UC weapons nerf?


Product Discussion


Am I the only person who was upset about the weapons Nerfs that came in the ult combat? the katana has been accepted as a bastard sword and the naginata a glaive. the meteor hammer in the adventurers armory is a better weapon overall than the one in ult combat. are these intentional downgrades or were they mistakes that will be fixed in later errata?

on the other hand i am pleased that the samurai great armor is on par with full plate. i am also pleased with the ATs (just to show I'm not a negative Nancy)


The fact that katana now has an awesome crit range bothers me not at all. Put keen on one of those bastards and invest in critical feats and have fun chopping the limbs off everything in sight ... with limbs.

Dark Archive

jeuce wrote:

Am I the only person who was upset about the weapons Nerfs that came in the ult combat? the katana has been accepted as a bastard sword and the naginata a glaive. the meteor hammer in the adventurers armory is a better weapon overall than the one in ult combat. are these intentional downgrades or were they mistakes that will be fixed in later errata?

on the other hand i am pleased that the samurai great armor is on par with full plate. i am also pleased with the ATs (just to show I'm not a negative Nancy)

katana became d8, 18-20. its better than d10 19-20.

meteor hammer in AA was almost brokenly overpowered. the dual d10s criitting on 19-20 made all other double weapons cry. it had to be held back.


Name Violation wrote:

katana became d8, 18-20. its better than d10 19-20.

meteor hammer in AA was almost brokenly overpowered. the dual d10s criitting on 19-20 made all other double weapons cry. it had to be held back.

those were just examples.

personally i think the nodachi should be stipulated to be useful from horseback only. that beast of a sword would slow down anyone trying to use it in hand to hand.
what about a pc using his katana and scabbard for twf? its not sharpened, but would you use the same stats as the combat scabbard fomr the armory?

Dark Archive

jeuce wrote:
Name Violation wrote:

katana became d8, 18-20. its better than d10 19-20.

meteor hammer in AA was almost brokenly overpowered. the dual d10s criitting on 19-20 made all other double weapons cry. it had to be held back.

those were just examples.

personally i think the nodachi should be stipulated to be useful from horseback only. that beast of a sword would slow down anyone trying to use it in hand to hand.
what about a pc using his katana and scabbard for twf? its not sharpened, but would you use the same stats as the combat scabbard fomr the armory?

you're aware of the AA erratta right?

Combat scabbard simple onehanded weapon 1 gp 1d6 crit x2 1 lb. B improvised,

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons


jeuce wrote:


on the other hand i am pleased that the samurai great armor is on par with full plate.

I'm not. There's no way I'm going to buy the notion that an O-yoroi afforded protection to its wearer on par with a European steel plate harness. No way! The worst offense is their claim in the piecemeal armour rules that the leg components of an o-yoroi are actually better (literally twice as good!) than a European fauld, tassets, and legharness. Utter, uninformed Japanophile nonsense!

It's pretty obvious that the Asian armour section was written by somebody with a deep interest in the subject--just compare the lavishly detailed description of O-yoroi in UC versus the vague description of full plate armour in the core rulebook. I suspect that one or more of the Paizo designers has a serious untreated case of "Japanese w3ap0nz r0xxorz!!!11" and that they allowed it to creep into their representation of such things in the game's rules. It's sad that we'll probably never be rid of it now. :(

I just don't think any of it was necessary at all; most of the new armour types introduced in UC could have been easily represented in the game by scale, splint, and banded, etc.

If Paizo wants to give such in-depth treatment to armours from different cultures, when can I expect such a treatment of European stuff? Maybe I think the rules for scale, splint, banded, etc. don't do justice to my favorite armour types. Maybe I demand specific rules for brigandine, coats of plates, several different types/styles of full plate armour, double mail, and others.


ArmoredSaint wrote:

Utter, uninformed Japanophile nonsense!

For the longest time people have said that folks can just re-skin existing armors/weapons for the purpose of representing items from eastern cultures.

The reverse is also true.

And honestly, the description of the O-Yoroi seems almost word for word lifted from Wikipedia. If it's true that O-Yoroi combined both Plate+ Lamellar, then having a lower AC bonuse (8 as opposed to 9) while having a higher dex bonus (2 as opposed to 1) makes sense.

I doubt anyone on the boards is a true Weapons and Armor Expert, especially when it comes to comparing different cultures.

And to belly-ache over the fact that certain number combinations are attributed to eastern armor and weapons as opposed to Western ones I find to be silly. Those stats are probably attributed to those culture's Armors as much because they wanted to differentiate the new set of equipment from stuff in the APG/Core. The Heavy armors especially fall into previously unavailable niechhes of Heavy Armors with High Dex bonuses. The same applies to weapons, though there's considerable more overlap in that area, so I'm just gonna leave that discussion alone.

Liberty's Edge

Weapons experts don't officially compare across cultures, and hardly within a culture. However, the theory that has gone into D&D over the years is not entirely baseless, and European armor is almost certainly superior to Japanese armor, and generally Asian armor- at least for the purposes of what is being simulated. Full plate is truly in a weak place in game compared to reality, and honestly has been since probably 2ed or so.

I think they did an acceptable job with the weapons- the katana definitely needs to be an 18-20 crit weapon based on the "curved weapons crit more" philosophy, so making it similar to the bastard sword with the wielding restrictions was, I thought, a good thing. The katana falls in line with the PHB weapons correctly. I was terrified that it would be a bastard sword, worse than a bastard sword, or better than a bastard sword. Instead, it gets the same treatment as other weapons, on the same scale. Good damned job there.

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