggu (or whatever replacement brain-eating menaces you use) are always happy to buy any number you have. Best part of it? It is not their fault! They just can't eat anything else! Thus, it's no fault of theirs that they eat brains, and thus it can't be called morally questionable. So, providing them with food isn't either... unless you want to push the very racist and intolerant idea that goblins are more valuable than the brain eaters?
[Sets up traps in the form of trap cages where the expected goblin strike force can hide from her scary dogs]
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The poor, starving illithids...
overheard in the underdark:
"I hate goblins, they're stupid!"
"but you can't have any more drow until you finish your goblins"
Several years back I was GMing and, feeling somewhat churlish, had the (good aligned) PCs stumble across an orc wedding deep in the forest. The PCs got the drop on them, fireballed the ceremony and slew all the orcs as they fled.
Sometimes I think good vs evil has less to do with morality and more to do with which side you're on.
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[Settles himself in some camouflage among the bushes in Interzone's yard]
*uses scrying to check on status of prop 'home' used to fool intruders. Activates perimeter defenses... laughs from comfort of actual dwelling*
silly goblins.
Planeshift them all to a lawful good plane and leave them there. The archons will deal with them in the most good and lawful way.
Confident in your altruistic act, you may planeshift back home and don't need to stay around to see what happens. Whatever happens, you can be sure it's the right thing.
In fact, do this with all the evil monster settlements you can find! It's for the betterment of all!
(Pay no attention to the fact that this advice was given by a lawful evil outsider)