Hey everyone, I'm starting a new campaign and I'm trying to decide if I want to use an AP or try Sandboxing a campaign. I've ran one once before but it was more of a joke campaign that I ran when we were missing too many players and it was a LONG time ago.
anyway, any good pointers on running a sandbox style game?
RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32
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The best advice I can give is this:
Have many options presented to the players and let them set the pace and direction of the game. Be prepared for them to do something unexpected, and be ready to improvise if you didn't prepare for something that comes up.
If you need advice on how to run a sandbox game, as in how to prepare and handle one, let us know and we can discuss that.
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Make sure your players are up for it. The fact is, not every player is up for this kind of thing. I was born and bred a sandbox GM and my last campaign (before the one I’m running now) was hell because two of the players had zero initiative, and needed things spoon-fed to them.
At one point I flooded them with options, characters, details, and there they were with 2 zillion plot threads. They took none of them until something came in and literally bonked them on the head.
Seconded on the "letting your players set the tone" bit. Improvisation helps a lot, and as long as they're having fun, don't worry about having to fight some evil guy, or rescue someone (unless that's what they're looking for). Ask them about what kind of game they want to play and just come up with rough scenarios.
Oh, and if you have two ideas planned, expect them to bypass those and go for something you had not expected.
alternatively you can write a campaign and just change locations when your players do something screwy.
Such as if you have a mountain fortress they need to storm to advance your plot but they go off into the woods then create a giant tree fortress that contains exactly what the mountain would have.
This is technically railroading but the PC's wont feel like it is, which is the important part.
Or make sure they create their characters with goals before they are approved for play. That way they already have a task for you to fill in the holes for, that way you know they will follow it.
Remember that the term "sandboxing" has about as many definitions as the term "virtue." Make sure that you and your players are on board as to what definition that you're using.
Start small and build outward. Don't worry about to many details about global or multiverse issues. If you have a pantheon of gods worked out that's cool but you can always start with one or two that will be relevant on the local level and add others as the need arise.
Give them a central quest hub, typically a village or a small town. You can also do urban sandbox games but I think they present a ton of challenges to a novice GM.
Outline local authorities such as the local baron, village elders, the militia captain, local clergy, friendly doddering hedge wizard, etc. These individuals represent your core quest givers and provide significant campaign rewards.
Outline critical resource points for adventures, these are normally Inns, Craftsmen, Healers, Merchants, etc. These represent resources the players can rely on and ways of spending ill gotten gains.
Depending on the goals of your players outline some additional NPCs that provide hooks to various subplots and secondary quests. The PCs don't need to follow these to get necessary loot and XP but they can result in NPC boons and various cool plot devices such as Romantic Entanglements, etc.
Once you've got a pretty solid foundation built for your quest hub then you can begin designing various adventure sites in the close proximity to the home base. Typically the average CR for encounters in these locations needs to be around CR = APL or APL +1 or such. If there is going to be a high CR monster close to the quest hub rumors in the tavern need to provide insight to the players so they can plan accordingly and exit accordingly.
As the PCs begin to defeat the local adventure locales offer them hooks to more challenging location farther and farther afield. Eventually you might even transition them to a new quest hub as the resources available to the initial hub are insufficient.
Remember to keep the setting dynamic. If the PCs hear about a quest to defeat a Goblin tribe when they are 3rd level but choose not to encounter it then if they choose to fight it when 6 months have gone by and they are now 6th level then the tribe should be a bigger threat. Also nature abhors a vacuum, if the PCs clear out one dungeon but don't occupy it in a meaningful manner, other hostiles might take up residence. This is a useful way of re-using adventure locations you developed earlier in the campaign.
If you Players are really, really passive you might have to go with a blended sandbox plot mcguffin narrative to get them off their keisters but I think most people have played enough CRPGs that if the initial village seems vaguely like a quest hub they'll figure stuff out on their own.
The fact is, not every player is up for this kind of thing.
Some players founder in a sandbox style campaign.
I think the most important thing for a good sandbox style game is that your need PCs with motivations. The initiative is with the players. If their characters do not pursue their own goals, you might as well just use random wandering monster tables.
When your players create their characters, ask for motivations. They should be something the players will enjoy because they are going to drive the game. Also, discuss conflicting motivations. Depending on the group, this can create dynamic inter party conflict which some people enjoy. Not everyone does and it can tear a group apart. So it is something that should be discussed before hand.
Once you have motivations, create a villain your players will love to hate. You should already have the PCs motivations, so create your villain with conflicting motivations so that he involves himself in your PC's efforts. You do not need face to face conflict for your players to hate your villain's guts. He just needs to put obstacles in their way. Once they defeat a few of his plans, have your villain make it personal and go after what the PCs care about. If the PCs do not hate him yet, they will now.
Thanks for the advice guys! If anyone has anything else to say, please go on!
Make sure your players are up for it. The fact is, not every player is up for this kind of thing. I was born and bred a sandbox GM and my last campaign (before the one I’m running now) was hell because two of the players had zero initiative, and needed things spoon-fed to them.
At one point I flooded them with options, characters, details, and there they were with 2 zillion plot threads. They took none of them until something came in and literally bonked them on the head.
+1
I've had the same experience more than once. For someone like me who loves playing in sandboxy games and takes a lot of initiative when roleplaying, it's hard to believe how poorly some players take to this kind of game.
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No matter what game I'm running it tends to turn into a sandbox. My players always tend to find unusual solutions to simple problems - especially in urban games.
NPCs need to be constructed on the fly, and encounters built around my player's mad ideas. All because the quest for the jelly donut requires 80 ft. of rope and access to a scroll of regenerate and a captured shocker lizard.
As opposed to going to the nearest bakery and buying a jelly donut.
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You could always combine the two and run the Kingmaker AP. It has a very sandbox-y feel to it yet shows how a set over all story arc helps keep a campaign in a set direction. It will help you a lot. It also has rules for kingdom building and mass combat so you have those learnt should a future party decide to go down that route.
I think the most important thing for a good sandbox style game is that your need PCs with motivations. The initiative is with the players. If their characters do not pursue their own goals, you might as well just use random wandering monster tables.
When your players create their characters, ask for motivations. They should be something the players will enjoy because they are going to drive the game. Also, discuss conflicting motivations. Depending on the group, this can create dynamic inter party conflict which some people enjoy. Not everyone does and it can tear a group apart. So it is something that should be discussed before hand.
Once you have motivations, create a villain your players will love to hate. You should already have the PCs motivations, so create your villain with conflicting motivations so that he involves himself in your PC's efforts. You do not need face to face conflict for your players to hate your villain's guts. He just needs to put obstacles in their way. Once they defeat a few of his plans, have your villain make it personal and go after what the PCs care about. If the PCs do not hate him yet, they will now.
Great advice!
I'd like to expand on that a little.
In a live action game I've been helping run, we required each character to have three goals:
- Short term goal - something they can accomplish in 1-3 games.
- Make an ally in the town guard.
- Learn all the 2nd level illusion spells.
- Visit a place that's too dangerous for most people, and bring back proof I was there. - Long term goal - something that can be accomplished over 3-12 game sessions.
- Establish a base of operations.
- Find my long lost brother.
- Own the fastest horse in the land. - Recurring goal - something that can be accomplished or worked toward over and over.
- Prove myself against a superior foe.
- Get fame and reputation with the populace.
- Seek adventure in every part of the world.
Working one-on-one with each player to create these goals really helped us convince them that their goals were important to us. It also helped us prepare a game that would interest them. You may want use use this, or make something like it, but I suggest making some kind of a structure in advance. It will help you make reasonable demands of the players, and help them know what you expect.
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There are a few things I've found are important from playing sandbox games.
1) Backstory. The players need a backstory. Nothing too long, perhaps even a paragraph or two is enough. As a GM make sure you have this in advance so you can add personal elements to the game. This ties in with motivation mentioned by Blueluck.
2) Let the players "bring the cool". Reward you players for good ideas. If they have a solution you hadn't thought of then run with it. Try no to say 'no' to anything. If they head off to talk to the local priest then ask them what his name will be. One idea I like for NPC concept creation is if they want to create an NPC ally then the PC's come up with the concept and their virtues, then as a GM it is your job to add their darker side to build the rounded character.
3) Reward the players. If one of the PC's wants to write a letter to an NPC away from the table then encourage it. Send them a rely with a small amount of XP as well. Even if the characters are sending letters to each other if the CC you in the email then not only are they creating more plot hook but it allows you to get an idea of where they party might head next session. Again, a small amount of XP as a reward will encourage more of this.
In a live action game I've been helping run, we required each character to have three goals:
Short term goal - something they can accomplish in 1-3 games.
- Make an ally in the town guard.
- Learn all the 2nd level illusion spells.
- Visit a place that's too dangerous for most people, and bring back proof I was there.
Long term goal - something that can be accomplished over 3-12 game sessions.
- Establish a base of operations.
- Find my long lost brother.
- Own the fastest horse in the land.
Recurring goal - something that can be accomplished or worked toward over and over.
- Prove myself against a superior foe.
- Get fame and reputation with the populace.
- Seek adventure in every part of the world.
Whenever a short or long term goal is accomplished, the player makes up a new one. We also let players change their goals any time they'd like.
In an indie RPG called Duty & Honour (based on the peninsular war in Spain) there is a rather good player mission system that works similar to this. Worth buying the PDF for a look.
Another trick I like to use it to allow them the freedom of the world, but give them the resources of an island.
That being said, I usually start them, literally on an island... or valley... or some other isolated setting. This lets them make decisions without too many variables being thrown in.
In time, give them a means to leave this "island." By then, you'll have a feel for the direction they'll take and can have more resources planned for those eventualities.
The key to a good sandbox is to always let the players FEEL like they're calling the shots, especially when you're railroading them.
As stated earlier, however, some players just don't sandbox well; they just need direction.
It's important to have pre-game dialog to find out what the players expect and would like to see. Back stories and plans for the future help give you the direction of where they'll likely go, but it's important to know if they like a lot of intrigue, combat, ROLEplaying, or just want a night with friends away from work, school, and family.