It does say "every creature that hits" the TWF, not "every attack that hits", so I would interpret it as 1 AoO per creature.
Otherwise, it seems incredibly strong. You full attack your enemy on your turn, and if he full attacks you, you also get to make a full attack on his turn, except that all of your attacks are at your highest BAB.
Dazing/Stunning Assault have a very similar issue,
i.e. vagueness as to whether each hit provokes an AoO or Stun Save,
or whether ´each creature that hits them... before his next turn´ only provokes once.
I see both side of the issue, but only attacking someone once, and after a full attack to set it up is pretty weak for a 19th level ability. That could have been a single digit level if that is all it does. The key to this is that the defender can't attack unless he is hit. You get definite damage on him, but he might hit you back.
AGP:Deadly Defense (Ex): At 19th level, when a two-weapon warrior makes a full attack with both weapons, every creature that hits him with a melee attack before.....
If AoO per Attack WAS the intention, it seems bizarre to say ´every creature that hits... provokes an AoO´ instead of ´every melee attack that hits provokes an AoO´. Tightening up the wording couldn´t hurt, here or in Dazing/Stunning Assault´s case.
Also, it´s not just getting ONE attack,
the other Class Variant abilities mean you can make TWO attacks when given an AoO.
Given there´s plenty of other ways to draw AoO´s (Teamwork Feats for one), and that the 2WF Variant gets plenty of other useful benefits, I feel it´s OK if this isn´t AS amazing on it´s own. The ability DOES give additional chances (at Full BAB) for either main and/or off-hand to hit, triggering 2 Weapon Rend if they hadn´t hit previously (whether from low attack rolls or miss chance).
Ironically, their other Class Ability boosting their AC after making a Full 2WF Attack makes this ability less likely to kick in :-)
If AoO per Attack WAS the intention, it seems bizarre to say ´every creature that hits... provokes an AoO´ instead of ´every melee attack that hits provokes an AoO´. Tightening up the wording couldn´t hurt, here or in Dazing/Stunning Assault´s case.
Also, it´s not just getting ONE attack,
the other Class Variant abilities mean you can make TWO attacks when given an AoO.
Given there´s plenty of other ways to draw AoO´s (Teamwork Feats for one), and that the 2WF Variant gets plenty of other useful benefits, I feel it´s OK if this isn´t AS amazing on it´s own. The ability DOES give additional chances (at Full BAB) for either main and/or off-hand to hit, triggering 2 Weapon Rend if they hadn´t hit previously (whether from low attack rolls or miss chance).Ironically, their other Class Ability boosting their AC after making a Full 2WF Attack makes this ability less likely to kick in :-)
The question is whether or not a full round attack is considered on action or is each attack a separate offense. This is important because IIRC you only get one AoO per offense.
I do think the defensive ability was meant to make sure you never had to use this one, but if you get hit :).
Even if it is only one hit combining it with the feat that allows you to stun or daze someone can also be useful.
See I was using Rolibar's Gambit as a reference (as well as come and get me) both feats/powers are available around level 12. Both of them allow an AOO per attempt to hit you. What'smore because of the AC penalty they impose, they'll get more use.
EG a 12 level barbarian with 16 Dex and combat reflexes could make 4AOO if he had come and get me, he only needs to be attacked, not actually struck.
A level 19 fighter with GTWF Dex 20 could make up to 6 AOO. Using Both Weapons to hit (triggering rend- this may or may not outdamage the 2hander barbarian) However he takes no AC penalty and only successful hits against him provoke. He'll get far less use of this ability than the barb. Remember this is a level 19 trick. I'd argue each hit provokes other wise it kinda sucks....
I agree that at 19th level it should give me more than one attack, plus otherwise it really is not all that deadly.
I agree that at 19th level it should give me more than one attack, plus otherwise it really is not all that deadly.See I was using Rolibar's Gambit as a reference (as well as come and get me) both feats/powers are available around level 12. Both of them allow an AOO per attempt to hit you. What'smore because of the AC penalty they impose, they'll get more use.
EG a 12 level barbarian with 16 Dex and combat reflexes could make 4AOO if he had come and get me, he only needs to be attacked, not actually struck.
A level 19 fighter with GTWF Dex 20 could make up to 6 AOO. Using Both Weapons to hit (triggering rend- this may or may not outdamage the 2hander barbarian) However he takes no AC penalty and only successful hits against him provoke. He'll get far less use of this ability than the barb. Remember this is a level 19 trick. I'd argue each hit provokes other wise it kinda sucks....
Exactly, this is a fighter class ability worth it's level.
Off topic- but what do you reckon about Two Weapon Warrior vs Two Handed Warrior. Does 2h still win?
I think the Two-Hander does more damage, but he has more chances to get locked down, and with the abilities to negate the TWF penalties I would to go with the TWFer's.
The defense is also in the TWFer's guys favor. You have to hit him, but you don't really want to.The Weapon Master gives a +4 bonus to the DC of the critical feats, and you can take a -5 to count one attack as an auto-crit. Scythe X 5 is nasty. They also start getting the bonuses to attack and damage ahead of the other variants.
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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Hi, just wanna check my reading of Deadly Defense is Correct (Two Weapon Warrior Archetype) it says ‘When a 2 weapon warrior makes a full attack with both weapons every creature that hits him with a melee attack before his next turn provokes an AOO.’
My question: is it one AOO or one AOO PER HIT. If a creature hits you 3 times does it provoke 3 times?
Cheers.
"Every creature that hits him with a melee attack" provokes.
Not
"Every attack that hits him" provokes.
One AoO (well, one with each weapon, since you already have Equal Opportunity, so really it's 2 attacks for the price of one) per creature, whether they hit you once or 10 times.
Hi, just wanna check my reading of Deadly Defense is Correct (Two Weapon Warrior Archetype) it says ‘When a 2 weapon warrior makes a full attack with both weapons every creature that hits him with a melee attack before his next turn provokes an AOO.’
My question: is it one AOO or one AOO PER HIT. If a creature hits you 3 times does it provoke 3 times?
Cheers.
"Every creature that hits him with a melee attack" provokes.
Not
"Every attack that hits him" provokes.
One AoO (well, one with each weapon, since you already have Equal Opportunity, so really it's 2 attacks for the price of one) per creature, whether they hit you once or 10 times.
That is a good point, and I was judging it as a 19th level ability before, but seeing as how it only replaces DR 5 I don't mind it.