Will of the Gods PbP ooc discussion


Play-by-Post Discussion

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Talomyr wrote:
Sojourn wrote:

TEAM - I would recommend a way to see in the dark. I would also recommend a good way to travel (flight would be best).

Light is a 0 Level spell on our caster's lists. Darkvision is a 2nd lvl arcane spell, for other magical darkness there are other methods.

One of my domains is Travel, so we'll have access to teleport, fly, dimension door etc.

I have teleport as well. Flight as a travel mode just comes in VERY handy at higher levels. No worries, either way.

Light tends to stink in stealthy modes though. Darkvision makes things much easier, IMHO, at these levels. Coupled with Darkness spell - we can see out but those without Darkvision can't see in.

When we get closer to being done with characters I'd like to discuss strategy and maybe a practice session or two before we move forward.

BTW, I have a Rod of Extend and plan on using only 2 of the 3 charges per day if anyone wants to share. For those hour long durations, it makes it a full day at our levels.


okay joking aside, i don't want OOC strategy discussion, most of your characters will not have known or met each other or at very least not have tons of experience with each other.

There will be fun combat and such be remember the experience is to be about roleplaying.

I hope i'm not seeming harsh but meta gaming will upset me as a dm.

Grand Lodge

I will remove the Eyes of the eagle and replace with Goggles of Night and 5 potions of true strike.

Liberty's Edge

Female Human Witch/2

Hello! I was just wondering if I can use my witch (using name for post) in your game? I know not of what the campaign is about, but if you have any open spots, I'm more than enthusiastic to join!

Also, note that my profile is not fully complete due to versatility of campaigns. Whatever is special for this campaign, I'll put it in the description, labeled under the campaign name.


alena, this game is already full, if we were looking for more we would post in the gamer connection forum, this thread is for this game discussion, the rules of these forums state to only post looking for players or looking for game posts in the gamer connection forum.


Oh! Okay, I'm sorry. No wonder I can't get into anything. I've been looking for campaigns on this forum and not the other...Sorry! ^ ^'

Grand Lodge

Kalderaan wrote:

When we get closer to being done with characters I'd like to discuss strategy and maybe a practice session or two before we move forward.

I don't see the point. In the roleplaying context established, we've never met each other before, so we're not coming into this as the "A Team". Teamwork is something that's going to evolve by play. For those who haven't run high level characters before.. it's going to be a learning curve, but I'm okay with that.

PBP games move slowly enough. I really don't want to do weeks on a practise session before getting to the meat of the campaign.


Gnome Summoner 13
LazarX wrote:
Kalderaan wrote:

When we get closer to being done with characters I'd like to discuss strategy and maybe a practice session or two before we move forward.

I don't see the point. In the roleplaying context established, we've never met each other before, so we're not coming into this as the "A Team". Teamwork is something that's going to evolve by play. For those who haven't run high level characters before.. it's going to be a learning curve, but I'm okay with that.

PBP games move slowly enough. I really don't want to do weeks on a practise session before getting to the meat of the campaign.

I concede - no meta-gaming per the DM request. I respect that.

I'm ready for the kickoff when everyone else is.

Scarab Sages

Sojourn wrote:


I'm ready for the kickoff when everyone else is.

Hi Kalderaan (and Leshok) . I really need to catch up on character creation but I've been held up with the end of the semester . If your character is 'the Blackstaff' and a covert master wizard , perhaps mine could be a more publicly wizardly figure whose role as an Abjurer means she is publicly in charge of the royal family's close magical protection (using magical tutoring as a remit for doing so) while your role is the same but not publicly known (Perhaps not even by my character) ?

Leshok , I had some more questions about the royal family itself . Does the king have any children ? If so how old are they and do any of them have magical abilities ? If one/more than one does the tutoring could be actual schooling in magic , if not it could be something more mundane like etiquette or any of the Knowledge skills (with magical protection obviously coming with the job) .


Female Elf Wizard (Illusionist) 13

Navior here. The character's not quite done, but I'm getting there!

I've purchased a number of additional spells at 120% of the scroll value for my spellbook. Amongst other belongings, I've also purchased a headband of vast intelligence +4 which grants 2 additional skills at max ranks. Since this wasn't gained through play, I figure the best way to determine what those two skills are is to treat it as if it were randomly rolled treasure, which means randomly rolled Knowledge skills as per the item description (if you'd like me to handle it differently, just let me know and I'll change it). So I'll roll those here. There are 10 Knowledge skills, so I'll roll a d10 for each and number the skills in alphabetical order. Here goes:

1d10 ⇒ 9
1d10 ⇒ 3

That makes Knowledge (planes) and Knowledge (engineering). She already has a few ranks in Knowledge (planes), but that's okay.

And rolling for hp:

12d6 ⇒ (1, 5, 1, 4, 6, 4, 3, 4, 3, 6, 2, 1) = 40 + 6 (max at 1st level) + 13 (Con bonuses) = 59


Adrien Wasila wrote:
Sojourn wrote:


I'm ready for the kickoff when everyone else is.

Hi Kalderaan (and Leshok) . I really need to catch up on character creation but I've been held up with the end of the semester . If your character is 'the Blackstaff' and a covert master wizard , perhaps mine could be a more publicly wizardly figure whose role as an Abjurer means she is publicly in charge of the royal family's close magical protection (using magical tutoring as a remit for doing so) while your role is the same but not publicly known (Perhaps not even by my character) ?

Leshok , I had some more questions about the royal family itself . Does the king have any children ? If so how old are they and do any of them have magical abilities ? If one/more than one does the tutoring could be actual schooling in magic , if not it could be something more mundane like etiquette or any of the Knowledge skills (with magical protection obviously coming with the job) .

Adrien - thank for the invitation for the hook.

I like our connection - public and private security for the royal family. My role has me on the road more and yours is more of an internal role. An analogy would be CIA for me and FBI/Secret Service for you. We would have the inter-agency thing going on but our common sponsor (the king) would trump the usual divisions.

It would make a good amount of sense that we conduct security meetings to discuss threats (actual and potential) and the like.

It is up to you how well we know each other. Is it a strong connection - friendship - or a passing connection - coworkers? I am fine either way (just tell me what you decide).

As far as the Blackstaff position goes, your character wouldn't know about it. It is a very secretive position, known by very few.


Ardra wrote:

Navior here. The character's not quite done, but I'm getting there!

I've purchased a number of additional spells at 120% of the scroll value for my spellbook. Amongst other belongings, I've also purchased a headband of vast intelligence +4 which grants 2 additional skills at max ranks. Since this wasn't gained through play, I figure the best way to determine what those two skills are is to treat it as if it were randomly rolled treasure, which means randomly rolled Knowledge skills as per the item description (if you'd like me to handle it differently, just let me know and I'll change it). So I'll roll those here. There are 10 Knowledge skills, so I'll roll a d10 for each and number the skills in alphabetical order. Here goes:

1d10
1d10

That makes Knowledge (planes) and Knowledge (engineering). She already has a few ranks in Knowledge (planes), but that's okay.

And rolling for hp:

12d6 + 6 (max at 1st level) + 13 (Con bonuses) = 59

Andra - Leshok said that you can reroll 1's for Hit Points so you can reroll the three ones you have.


Female Elf Wizard (Illusionist) 13
Kalderaan wrote:
Ardra wrote:

And rolling for hp:

12d6 + 6 (max at 1st level) + 13 (Con bonuses) = 59

Andra - Leshok said that you can reroll 1's for Hit Points so you can reroll the three ones you have.

Oh, cool!

3d6 ⇒ (2, 4, 6) = 12

So we get 59 - 3 + 12 = 68

Scarab Sages

Kalderaan wrote:


Adrien - thank for the invitation for the hook.

I like our connection - public and private security for the royal family. My role has me on the road more and yours is more of an internal role. An analogy would be CIA for me and FBI/Secret Service for you. We would have the inter-agency thing going on but our common sponsor (the king) would trump the usual divisions.

It would make a good amount of sense that we conduct security meetings to discuss threats (actual and potential) and the like.

It is up to you how well we know each other. Is it a strong connection - friendship - or a passing connection - coworkers? I am fine either way (just tell me what you decide).

I think it's likely that our characters would be friends , there's enough similarity in their alignment and their core motivation (protecting the king and royal family) to imagine they'd enjoy each other's company . Because there's a strong split between arcane and divine magic I think our characters would also have an arcane background in common (although mine having followed a traditional magical training would be intrigued by your character's different approach as well) . On the other hand I think it would make sense that your character wouldn't tell mine a lot of what's going on behind the scenes (for security purposes) which would account for the alignment difference and your extra-secret role . The CIA and FBI analogy seems like a good one

Something that might also be interesting is that I'm envisioning my character as having come from a Medici-like noble family in a foreign province and essentially having become a retainer of the royal family as a reaction against the intrigue-filled world she was intended to join (see my earlier post for a background idea) and given purpose by her visions inspired by the couatl .

The contrast between a character who is a titular noblewoman (or man , I still haven't made up my mind about the gender) but is now in effect a retainer (a governess/tutor and scholar) and may still be seen by some as a foreigner and someone whose nobility comes from merit and dedication could be interesting to play .

PS : Navior , I'm making Illusion and Necromancy my opposed schools for background purposes but it'll also give you plenty of chances to shine with your character's own spells .

Grand Lodge

Any comments on Jholanna? I'd like some feedback on the Sunwalker before I commit to making an alias for her.


LazarX wrote:
Any comments on Jholanna? I'd like some feedback on the Sunwalker before I commit to making an alias for her.

Are you asking Leshok or the other players?

I don't usually comment on players builds as many take it personally (in a negative way).


Adrien - I like the friends angle. Sojourn is away a lot and would very much enjoy the company of another arcane master. He is educated and enjoys discussing matters arcane, especially spellcraft.

He is a single-minded individual, so the diversions would be welcome.

The noble station angles would be an interesting dynamic, I agree.

I envision the two meeting to discuss politics at court, arcane security, and life in general. Both are fairly long-lived - how long have we known each other?


Male Human Fighter 10 (Free-Hand Fighter), Chevalier 3

Random newbie-to-high-levels question, is my +10 to stealth worth the 15,000 gp I spent on it? I could spend that money on maybe a badass mount that would allow me to fly and probably get killed within the first fight (which reminds me, did we ever get a clarification on whether or not Leadership was allowed? Because I'd consider a mount co-hort if I had the chance), but I've always wanted a badass mount. I could also buy more utility magic, maybe another magical ring or a better Amulet of Natural Armor. Or even a better headband/belt thingy.

LazarX, I read and enjoyed your backstory. Have to say it's more original than mine, but then again my character isn't very original in many ways.


Bonzo Wiggin wrote:

Random newbie-to-high-levels question, is my +10 to stealth worth the 15,000 gp I spent on it? I could spend that money on maybe a badass mount that would allow me to fly and probably get killed within the first fight (which reminds me, did we ever get a clarification on whether or not Leadership was allowed? Because I'd consider a mount co-hort if I had the chance), but I've always wanted a badass mount. I could also buy more utility magic, maybe another magical ring or a better Amulet of Natural Armor. Or even a better headband/belt thingy.

LazarX, I read and enjoyed your backstory. Have to say it's more original than mine, but then again my character isn't very original in many ways.

Bonzo - I will answer with another question: Is your character focused on hiding? Does your character tend to be shadowy, attack from hidden positions, sneak around, etc?

Those questions should determine if it is worth it or not.

I was always taught to be very good at what I do and don't try to do everything.


LazarX wrote:

Created using PCGen 5.16.4 on Dec 15, 2010

Johlanna the Sunwalker
Female Human; Medium Humanoid
Spoiler:
( Human, Human )
Paladin13
Hit Dice:
(13d10)+61
Hit Points:
143
Initiative:
+2
Speed:
Walk 20 ft.
AC:
26 (touch 12, flatfooted 24)
Attacks:
Mace +3 (Heavy/Adamantine) +19/+14/+9; *Sun Blade +18/+13/+8;
Damage:
Mace +3 (Heavy/Adamantine) 1d8+6; *Sun Blade 1d10+5;
Vision:

Face / Reach:
5 ft. / 5 ft.
Special Attacks:
Channel Positive Energy, Smite Evil
Special Qualities:
Aura of Courage, Aura of Good, Aura of Justice, Aura of Resolve, Bonus Feat, Celestial Spirit, Mercy (Cursed), Detect Evil, Mercy (Diseased), Divine Health, Mercy (Frightened), Lay on Hands, Negative Levels, Mercy (Poisoned), Mercy (Shaken), Skilled
Saves:
Fortitude: +16, Reflex: +11, Will: +15
Abilities:
STR 16 (+3), DEX 14 (+2), CON 16 (+3), INT 12 (+1), WIS 14 (+2), CHA 20 (+5)
Skills:
Acrobatics: -1; Appraise: 1; Bluff: 5; Climb: 1; Craft (Untrained): 1; Diplomacy: 13; Disguise: 5; Escape Artist: -1; Fly: 2; Handle Animal: 12; Heal: 8; Intimidate: 9; Knowledge (Nobility): 6; Knowledge (Religion): 7; Linguistics(Abyssal, Infernal): 3; Perception: 6; Perform (Untrained): 5; Profession (Farmer): 6; Ride: 6; Sense Motive: 12; Stealth: -1; Survival: 2; Swim: 0;
Feats:
Armor Proficiency, Heavy, Armor Proficiency, Light, Armor Proficiency, Medium, Channel Smite, Covering Defense, Extra Channel, Extra Lay On Hands, Extra Mercy, Improved Channel, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Shield Focus, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Toughness
Challenge Rating:
12
Alignment:
Lawful Good
Possessions: +3 Celestial Armor; Amber; Bedroll; Belt of Physical Perfection +2; Bloodstone; Coin (Gold Piece); Coin (Silver Piece); Brown-Green Garnet; Red Garnet; Handy Haversack; Headband of Mental Superiority +2; Holy Symbol (Silver); Holy Symbol (Wooden); Horse (Heavy/Combat Trained); Ink (1 oz. Vial); Inkpen; Lion's Shield; Mace +3 (Heavy/Adamantine); Fire Opal; Traveler's Outfit; Parchment (Sheet); Rations (Trail/Per Day);...

FEEDBACK:

Spoiler:
did you take enough feats? a level 13 human paladin should have 8 total feats (7 from levels 1 human bonus feat.) and i think i only see 7 feats here? could be wrong.

I haven't done the math yet, but did you spend your full 140,000? like i said i haven't check yet.

Looks like you've built a paladin here based around being a paladin =P which is never bad!

your feat choices will expand your existing abilities so you can use them more often/make them stronger.

go go gadget paladin!

Bonzo - leadership is allowed, but we need to have a conversation about it, to understand the nature of your followers and cohort (i prefer to design cohorts, but i always take your request into consideration). as for the +10 to stealth? ALL things are only useful when they are, so any choice can be good under the right circumstance.


Male Human Fighter 10 (Free-Hand Fighter), Chevalier 3
Leshok wrote:


Bonzo - leadership is allowed, but we need to have a conversation about it, to understand the nature of your followers and cohort (i prefer to design cohorts, but i always take your request into consideration). as for the +10 to stealth? ALL things are only useful when they are, so any choice can be good under the right circumstance.

Well I think I'm going to drop my Improved Shadow. Someone can hit me with Invisibility if I need to be all sneaky. I was attracted to the idea simply because my fighter archetype requires me to use light armor, so since having stealth as a viable option maybe it was a good option. Kalderaan convinced me, with his subtle manipulations :P. At the very least I'll instead pick up a Ring of Chameleon (which I just discovered) which does the exact same thing AND gives me permanent access to the Disguise spell for almost 3,000 gp cheaper. But I'll probably just steer clear of the stealthiness for now.

As far as Leadership, I would only be interested if it got me something I could use as a mount. In this case I would probably drop my Staggering Critical and Cleave feats for Leadership and Mounted Combat. I would much prefer a flying mount, obviously something that understands Common because I have no other way of communicating with it. I tried to add you to gmail chat, Leshok, so we could chat about it, but I'm not sure if it worked (don't really use it ever). My email is garabbott@gmail.com, if you want to try getting ahold of me.

EDIT: And of course, if I pick up the Leadership feat, I'll work it into my backstory. it would probably even make it more interesting, too, haha.

Scarab Sages

Kalderaan wrote:

Adrien - I like the friends angle. Sojourn is away a lot and would very much enjoy the company of another arcane master. He is educated and enjoys discussing matters arcane, especially spellcraft.

He is a single-minded individual, so the diversions would be welcome.

The noble station angles would be an interesting dynamic, I agree.

I envision the two meeting to discuss politics at court, arcane security, and life in general. Both are fairly long-lived - how long have we known each other?

Sounds very good as that's exactly what I had in mind . I think the characters may have met first at Duchess Sativa's court as courtiers (my character being unaware that yours became a magician at this point) and then moved on with my character continuing to train an apprentice who eventually sought another master . At this point she applied for the position at the royal court and was surprised (but also glad) to meet with Sojourn again . They've worked together more closely ever since , united by shared interest in protecting the royal family and studying arcane magic (in fact it's likely your character may be the source of much of her own knowledge of Conjuration magic)

I can send you my background (which I've just finished now and am sending to Leshok for approval) as I have a few more ideas for events they might have lived through together . It mainly expands on your idea of the assassination attempt on the king and the seditious baron at Countess Sativa's court

I think the character will be 50 or so , allowing for a relatively long time to study magic , do some adventuring and training an apprentice while continuing to grow in power as a magician . Perhaps Sojourn and she first met about 20 years ago and then again as court wizards 10-15 years ago depending on how Leshok imagines the royal family's age


Adrien Wasila wrote:
Kalderaan wrote:

Adrien - I like the friends angle. Sojourn is away a lot and would very much enjoy the company of another arcane master. He is educated and enjoys discussing matters arcane, especially spellcraft.

He is a single-minded individual, so the diversions would be welcome.

The noble station angles would be an interesting dynamic, I agree.

I envision the two meeting to discuss politics at court, arcane security, and life in general. Both are fairly long-lived - how long have we known each other?

Sounds very good as that's exactly what I had in mind . I think the characters may have met first at Duchess Sativa's court as courtiers (my character being unaware that yours became a magician at this point) and then moved on with my character continuing to train an apprentice who eventually sought another master . At this point she applied for the position at the royal court and was surprised (but also glad) to meet with Sojourn again . They've worked together more closely ever since , united by shared interest in protecting the royal family and studying arcane magic (in fact it's likely your character may be the source of much of her own knowledge of Conjuration magic)

I can send you my background (which I've just finished now and am sending to Leshok for approval) as I have a few more ideas for events they might have lived through together . It largely expands on your idea of the assassination attempt on the king and the seditious baron at Countess Sativa's court

You can e-mail me directly at kalderaan_@_yahoo.com (leaving out the _ marks).

Scarab Sages

Background sent for your perusal Leshok and Kalderaan. I'll focus on the stats aspect and create an alias this evening (starting now) .

13d6 ⇒ (2, 5, 3, 6, 4, 5, 5, 3, 2, 1, 1, 6, 2) = 45 + 13 (Need to check her Constitution score)

2d6 ⇒ (1, 5) = 6

1d6 ⇒ 6

67 HP before Constitution modifiers if I've counted correctly . Or rather 71 if the first level roll is a full one

Silver Crusade

Male Human

Hey guys,

I know that I have been a little scarce as of late, but here are my details so far.

Wizard (Evocationist) 3 levels
Rogue 3 levels
Arcane Trickster 7 levels

Race: Tiefling

Age Catagory: Middle Age

More to come.

Thanks for your patience,

Dave

Grand Lodge

Leshok wrote:
LazarX wrote:

Created using PCGen 5.16.4 on Dec 15, 2010

Johlanna the Sunwalker
Female Human; Medium Humanoid
** spoiler omitted **
...

Spoiler:

PCGen says I've spent my feat allotment but I can go back and check. Did spend all my wealth allotment save for an amount kept for traveling expenses.


at second glance i do see that you took all your feats! I like the character =)

Okay gang looks like we are almost ready for this all to start! I will be working on the last maps this weekend so you can have a better picture of Ulstadt!

So any questions at all let me know, otherwise it looks like we launch on monday!


Leshok wrote:

at second glance i do see that you took all your feats! I like the character =)

Okay gang looks like we are almost ready for this all to start! I will be working on the last maps this weekend so you can have a better picture of Ulstadt!

So any questions at all let me know, otherwise it looks like we launch on monday!

I'm looking forward to it!

***Anxiously awaiting the IC thread link...***


Finalised character is up on this alias

Grand Lodge

Leshok wrote:

at second glance i do see that you took all your feats! I like the character =)

Okay gang looks like we are almost ready for this all to start! I will be working on the last maps this weekend so you can have a better picture of Ulstadt!

So any questions at all let me know, otherwise it looks like we launch on monday!

Mayhap you can pack the campaign files we need into a zip file that we can download?


HP Rolls: 12d8 + 8 + 13 ⇒ (3, 8, 2, 8, 5, 2, 4, 7, 8, 6, 4, 2) + 8 + 13 = 80 (Toughness)


I will devote some time to making the files as accessible as possible! there is a lot i have on paper but not on PC so moving from one to the other does take time when still working 40 hours a week maintaining a relationship and running a weekly pathfinder game in person =) but i promise you access asap! cause now i'm excited to make it all.


5th Generation Cappadocian | Bloodpool: 29/40 | Willpower: 8/8

Talomyr checking in again...

Braelin Vindasel is ready to go.

Scarab Sages

I was halfway through the sheet and intent on posting it when I got an error message (!) Luckily I had saved it . I should be done by tomorrow although I'lll be on a plane for some of the day (flying back home for Christmas) .

Excited about the game !

Grand Lodge

LazarX wrote:
Leshok wrote:

at second glance i do see that you took all your feats! I like the character =)

For hit points I took the standard full hit dice at first level and half plus one plus con modifiers for the rest.


Talomyr - nice job. Looking forward to meeting you IC. Nice call on the wand, btw.

Brynn - just a suggestion, but I recommend spending a few hundred gold and upgrading your bow to a Strength bow to +3. It's cheap and adds 3 pts of damage per arrow.

Excited to start play this coming week!


Male Human 13th Ranger

I am looking forward to it as well.

Kal, Thank you for the suggestion, and I will review my equipment!

Grand Lodge

Bonzo Wiggin wrote:

LazarX, I read and enjoyed your backstory. Have to say it's more original than mine, but then again my character isn't very original in many ways.

I actually call it more of a front prologue story as it hasn't revealed much of her past as postshadowed it.


Male Humanish 3 Rogue 3 Wizard rest Arcane Trickster

<------- This is LostSoul's Char

Ready to get this going guys. :)


Male Humanish 3 Rogue 3 Wizard rest Arcane Trickster

Rolls:
3d8 + 0 ⇒ (8, 7, 2) + 0 = 1710d6 + 0 ⇒ (4, 2, 5, 5, 5, 5, 3, 2, 6, 5) + 0 = 42


Male Humanish 3 Rogue 3 Wizard rest Arcane Trickster

Sorry should have been 2 d8 rolls the first is max.

2(d8) Rolls:
2d8 + 0 ⇒ (4, 2) + 0 = 6


Male Human Fighter 10 (Free-Hand Fighter), Chevalier 3

Who/what are we waiting on now?

I still need to stat out my wyvern cohort, but beyond that this alias is 100% finished. Except for experience. Still. Anyone know what experience a lvl 13 character has? :P


Female Elf Wizard (Illusionist) 13

Ardra's stats are pretty much done. I just need to decide what spells she has prepared and write out her full background.


Male Human Fighter 10 (Free-Hand Fighter), Chevalier 3

Rolling for cohort's hp from 1 level of Fighter.

1d10 + 4 ⇒ (5) + 4 = 9

Scarab Sages

I've been unexpectedly delayed by the weather (trying to flight out from London) but I've now got a place on a flight tomorrow and some time to finish my character sheet.


Male Humanish 3 Rogue 3 Wizard rest Arcane Trickster

Waiting patiently.......!!!! :)


Male Humanish 3 Rogue 3 Wizard rest Arcane Trickster

Just talked to the DM, it will be a bit on the start date some personal issues came up. Will let you know if I hear anything.


Daon Wright wrote:
Just talked to the DM, it will be a bit on the start date some personal issues came up. Will let you know if I hear anything.

I hope everything works out. I know how life can toss curves - it seems I've been dodging them all year. ;)

Any idea on how long (days, weeks, months)?


Female Human Wizard (Abjurer) 13

Posting as my character . The character sheet still needs a fair amount of fine turning . Calculating all those costs and modifiers is dizzying !

Thanks for the update about the game . I'm hoping to finish tonight (GMT) so we can look forward to playing soon :)


Male Humanish 3 Rogue 3 Wizard rest Arcane Trickster
Kalderaan wrote:
Any idea on how long (days, weeks, months)?

Nothing yet, but knowing the situation I would take a guess at days.

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