Was wondering about converting Pathfinder into a Mega-Damage magic system.
Was thinking Magic spells would do : 1 damage = 1 mega-Damage
+1 AC on magic armor would convert into = 10 MD.
(examples: 5d6 fireball would do 5d6 MDamge. While a +2 magic Chain Mail +6 AC, would convert over 80 MDamage.)
(example: Mage Armor is +4 AC... would convert over to 40 MDamage.)
Main problem is monster conversion: (just a rough guess at this point).
Any creature that requires Magic, silver, cold iron, etc become MDamage.
Hp: 1 hp = 1 MDC
AC: 1 ac = 10 MDC (Dex, Dodge not counted)
(example Pixie would have 4d6+4 MD + 20 MD (+1 natural +1 size).
Looks like he's trying to convert PFRPG spells to Rifts?
Yes, trying for a Rifts type damage system
so 1 MDC is equal to 100 hp
and a Magic Fireball goes back to being a crater in the ground, unless you have some sort of magic protection or armor.
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Also, when AC is converted over to 10 MDC. You no longer use that AC amount for AC anymore. Makes target easyer to hit, but they have more protection vs damage. Dex and Dodge does not convert to MDC, so they still help you avoid damage.
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Ya was looking at my old rifts books. Was thinking i really like the rifts background story. But i perfer the D&D magic system over all, just wanted to ramp up the damage to Rifts type damage.
evocation.... well all magic.
So Chill touch would be doing 1d6 MDC or Acid Arrow doing 2d4 MDC. etc.
Say a 1d6 +2 Flaming magic sword (+1d6 fire damage), would be convered over to 1d6 +2 +(1d6) MDC.
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note: on the pixie example given in first post (change the +20 MDC to +10 MDC.... the Size bonuse (+1ac)... in most likly hood should not be converted, but keep at an AC.
While I can understand the sentiment, it's broken. Direct damage is what fighters do, damage for wizards is at best an also-ran. If you go this way you make every other class in combat redundant, and you render most challenges a cakewalk while you have spells.
If you want more damage from damaging spells, the best 'fix' is to add metamagic feats or spells that address the problem without having to handle damage in chunks of 100 points at a time.
A Fighter in +1 magic Half-Plate would have 90 MDC armor. Throw on a +1 magic heavy wooden shield and you add another 30 MDC armor.
A Rogue in +3 magic Leather armor would have 50 MDC armor. Have a Cleric cast shield of Faith on him for another 20 MDC. Give him a +1 Dagger for 1d4+1 MDC damage.
Clerics could cast Shield of Faith for 20 MDC.
Bear's Endurance = The hp that it grants becomes MDC.
Magic Vestment = +10 MDC per AC it would have given
Druids Barskin = +10 MDC per AC it would have given.
Shillelagh = the 2d6 become MDC damage.
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True, any class that does not use magic, would have to get magic items to stand up. But once they get a magic weapon, it becomes MDC.
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The par-dime does shift. Those with magic armor and weapons, have the advantage.
A Fighter in +1 magic Half-Plate would have 90 MDC armor. Throw on a +1 magic heavy wooden shield and you add another 30 MDC armor.
A Rogue in +3 magic Leather armor would have 50 MDC armor. Have a Cleric cast shield of Faith on him for another 20 MDC. Give him a +1 Dagger for 1d4+1 MDC damage.
Clerics could cast Shield of Faith for 20 MDC.
Bear's Endurance = The hp that it grants becomes MDC.
Magic Vestment = +10 MDC per AC it would have givenDruids Barskin = +10 MDC per AC it would have given.
Shillelagh = the 2d6 become MDC damage...............
True, any class that does not use magic, would have to get magic items to stand up. But once they get a magic weapon, it becomes MDC.
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The par-dime does shift. Those with magic armor and weapons, have the advantage.
So it rewards magic users and magic equipment users, and penalises those that do not do so. Thanks, but I prefer my games to go the other way. Besides, only 1 MDC would wipe out most characters even if their armour dealt with the rest. I don't see it as a workable system.
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You are incredibly brave for asking this question, given K.S.'s history of internet conversion paranoia. I'm sure a strike team of ninjas and superspies are on their way to your house now...
As for advice, I doubt you'll find much help here. If the above posts are any indication, most 3.5 players will fail to understand Palladium/Rifts method of putting verisimilitude before game balance. Not that one is better than the other (though most 3rd ed. books do win in the editing category).
Have you considered a more linear method? Multiplying damage could get out of hand if you still have access to metamagic feats. Increasing the die type might be a better route, as has already been suggested. You could also have enhancement bonuses on armor act as DR against magical damage.
Even in Rifts, the system it's "designed" for, the mega-damage system is a bit clunky and requires a certain amount of house-ruling. I don't see it translating to Pathfinder, or any other d20 system, well.
So I agree you would be better served trying to use the DR rules to accomplish whatever you're trying to do.
You know, I always liked the spell 'urban renewal' from Shadowrun ... but that was the way to do mega-magic that wasn't broken: place limits on the spell to compensate for massive damage. So you could make a 3rd level spell that inflicted MASSIVE damage to a structure (for example, 3d6 per level ignoring hardness to every 5' cube of the structure) but none to the people inside it (unless, like, the structure fell on them).
Here's a question: do your magic items and spells take the damage like they do in Rifts? If so, people are going to need to buy a LOT of armor if it goes like our old games (we used to make jokes about characters getting blasted into nudity at least once per session, all based on reality).
At low levels, the game just became rocket-launcher tag. If the enemy wizard casts magic missile, you're a small blood spot. Even worse than it was before with sleep and color spray, now you can flatten people outright with magic missile.
What about school powers? Many of them do damage as well.
How would noncasters survive past 1st level? Heck, EVERYONE is vulnerable at 1st level now; high level casters must have the Dexterity of the gods and Improved Initiative, winning fights by getting initiative and slaughtering the opposition.
Wands just became really, really scary.
Until magic weapons become available, do the PCs only do hp damage, not megadamage?
As you can see, there are lots of questions you need to answer. Many of the problems come from trying to survive at low levels and what people without magic (often low level) can do to survive. I'm sure other issues will turn up as well. Remember something else: in Rifts, most weapons are just as effective as spells at doing damage. Are the fighters and rogues going to have CV-212's or CR-1's to let them do relevant damage?
Nevermind, changed my mind.
That's the kind of solution I'm thinking of!
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I don't think that's what this is at all Morgen. I suspect 'mega-damage' is an independent system that we don't really understand without actually reading it.
I was going off of the math of someone being in +2 chain mail being completely immune to fireballs at least from what I was getting from the first post, but others seem to know what this system was intended for.
Obviously something else is going on, sorry.
I don't think that's what this is at all Morgen. I suspect 'mega-damage' is an independent system that we don't really understand without actually reading it.I was going off of the math of someone being in +2 chain mail being completely immune to fireballs at least from what I was getting from the first post, but others seem to know what this system was intended for.
Obviously something else is going on, sorry.
Mega-damage is a system created for Palladium games (Rifts, Robotech, etc) that is supposed to simulate how certain things can only be damaged by incredibly strong attacks. Each point of mega-damage equals 100 points of ordinary damage.
For example, an ordinary human would have 30 SDC points, while a car might have 200. So an RPG round doing 4d100 (100-400) points of damage would obliterate the person and very likely destroy the car.
But if the car was made from 200 points worth of mega-damage materials (say for example KITT) then that same RPG round would only do the equivalent of 1d4 (1-4) points of damage, while something like a shotgun (3d6), or even a light machine gun round (6d6) would bounce right off.
Obviously, damaging something made from mega-damage materials requires something that does mega-damage. So you have laser pistols that do 1d6 mega-damage points, or mega-damage cannons that do 3d10 mega-damage points.
In theory this system is supposed to simulate the DR of something like a Gundam or supernatural creatures, but in practice it's massively clunky. Because it means that at first level your characters are carrying light weapons and spells, the Pathfinder equivalent of a magic missile and crossbow necessary to take on a CR 1 threat, that are actually doing the damage of a real-world anti-tank round.