So, I had an idea to run a Count of Monte Crist type revenge campaign. I would set up the party to have a very clear and powerful enemy, then take everything away from them, then give them virtually limitless wealth with which to seek revenge.
What I want to know is...would that completely break the game? Or could it be done?
Surely, they'd have access to enormous power in the form of magic items and hired help, but the availability of these things wouldn't be unlimited. And the BBEG would be hugely powerful. Not just any old assassin would be able to take him down. And it's not like Holy Avengers would be available at the corner market.
Help me to think through this one. It may be unusable, but it sounds awesome to me.
So, I had an idea to run a Count of Monte Crist type revenge campaign. I would set up the party to have a very clear and powerful enemy, then take everything away from them, then give them virtually limitless wealth with which to seek revenge.
What I want to know is...would that completely break the game? Or could it be done?
Surely, they'd have access to enormous power in the form of magic items and hired help, but the availability of these things wouldn't be unlimited. And the BBEG would be hugely powerful. Not just any old assassin would be able to take him down. And it's not like Holy Avengers would be available at the corner market.
Help me to think through this one. It may be unusable, but it sounds awesome to me.
The big challenge here might be less "the party has all of the power" and more about motivations/goals.
The reason the Count of Monte Cristo is so cool is that he's not just coming back to kill them, he's coming back to ruin them in a variety of specific ways. And there are multiple villains, all involved in Edward's downfall.
If you set up the campaign where the party has a bunch of nice stuff/etc and suddenly BBEG takes it away, they may well simply use their unlimited wealth to kill him. Which won't take very long either way, or be as interesting.
So I think you will need to talk this through with your players EXTENSIVELY. If everyone is on board, the next step will be a very careful process of character creation; this only works if everyone involved is has a deep personal stake in the matter.
After that? Virtually unlimited resources = virtually unlimited resources. It will "break" your game. Whether or not that matters depends on what kind of challenges you are throwing at them.
|
Unlimited wealth could easily break the game. I suggest finding a way to "tied up" the wealth so that while the players have it, they cannot use it without giving up something for it.
For example, they inherited a goldmine. The mine can provide them (after expenses) 20k gold per month for the rest of their lives OR they can sell the mine to someone else for 250k right now.
It forces them to make choices, do they want to rush headfirst into revenge? Or do they wait it out and get more in the long term.
Remember that the Count of Monte Cristo story spanned years and he took his time setting up his revenge.
Give them a "Golden Goose" and see what they do with it. Don't just throw wealth into their faces, it kills RP.
Staff of the Magi anyone?
|
The big challenge here might be less "the party has all of the power" and more about motivations/goals.
The reason the Count of Monte Cristo is so cool is that he's not just coming back to kill them, he's coming back to ruin them in a variety of specific ways. And there are multiple villains, all involved in Edward's downfall.
If you set up the campaign where the party has a bunch of nice stuff/etc and suddenly BBEG takes it away, they may well simply use their unlimited wealth to kill him. Which won't take very long either way, or be as interesting.
So I think you will need to talk this through with your players EXTENSIVELY. If everyone is on board, the next step will be a very careful process of character creation; this only works if everyone involved is has a deep personal stake in the matter.
After that? Virtually unlimited resources = virtually unlimited resources. It will "break" your game. Whether or not that matters depends on what kind of challenges you are throwing at them.
Unless they changed it for that movie, his name was Edmund.
I'd say money can't buy everything. Even the biggest cities in a campaign have limits on the resources available. As a DM you can control what raw materials, components, and magic they have open for purchase. And finding people who can craft the items the players want may be few and far between. If your party is higher levels, have the spells, and the skills and feats to craft the items, think about time. Crafting high level magic items takes time, lots of it. If you keep the campaign active and the party moving all that money does little for them.
If it's tied up in a stronghold they purchased, who's watching it while they are away? If they take it with them, they better have some impressive inter-planar holding spaces created or an airship or something to move it about.
I'd say keep things active, give a limited time frame in which enemies are vulnerable. Make the campaign urgent and you should be able to balance out most of the ways to break the campaign with unlimited wealth.
I played a vampire campaign like this once. I had lost everything (family killed, friends sold into slavery, wife taken from me) and then as I rotted in prison I was turned by my sire. He had just as much hate for the one that destroyed my life as I did but he showed me that simply charging in and slaying him was not enough. He taught me that I would have to make him pay first. Ultimately the entire game was me and two other vampires working together to erode the power base of the BBEG. Then when we had turned his life upside down and made everyone he relied upon loathe him and destroyed everything he held dear we made our move and toppled him from power. We were greeted like champions rather than upstarts and we took over his whole organization.
Ultimately the goal is not to kill the one who took everything it's to ruin him. Make him a shell of a man and then crush him. If I were you I would give the PCs a powerful benefactor rather than a mound of cash. Have him design plots that he can not pull off (because he would be killed by the king, demon, etc) but that the PCs can because they are no bodies. This gives the benefactor who might be just as evil plausible deniability and the PC just enough power and focus to their game
Unlimited wealth works, as long as you spend some thought on availability of merchandise. Also, cause & effect stuff can play into it, like if you're buying up all the magic gear in town, certain people will notice and things can suddenly get ... complicated.
Sorry, I'm still stuck on imagining unimaginable wealth. ;)
I'm sorry you did not trademark this idea. It is now mine.
Bwahahahahahaha!
But seriously? Great idea.
Have at it! I'd love to hear your take on it. I'm always looking for new ideas and help thinking through my own. And thank you!
My concept so far is this: (And thanks for the ideas you've all offered so far.)
-The party will establish themselves somehow (i.e. low-level adventures)
-A high-level rival party will utterly destroy them (maybe frame them or something) and not think twice about doing it.
-They will lose everything and go to prison.
-A mysterious figure will spring them and take them to the lair of a powerful dragon.
-Dragon will explain that the same high-level party killed his mate and clutch and now he wants them to suffer his pain.
-He "hires" party to completely destroy the bad party through the most vile and punishing means possible, but they cannot kill them - the killing blow gets to come from the dragon.
-Dragon grants them unlimited access to his hoard of treasure to carry out the punishment.
That's all I've got so far. Feel free to critique and add to.
|
|
I think the Dragon idea is a great one. Remember that the Count was not usually the one getting his hands dirty, it was instead his minions and flunkies, his Luigi Vampas and his Cavalcantis. I'd go with making the Dragon your count character, and going with that philosophy. That way you can make him ridiculously intelligent and scheming and just hope your PCs are greedy (and what PC isn't?)
Also, I'm not sure whether it should end with a battle against the dragon. It would certainly fit into the master manipulator archetype, but it may be better just to have the dragon reward them and then be on his way. It would be pretty easy to have an ulterior motive said dragon has in getting rid of this guy (seal on his power, has an artifact he wants, other random take over the world nonsense).
heres my only concern:
telling someone they have unlimited wealth, and then saying "well, this and this and this and this just arent available" seems like sort of a copout to me.
If you wanted to provide them a hefty source of income and personal favours, thats one thing. Just dont call it unlimited :)
I'm sorry you did not trademark this idea. It is now mine.
Bwahahahahahaha!
But seriously? Great idea.
Have at it! I'd love to hear your take on it. I'm always looking for new ideas and help thinking through my own. And thank you!
My concept so far is this: (And thanks for the ideas you've all offered so far.)
-The party will establish themselves somehow (i.e. low-level adventures)
-A high-level rival party will utterly destroy them (maybe frame them or something) and not think twice about doing it.
-They will lose everything and go to prison.
-A mysterious figure will spring them and take them to the lair of a powerful dragon.
-Dragon will explain that the same high-level party killed his mate and clutch and now he wants them to suffer his pain.
-He "hires" party to completely destroy the bad party through the most vile and punishing means possible, but they cannot kill them - the killing blow gets to come from the dragon.
-Dragon grants them unlimited access to his hoard of treasure to carry out the punishment.That's all I've got so far. Feel free to critique and add to.
In the Draconomicon, there is a silver (I think) dragon who had lost his mate due to his greed, and now donates virtually all of the treasure he gets to those who need it. A dragon would not normally be willing to part with his hoard merely for revenge. Make the treasure have something to do with how the mate and clutch died, so he wants to get rid of it.
You could also give the dragon a surprise motive, a normally good dragon wants to lay waste to an entire town of innocents as part of the endgame of his revenge and now the players must stop him.
Great points and ideas, all! This is why I love these boards!
No, the wealth will not literally be "unlimited"...but basically. Maybe they'll have to account for expenses with the dragon.
The dragon will absolutely be deeply, deeply evil. (I'm thinking a red.) But he won't come across that way to the party. He'll come across as disconsolate and vulnerable, and of course a very vengeful.
I LOVE the idea that there never was a mate and clutch. He's manipulating the party to do his dirty work! LOVE IT!!
It's not that I'll say "this and that just aren't available," it's that they'll still have to go on side quests to actually EARN them in one way or another. The $$$ would just make that side quest possible. If they want a Staff of the Magi, they're going to have to use their resources to recover the one that's out there, or wait the 47 years it takes to have one made.
I'm trying to keep this one more on the sandbox end of the spectrum, so whether they fight the dragon at the end would be entirely up to them.