It really seems to me that the item creation rules in Pathfinder organised play (ie: no item creation) make playing a wizard a bit of a non-starter.
The problem with a wizard character is that you can learn an enormous variety of spells, but you can only prepare a few of them at a time. A spell that you know but can't cast is pointless - what's the use of learning Animate Rope if you never prepare it for casting?
The solution that the game system gives is Scribe Scroll. A scroll is a prepared spell. A wizard can prepare as many spells as they like in addition to their slots, if they pay the item creation cost. They also spend a full-round action (a move to get the scroll out, a standard action to read it) to cast them - a penalty paralleling the sorcerer's penalty to cast a metamagic spell.
In my home game (Kingmaker), my wizard has done scrolls for many of those spells that you need rarely, but which are lifesavers if you have them. I did a few scrolls of Mount. Pointless to prepare, but when a zombie horde has approached from the stable end of the inn and has just eaten your horses ... . I crafted a wand of Endure Elements, because when you need that spell, you need a lot of 'em. On hitting CL 5, my first action was to learn Water Breathing and make a scroll. Expensive, but when you need it nothing else will do. Locate Object. Create Treasure Map. Identify. Share Language. None of which you would normally prepare in your daily slots, unless you totally were given a clue that your were going to need them.
Without this mechanism - being able to pre-prepare a few special-effect spells on scrolls - I can't see that playing a wizard is very useful or fun. Given that this (IMO) is what scrolls are for, that this is the whole point of them, it should be simple to accommodate a basic mechanic of a core class without ruining organised play. (obvious fix: rule that spell completion items made by a PC wizard can only be used by that character - Read Magic and UMD notwithstanding. No selling wands/scrolls that you craft.).
BTW: where do wizards get new spells from in Pathfinder Organised Play? Surely they are not limited to just the two spells per level that they ordinarily pick up? That would really and truly make playing a wizard royally pointless.
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Crafting items creates an imbalance in character gear. And where is the line? What items? Do wizards get Scribe Scroll but not other classes?
If you have the rarely used utility spells in your book, you can use your Bonded Item to cast them.
It already is a rule that you cannot sell items between characters.
You may purchase scrolls with the intention of adding the spells to your book. The appropriate costs must be paid, and the Spellcraft check made.
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Paul
I'm playing a level 6 Wizard/Transmuter level 1 Pathfinder Chronicler and I have lots of fun and would argue that in several games lately I have been one of the most useful characters in the group.
So how do I manage to do that?
Have a varied selection of spells prepared. Tweak them once you get the mission notes. You tend to have time to change lists after you get information. You need different spells for a dungeon crawl or for overland missions.
You can buy scrolls. All that scribe scroll is doing is to half your cost. Invest in some scrolls to be more flexible. Yes - I did buy a scroll of fireball at level 1 (having just reached 4 PA) and having extra money to have played up an adventure. At that time it was for two possible uses:
A) keep it until level 5 to scribe it into my Spell Book (this should answer your other question how to get more spells).
B) use it in a really, really tight spot.
Actually I did B). Still need to write it up for Kyle Baird (name drop).
And there is the bonded item that allows one spell of choice.
In addition sometimes there are wands with a low number of charges to be bought. Get them if you can.
A wizard certainly is more difficult to play as a simple fighter. Know your spells, prepare ahead, anticipate and be flexible how to use spells. I managed in the last two games to use my very last spell slot in the last encounter and had a great blast of a game.
Wizards can be a lot of fun.
Thod
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Paul
I'm playing a level 6 Wizard/Transmuter level 1 Pathfinder Chronicler and I have lots of fun and would argue that in several games lately I have been one of the most useful characters in the group.
So how do I manage to do that?
Have a varied selection of spells prepared. Tweak them once you get the mission notes. You tend to have time to change lists after you get information. You need different spells for a dungeon crawl or for overland missions.
Ditto on all of this. My primary character is a level 8 wizard (Evoker). Note, this is supposed to be the "weakest" of the wizard specialties too. One of the people who GMs for me regularly gets frustrated at how effective the character is already. By the end of level 1 I had a 20 INT, my 8x/day power (which made up for not having a good allotment of spells), and a good quantity of backup scrolls that I had purchased. Like Thod my scroll that I held onto until it saved my butt was command undead. Not being able to scribe scroll just means you have a little less gold in the pocketbook, which trust me, don't really matter that much.
Now at level 8 I rarely go through all my spells. I pick and chose what I take based on the VC's adventure description or other in-game hints. Sure there are a few staples, but my evoker has "sub-specialized" in conjuring, and the free spell focus (evocation) makes my spells virtually unresistable on most adventures. Instead of taking feats I've been taking the spell penetration line. It's completely possible to build an effective wizard and have fun with it.
In reality, I've discovered that people who complain about the prepared spell slots on wizards tend to have a play style that lends itself better to playing sorcerers. For example, I can't stand them (sorcerers that is), but I recognize that some do. Perhaps this would be a good alternate class choice?
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Hi Paul,
One of my characters is a 6th level conjurer wizard with a ring as his arcane bond. The ring certainly helps when you need to cast a spell that you wouldn't normally prepare. The PFS system of letting you buy any 1st-level scroll really helps too. After just one scenario you have enough gold to buy a variety of scrolls. It really helps to make a wizard quite versatile even at 1st or 2nd level.
Regarding new spells, there are a couple of options:
If you receive a chronicle sheet with scrolls listed, then you can copy them into your spellbook. You only have to pay the cost of copying the scroll and also make a Spellcraft roll.
You can also buy scrolls that don't appear on your chronicle sheets and repeat the same process of copying them into your spellbook.
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What is weakest and strongest changes up a bit for PFS because it maxes out at 12, and you face less things that can be immune to Evokers.
Nobody's "immune" to evokers any more than somebody is immune to any wizard. Just because my bonus spell has to be in evocation, I still can cast from conjuration, transmutation, and the "good" schools. Sure maybe I won't be slinging out maximum damage, but with the spell penetration abilities and things like magic missile, there's always room for the extra damage he deals along with all the "normal" spellcasting I do.
While my experience is with Living Greyhawk and not PFS, I can tell you this:
I had a level 7 wizard in a living campaign setting where magical item creation was allowed. I used scribe scroll exactly once, at 1st level.
Once you get past that initial "I have no spells per day" hump, it's not bad. By 5th level, my wizard was prepping a couple fireballs or hastes and my level 1 slots were usually full with utilitarian spells or magic missiles, aka "Counterspell".
Basically, it shakes down like this. Sorcerers are for people who think they need to throw a fireball every turn or people think they aren't doing their job. Wizards are for people who accept the fact that saying "I cast haste" is really all they need to do for the whole fight.
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My primary character is a level 8 wizard (Evoker). Note, this is supposed to be the "weakest" of the wizard specialties too.What is weakest and strongest changes up a bit for PFS because it maxes out at 12, and you face less things that can be immune to Evokers.
Agree with 'Moon and Bolduan. While evokers are scorned at higher levels by the CharOpers, in PFS the level cap completely changes that..they are fine characters to play.
You can play almost any version of evoker (Wizard or Druid or Cleric etc.) and have a solid, playable, and fun character in PFS.
-Pain
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Wizards can adapt to almost any circumstance and can solve problems many other classes cannot. In the scenario I GMed this weekend, our Sorc was basically useless, because he couldn't cast any utility spells we desperately needed.
Having said that, having too many non-martial PCs in one scenario is a bad thing and almost caused a TPK at my table (again). Rogues/bards are perhaps the weakest character classes, wizards are medium (but can vary from low to high, depends on player), Fighters / Barbarians / Pallies have still meant cakewalking scenarios, at least at low levels.
It really seems to me that the item creation rules in Pathfinder organised play (ie: no item creation) make playing a wizard a bit of a non-starter.
The problem with a wizard character is that you can learn an enormous variety of spells, but you can only prepare a few of them at a time. A spell that you know but can't cast is pointless - what's the use of learning Animate Rope if you never prepare it for casting?
The solution that the game system gives is Scribe Scroll. A scroll is a prepared spell. A wizard can prepare as many spells as they like in addition to their slots, if they pay the item creation cost. They also spend a full-round action (a move to get the scroll out, a standard action to read it) to cast them - a penalty paralleling the sorcerer's penalty to cast a metamagic spell.
In my home game (Kingmaker), my wizard has done scrolls for many of those spells that you need rarely, but which are lifesavers if you have them. I did a few scrolls of Mount. Pointless to prepare, but when a zombie horde has approached from the stable end of the inn and has just eaten your horses ... . I crafted a wand of Endure Elements, because when you need that spell, you need a lot of 'em. On hitting CL 5, my first action was to learn Water Breathing and make a scroll. Expensive, but when you need it nothing else will do. Locate Object. Create Treasure Map. Identify. Share Language. None of which you would normally prepare in your daily slots, unless you totally were given a clue that your were going to need them.
Without this mechanism - being able to pre-prepare a few special-effect spells on scrolls - I can't see that playing a wizard is very useful or fun. Given that this (IMO) is what scrolls are for, that this is the whole point of them, it should be simple to accommodate a basic mechanic of a core class without ruining organised play. (obvious fix: rule that spell completion items made by a PC wizard can only be used by that...
My advice is to find a group of friends with similiar playstyles campaign philosophies and do your own thing that makes you happy. No one is going to hold a gun to your head and command you to play PFS. . .at least they haven't done that to us yet. :P
You can buy scrolls. All that scribe scroll is doing is to half your cost.
True - I hadn't considered this. And the level cap in what you can buy is no biggie. Most of the things I like to have on-hand are level 1 and 2 anyway.
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 4
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For what it's worth, in the list of most popular classes to play (from the data I have of our 60+ person community) - wizard is ranked 4th out of 21.
They typically overcome the spells per issue with:
Bonded objects
Buying scrolls
Spending 2 PA to get 50 charged 1st level wands
Pearls of Power
Generic Wondrous Items with spells times/day
The problem with a wizard character is that you can learn an enormous variety of spells, but you can only prepare a few of them at a time. A spell that you know but can't cast is pointless - what's the use of learning Animate Rope if you never prepare it for casting?
The solution that the game system gives is Scribe Scroll.
Another solution that the game system gives is leaving slots open:
At first level, probably not a good choice (but at first level, magic missile or color spray is probably it). And while the technique doesn't work in combat, as scrolls would, there are several spells (think water breathing) that tend to be used in situations where 15 minutes prep isn't too long.
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 4
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Generic Wondrous Items with spells times/dayCan you expand on this, Steve? I'm not sure what you mean by this.
Rather than prepare some spells for casting on yourself, consider purchasing any of these wondrous items that duplicate spells: Boots of Levitation, Cape of the Mountebank, Hat of Disguise, Horn of Goodness, Scabbard of Keen Edges, Slippers of Spider Climbing, Wind Fan, and many others.
However, my favorite item for Pathfinder Society characters is the Hand of Glory.
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 4
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Another option for that 7th level Wizard looking for more spells per day is Minor Spell Expertise.
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Generic Wondrous Items with spells times/dayCan you expand on this, Steve? I'm not sure what you mean by this.Rather than prepare some spells for casting on yourself, consider purchasing any of these wondrous items that duplicate spells: Boots of Levitation, Cape of the Mountebank, Hat of Disguise, Horn of Goodness, Scabbard of Keen Edges, Slippers of Spider Climbing, Wind Fan, and many others.
However, my favorite item for Pathfinder Society characters is the Hand of Glory.
Thanks for the reply. The "generic" wondrous items had me confused about what was being communicated.
RPG Superstar 2013 Top 8
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You're awfully dependent on a first level spell. That is going to have effects as you get to higher levels. Even if you consistently face things that can be tripped, which won't be as true as you go up in level, the damage from MM is at best weak at higher levels. You really should be doing something more effective with your actions.
Average damage on a 10d6 fireball is 35. That drops to 17 if the target makes it save, which also discounts any energy resistance (or vulnerability) a monster has.
Average damage on a 9th level magic missile is 17 with no save and automatic hit and almost no possibility of energy resistance. Also does full damage to incorporeal creatures.
The fireball might hit more creatures and do more aggregate damage, and it might also get a friendly creature or some unattended objects you don't want to damage.
I don't think that the damage from magic missile is weak at higher levels.
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When you get enough dough, a wand of haste might be a good investment if you know you're going to be throwing them out every combat. They're kind of pricey but probably also worth it.
FWIW, Fireball can still be pretty ridiculous in the upper levels with the right build (Magical Lineage, Wayang spell hunter, Preferred Spell, Spell Perfection)
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Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria
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Hey everyone,
I'm digging up kind of a dead post but this seems to be the best place.
Just played a con over the weekend and my wizard foresight wizard with tripping magic missiles got to level 6. Hooray, I get haste and more low-level spells! Most of my 1st level spells are predetermined:
** spoiler omitted **
The nice thing about those Magic Missiles is they hit and trip but I don't get many of them. My workaround used to be a wand of magic missile. This worked well until my module yesterday where when we were in trouble and I was out of spells, 1d4+1 was more of a joke than helpful. Now that wand is about gone and I need to replace it with something. Is there a level 1 or 2 (on either a wand or scroll) that isn't going to break the bank but give me benefits for levels to come as something to do to conserve spells/backup when I run out?
You already received good suggestions for additional purchases, but I just want to mention, that you can't use your toppling spell metamagic feat with the magic missiles from your wand. I am not claiming that you tried to do so, I just wanted to clarify it for other readers.
And as Jessex has mentioned Int 28 might be a bit ambitious, by all means continue using your toppling spells, but remember that CMDs and legs tend to increase dramatically at higher levels.
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28 int at level 9 I hear?
Do note that level 9 with 5th level spells is when you get all of the really good save or dies. I managed to get a 30 cha on my sorcerer at level 10 (wafer) and very few things made the save against his icy prison, and if they did, they are now entangled for you to enervate and try again...