How do you guys rule on Purple Worms and other burrowing creatures with tremor sense when it comes to surprise rounds? Do you enforce an automatic surprise on characters as it bursts out of the ground a la Tremors or Dune?
I recently ruled that the characters/victims still get a Perception roll to hear the creature coming, which means pretty much no surprise for a Purple Worm (since it's so big it's easy to perceive). So I was left with either auto-surprise or no surprise and I went with the latter.
Second question: Does a purple worm get to bite -or- sting or bite -and- sting. Unlike most creatures in the SRD, the Purple Worm's attacks are seperated by a comma, not an "and" or an "or". That left me scratching my head.
Thanks in advance.
If you can feel it coming, why are you surprised?
That being said, in the first round before it attacks, it pretty much goes first, because it cant be attacked before it appears. So it may not get a surprise round, but it does get to munch on someone.
And actually, like ANY creature with multiple natural attacks in the SRD, the Purple Worms attacks are separated by a comma. This is because they get all of them on a full round attack.
Check for example, the Badger or Eagle :)
I would say it gets a surprise round, but everyone that noticed the tremors can act during that round. It gives it a fast paced start, which I think would make sense. After all, it wouldn't get a full attack immediately after surfacing, that's just silly.
...in the first round before it attacks, it pretty much goes first, because it cant be attacked before it appears. So it may not get a surprise round, but it does get to munch on someone.
Though, if it's not a surprise round because they heard it, and the victims win initiative, they could still ready actions and attack when it emerges, yes?
Thanks.
They can. Keep in mind, this will move their initiative to right before it as well, for rounds going forward.
Honestly, its a perfectly reasonable thing to do when you can tell a giant burrowing creature is coming for you ;)
Honestly, its a perfectly reasonable thing to do when you can tell a giant burrowing creature is coming for you ;) [/QUOTE
Yup, sounds very reasonable, thanks.
I consider two things - does the party have a chance of discerning its presence (burrow vs. earth glide, for example), and if the creature is trying to sneak up on the party, I allow it to make a Stealth check vs. their Perception, taking into account distance.
During the surprise initiative, if a character who perceives it warns the others (speech is a free action) and their initiative count hasn't passed, I do allow the potentially surprised character to be unsurprised, though they don't have quite as much info, since they didn't perceive it directly.
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/skills/perception.html#_perception
Uhm, pathfinder DOES cover this... "Sense a burrowing creature underneath you DC 25" Simple and fair. If the devs meant burrowing beasties had to roll stealth tests, they would have been given skill points in stealth with high racial bonuses.
For deeper distances, it will be nigh impossible since Perception tests made through a wall add 10 to the DCs per foot of thickness.
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/skills/perception.html#_perception
Uhm, pathfinder DOES cover this... "Sense a burrowing creature underneath you DC 25" Simple and fair. If the devs meant burrowing beasties had to roll stealth tests, they would have been given skill points in stealth with high racial bonuses.
For deeper distances, it will be nigh impossible since Perception tests made through a wall add 10 to the DCs per foot of thickness.
Cool. I'll be the first to admit I have neither the 500+ page core rulebook nor the thousands of pages of auxiliary material memorized.
Nor does this mean that if I had a burrowing creature with Stealth, that it would be sticking to that flat DC25. But I'm glad there's a defined starting point.