Because it's almost certainly too late for Bestiary 3. :)
-- The woodwose.
Although I'd like to see the Gobi Death Worm (it resembles the worms of dune).
The Death Worm is already in bestairy 2 named normal DeathWorm, in golarion there isn't Mongolia.
THe first dragon idea I actually like! Good work Meepo! But then again, this idea comes from the guy who also introduced me to Buggane, Kamaitachi/Sickle Weasel, Cherufe, ichneumon and abaia in an earlier post of him, all creatures that now play big roles in my own RPG's and Stories.
I support his entry. Especially a winter and autumn dragon would be sweet!
And no, I don't think the Winter Dragon would be anything LIKE the white dragon, I never really liked the overused rainbow D&D dragons anyway, but a winter dragon, the possiblities are much better with those.
Autumn dragon=Byako the white tiger
Spring dragon=Seiryu the azure dragon
Summer dragon=Suzaku the vermilion bird/phoenix
Winter dragon=Genbu the black tortoise
The "Season Dragon" seems to be the most logical choice of where to go for 5 new dragons
Although, I have always felt that the dragons covered in bestiaries are kind of dissapointing. There is no room for fluff to distinguish them from the existing types.
The Death Worm is already in bestairy 2 named normal DeathWorm, in golarion there isn't Mongolia.Because it's almost certainly too late for Bestiary 3. :)
-- The woodwose.
Although I'd like to see the Gobi Death Worm (it resembles the worms of dune).
And a giant version appears in Mystery Monsters Revisited
The "Season Dragon" seems to be the most logical choice of where to go for 5 new dragons
Although, I have always felt that the dragons covered in bestiaries are kind of dissapointing. There is no room for fluff to distinguish them from the existing types.
And que Dragons Unleashed!
Eye of the Deep- is a aquatic relative of the beholder that is open content.
Doesn't it seem kinda lame to use beholder-like monsters when they can't use beholders themselves? I don't think its a good idea to update every monster, especially if it doesn't really work outside of the D&D brand. It would be like updating a race that was specifically a minion of ilithids. You'd have to change so much, is it really worth converting it at all?
Ravid- one of the very very few creatures from the positive energy plane that is snake like with one clawed arm that can animate objects at random.
Why can it animate objects when there is almost no objects in its home plane? That would be like possessing the ability to breathe under water when your race lives in the desert.
Drop Bear-evil flesh eating Kaola that drops from trees to attack it's victoms.
That honestly sounds like a really bad one-liner. I'd pass on that.
Almiraj-evil one horned golden rabbit.
I'm not digging the sound of this one either.
What I mean by a light based creature is not a celestial but a creature that is made of light or has many light based powers.
I kind of figured, but considering we don't have an Elemental Plane of Light or anything, an entirely light-based creature would be kind of hard to place. Maybe Positive Energy Plane?
Dragonborn look like lizard men that is not what I am talking about. dragon blooded race I was thinking about would be able to pass for human except they might have some patches of scales, have strange looking eyes, etc.
Aw man, I absolutely hated all the art work of the race you're describing from 3.0. What was it, the Spellscale? I think? It basically was "Half-Elf background, but I'mma dragon!" I honestly like the sound of reptilian dragonborn better. I personally don't like races that have different racial traits, but are otherwise indistinguishable with humans. Its one of several reasons things that make me dislike the B3 interpretation of catfolks. If you're going to look human but have different racials, why not just make it an alternate human option?
Momstrous humaniods, fey, and aberration based races would not have that high of a RP cost.
I agree fey wouldn't; the option's already in the book. Mon. humanoids and aberrations were left out of the book for a reason, especially when you consider that DRAGONS were added in there.
If I was designing a plant(or any creature type immune to mind-affecting effects) race I would make it so mind-affecting effects would work on it.
That would be an incredibly powerful racial trait. Immunity to several entire schools of magic? (Most illusion, all enchantment, some necromancy). I would never allow that race at my table; mind blank has the spell level it does for a reason.
Not every aspect of this game is Lovecraft's so you can have non evil creatures from a world of dreams besides Leng is the place were nightmares are.
I think Animated Dream covers the bases nicely. Good-aligned dream stuff has a very high chance of turning into Care Bears. Don't really want to see Care Bears in my game.
Yes, but none of the video game companies own the rights to all the eyeball monsters.
I agree. Its mostly about style though. James made a pretty good post about trying to have a "look" for Pathfinder's creatures and its sort of hard to do flying eyeball differently from FF / DQ.
They might go on a asian cool down but that doesn't mean there will be no asian myth monsters.
Definitely. I just don't think we'll see many in Bestiary 4, if that's the stat block book this year.
Monsters that use mirrors to attack, travel like a teleport, come from a mirror dimension, or that can animate/control mirrors, or are just made out of them like a golem.
Could be cool. Could also be really difficult to write rules for. 3-dimensional flanking anyone?
Organic living weapons and armor, symbiotic creatures that can be used as weapons, armor, tools, etc.
Still sounds better as equipment IMO. Or maybe as the centerpiece of a high Sci-Fi book. Not really feeling it in a Bestiary however.
I always see people who like to make dragons that are covered in fur instead of scales. I thought it was a weird internet thing until I went to my first Ren Faire and saw vendors actually selling furry dragons. Was there any mythological basis for this type of dragon or is everything I know wrong?
I always see people who like to make dragons that are covered in fur instead of scales. I thought it was a weird internet thing until I went to my first Ren Faire and saw vendors actually selling furry dragons. Was there any mythological basis for this type of dragon or is everything I know wrong?
The old Hobbit cartoon had Smaug with hair.
Doesn't it seem kinda lame to use beholder-like monsters when they can't use beholders themselves? I don't think its a good idea to update every monster, especially if it doesn't really work outside of the D&D brand. It would be like updating a race that was specifically a minion of ilithids. You'd have to change so much, is it really worth converting it at all?
They were able to do that very thing with Neolithids. As I recall from Lords of Madness. Neolithids were actually the immature tadpoles of illithids that continued to grow and grow and eat, until it became massive.
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I always see people who like to make dragons that are covered in fur instead of scales. I thought it was a weird internet thing until I went to my first Ren Faire and saw vendors actually selling furry dragons. Was there any mythological basis for this type of dragon or is everything I know wrong?
Interesting question. This Catalonian picture of a dragon (c.1400) shows what is apparently a beard, and similar features appear on Oriental dragons. I can't find any evidence for anything more hirsute, except for perhaps the Questing Beast, which, although sharing some features with dragons, is probably sui generis.
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Well, I can see "Alien but good" working. Like the schtick of WotC's Sithillar as freaky transhumanists who believe in consent. Or my idea for a vaguely humanoid formation of tentacles colored like a starry sky, with little tenticluar wings and three eyes in the middle of their "chest". That also happen to be a race of Space Jesuses.
I'm in this boat as well. Got some posts requesting "Eldritch"/alien angels way back in this thread. :)
This may be a bit tricky, but some sort of posessed vehicle/construct/robot-type creature, either demonic or bioweaponish in nature, perhaps with a template that can be applied to existing constructs or vehicles?
Imagining various golems, ships, and whatnot being infested with this sort of "meat moss" that eventually grows into an organic shell around the artificial "skeleton", turning it into a living creature that weaponizes its "host" in various ways.
Maybe there could be some features involving absorbed passengers/crew/victims as well...
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think Animated Dream covers the bases nicely. Good-aligned dream stuff has a very high chance of turning into Care Bears. Don't really want to see Care Bears in my game.
I don't know. I can easily imagine tons of dream-related creatures that are Good and not Care Bearish.
Besides, Desna has as much stake in the dream game if not more than the Leng crowd, and she's no Care Bear. She raids the Abyss to chew demon lord faces off and doesn't afraid of anything.
I'd love to see some benign dream-creatures whether they're related to her or not.
(ha! Just thought of another! A celestial/dream-creature manifestation of the Third Man factor!)
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And another vote for some sort of ooze race as well, as long as they're sufficiently alien and don't feel like they're primarily playing to fetishes.
Complex ooze colonies, starting with a simple "root" at the beginning of a colony's life cycle and becoming more varied in nature, behavior, diet, etc. as the colony expands and converts more matter and organisms to its mass. And as the individual parts of the colony grow more advanced and intelligent, their nature might actually shift.
So you could have the odd situation of having a threat early on that does nothing but eat what it can reach. Then it stops devouring and begins converting people into near-mindless ooze-creatures serving the whole. And it continues to spread and grow in complexity until the ooze creatures' intelligence rises to something similar to what they had before. And then you might wind up with a colony of ooze-based life that might very well be relatively benign now that they've evolved into something more than mindless eating machines. Now how to reconcile that with the neighbors of the people they used to be...
How much of what they once were still lives within those new forms? And how much of a difference does that make to your PC, who may have very well been attached to some of them?
"We ate and changed the outside before we understood. We did not know we were doing harm. Now we wish to change only the inside, but we must understand the outside to learn how."
Could be a fun, entirely alien approach to alignment shifts.
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And I will send a free... something... to anyone who can sell me on a new family of five logically related dragons. New colors need not apply. Mythical creatures preferred. One head only please.
Okay Then! Here's the Card Dragons, fey dragons from the First World created by the member of the Eldest known as The Lantern King and patterned after playing cards due to his love of gambling. The first eggs were scattered randomly across Golarion by his minions "just to see what happens"
-Diamond Dragons- Aligned "Any Lawful". They are covered in red, crystalline diamond-shaped scales and have a row of diamond-shaped spines running down their backs.
They tend to be rather finicky and obsessed with matters of money; finance and treasure, though they also like to delegate the acquisition of said treasures to adventurers.
They have two breath weapons they can use, either a cone of red diamonds that do slashing damage or a deep red gas that temporarily (Though it can be made permanent with careful application of certain alchemical substances) traps whatever fails to move out of the way in a red diamond-shaped prison.
-Club Dragon- Aligned "Any Neutral". These dragons are covered in black, blunt, domelike scales, with two horns on their blunt-snouted heads that look like a combination of the horns of a moose and the club on a playing card.
They are not stupid, but they do tend to be direct in their dealings with others. They are boisterous creatures with a love of combat, ale and meat, and are always willing to join a good battle.
They have two breath weapons. One is a cone of "clubs" that do bludgeoning damage. The other is a very large "club" spit for a distance that explodes on impact.
-Spade Dragons- Aligned "Any Evil". These dragons are covered in black spikey spade-shaped scales and have seven horns that look like bulbous spade-symbols surrounding the crown of their heads.
They are arrogant and boastful, striving to become the most powerful beings by honing their physical and magical prowess and defeating and killing other powerful beings in battle to prove their might. The most powerful amongst their number is known as "The Ace of Spades" and all amongst them strive to earn that title. They are also very much risk takers and gamblers with their own lives because, in the words of a former Ace of Spades "That's the way I like it, no one wants to live forever!"
They have two breath weapons. One is a cone of "spades" that do piercing damage .The other is a spray that quickly solidifies when it hits the floor to form a surface of spade-shaped black spikes that act like caltrops, but with a nasty poison they dissolve into the wounds of anybody who steps into them.
-Heart Dragons- Aligned "Any Good" These dragons are covered in red, heart-shaped scales and have a unicorn-like horn on their heads that looks an awful lot like a heart on its base.
They are kind, gentle souls who seek mostly to help others, whether by gaining enough power to do something about the problems of one of Golarion's more miserable areas or by providing help in secret. They are quite loved and respected by the humanoid races, though some find their maternalism suffocating.
They have two breath weapons. One is a cone of hearts that heals all in its path. The other is a bright, sparkling red gas that causes those caught in it s path to (If they fail their Will save) sit down and rethink what they've done with their lives.
-Joker Dragons- Aligned "Any Chaotic". The scales of these dragons are colorfully patterned like a Jester's outfit, though its said that no two dragons' patterns are the same, and they have several colorful horns on their head in the shape and formation of a jester's cap.
Said to be their creator's favorites for their whimsical and capricious natures, they tend to approach all situations for their comedy potential, whether they be on the Good or Evil sides of the alignment spectrum. They make a elaborate plans for not only accomplishing their various (often silly or ludicrous, but surprisingly smart when you look closer at them) goals but being hilarious while doing so.
They have two breath weapons. The first is a gas that gives a random buff to any of its allies standing in it. The second is a cone of prismatic fire that gives a random hampering condition (Such as poisoning them, turning them to stone, setting them on fire, stripping off their clothing, temporarily turning their eyes into tiny noses, ect.) to whoever it hits.
So, what do you think of that idea Mr Schneider?
I really don't like the Turtle/phoenix/tiger/azure dragon version of the Season Dragons, I think Meepo's ideas is much can much better, there will be finally a white dragon (winter dragon) that I like in there.
The Doom Dragons (War, Pestilence, Death, Famine and Doom) are also very cool!
Why can it animate objects when there is almost no objects in its home plane? That would be like possessing the ability to breathe under water when your race lives in the desert.
Because it takes the positive energy with it on its travels, it also doesn't want the objects to be animated, it can't control its powers but it works like an aura. On its homeplane nothing happens, but when they are summoned or they slip into another realm which holds objects their strange aura starts to animate objects against its own will, the objects follow the Ravid but the Ravid doesn't even care, of course its handy for the Ravid as the animated objects protect it.
I think Paizo should limit the number of objects that are animated in its wake to 5 and give it an higher CR than 5, maybe CR10, also a update to its pathetic appearance would be sweet.
That honestly sounds like a really bad one-liner. I'd pass on that.
Yes, and a flying fungus-thing that doesn't even look anything like a fungus on any of its illustrations does sound ok? (Don't get me wrong I also like Mi-Go's but it does look hilaric to me.)
Sometimes you need some imagination and update skills to make monsters suitable.
In the case of the Drop Bear for example you can merge it with another tree-dropper from australia named Yara ma yha who, while that name is impossible you can use the Drop Bears name for fun reasons and give it some red tiger stripes (becaucse the Yara is red) and some nasty Aya Aya fingers that suck blood from victims and you have two Australian cryptids/horrors merged into one creature.
Really strange that a Lovecraft fan dislikes impossible, funny and strange monsters. Very odd.
My thoughts on undead are to keep to a few very basic 'types', and build everything with templates. I don't need two dozen skeleton monsters, just lots and lots of cool things I can apply to them (same for zombies, vamps, etc). For instance, I think a wight is nothing more then a very powerful zombie lord.
If you give me a monster, I will have a monster to use today, but if you give me the tools to build monsters, then I have monsters for the rest of my life.
But hey, does anyone remember Ibexians? Also called Goatmen? Or Gruffs.
Used em in a game once in a Chaos beastmen kinda vein (was into warhammer at the time). After reading the dresden files I reckon they'd work as bigger badass cousins to the Fey Satyrs. Then apply the giant template every time they get 100 years older.
And the Bargda of the Mystara (Known World/OD&D) compendium. Some really interesting critters in that one, including the Nagpa - a knockoff of those vulture people from Dark Crystal.
Anyhow, YEAH, more goat-people. That's old-school Runeques right there. :D
So cool skeletons such as Gashadokuro, Baykok and Ravenger can all perish in the template box but the goat-people (who can just be a template of satyrs) are cool with you?
Why can it animate objects when there is almost no objects in its home plane? That would be like possessing the ability to breathe under water when your race lives in the desert.Because it takes the positive energy with it on its travels, it also doesn't want the objects to be animated, it can't control its powers but it works like an aura. On its homeplane nothing happens, but when they are summoned or they slip into another realm which holds objects their strange aura starts to animate objects against its own will, the objects follow the Ravid but the Ravid doesn't even care, of course its handy for the Ravid as the animated objects protect it.
I think Paizo should limit the number of objects that are animated in its wake to 5 and give it an higher CR than 5, maybe CR10, also a update to its pathetic appearance would be sweet.
An "accident prone" monster still does not sound pretty cool to me.
That honestly sounds like a really bad one-liner. I'd pass on that.Yes, and a flying fungus-thing that doesn't even look anything like a fungus on any of its illustrations does sound ok? (Don't get me wrong I also like Mi-Go's but it does look hilaric to me.)
Sometimes you need some imagination and update skills to make monsters suitable.
In the case of the Drop Bear for example you can merge it with another tree-dropper from australia named Yara ma yha who, while that name is impossible you can use the Drop Bears name for fun reasons and give it some red tiger stripes (becaucse the Yara is red) and some nasty Aya Aya fingers that suck blood from victims and you have two Australian cryptids/horrors merged into one creature.
Really strange that a Lovecraft fan dislikes impossible, funny and strange monsters. Very odd.
Yeah, the "traditional" art of the Mi-Go is pretty weird / unbefitting of the monster itself, I agree. I think that updating monsters is okay; for example, I like the update of the flumph. I feel like being a space-faring aberration that is against the other horrors of the void is interesting; especially considering how hopeless the flumph's situation is (CR 1 monster and all). When I see a flumph, I don't see a silly fart monster. I see a desperate monster that is basically a sign of how pathetic the forces of Good are in the grand scheme of things. Maybe the flumphs lost everything to the Old Ones and that is why they basically surmount to warning others and helping them prepare for their arrival.
In fact, don't like "funny" monsters; not at all. That sort of goes against the point of them being monsters, and the only exception to my rule that I can think of at the moment is the tanuki. I'm not sure how me being a fan of Lovecraftian monsters should equate to me being a fan of silly monsters; Lovecraft's work is anything but silly, it is about cosmic insignificance and monsters that invoke that feeling should never be silly.
I also think that if you have to significantly alter the monster's real world legend for the idea to be interesting mechanically, then the monster probably isn't much of a threat as it is and doesn't really deserve to be a game monster in the first place. In the example you give with the demonic kola bears, for example, if both of the monsters aren't cool enough on their own to warrant them being in a Bestiary, why should combining them yield better results? Would chupracobra and sasquatch merged together be a cooler monster? Not at all, in fact, merging them together would cause them both to lose their former identities; a chupraquatch is not a sasquatch or a chupracobra. Merging them together basically nullifies the entire point of using either name or legend; you lose the ability to recognize the monster based on its lore. In contrast, okay to, say, take the legend of the Jersey Devil and retheme it to fit a place in Golarion (aka the Sandpoint Devil) because the spirit of the monster is still very much recognizable when you read the Sandpoint Devil's entry. You won't be able to say the same for the chupraquatch.
So cool skeletons such as Gashadokuro, Baykok and Ravenger can all perish in the template box but the goat-people (who can just be a template of satyrs) are cool with you?
Yup.
Maybe an entire splat just on them, and various offshoot 'goat types' (Minotaurs, yakmen, etc).
Better yet, just produce an entirely new setting based around variations of goat people, and stop producing stuff for Golarion. YEAH... thats the ticket. Goat people FTW. {smirk}
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I really don't like the Turtle/phoenix/tiger/azure dragon version of the Season Dragons, I think Meepo's ideas is much can much better, there will be finally a white dragon (winter dragon) that I like in there.
The Doom Dragons (War, Pestilence, Death, Famine and Doom) are also very cool!
But what do you think of my Card Dragons?
Depends on how its handled. I did a conversion of Slender Man and it seemed to go over pretty well with people, but I think that there's a very thin line with this sort of stuff. For example, the new Thin Man monster goes out of its way to show that it is partially Slender Man inspired without going far enough to be satisfying. (At least to me, anyway.)
Agreed. I think the problem with the Thin Men was that it didn't really capture the feel or appearance of the Slender Man, and tried to hard to make it something different. Although you could honestly say that with any monster that is adapted from something else.
Parasite crittersIn my humble opinion, I've seen these handled best as a type of disease.
I think I am thinking less "tapeworms" and more headcrab/facehuggers. Although these probably would work better as a template.
Wickerman constructWhat makes a wickerman different from a scarecrow golem?
Size, since a wickerman is pretty damn big. It's also a good nod to a classic horror movie (the original, less said about the Nick Cage remake the better.
Good carrion-eaters (maybe a agathion based on hyena or vulture?)Carrion-eating agathions are not going to happen. Their description in Bestiary 2 specifically says that agathions never manifest as carrion eaters among other things. It has to do with the animal possessing unsavory symbolism to humanoids that carries over when they die. Agathions are basically furry souls after all. :) Unless you're a catfolk who turns into a leonal or a sylvanshee or a kitsune who turns into a vulpinal, I guess.
Which generally indicates more western bias...scavengers don't have such a a bad rap amongst other societies. Hell, there is a ready to go Vulture agathion in myth already, Jatayu, who was related to the Garuda
Also they do mention beetle agathions...Can't imagine that beetles are considered more noble than some scavengersNew BehemothsIt'd be sweet, but I think Kaiju are more likely at this point considering A) how much James Jacobs wants them to exist and B) how often people ask for them.
We have behemoths that so far have been mentioned and not statted, including Sirocco and holocaust behemoths, so it seems like more are to come
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Stuff I don't see Paizo ever printing:
Good positive energy undead...James Jacob prefers all undead with only a few unique exceptions to be evil.He has specifically said that, but James isn't in charge of the Core Rulebook line. He's very influential throughout Pathfinder's lines, but it is certainly possible that Jason or Sean could sneak a few non-evil Undead into a Bestiary somewhere someday; stuff has been printed in the Core line before that James has come out and said he didn't agree with, but for the most part they're all pretty well in sync. I like to imagine that Jason and Sean would stop and think, "Does this make sense in Golarion?" and if they weren't sure answer it, they'd go Jamestopia.
No but James has also stated that anything that shows up in Core also shows up on Golarion, or at least a neighboring world. It might not be common, but it's out there.
So while James might not always get the way, I am not sure anyone has contradicted him regarding monsters/races yet. And no developer/Paizo person has come forward champion the idea of good undead, So I still say we won't ever see it.
Why can it animate objects when there is almost no objects in its home plane? That would be like possessing the ability to breathe under water when your race lives in the desert.Because it takes the positive energy with it on its travels, it also doesn't want the objects to be animated, it can't control its powers but it works like an aura. On its homeplane nothing happens, but when they are summoned or they slip into another realm which holds objects their strange aura starts to animate objects against its own will, the objects follow the Ravid but the Ravid doesn't even care, of course its handy for the Ravid as the animated objects protect it.
I think Paizo should limit the number of objects that are animated in its wake to 5 and give it an higher CR than 5, maybe CR10, also a update to its pathetic appearance would be sweet.
That honestly sounds like a really bad one-liner. I'd pass on that.Yes, and a flying fungus-thing that doesn't even look anything like a fungus on any of its illustrations does sound ok? (Don't get me wrong I also like Mi-Go's but it does look hilaric to me.)
Sometimes you need some imagination and update skills to make monsters suitable.
In the case of the Drop Bear for example you can merge it with another tree-dropper from australia named Yara ma yha who, while that name is impossible you can use the Drop Bears name for fun reasons and give it some red tiger stripes (becaucse the Yara is red) and some nasty Aya Aya fingers that suck blood from victims and you have two Australian cryptids/horrors merged into one creature.
Really strange that a Lovecraft fan dislikes impossible, funny and strange monsters. Very odd.
Ravids do exist in the Golarion-verse...they are mentioned in The Great Beyond. In one of the versions of this thread, a developer came on and said the main reason they hadn't shown up yet was figuring out some way to balance out the CR, which was apparently causing problems. So maybe they will show up when Formians show up?
The developers have said NO to Dropbear, for the same reason they said no jackalopes; they think they are too jokey. I agree with the other poster, making a Yara ma yha who into a dropbear is not a good idea. For one, the two have completely different origins; one started out as a joke on tourists, the other started out as a way to keep aboriginal children from wandering too far, by scaring the crap out of them. Also the Yara ma yha who is frelling horrifying...making it an evil koala bear...nope.
Bear in mind I like dropbears, but want them to stay far away from my vampiric tarsier monsters.
Also, no need to change the name...they didn't change the name on many of the Japanese monsters you are fond of, which are at least as difficult to prounounce.
As for lovecraft, "funny" is not at all what I would use to describe his monsters
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I could roll with a vulture agathion. Eaters of the dead that prevent the spread of disease and protect the dead from defilement of body and/or soul? Hell, it ties into certain real world cultures quite nicely, as said above by MMCJawa. They could even have a link with good-leaning cultures that practice sky burials.
The Drop Bear/Yara was just an example btw.
And I do find some of Lovecrafts monsters hilaric, isn't it the name it is the actual creature such as Mi-Go, old ones and the Colour out of space name.
Also I like some funny monsters, in the real worlds bestiary you also have funny creatures, especially many funny beetles (giraffe beetle) and strange impossible worms and fishes, so why would the monster world be all serious and fitting? I would like some Drop Bear, Jackalope (which in fact is just the wolpertinger without wings) and Bonnaccon action, and they are all much less hilaric than flumphs are to me.
Why so serious?
An "accident prone" monster still does not sound pretty cool to me.
I get the feeling you don't like many monsters, what do you think about Baykok, Charybdis, Alraune, Akhlut, Dust Digger and Mokele-MBembe for example? I'm very curious.
BTW the Jyoti also live on the positive energy plane and they have plenty of items for the ravid's aura to animate, even very powerful objects they like to collect.
The Drop Bear/Yara was just an example btw.
And I do find some of Lovecrafts monsters hilaric, isn't it the name it is the actual creature such as Mi-Go, old ones and the Colour out of space name.
I think you need to consider the context of the stories they were published in. The stories in which the Mi-go and the Color out of Space appear are dead serious and both monsters are used rather effectively, with the horror being less focused on the appearance of the monster but what they do.
In fact most of Lovecraft's monsters are described only vaguely if at all, and they remain mostly in the shadows.
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In fact most of Lovecraft's monsters are described only vaguely if at all, and they remain mostly in the shadows.
However, when he did decide to give a full-tilt description of one of his monster is At the Mountains of Madness, he gave an amazingly thorough description.
Objects are eight feet long all over. Six-foot, five-ridged barrel torso three and five-tenths feet central diameter, one foot end diameters. Dark gray, flexible, and infinitely tough. Seven-foot membranous wings of same color, found folded, spread out of furrows between ridges. Wing framework tubular or glandular, of lighter gray, with orifices at wing tips. Spread wings have serrated edge. Around equator, one at central apex of each of the five vertical, stave-like ridges are five systems of light gray flexible arms or tentacles found tightly folded to torso but expansible to maximum length of over three feet. Like arms of primitive crinoid. Single stalks three inches diameter branch after six inches into five substalks, each of which branches after eight inches into small, tapering tentacles or tendrils, giving each stalk a total of twenty-five tentacles.At top of torso blunt, bulbous neck of lighter gray, with gill-like suggestions, holds yellowish five-pointed starfish-shaped apparent head covered with three-inch wiry cilia of various prismatic colors. Head thick and puffy, about two feet point to point, with three-inch flexible yellowish tubes projecting from each point. Slit in exact center of top probably breathing aperture. At end of each tube is spherical expansion where yellowish membrane rolls back on handling to reveal glassy, red-irised globe, evidently an eye. Five slightly longer reddish tubes start from inner angles of starfish-shaped head and end in saclike swellings of same color which, upon pressure, open to bell-shaped orifices two inches maximum diameter and lined with sharp, white tooth like projections—probably mouths. All these tubes, cilia, and points of starfish head, found folded tightly down; tubes and points clinging to bulbous neck and torso. Flexibility surprising despite vast toughness.
At bottom of torso, rough but dissimilarly functioning counterparts of head arrangements exist. Bulbous light-gray pseudo-neck, without gill suggestions, holds greenish five-pointed starfish arrangement. Tough, muscular arms four feet long and tapering from seven inches diameter at base to about two and five-tenths at point. To each point is attached small end of a greenish five-veined membranous triangle eight inches long and six wide at farther end. This is the paddle, fin, or pseudofoot which has made prints in rocks from a thousand million to fifty or sixty million years old. From inner angles of starfish-arrangement project two-foot reddish tubes tapering from three inches diameter at base to one at tip. Orifices at tips. All these parts infinitely tough and leathery, but extremely flexible. Four-foot arms with paddles undoubtedly used for locomotion of some sort, marine or otherwise. When moved, display suggestions of exaggerated muscularity. As found, all these projections tightly folded over pseudoneck and end of torso, corresponding to projections at other end.
Cannot yet assign positively to animal or vegetable kingdom, but odds now favor animal. Probably represents incredibly advanced evolution of radiata without loss of certain primitive features. Echinoderm resemblances unmistakable despite local contradictory evidences. Wing structure puzzles in view of probable marine habitat, but may have use in water navigation. Symmetry is curiously vegetablelike, suggesting vegetable 's essential up-and-down structure rather than animal's fore-and-aft structure. Fabulously early date of evolution, preceding even simplest Archaean protozoa hitherto known, baffles all conjecture as to origin.
True however I was more trying to get at H.P. Lovecrafts monsters not being silly when read in the context of the stories they appear in.
But what do you think of my Card Dragons?
They are very creative! But personally not my own wish for a dragon, but still creative! Keep it up!
Also Wesley Snijder should take a look at the Batibat and Aitvaras, the things you can do with those monsters are awesome!
Which generally indicates more western bias...scavengers don't have such a a bad rap amongst other societies. Hell, there is a ready to go Vulture agathion in myth already, Jatayu, who was related to the Garuda
Also they do mention beetle agathions...Can't imagine that beetles are considered more noble than some scavengers
Well, yeah. Paizo's quite literally as far west as you can possibly go in the Western World, being in Seattle and all. Unless they relocate their offices to Haiwaii, I suppose. :)
Being serious, I think the difference is that beetles are pretty. Even if they eat carrion, many cultures view them like living gems and jewelry. In contrast, while many admit the necessity of vultures, I can't think of a single culture that has ever used the vulture to symbolize something good; their symbolism is usually pestilence and death, and agathions take an animalistic form that is appropriate for how the Good person visualizes themselves. You'd have a hard time selling the idea of a Good person who pictures themselves as a vulture, considering that the very word is used as a synonym for a bottom feeder / scummy sort of person.
No but James has also stated that anything that shows up in Core also shows up on Golarion, or at least a neighboring world. It might not be common, but it's out there.
So while James might not always get the way, I am not sure anyone has contradicted him regarding monsters/races yet. And no developer/Paizo person has come forward champion the idea of good undead, So I still say we won't ever see it.
I agree. Like I mentioned, the Rules team tends to weigh James' opinion on new monsters heavily before including them in the Bestiaries; especially if the monster breaks norm for Golarion. Still, that doesn't mean we'll never see it, as James has also said that some rules system (such as Words of Power) do not have a place in official Golarion lore. Unless your GM says otherwise, of course!
I could roll with a vulture agathion. Eaters of the dead that prevent the spread of disease and protect the dead from defilement of body and/or soul? Hell, it ties into certain real world cultures quite nicely, as said above by MMCJawa. They could even have a link with good-leaning cultures that practice sky burials.
Honestly, I'd be bored if it was the equivalent of Nirvana's janitor. What good does that do on a plane like Nirvana, where there is no death? The good outsiders (especially the agathions) typically hold their functions in the Outer Planes, not the Material Plane. I wouldn't expect an outsider to exist only to eat the corpses of creatures and function at burial rites.
Now, where a vulture agathion could get interesting is if you start adding in the old tradition of sin eating. You have an agathion whose job is to purify the souls worthy of nirvana of their taint, perhaps as part of their return to innocence. They eat away the chaotic, lawful, evil, and even neutral deeds of an otherwise good soul, which returns it to a more perfect, innocent form. In this case, you could take what is normally an animal associated with fairly evil things and change its function to something of a martyr; the soul of a person who is willing to sacrifice themselves for the betterment of others.
And I do find some of Lovecrafts monsters hilaric, isn't it the name it is the actual creature such as Mi-Go, old ones and the Colour out of space name.
I'm sorry if English isn't your first language and this offends you, but your misspelling of the word "hilarious" as "hilaric" is distracting me.
That said, yes, Lovecraft's alien race is called the Mi-Go and the ancient gods in his stories are called Old Ones. The monster name "colour out of space" is actually the name of the short story that the titular monster was featured in, The Colour Out of Space. I can't recall the story of the Mi-Go well, but I'm fairly certain that because they speak an alien language, Mi-Go is simply the closest translation that our human vocal chords can comfortably pronounce. If you read the story, the Colour Out of Space's name becomes very apparent, because it infects the world around it with this sick, grayish color. I don't see why you would find the name "Old Ones" funny, however. Even if I did understand, I don't understand why those monsters are funny. The Mi-Go abduct and vivisect humanoids for their horrid experiments. The Colour Out of Space erodes your mind until you're a brainless dope or until your body collapses into dust. Those are both pretty horrible ways to die.
I get the feeling you don't like many monsters, what do you think about Baykok, Charybdis, Alraune, Akhlut, Dust Digger and Mokele-MBembe for example? I'm very curious.
BTW the Jyoti also live on the positive energy plane and they have plenty of items for the ravid's aura to animate, even very powerful objects they like to collect.
Incorrect, I just don't like monsters that only exist to be silly or a joke. When a monster is faithfully stated up according to its mythological origins, if it poses no threat to the PCs then it doesn't deserve to be added to the game. I can't think of a single Pathfinder monster I don't like for such a reason.
Of the monsters you listed, before Pathfinder came around the only one I had ever heard of before was Charybdis, and I even had to do some research on all of those monsters (in my Bestiary 3) in order to remind myself what they were. Honestly I have a much better appreciation for Paizo after reading the baykok and alraune's real world myths, because Paizo did an excellent job of making their work much better than the source material. But yeah, overall I don't hate those monsters but I don't love them either. They're pretty bland in my opinion.
It's pretty obvious that you like difficult, strange-appearance monsters from books which I sometimes like (Colour and Nightgaunt) and sometimes don't (Mi-Go and Dark Young), and I like mythology and folklore monsters/stories which you find bland and boring.
It's pretty obvious that you like difficult, strange-appearance monsters from books which I sometimes like (Colour and Nightgaunt) and sometimes don't (Mi-Go and Dark Young), and I like mythology and folklore monsters/stories which you find bland and boring.
Um, once again you're making pretty bold assumptions about my tastes in monsters. Especially considering that as a whole, we've talked about maybe 2% of all the monsters out there in the game. I've already given you example of mythological monsters I do like. As a matter of fact, my home game only usually real-world mythological deities, so I like mythological monsters quite a bit, thank you.
I said it once, I'll say it again. I don't like monsters who don't provide enough mechanics to actually be a suitable challenge at their intended CR. That doesn't mean I always want my monsters to be soul-crushingly difficult, because what monsters are soul-crushingly difficult depends on the monster's CR compared to the party's APL. Stack enough templates onto something ordinary like a moose and you'll get a soul crushing encounter. But if a monster isn't strong enough on its own to be a suitable threat to a group of 1st level PCs, then I don't think its worth converting, no matter where that monster comes from. For example, a jackalope is just a rabbit with some antlers. Its not at all threatening and might warrant a familiar's statblock at beast. Traditionally speaking familiars are added to bestiaries in batches because they're not suitable for combat (they're typically CR 1/3 or so).
My other point was against the idea of mixing monster mythology together in order to make the resulting monster tougher. That doesn't work because the moment you mix those monsters together, their flavors stain each other. At that point, why even base your monster after either myth because you're ruining both myths with the other's presence.
TL;DR, You shouldn't make assumptions about what other people like, nor should you try to quantify other people's tastes into a vague, one word sentence that tries to end the discussion in your favor.
Man-Bear-Pig, a monster from Andoran Naturally (since it can only be seen by politicians)
And some christmas critters!
Ooh! Ooh! Don't forget Robot Devil, composite Santa, and evil Lincoln! :D
Remember folks, it's not an opinion contest, it's a wishlist. ;)
the differences can be blurry.
Well we can get evil Lincoln when we get to 1918 russia, teleport to the US and one create undead spell later...
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Man-Bear-Pig, a monster from Andoran Naturally (since it can only be seen by politicians)
God that episode makes me so angry, as all climate change denialism does. But I digress.
Somebody mentioned the idea of Kaiju in Pathfinder, and I gotta say that they'd be perfect for introducing that Eva-expy I mentioned a few pages back as a sort of "biological construct" designed to fight them.
They could even have it made in Zon-Kuthon-worshipping Nidal to justify importing some of the dark psychological elements as well, IE having the Eva-expies be made of the pilot's mothers, said pilots having severe abandonment issues, the creator of the Eva-expies planning to cure the world's loneliness by fusing them all into one being/having a giant naked girl hug them and turn them all into Tang, ect.
If they use that bad joke monster manbearpig and let Drop Bears out because they would be too silly then i'm gonna scream and shout and let it all out the Britney Spears way.
And even tho the Kaiju are bigger than Colossal they aren't bigger than the Island Turtle and the Bhole/Dhole Worm, and those creatures are Colossal too, so wanting creatures bigger than Colossal is not going to happen as they are already there and are also colossal.
Creature of interest today: Harionna, the female yokai with living, hooked hair that makes Rusalka's and Korrigan/Korred's hair look like little pony tails.
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I would love to see more devils, asuras, and qlippoth.
And even tho the Kaiju are bigger than Colossal they aren't bigger than the Island Turtle and the Bhole/Dhole Worm, and those creatures are Colossal too, so wanting creatures bigger than Colossal is not going to happen as they are already there and are also colossal.
Somewhere it has been said that there is no size cap on Colossal, so you could have Kaiju far larger than current monsters. My guess is that we will be seeing Kaiju sometime after mythic rules. It's pretty much been all but confirmed that we are getting them, it's just unclear on when or where.
I am of mind that an eva type construct would need to to go into some sort of distant worlds or science fantasy source book. Golarion, or at least the portions currently fleshed out, I don't think have the technology or magic needed to create something like that.
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Along with more agathions representing creatures wrongfully stigmatized by Western culture(vultures and such)...
MOAR KYTONS! Even if I'm terrified by the thought of anything that could top the Termagant in terms of OH GOD PLEASE NO
Also, more Asuras. And Tane-related creatures! And azatas. And divs. And maybe some expansion of the peri to further explore their themes. And psychopomps.
Speaking of psychopomps...I have to admit I'm feeling those guys more than the Aeons. Maybe the aeons need more love and expansion?
With Distant Worlds being a hit, I hope we can get some stock alien flora and fauna appropriate for the various worlds.
I would say in general the neutral outsiders need more fleshing out, and I would like to see more coverage of existing types as well as new ones. The options for a neutral petitioner seem a lot more limited than for either evil or good petitioners.
Aeons always strike me more as neutral versions of Qlippoth than as a typical outsider race.
How about some neutral outsiders associated with:
Battle/War
Magic
Civilization
Nature
Those are obvious ones off the bat.
Creatures from APs, and other books.
Fey Animal
Huldra
Mountain Troll
Chickcharney
Coral Golem
Lusca
Wereshark
Niranto
Lava Child
Delver
Lurker Above
Trapper
Excutioner's Hood
Gholdake
Buraq
Hadhayosh
Gremlin, Haniver
Aspidochelone
Vouivre
Drekavac
Blodeuwedd
Peluda
Stygira
Calathgar
Verdurous Ooze
Dweomor Cat
Shrik Nettle
Zomak
Giant Sea Urchin
Biloko
Flaming Skull
Medusa Head
Spring-Heeled Jack
Boruta
Werebat
Colour Out of Space
Dark Young
Dimensional Shambler
Elder Thing
Mi-Go
Star Spawn
Living Topiary
Ratling
Oni, Yamabushi Tengu
Oni, Earth Yai
Oni, Wind Yai
Oni, Nogitsune
Oni, Atamanuta
Oni, Noi
Raiju
Gare Linnorm
Selkie
Qallupilluk
Saumen Kar
Kami, Dosojin
Kami, Fukujin
Kami, Kaminami
Kami, Suijin
kijimuna
Gashadokuro
Jinmenju
Rokurokubi
Tidepool Dragon
Sea Cat
Tiberolith
Bakekujra
Coral Capuchin
Kapre
Werecrocodile
Addu
Faceless Whale
Gargiya
Lorelei
Seaweed Siren
Clockwork Familiar
Polevik
Bhole
Flying Polyp
Nightgaunt
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I'd also love to see a race of Mole-men based on the ones by John Hodgman. Yes, the one from the Daily Show.
You see, he wrote an awesome trilogy of books (Which you should all read as soon as possible) known as the Complete World Knowledge trilogy. And in the second book, "More Information Than You Requre," he talks about a race of mole-men.
And they are awesome, essentially a race of enlightened, powdered-wig wearing reptilian underground humanoids with acidic saliva, a coating of luminescent mucus and a system of government that inspired the founding fathers (The book goes into loving detail on the relationship between one of them and Thomas Jefferson)
That's not getting into the fact that they can change their gender, their strange relationship with The Great Century Toad that created the Earth, their parlament of vermin, their bizarre reproductive habits, their relationship to the Troglodytic Men and their many horrible steeds like the hoary chiggers, dirt pumas, pookas, dark newts, brain sharks, quick snails, man-eating clydesdales, iguana-like pseudosaurs, the list goes on.
I think they'd fit perfectly in Golarion, particularly in the Darklands. And speaking of Hodgman's works, Old Missus Crushgums from his third book "That Is All" so should be made into the Abolethic equivalent to a Nascent Demon Lord. And there needs to be a Hobo template with the power to summon duststorms and make hobo nickels.