How would they get into saventh yhi which is mysteriously protected from detection except by the way the PCs found it?
The Ioun Stone in the Wayfinder would not be leading to Saventh Yhi, but to Ilmurea, the Serpent City under Saventh Yhi.
Not sure if you have read the story of Eando Kline. He is a Pathfinder who put a mysterious Ioun Stone in his Wayfinder. This stone lead him way up north, thru an Orc nation, deep underground, to another Serpent City, where he awoke one of the Serpent Folk - he barely survived taking out that awakened sleeper and didn't want to have anything to do with waking any of the others.
I was thinking more along those lines of causing the Pathfinders to show up. After all, the Serpent Folk would not have gone into that kind of "sleep" without having multiple ways of being awoken - Ioun Stones, realy risers, etc..
How would they get into saventh yhi which is mysteriously protected from detection except by the way the PCs found it?The Ioun Stone in the Wayfinder would not be leading to Saventh Yhi, but to Ilmurea, the Serpent City under Saventh Yhi.
Not sure if you have read the story of Eando Kline. He is a Pathfinder who put a mysterious Ioun Stone in his Wayfinder. This stone lead him way up north, thru an Orc nation, deep underground, to another Serpent City, where he awoke one of the Serpent Folk - he barely survived taking out that awakened sleeper and didn't want to have anything to do with waking any of the others.
I was thinking more along those lines of causing the Pathfinders to show up. After all, the Serpent Folk would not have gone into that kind of "sleep" without having multiple ways of being awoken - Ioun Stones, realy risers, etc..
In City of seven spears it says that the magical protection of Saventh-Yhi extends into Ilmuera so this would be just as far-fetched.
But couldn't someone have been tracking the pc's and followed them to Saventh-Yhi? You could also say that once the pc's starts to activate the spears the magical protection will temporarily fluctuate allowing for magic to find the city. Another idea is to have an active cult of Ydersius infiltrating the various factions and leading them to Saventh-Yhi to stop the pc's or serve up the faction members as sacrifices in the ritual taking place in the last part.
In City of seven spears it says that the magical protection of Saventh-Yhi extends into Ilmuera so this would be just as far-fetched.
I wasn't really "seeing" the Ioun Stones as using divination, as when they would have been created, Saventh Yhi had not been built yet.
I was seeing them leading the owner along a certain trail, to an entrance to Ilmuera. Once above Ilumuera, then the stone may not work properly, as it's original setting didn't allow for an Azlanti city above, or now that it is in Saventh Yhi, it can "see" the course to one of the gates.
How would they get into saventh yhi which is mysteriously protected from detection except by the way the PCs found it?The Ioun Stone in the Wayfinder would not be leading to Saventh Yhi, but to Ilmurea, the Serpent City under Saventh Yhi.
Not sure if you have read the story of Eando Kline. He is a Pathfinder who put a mysterious Ioun Stone in his Wayfinder. This stone lead him way up north, thru an Orc nation, deep underground, to another Serpent City, where he awoke one of the Serpent Folk - he barely survived taking out that awakened sleeper and didn't want to have anything to do with waking any of the others.
I was thinking more along those lines of causing the Pathfinders to show up. After all, the Serpent Folk would not have gone into that kind of "sleep" without having multiple ways of being awoken - Ioun Stones, realy risers, etc..
In City of seven spears it says that the magical protection of Saventh-Yhi extends into Ilmuera so this would be just as far-fetched.
But couldn't someone have been tracking the pc's and followed them to Saventh-Yhi? You could also say that once the pc's starts to activate the spears the magical protection will temporarily fluctuate allowing for magic to find the city. Another idea is to have an active cult of Ydersius infiltrating the various factions and leading them to Saventh-Yhi to stop the pc's or serve up the faction members as sacrifices in the ritual taking place in the last part.
the "tracking the Pc's" is how the sargavan government is involved, we can't use that excuse for everyone.
Plus more expeditions aren't going to add to anything now, its not going to 'jump start' anything.
Oh my did we wander outside your sandbox? heaven forbid.have you tried just starting it over and do it up right.
or do you just want to brag about how y'all ruined a perfectly good adventure path i think its the later, have fun with your mess.
'
So if the DM's had ran the adventure with the motivations as they were written would things have been different?
Sandbox means the PC's have a lot of freedom. It does not mean the DM can run the plot as he likes and it will still work.
I am not being a being antagonistic like the other poster, just asking a question, and pointing out how I always view "sandbox".
PS:No AP is perfectly good.
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Hey Pendagast,
I just finished skimming thru the end books... I would strong suggest you 'consolidate' the DM for the remainder of the AP and read thru them.
While it may not be of much help depending on how your players want to run things, it will give you a better idea on where the AP winds up, and what affect the other factions may have on the overall campaign play.
I know that reading thru the remaining books has given me some ideas on how I want to approach things... of course all my ideas/plans may come to nothing when my players decide on how they want to do things.
Anyway, I am curious as to how things turn out for you, whether you can salvage your game or if you call it quits.
Good luck!
I suggest that you add the things you mention that made the PCs compelled to get to the city. Add some cool treasure, and some obscure clues or interesting glyphs.
I haven't yet read any of the Serpent's Skull modules (I prefer to wait until I have all six parts before I start reading an AP), so unfortunately I can't give you any specific suggestions on exactly what to add.
The notion some people have voiced that you somehow "did it wrong" makes no sense (and doesn't help, either). You can't "do it wrong" in a roleplaying game. If the PCs do things that the adventure didn't expect, then the DM just has to find some way to get back on track. Even if that means skipping parts of an adventure and making something up. It seems to me that this whole thread was started so the DM could get some ideas for what to invent to facilitate that.
I suggest that you add the things you mention that made the PCs compelled to get to the city. Add some cool treasure, and some obscure clues or interesting glyphs.
I haven't yet read any of the Serpent's Skull modules (I prefer to wait until I have all six parts before I start reading an AP), so unfortunately I can't give you any specific suggestions on exactly what to add.
The notion some people have voiced that you somehow "did it wrong" makes no sense (and doesn't help, either). You can't "do it wrong" in a roleplaying game. If the PCs do things that the adventure didn't expect, then the DM just has to find some way to get back on track. Even if that means skipping parts of an adventure and making something up. It seems to me that this whole thread was started so the DM could get some ideas for what to invent to facilitate that.
yea yea, i agree, I just am at sorta a writers block, A) because I didnt start this as the DM so im just getting the seat warm and B) I dont want to derail things by giving them something cool here that overshadows something they are supposed to get later.
Im also not 'feeling' the whole big war at the end thing.
Im toying with the idea of some backround war, I read a synopsis somewhere that has the pcs leading armies down tunnels made by the spears once activated to do dirty battle with hoardes of serpent folk.
Meh, im not really interested, more interested in fighting cultists and possibly an avatar or half-god.
The party has ONE, cool interesting magic item, It's a falcata, lets you free move in water, it's keen and its general description was just cool. Everything else is like, healing potion, +1 spear blah blah blah.
I read some of the adventure path magic items and was pretty disappointed too. Some of them I didnt even get, it was like a great big huh???
Oh I take it back we have TWO cool magic items, that mask we picked up is hilarious, the half orc ronin wears it, and his scare ability didn't work one time, so he took the mask off and intimidated the people (which did work) so the DM said the half-orcs face was scarier than the actual mask.
That was pretty funny.
We sort of prefer the low magic, running down the halls arms flailing in the air screaming wildly as the scary monster chases us out of it's lair style of play.
That being said we like our magic items, (like the cool sword) and prefer more powerful ones to have draw backs (like curses or activation rolls), We just don't like to have everyone in the party with one in each 'slot'. Or everyone with a 'really good weapon'
I was thinking actually I'd like to see more ancient azlanti artifact type finds here (not necessarily of the artifact power level)
We are sorta playing the falcata off as an azlanti style sword as opposed to a 'modern' weapon like a longsword, and as such the magus had to take exotic WP to use it.
I want something more like that.
I was kinda thinking maybe a staff with some intelligence,ego and all that good stuff, but not too powerful. I also might maybe to use an intelligent magic item to narrate and move things along a bit.
anyone have some ideas in this ball park?
Don't worry too much about the armies in the last installment of Serpent Skull--they're decidedly in the background. They're explicitly the distraction to pull the excess defenders from the titular Sanctum of the Serpent God so that the PCs can bring the hurt to the core guys.
As for magic items that can fill in details, you could use either the mantis blade the troglodytes are protecting, or the hezrou-in-a-jar in the boggard's district. Make it so that the hezrou was around during the fall of the city and still has more than two questions to answer truthfully; he'll be very motivated to fill them in on some of the city's history that way.
Don't worry too much about the armies in the last installment of Serpent Skull--they're decidedly in the background. They're explicitly the distraction to pull the excess defenders from the titular Sanctum of the Serpent God so that the PCs can bring the hurt to the core guys.
As for magic items that can fill in details, you could use either the mantis blade the troglodytes are protecting, or the hezrou-in-a-jar in the boggard's district. Make it so that the hezrou was around during the fall of the city and still has more than two questions to answer truthfully; he'll be very motivated to fill them in on some of the city's history that way.
yea i dont like the mantis blade AT all.
Anytime a magic item is aimed at a specific class (especially a class the PC's aren't going to be like red mantis assassin) it give me a bad taste in my mouth.So that one HAS to be replaced.
The Mantis blade is a minor artifact, so i could do something cool for a magic item.
the witch player is a big fan of the movie "Librarian quest for the spear"
I was thinking of a set of rods (three) that no only could be a spear (something along the line of a rod of lordly might) but when combined had some other cool power (maybe intelligence) I was thinking making the spear serpentfolk bane as it could have been from savenths era.
Each rod in and of it's self could be a meta magic rod (or could I have rods that meta hex instead of meta spell?) and then together they form a serpent bane spear that is intelligent.
So in a way its a rod, a spear and a staff.
Do i need anything else when it's combined together, or do you think the intelligent spear aspect is enough?
I also had in mind a cloak (along the line of spawn, the comic book) where it had it's own intelligence, maybe capable of performing some combat manuevers, was really ooky spooky, maybe something along the lines of a cloak of arachnidia and of the bat, combined on steroids, and intelligent.
then I thought of how the azlanti was this lost civilization, and maybe like atlantis they had more advanced technology, and although guns are new to golarion finding an ancient azlanti magic pistol (an intelligent pistol would be weird) would be the other idea, along with some information leading to proof the azlanti had more knowledge and technology etc etc (papers/detailed notes of lost alchemist discoveries, maybe a book of golem construction to make an advanced alchemy golem....stuff the PCs could sell for tons of gold and get huge credit for once returning to civilization)
anyway those are some of my thoughts and ideas, what do you think?
In racing to ruin, the people we were "racing" (or trying to shake) was from the sargavan government, they attacked us in our home, they tried to get some crazed barbarian dude with knives to kill us, they jumped us after a fight with some boogie men in the jungle with human bane arrows, and they beat us to tazion, where once rescued fro the monkey men were warned not to come back.
I do not think it is odd, considering all the trouble, and previous times they have been attacked, that the party attacked them and killed them in Saventh Yhi.
See, that was the context missing before. Now it makes sense why your party ambushed them. Well, in that case the prior GM goofed, because I don't think the Sargavans are supposed to be this hostile. He messed up on other fronts as well, apparently missing the opportunity to spread the rumours about the city by having someone from the Sargavan government have a loose tongue.
Oh my did we wander outside your sandbox? heaven forbid.have you tried just starting it over and do it up right.
or do you just want to brag about how y'all ruined a perfectly good adventure path i think its the later, have fun with your mess.'
So if the DM's had ran the adventure with the motivations as they were written would things have been different?
Sandbox means the PC's have a lot of freedom. It does not mean the DM can run the plot as he likes and it will still work.
I am not being a being antagonistic like the other poster, just asking a question, and pointing out how I always view "sandbox".PS:No AP is perfectly good.
Well it's not entirely the DMs fault. We as players just simply weren't interested in the NPCs. So the NPCs never got fleshed out, what were we supposed to do, sit there and listen to him as each NPC gave a soliloquy?
"But these NPCs are important you have to care about them"
nope sorry does work for me.
How would things have turned out different if instead of playing a witch or an inquisitor, the players who had PCs die played the actual female castaways as written? They would still have been members of the party.
As such would not have been tangled up with different factions, and brought them information.Gelik and Toshirou (is that right) got killed by cannibals, maybe they would have been safer back in camp I don't know. But that's what happened. Dice rolls are Dice rolls.
It's ok if the PCs get killed but the NPC's have to survive? How does that work?The DM tried to lead it in a direction where we hook up with a patron, he asked us about it several times, we wanted no part of it.
Should he have FORCED us into taking on a patron?
We did not need to hire anyone to translate for us, we had that witch.
She read everything right there in the cave.
I suppose a wizard with comprehend languages would have done the same thing, but he likely wouldnt have...
I think that it is the DM's job to adjust an AP so it fits to a certain point of course. That means adjusting an NPC's attitude or whatever is not interesting about them to make them interesting. Maybe your group being stranded would have liked a place to stay so give an NPC a house. Maybe another one has a way to get magic items, and so on. I do agree with you about not forcing NPC's on a party. Been there, done that, and it was not cool.
I was mostly asking out of curiosity, and I can't really make any adjustments without knowing what motivates your players or characters or both. I know one of my players loves RP, and another likes to kill things and take their loot so I try to throw in an encounter if I see combat guy's eyes glazing over, and I throw in a good dose of RP for the other player. The rest of the group is easier to satisfy. I have some of the books, but I have not ran it yet. It does give me something to look out for if my group decides to ignore the NPC's.
Don't worry too much about the armies in the last installment of Serpent Skull--they're decidedly in the background. They're explicitly the distraction to pull the excess defenders from the titular Sanctum of the Serpent God so that the PCs can bring the hurt to the core guys.
As for magic items that can fill in details, you could use either the mantis blade the troglodytes are protecting, or the hezrou-in-a-jar in the boggard's district. Make it so that the hezrou was around during the fall of the city and still has more than two questions to answer truthfully; he'll be very motivated to fill them in on some of the city's history that way.
yea i dont like the mantis blade AT all.
Anytime a magic item is aimed at a specific class (especially a class the PC's aren't going to be like red mantis assassin) it give me a bad taste in my mouth.
So that one HAS to be replaced.
The Mantis blade is a minor artifact, so i could do something cool for a magic item.
the witch player is a big fan of the movie "Librarian quest for the spear"
I was thinking of a set of rods (three) that no only could be a spear (something along the line of a rod of lordly might) but when combined had some other cool power (maybe intelligence) I was thinking making the spear serpentfolk bane as it could have been from savenths era.
Each rod in and of it's self could be a meta magic rod (or could I have rods that meta hex instead of meta spell?) and then together they form a serpent bane spear that is intelligent.
So in a way its a rod, a spear and a staff.
Do i need anything else when it's combined together, or do you think the intelligent spear aspect is enough?I also had in mind a cloak (along the line of spawn, the comic book) where it had it's own intelligence, maybe capable of performing some combat manuevers, was really ooky spooky, maybe something along the lines of a cloak of arachnidia and of the bat, combined on steroids, and intelligent.
then I thought of how the azlanti was this...
Since the city has seven districts you could make a staff or spear that was divided into seven parts similar to the old edition artifact The Rod of seven parts. Each part could have some minor power but when combined grow more and more powerful until it became a mighty weapon. Maybe tying it to the AP plot by having it be a weapon specifically designed to take down serpentfolk, maybe even a weapon wielded by Savith herself.
I was actually toying around with a similar idea to use in my Campaign, but since my players are obsessed with filling out their precious slots instead of having cool items I decided not to since they probably would have tried to sell the items to buy headbands and belts.
Hi,
i am just DMing KM in second Module and just started SfSS.
What involved my PCs pretty much is - as mentioned several time before in this thread - interaction with the NPCs.
There is a problem if your players are not interested in social interaction but i stressed out especially on the Shiv that the boring "survival" thing would be a major issue if they don't get the NPCs involved in managing the base camp.
I did similar things in the KM AP where most major NPCs are now members of the Crown Council of the country and every fourth week members (including the PCs) presents their work in the "Meeting Week".
I see the concern about having nothing completely new in every AP but i guess Serpent's Skull has several themes in it that are based on popular movies and TV series (Souls is much like the beginning of LOST, Racing to Ruin is the Indiana Jones theme the Seven Spears have a Stargate Universe touch and so on.)
My conclusion is if the GM doesn't manage to get the PCs get involved into the story either by personally involve them in the plot or establishing a personal link to NPCs that are involved no AP will work properly.
A mercenary background of the PC has his drawback in the issue that if the payroll ist empty there is no matter for them to stay (if they strictly play the gold grabbing type).
IMO the APs are neither bad nor good. I like them but i can understand that others might not.
If you you manage to involve you players or get involved as a player Serpent's Skull has something to excite you. But you have to find that hook.
ohh the whole slot/christmas tree thing makes my skin crawl.
that's why we don't do the magi-mart thing.
Sure you can find someone to buy anything, but you might not find someone who can sell everything.
Anyway, I had forgotten about the rod of seven parts. Odd.
In fact I dont remember what it did, nor do i ever remember playing with a group who had one.
I was thinking of each part being a meta magic rod AND like a +1 club or a dagger or something, putting it together would get that +1 added on, so If there were SEVEN parts, it would be a + 7 spear, on top of having meta magic? Dang that thing would put the mantis blade to shame!
So let me think, a +3 Bane Serpent Folk, Returning Spear of
Distance... thats a +6 weapon. Then Seven Meta magic feats?
Me thinks too much.
I want each item to be interesting enough in and of itself to be coveted by some monster or bad guy.
If I made it a +3 bane serpent folk returning spear of distance that would be too little if it only had ONE meta magic component.
Sooo a +1 Bane Serpent Folk, Returning Spear of Distance and THREE Meta Magic abilities? Plus intelligence and some special purpose powers? what do you think?
Or I could just make some rods lesser meta magic and others normal and maybe one greater? So some of the meta magic abilites would over lap (say one rod was lesser quicken and the other normal quicken..)
that might work fine.
ohh the whole slot/christmas tree thing makes my skin crawl.
that's why we don't do the magi-mart thing.
Sure you can find someone to buy anything, but you might not find someone who can sell everything.Anyway, I had forgotten about the rod of seven parts. Odd.
In fact I dont remember what it did, nor do i ever remember playing with a group who had one.
I was thinking of each part being a meta magic rod AND like a +1 club or a dagger or something, putting it together would get that +1 added on, so If there were SEVEN parts, it would be a + 7 spear, on top of having meta magic? Dang that thing would put the mantis blade to shame!
So let me think, a +3 Bane Serpent Folk, Returning Spear of
Distance... thats a +6 weapon. Then Seven Meta magic feats?
Me thinks too much.I want each item to be interesting enough in and of itself to be coveted by some monster or bad guy.
If I made it a +3 bane serpent folk returning spear of distance that would be too little if it only had ONE meta magic component.
Sooo a +1 Bane Serpent Folk, Returning Spear of Distance and THREE Meta Magic abilities? Plus intelligence and some special purpose powers? what do you think?
Or I could just make some rods lesser meta magic and others normal and maybe one greater? So some of the meta magic abilites would over lap (say one rod was lesser quicken and the other normal quicken..)
that might work fine.
each part works like a lesser metamagic rod except they are usable only once each day, if three or more parts are connected they work like normal metamagic rods and can be used twice each day, and with all seven connected they work like a greater metamagic rod usable three times per day (in total not for each rod). In addition they can grant useful spell like abilities that would be effective on the entire party. The ability could be linked to the district where it was found so a rod from the farming district could grant create food/water 1/day while a piece from the temple district may grant prayer 1/day f.ex. When all seven pieces are assembled they could become some sort of powerful weapon as you mentioned a +? spear of bane of monstrous humanoid maybe even intelligent. You could have this item replace the mantis blade entirely and say that the mantis blade is either long gone or replace it with a lesser sword which will be more useful for your group.
each part works like a lesser metamagic rod except they are usable only once each day, if three or more parts are connected they work like normal metamagic rods and can be used twice each day, and with all seven connected they work like a greater metamagic rod usable three times per day (in total not for each rod). In addition they can grant useful spell like abilities that would be effective on the entire party. The ability could be linked to the district where it was found so a rod from the farming district could grant create food/water 1/day while a piece from the temple...
ohh the whole slot/christmas tree thing makes my skin crawl.
that's why we don't do the magi-mart thing.
Sure you can find someone to buy anything, but you might not find someone who can sell everything.Anyway, I had forgotten about the rod of seven parts. Odd.
In fact I dont remember what it did, nor do i ever remember playing with a group who had one.
I was thinking of each part being a meta magic rod AND like a +1 club or a dagger or something, putting it together would get that +1 added on, so If there were SEVEN parts, it would be a + 7 spear, on top of having meta magic? Dang that thing would put the mantis blade to shame!
So let me think, a +3 Bane Serpent Folk, Returning Spear of
Distance... thats a +6 weapon. Then Seven Meta magic feats?
Me thinks too much.I want each item to be interesting enough in and of itself to be coveted by some monster or bad guy.
If I made it a +3 bane serpent folk returning spear of distance that would be too little if it only had ONE meta magic component.
Sooo a +1 Bane Serpent Folk, Returning Spear of Distance and THREE Meta Magic abilities? Plus intelligence and some special purpose powers? what do you think?
Or I could just make some rods lesser meta magic and others normal and maybe one greater? So some of the meta magic abilites would over lap (say one rod was lesser quicken and the other normal quicken..)
that might work fine.
hmm sounds like that might work well for the major treasure.
Maybe an axe to replace the mantis blade, my part needs a magic axe.
just an example of how it might be done:
Spear of Savith
This powerful spear was used by Savith to defend the City of seven spears from the serpentfolk. The spear has been divided
into seven pieces. Each piece originally stored in each of the seven Ziggurat's of Saventh Yhi but now scattered throughout
the city.
Piece 1: (military)
Works like a lesser metamagic rod of empower spell usable 1/day, this rod is also the tip of the spear and can be used as
a shortsword +1. It has the spell-like ability to cast bless 1/day CL 13+ number of rods
piece 2: (government)
works like a lesser metamagic rod of persistent spell usable 1/day, this rod also has the spell-like ability to cast Enthrall 1/day at cl 13+number of rods
piece 3: (mercantile)
works like a lesser metamagic rod of silent spell usable 1/day, can also be used to cast Identify 1/day at cl 13+number of rods
piece 4: (residential)
works like a lesser metamagic rod of merciful spell usable 1/day, can also be used to cast tiny hut 1/day at cl 13+number of rods
piece 5: (farming)
works like lesser metamagic rod of extend spell usable 1/day, can also be used to cast create food and water 1/day at cl 13+number of rods
piece 6: (temple)
works like lesser metamagic rod of focused spell usable 1/day, can also be used to cast prayer 1/day at cl 13+number of rods
piece 7: (artisan)
works like lesser metamagic rod of quicken spell usable 1/day, can also be used to cast crafter's fortune 1/day at cl 13+number of rods
If three or more rods are assembled the assembled rods work as normal metamagic rods usable a total of 2/day and the assembled rods spell-like abilities can be used one additional time each day
If all seven rods are assembled the rods work as greater metamagic rods usable a total of 3/day and the rod becomes a +3 monstrous humanoid bane returning distance spear and gains the additional spell-like abilities of Heroes feast 1/day, Neutralize poison 1/day and Greater dispel magic 1/day all effects at cl 20. All the rods other spell-like abilities can now be used 3/day each.
Of course this would be an artifact. To avoid the pc's finding all the pieces to early you could hide some of them in some of the vaults of madness featuring in part 4 and even some in Ilmurea in part 5 and 6.
I removed a post and some replies to it. Please stay civil.
I would be worried that if you send the players on a mcguffin hunt at this stage of the AP then you might run into problems with them getting bored again in the next chapter.
hmm the rod idea is gaining merit.
I dont think it's a mcguffin hunt, they are supposed to go to these places anyway, just the 'bosses' will have these items with some ancient runes for the witch to read to put it all together that this is some sort of cool 7 part weapon and maybe whatever other information i need the party to have.
So if it is intelligent, is it infused with the spirit of savith?
hmm the rod idea is gaining merit.
I dont think it's a mcguffin hunt, they are supposed to go to these places anyway, just the 'bosses' will have these items with some ancient runes for the witch to read to put it all together that this is some sort of cool 7 part weapon and maybe whatever other information i need the party to have.
So if it is intelligent, is it infused with the spirit of savith?
I have to support Pendagast here. His campaign is bogged down and he needs to try something different. The rod idea does have merit and sounds much more interesting than kill 100 of X creatures as a victory at each ziggurat.
So I've read vaults of madness.
The vaults are what? Former Bomb shelters? Is that why they exist?
I'm not sure I get the portal/'stargate' thing, is that the only way to get to and from the surface an illmurea?
Why the black mold? Why insanity you can't do anything about? This seems to be another place this group will get frustrated and derailed?
RP opportunity, but it will omni present throughout the entire book.
Im thinking of getting rid of the insanity mold, has anyone played through this part yet? Is being insane and paranoid and everything else you encounter also being insane and paranoid, integral to any part of the future story? OR is it just here 'because'. The PCs can't do anything to prevent themselves from succumbing to it, so it seems to just be a mechanic for 'why saventh yhi' declined....thoughts anyone?
I didnt like the insanity part either. I agree it has potential to be a gamebreaker. Id suggest using it just by direct contact (as opposed to merely walking through the Vaults and getting it) with the spores/caps itself.
I finished reading #5 and ive decided not to run this AP. Its more of a personal preference behind my reason.
late edit*** as for a reason behind why the Vaults are there, I just look at it as an extension of City of Seven Spears.
City of Seven Spears: The Lower Levels!
I like the Vaults. Books 1-4 are almost perfect, it kind of lost me in book 5 with my above spoiler. I love Ilmurea otherwise.
*** meant to edit this into my above post, sry :)
I have skimmed through the urdefhans parts too with a 'meh' feel to them.
I was considering just replacing all of them with Drow. Plots, names everything can stay the same.
My group LOVES Drow (as enemies) thinks they are cool and had a blast with the second darkness campaign, as a result, I think I will substitute them here.
As two subterranean races bent on domination of the surface dwellers, it would make sense that the drow may have an ulterior motive and want to see the serpentfolk revival fail. Sort of a enemy of my enemy thing. I don't think the players would get along with urdefhans at all, just wouldn't fly with my group, the moor locks are a stretch, but the Drow they could maybe ally with or at least live and let live for the purposes of getting information.
I might be able to engineer drow as one of the 'backround armies' the run interference while the PCs defeat ydersius.
I want to put the seven part staff, one each in the vaults, makes sense that after saviths death, the weapon was hidden in case it was ever needed again.
I think I am going to make the city already claimed by the Gorilla King (except for that part of it that is infested with serpent folk)
I might have the Gorilla King emissaries contact the party to from a truce to essentially get the PCs to get rid of the serpentfolk for some perceived reward.
alternatively the PCs could just work their way through the city and kill the Gorilla King too, if they so chose.
That way they can either team up or take him out.
They might like that, would make it seem better than just a bunch of monkey men with no rhyme or reason.
I could still work in the three part test, if the party get into killing too many of his minions and he feels he might want to turn the PCs in the direction of the serpentfolk.
That part is going to be fun I think and give the whole city a "planet of the apes" feel to it.
I should have some sargavan government folk and some aspis agents as his naked human slaves too.
Thanks for all the comments from those that have played ahead.
We're still on the Shiv and after reading the problems with players getting lost in the sandbox I'm going to work on creating some serious enemies. There's nothing like hating an NPC to keep a party motivated.