so one my groups first try at pathfinder during the time they all made the characters player brings up that no one picked a cleric wizard fighter or rouge. we all that was weird and went on....
manly because i want to here you argue and i have seen 2 other message boards talk about some thing like this; my question to you is do you thank a party need a healer caster tank and skill-in-a-box to be a successful party in any situation?
I think this is a particularly great combination to take into a dungeon.
You have a very buffing oriented team there with healing available to each character. Everyone can wear armor to some degree and the bard helps to make up for the medium BAB. Also between the bard and inquisitor you should be able to identify anything you come across.
The alchemist gives wonderful flexibility in spells available since he can sit down and prep an extract with just a minute.
The paladin makes a wonderful tank as well since he can swift heal himself at any time while having enough armor to keep from being hit often.
Three of the characters in the party are skill monkeys and two make excellent face characters.
All in all I would give this party a survival rating of A to A+ on first glance.
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austin thomas] WORDS
Definitely Maybe.
Any situation?
*ANY* situation?
O_o
Well no - unless someone picks up Profession: Baker and Craft: Muffins they are going to fail the Halfling Bake Off encounter....
..oh yes, there will be 2 tea spoons of sugar and 3 fluid ounces of blood.. *shake vigoursly*
All your party characters have some form of healing, and you have classes that can tank, you sould be good.
Good luck with those traps...
Anyone can find traps and magical traps can be dispelled instead of simply disarmed -- it might take a little more resources but it's going to be very difficult to handle.
Despite the obvious attempt at trolling;
Alchemist, bard, and paladin can all provide healing.
Alchemist, bard, and inquisitor can all provide a wide skill set.
Paladin and inquisitor can provide a strong front line presence.
Use Magic Device can be used to provide the occasional wizard spell. ie. scry
3/4 classes here can use a wand of cure light wounds to provide out of combat healing.
All your party characters have some form of healing, and you have classes that can tank, you sould be good.
Good luck with those traps...
i was not really worry about this group they are all really good players(it like DMing with 4 Mc.Givers with all the gum and tooth picks they could ever need) just wanted to how you thank the run of the mill group would do
3/4 classes here can use a wand of cure light wounds to provide out of combat healing.
All the classes present can use a wand of cure light wounds without use magic device.
exp of cleaverness: 1bard finds trap door
2group sets up cleaver plane
3alchemist poison the wiz of poor humanoid to just over drolling on self lvls
4paladin tricks poor humanoid down hall to door
5Inquisitor bull rush the humanoid in to door breaking door
6party kills what is left of the humanoid easy
7step throw door...no trap
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I only metioned traps bacause you said: ....enter into a dungeon.
In most outdoors adventures traps are not that frequent anyway. That been said i think your party should be good.
Its the type of non-standard group setup that gives the more interesting roleplay oportunities, i just love this kind of stuff.
You asked if the average player could pull off a group like this, i think they could. Bad player will be bad even if its a 3 druids and 3 wizards party, the set up doesnt matter that much . Its the player
your right and thats how i feel to i want to see if any one would come here and post how one class type is apparently need more then another
All the classes present can use a wand of cure light wounds without use magic device.
Oops, you're right. I was looking at the Inquisitor spell list in the Spells section, not the one on pg. 42 of the APG. I thought that was a little strange.
...you have classes that can tank...Forgive the new guy, but is there tanking in Pathfinder?
mmmmm what do you mean ?
Yes you can "Tank" in pathfinder. To do so you have to make yourself so much of a nuisance and problem that they can't simply move past you.
If you are dealing enough damage in a round to drop them in 1~3 rounds you have successfully tanked -- they cannot ignore your presence and must work around you or deal with you first. If you can stop them from moving you have again successfully tanked by preventing them from getting to anyone but yourself. If you can move into their path and way so that they can't hit what they really want to then again you have successfully tanked.
There are means to do all three of these in pathfinder without being a caster (and with being a caster too).
Remember tanks don't just sit there and take damage (indeed most try to avoid damage first and weather it second) they also bring a big gun to the battle that kills things, as well as communication gear, and other capabilities.
I hate the term "tank", I'm not sure if it comes from the MMPORPG world or it came from the hell of RPG boards....you have classes that can tank...Forgive the new guy, but is there tanking in Pathfinder?
i was just using it to point out a class that could take a lot of damage. pardon my slang
mmmmm what do you mean ?...you have classes that can tank...Forgive the new guy, but is there tanking in Pathfinder?
Tanking is a concept generally unique to video games, where monsters have AI based on a "hate" or "aggression" mechanic and attack whomever has the highest score. In Pathfinder specifically it's difficult to fill this role because each monster/enemy is played with actual human intelligence and is likely to analyze the situation based on factors beyond "aggro."
Intelligent enemies are likely to go after the largest perceived threat, like a caster or whomever is doing the most damage. Less intelligent creatures tend to go after the easiest/most appealing target- which includes being able to actually hit.
In pathfinder/dnd/etc. it's instead more important to simply have characters who exist in melee to prevent them from getting to your squishier allies. It's not tanking per say, since the traditional concept is difficult to achieve without magical help, but instead a form of battlefield control.
...you have classes that can tank...Depends...
...typically, when a dark doorway leads to the sounds of a bloody battle, we push the big guy in all the armour through..
..and wish him/her/misc good luck!
..else, everyone assumes they're gonna get hit at sometime by someone, typically often and with something blunt and heavy.
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*argh! o_o I be trapped in a quote bubble!*
lol
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In pathfinder/dnd/etc. it's instead more important to simply have characters who exist in melee to prevent them from getting to your squishier allies. It's not tanking per say, since the traditional concept is difficult to achieve without magical help, but instead a form of battlefield control.
Well, if I was informed correctly, 4e genuinely does have abilities that mimicked MMO tanking. Which is why I asked...
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I believe all party rolls and set up from mmorpgs wore rip off from the original d&d. Im not sure at which point the term "tank" was invented. Maybe it was meat-shield before?
In 3.5 and Pathfinder i would define "tank as a character who is hard enoth to hit that he doesnt get wounded often and has enoth hit points to survive around 4 rounds of getting seriously pummeled without assistence.
You can build most class in this game (with the help of a prestige) to fit that description at some point in there progresion.
Well, if I was informed correctly, 4e genuinely does have abilities that mimicked MMO tanking. Which is why I asked...
Ehhhhh.... yes and no. (This is one of the more common misconceptions about 4E -- and I'm not a big 4E fan, but still.)
MMO tanking: the "tank" character has abilities that force monsters to attack it over other options.
4E tanking: the "tank" character has abilities that make it more attractive than it otherwise would be to attack them over other options, but the "tanked" still get to make a choice.
Maybe that seems like splitting hairs, but I think when you imagine tanking applied to PCs (that is, a beefy monster is trying to get them to attack it instead of the theoretically squishier evil wizard) the distinction seems important. Nobody likes to be told that they're forced to attack a certain enemy because they're really mad at it; it usurps the free will of their character despite not, in theory, being a compulsion that usurps the free will of their character. On the other hand, being told "you can attack the fighter or the wizard, but if you go for the wizard the fighter might get a free hit on you" isn't at all the same thing -- you're presented with a choice.
mmmmm what do you mean ?...you have classes that can tank...Forgive the new guy, but is there tanking in Pathfinder?Tanking is a concept generally unique to video games, where monsters have AI based on a "hate" or "aggression" mechanic and attack whomever has the highest score. In Pathfinder specifically it's difficult to fill this role because each monster/enemy is played with actual human intelligence and is likely to analyze the situation based on factors beyond "aggro."
Incorrect. the term Tanking has been used since I used to play 2nd ed, when the gold box games were popular. I suspect its been arround a lot longer than that. MMORPGs brought it into more obvious usage, but the concept was already arround in RPGs and the wargames the RPGs came from.
Back on topic: I really like the group outlined. I think it could do really well. Heck, with bad players I think it would do better than the standard party, since a bad wizard or cleric is a hinderance more than a bennefit. This group is much more likely to have the right spell for the situation or be able to go without it, and I would much rather have an obviously combat focused Inquisitor than Healbot1000 cleric (though non-Healbot1000 clerics I have no issue with).
it funny i did not really pay notice to the fact that they all picked one man part type class all can heal, all can cast, and even all with some combat type ability even if it is not "hit it with a stick" thats kinda of weird.
oh well they still got to live throw my Lovecraft filled world of death MOHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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In fairness, prior to the advent of MMO's, the term "tank" referred more commonly to a character that was, well, a tank. Slow, cumbersome, but capable of dealing large amounts of physical damage.
In MMO's, "tank" seems to refer more to the large "tank" (as in gas tank) of HP's that the warrior classes receive, and the relative depletion thereof pursuant to grabbing and maintaining aggro.
This reflects my experiences, YMMV.
This party combo sounds really fun. Austin, is English a second language for you?
ehh no and i wish that was the reason.......i just am Dyslexic (its that not i cant spell so i just say i am but really the fact that i play dnd is ironic)
[In MMO's, "tank" seems to refer more to the large "tank" (as in gas tank) of HP's that the warrior classes receive, and the relative depletion thereof pursuant to grabbing and maintaining aggro.
*chuckle* Try the term APC (Armored Personnel Carrier), see if that applies better.
I don't find that at all ironic, most people with problems(which is everyone to some degree or another) like to do things to escape. I've been playing since I was a kid, but in the last couple of years it's been a great escape from the self-loathing that comes from being a recovering drug addict. Clearly I understand the irony in someone with dyslexia playing a "reading heavy" game such as dnd but the desire to escape is something I can identify with very much. :)
[In MMO's, "tank" seems to refer more to the large "tank" (as in gas tank) of HP's that the warrior classes receive, and the relative depletion thereof pursuant to grabbing and maintaining aggro.*chuckle* Try the term APC (Armored Personnel Carrier), see if that applies better.
Blink Tank: a character who avoids taking damage as opposed to a character who can take a lot of damage.
MMO tanking: the "tank" character has abilities that force monsters to attack it over other options.
4E tanking: the "tank" character has abilities that make it more attractive than it otherwise would be to attack them over other options, but the "tanked" still get to make a choice.
However there are some similarities too. Both MMO and 4E tanks are given more abilities to reduce damage suffered or increase healing received than other classess/builds.
I always wanted to run or plat in an "all caster" campaign.
These are my 4 very favorite classes and together they can handle just about everything.
You have two arcane casters, two divine casters, four healers, two skill monkeys, UMD, Trapfinding, two knowledge monkeys, two faces, a front-line warrior, a second-line warrior, AoEs, and party buffs.
I really think this party can outperform Fighter, Rogue, Wizard, Cleric up to about level 10.