Hi There,
I'm GM'ing a new group of adventurers through RotRL, and, having gone partly through this (AWESOME!) AP with another group, I remember the fight with Nualia as being a bit of a walkover. Granted, I should have played her smarter, and this time I will, but still...
So, any thoughts on this?
thanks in advance,
GRU
I've had to alter monsters consitently throughout the adventures, but I just like everything to be challenging for my group of 6-7. The encounters in the book are great, but I have a large group who know how to work together.
As far as the fight with Nualia, my group had persuaded Lyrie and Vancaskerskin to give up Nualia and even assist in taking her down in exchange for being allowed to live and escape prison. In the end the rogue changed the trap outside of her room in the dungeon and they tricked her into walking down the corridor, sprung the trap, then attacked. I still made it painful for the players, but they got a great sense of accomplishment from it and still talk about it and we are well into Hook Mountain Massacre.
Hi James,
So, I take it that you think that she's okay (for the level) as written?
What I meant was, that she may (again as written) be too weak for the level, the way a lot of people have found "X" (you know who) to be too tough.
Did you make her use any smart strategies? Any pointers are welcome, as I would rather play smarter, than just beef her up...
GRU
Hi James,
So, I take it that you think that she's okay (for the level) as written?
What I meant was, that she may (again as written) be too weak for the level, the way a lot of people have found "X" (you know who) to be too tough.Did you make her use any smart strategies? Any pointers are welcome, as I would rather play smarter, than just beef her up...
GRU
Do you play Pathfinder or 3.5? If you play Pathfinder and use her out of the book, she's going to be super weak because she's written with 3.5 class levels. I made her a Pathfinder Cleric, removed her Fighter level and replaced it with a Cleric level, and then tinkered with her feats to keep the Bastard Sword (so I could use the nice artwork). Since I had twice as many PCs as expected, I then added two Cleric levels and gave her two dogs instead of one. Plus they had let Tsuto escape and he was encountered here. It almost killed everyone since she now had Channel Positive Energy. Two PCs died, but the Paladin brought her down.
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Hi James,
So, I take it that you think that she's okay (for the level) as written?
What I meant was, that she may (again as written) be too weak for the level, the way a lot of people have found "X" (you know who) to be too tough.Did you make her use any smart strategies? Any pointers are welcome, as I would rather play smarter, than just beef her up...
GRU
I found that the biggest problem with making this encounter challenging is that there is only 1 of Nualia, and there are 4-6 PCs. Since the players get 4 times as many actions as she does, she will get whittled down pretty quickly, particularly if you have more than 4 players.
I definitely second Rogue Eidolon's suggestion to convert her to Pathfinder if your group isn't running 3.5.
If you're concerned about things being too easy, I would add another Yeth hound or two. I've also had very good luck with giving her the ability to use her Channel Negative Energy more effectively. I swapped out some of her feats for things like Channel Smite and Selective Channeling, which give her a boost in attack power without making things too crazy. If you're still running 3.5, you can go with feats like Divine Justice and Divine Might (from PH2 and Complete Warrior, respectively), that do much the same thing.
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In terms of strategy, don't forget to make good use of her abilities while you can. Make sure to activate her Sihedron Medallion for extra HP, and to cast defensive spells if time permits. Also, be sure to use the power from Lamashtu's Mark on the first round if you can, and target someone for whom the Charisma penalty will matter (like a Bard, Sorcerer, or Paladin) if possible.
Do you play Pathfinder or 3.5? If you play Pathfinder and use her out of the book, she's going to be super weak because she's written with 3.5 class levels...Hi James,
So, I take it that you think that she's okay (for the level) as written?
What I meant was, that she may (again as written) be too weak for the level, the way a lot of people have found "X" (you know who) to be too tough.Did you make her use any smart strategies? Any pointers are welcome, as I would rather play smarter, than just beef her up...
GRU
Hi Rogue Eidolon,
We play Pathfinder (and the first time i used her as written (3.5) and gave her CMB & CMD)I've seen her at the OGC made as a Pathfinder NPC..GRU
In terms of strategy, don't forget to make good use of her abilities while you can. Make sure to activate her Sihedron Medallion for extra HP, and to cast defensive spells if time permits. Also, be sure to use the power from Lamashtu's Mark on the first round if you can, and target someone for whom the Charisma penalty will matter (like a Bard, Sorcerer, or Paladin) if possible.
Thanks, Tamago & Rogue E.
you've given me some good advice!GRU
Do you play Pathfinder or 3.5? If you play Pathfinder and use her out of the book, she's going to be super weak because she's written with 3.5 class levels...Hi James,
So, I take it that you think that she's okay (for the level) as written?
What I meant was, that she may (again as written) be too weak for the level, the way a lot of people have found "X" (you know who) to be too tough.Did you make her use any smart strategies? Any pointers are welcome, as I would rather play smarter, than just beef her up...
GRU
Hi Rogue Eidolon,
We play Pathfinder (and the first time i used her as written (3.5) and gave her CMB & CMD)I've seen her at the OGC made as a Pathfinder NPC..
GRU
Yeah, there's really only one class-leveled NPC in Rise who will be a large challenge to a PF group without updating to Pathfinder, and her name, as you might expect, starts with X...
(Minor Edit to my first post--she has Channel Negative Energy, not positive. That with Selective Channel can make her a force to be reckoned with--she blasts the whole party while the hounds and possibly Tsuto run interference to prevent the party from ganging up on her)
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Don't forget her yeth hound's fear-inducing howl. When I ran her, the party put a table over the pit trap and climbed over it, just to have 2/3 of the party (including the only cleric!) run away, climbing over the table to do so. Then the hound bottlenecked the entrance to her room while she cast spells and gloated. Even when the hound went down and they were flanking her, she dropped everyone in the party to negatives except the wizard and the bard (doing some fancy footwork a la fight defensively + Combat Expertise) before the cleric made it back.
In the end, she was no pushover for our group, and it was a memorable encounter.
Those Yeth Hounds are brutal.
My party consists of 5 PF characters with 25-pt ability scores but sometimes hampered by marginal tactics. Erylium survived two combats before I decided she'd be better off communing with Lamashtu and escaping to Thistletop. She functions much better as combat support than operating by herself, IMO.
By the time the party reached Nualia, they'd been able to recruit Orik, as I'd hoped. Good thing. Erylium really rounded out Nualia's encounter, staying invisible in the back and summoning various critters for a few rounds before joining the fight. (Her poison claw attacks can definitely be debilitating!) I'd also rebuilt Nualia for PF with a 20-pt ability and gave her Channel Smite as her 5th level feat, bumping her CR back to 5.
Overall, that really pushed the party hard and made for a memorable encounter. But fair warning, that one went down to the wire. Without Orik, that probably would have been a TPK, even with a strong party of 5.
My party consists of 5 PF characters with 25-pt ability scores but sometimes hampered by marginal tactics. Erylium survived two combats before I decided she'd be better off communing with Lamashtu and escaping to Thistletop. She functions much better as combat support than operating by herself, IMO.
By the time the party reached Nualia, they'd been able to recruit Orik, as I'd hoped. Good thing. Erylium really rounded out Nualia's encounter, staying invisible in the back and summoning various critters for a few rounds before joining the fight. (Her poison claw attacks can definitely be debilitating!) I'd also rebuilt Nualia for PF with a 20-pt ability and gave her Channel Smite as her 5th level feat, bumping her CR back to 5.
Overall, that really pushed the party hard and made for a memorable encounter. But fair warning, that one went down to the wire. Without Orik, that probably would have been a TPK, even with a strong party of 5.
Sounds good, but lethal
Good stuff, guys and thanks!GRU
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Here's a slightly different take on her...
Nualia (CR 5)
Female aasimar anti-paladin 6
Init -1; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +4
Aura strong evil, aura of cowardice (10 ft. radius, -4 to saves vs fear)
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DEFENSE
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AC 16, touch 9, flat-footed 16
(armor +7, Dex -1)
hp 55 (6d10+18)
Fort +9, Ref +3, Will +9
Defensive Abilities plague bringer, unholy resilience; Immune disease; Resist acid 5, cold 5, electricity 5
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OFFENSE
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Spd 20 ft. (armored)
Melee +1 keen bastard sword +11/+6 (1d10+4, 17-20/x2) and claw +4 (1d6+1, 20/x2)
Ranged mw composite longbow +6/+1 (1d8, 20/x3)
Special Attacks channel negative energy (3d6, DC 15), cruelty (DC 15; sickened, staggered), fiendish boon 1/day (+1, 6 minutes), smite good 2/day (+2 attack, +6 damage, +2 AC), touch of corruption 5/day (3d6 plus cruelty)
Spell-Like Abilities (CL 6th):
At will – detect good
1/day – daylight
Spells Prepared (CL 3rd, touch +9, ranged touch +5, concentration +5):
1st – bane (DC 13), protection from good
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TACTICS
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Before Combat If Nualia suspects combat is imminent, she summons her fiendish spirit into her sword, granting it the keen ability, and casts protection from good.
During Combat Nualia activates her Sihedron medallion as a free action at the start of combat to gain false life, then casts bane on her enemies. She prefers to fight with her bastard sword and claw, but she will not hesitate to use her touch of corruption to stagger particularly dangerous enemies. If she can, she will move to make sure her aura of cowardice affects as many of her opponents as possible before her yeth hound ally uses its bay.
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STATISTICS
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Str 16, Dex 8, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 15
Base Atk +6; CMB +8; CMD 17
Feats Exotic Weapon Proficiency (bastard sword), Lamashtu’s Mark, Weapon Focus (bastard sword)
Skills Intimidate +10, Knowledge (religion) +6, Linguistics +1, Ride +5 (+2 armored); armor check penalty -3.
Languages Common, Celestial, Goblin
Gear +1 bastard sword, +1 breastplate, Sihedron medallion, masterwork composite longbow and 20 arrows, gold holy symbol (worth 100 gp), 7 pp, 5 gp.
Here's a slightly different take on her...
Nualia (CR 5)
Female aasimar anti-paladin 6
** spoiler omitted **...
Nice!
GRU
Its too bad that I'm probably not running this again any time soon. Nualia as an antipaladin is a great idea. Its on NPC that springs to mind as being perfect for that class.
I had a party of six go in to attack her, so I added a Yeth hound, but the group dispatched one Yeth hound, and as soon as the hound wasn't there to hedge out PCs, the druid's animal companion tripped her, and they beat her to death on the ground.
However, the Yeth hound's howls can make all of the difference if it scatters everyone.
Its too bad that I'm probably not running this again any time soon. Nualia as an antipaladin is a great idea. Its on NPC that springs to mind as being perfect for that class.
I had a party of six go in to attack her, so I added a Yeth hound, but the group dispatched one Yeth hound, and as soon as the hound wasn't there to hedge out PCs, the druid's animal companion tripped her, and they beat her to death on the ground.
However, the Yeth hound's howls can make all of the difference if it scatters everyone.
I will use Carpy's antipaladin - should be great.
GRU
I will use Carpy's antipaladin - should be great.
GRU
Yeah Carpy that is a thing of beauty. It makes me sad that I ran this campaign prior to Pathfinder and I probably won't get to run it again until my toddlers are old enough. However, I may just take your version of Nualia and drop her on my boys playing Kingmaker. Thanks matey!!
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Thanks for the kind words, guys. Making her an anti-paladin wasn't my idea originally - there was a thread recently on updating RotRL with APG material, which also included
but I thought it was a perfect fit, so I was happy to stat her up.
To increase her nastiness even further, there's a gray area in the rules that suggests she might be able to use her claw to deliver her touch of corruption as a standard melee attack - if you decide to go that way, her claw attack is a +9, and deals 1d6+3 damage (plus the touch of corruption damage and stagger effect).
Also not only is the yeth hound bay a fear effect, but so is bane, and bane's penalty to fear effect saves stacks with her aura of cowardice. She should quite literally leave your PCs cowering in fear! ;)