Yeah, maybe I'm just being lazy, but...


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


...if this is already somewhere out there, why not ask? Does anyone know of a compiled list of monsters with no hit dice (and therefore supposedly ok for pc's) out there?

Sczarni

ChuckSC6568 wrote:
...if this is already somewhere out there, why not ask? Does anyone know of a compiled list of monsters with no hit dice (and therefore supposedly ok for pc's) out there?

Officially, everything in the bestiary is made to be monsters and not made to be PCs. Anything that you think you would like to have as your PC you have to check with your DM and have them OK it.


ChuckSC6568 wrote:
(and therefore supposedly ok for pc's)

This is a generous misreading of the book's actual statement that has lead to some trouble historically.

Anything not explicitly offered as a player race is not a player race. GM approval is required for monster PCs, and the book suggests that in those situations, fractional HD monsters are the most appropriate. That statement is in no way a consent for players to make MPCs without expressed permission.

They are not "okay" for PCs. These kind of things have a way of getting out of hand, don't they? Anyone else remember when Prestige Classes were in the DMG and intended for NPCs and only the occasional PC with GM permission? That lasted.


Perhaps I could have worded my question better. Has anyone already compiled a list of monsters from the Bestiary books that do not have racial hit dice and specifically have a section detailing them as player characters?


And of course I realize that GM permission would be required to play one of these monsters regardless. Hell, GM permission is required to play anything actually.

Paizo Employee Director of Narrative

This is off the top of my head, so I probably missed some:

aasimar
tengu
tiefling
dhampir
ifrit
oread
slyph
undine

Edit: goblin
hobgoblin
kobold
fetchling
grippli


Looked the books over since then, and I THINK I have them all. Please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong or if I left something off the list...

Aasimar
Drow (including Drow Noble)
Duergar
Goblin
Hobgoblin
Kobold
Orc
Svirfneblin
Tengu
Tiefling
Dhampir
Fetchling
Grippli
Ifrit
Oread
Undine

Shadow Lodge

ChuckSC6568 wrote:
Perhaps I could have worded my question better. Has anyone already compiled a list of monsters from the Bestiary books that do not have racial hit dice and specifically have a section detailing them as player characters?

...

The bit in the bestiary has nothing to do with detailing them as "player" characters. For example both Drow and Drow Noble are listed even though there is a pretty significant gap in power between the two. The listings are there so GMs can create NPCs.

I don't care if you guys are using these races for your game, just pointing it out because the zero HD thing doesn't mean they are balanced versus PC races at all or that that's even a consideration.


Honestly, except for perhaps the drow and drow noble, I don't see a big jump in balance between those races I previously listed and the "core" races. Almost all of them have some sort of darwback/weakness that helps offset any sort of power spike, and the ones that don't REALLY aren't all that much more than your standard races.


Then there's the weakness that they ALL have. They're monsters. Just being in the vicinity of the right town could spell trouble for them.


Evil Lincoln wrote:
Anyone else remember when Prestige Classes were in the DMG and intended for NPCs and only the occasional PC with GM permission? That lasted.

...no :)

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