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So, I'm juggling this idea around in my head where the basic concept is as such-
At the beginning of the game, the charecters anger a powerul witch in some way, and are reincarated (via the forced reincarnation grand hex) into a monstrous race of some sort, be it kobold, gnoll, strix or goblin.
The world in question is far more human-centric then normal, and those not of the core races (and even some of the core races, namely half-Orc, half-elf, and to a lesser degree, gnome) are hated and feared.
The campaign will foucs largely on relations between player charecters and a struggle to get society not to hate you, or simply remove yourself from it, leaving your old life behind for one of misunderstood fear.
Odds are, there will be more talking in this game then combat, but combat won't exactly be rare, either.
There are goals that can be chased after, but what goal is yours is up to the players-
The endgame goal could vary from returning to your normal forms permannetly, slaying the witch that wronged you, getting as much of socioty as you can to accept other races, or even massing armies of these other races to usurp the tyrant humans, all depending on what the charecters desire, and when they think thier job is finished.
Any interest in this concept? If so, I'll flesh it out some more, but I don't wanna spend too much time making a setting that no-one will ever play.
Also, not sure general discussion is the right place, but I didn't know anywhere better to place it.
Interest checks usually go here, I'll flag so a mod can move it.
Interest checks usually go here, I'll flag so a mod can move it.
Alright, thank you.
I would love to play in a game like that. Especially if the race I was reincarnated as was determined randomly.
I would love to play in a game like that. Especially if the race I was reincarnated as was determined randomly.
It would likely be determined randomly, but with the core races taken out of the list, and a few more odd races added.
The point is to have to play a creature that is feared, while having used to have been a normal person, so rolling into human would likely mess the point up a bit.EDIT-
Of course, I'm always open to imput if I could do something better-
Even if it doesn't end up exactly what I had in mind to start with, if it isn't fun, then there isn't much of a point, as no-one will want to play it. If I wanted to GM a game with no players, I'd write a book. I don't want to write a book, so input on how this concept could inprove is welcome.
Oh, I get what you meant: the race shouldn't be a common one, it should be a monstrous one. The story is meant to be a character who was "normal" being forced to become what is classically considered a monster and have to learn to survive.
Edit: and learn that what is considered to be a monster isn't aways one really - it depends on the person.
It's a classic tale of a person of privilege transposing to a person of prejudice.
Oh, I get what you meant: the race shouldn't be a common one, it should be a monstrous one. The story is meant to be a character who was "normal" being forced to become what is classically considered a monster and have to learn to survive.
Edit: and learn that what is considered to be a monster isn't aways one really - it depends on the person.
It's a classic tale of a person of privilege transposing to a person of prejudice.
In essence, yes, on all parts.
I'm hoping it will be interesting enough to attract people.
The race builder gives a good way to transform gradually. I could also let you transform to something even more extreme.
The race builder gives a good way to transform gradually. I could also let you transform to something even more extreme.
Indeed, that's another way to do it.
though, this gives prep time and time to explain what's going on to those you knew.
Good and bad-
All depends on how the players would rather do things.
Abrupt and terrifying was the original goal, but a more gradual change into another race or horrible monstrosity could work as well, if that's what the players wanted.
Either way, I'm interested in knowing how many people are acutally interested in the concept as a whole, to see if it's worth fleshing out the whole thing.
So, I wrote up an idea of what a introduction of sorts would be, as a bit of an example of the concept. Less becuase I felt people wouldn't get the concept without it, more because I had a lot of fun writing it.
Sorry for using "you" so much, but it's hard to write in third person without names.
Your eyes flick open.
You find yourself laying on wet ground, looking up at a clear sky as insects buzz about above you. The smell is horrid, and the sounds of the swamp fill the air- toads, running water, the obnoxious drones of various insects... That's ok. That's manageable. That makes some sense.
What makes less sense is that you have no idea how you got here. You left your house last night and then, suddenly, you were here, daylight shining down on you in a marsh. Maybe you drank too much last night, or hit your head. That could make some sense.
What makes no sense at all, Though, is this cool sensation on your skin, and how cold you feel. The tingling feeling that extends far past your back doesn't help either, a foreign sensation of an extra limb. Everything seems larger, and you see some green scales in front of you, as if you had a snout pressed against your face. You inhale a bit more, feeling the air run through what seems to be your own snout. What seems to be your tail is covered in muck, and is squished up against your back as you lie on the ground.
Reality slowly dawns on you as the new sensations slowly die down a bit, and start to make a little more sense, allowing you to think about something other then the overwhelming strangeness of this body. You're far from human, have no clue where you are. Even what you are is somewhat hard to decipher, but you know what you were, and who you are- aside from whatever happened last night, your memories are intact.
Eventually, the overwhelming sensations die down to a degree of normalcy, the knowledge of how to use this body thankfully coming on instinct, you can finally think straight enough to properly move.
I have to say I got a soft spot for "Alien Problem? Monster Solution!"
I have to say I got a soft spot for "Alien Problem? Monster Solution!"
I never actually saw that.
^Monsters vs. Aliens was quite comical (spoofing several things), so admittedly it might not be the kind of thing you're looking for. But the heroes in there certainly do get discriminated against (very badly) until all of a sudden they are needed.
^Monsters vs. Aliens was quite comical (spoofing several things), so admittedly it might not be the kind of thing you're looking for. But the heroes in there certainly do get discriminated against (very badly) until all of a sudden they are needed.
Makes sense. I've never quite been the funny kind, myself.
Not to say that I don't like funny charecters, I'm just bad at funny myself.
It's a bit comedic and cute: Show Me the Way
Listen to Act 2.
I'd certainly be interested in this kind of game. Question though, would we start play after the table is used to see what we get, or would we have say, the first session as humans, all is as usual, yada yada, then BAM, angry witch?
I'd certainly be interested in this kind of game. Question though, would we start play after the table is used to see what we get, or would we have say, the first session as humans, all is as usual, yada yada, then BAM, angry witch?
I'd assume the story would start immidatly after the witch happens - waking up dazed and confused, not quite sure where, or what you are.
I prefer to have the roll made after the charecter is, but that might be rather frustrating to some, so I'm flexible on that.
You should post a roll list of results on the modified reincarnate rolls so people know what might happen or what they could pick if they're feeling less daring.
You should post a roll list of results on the modified reincarnate rolls so people know what might happen or what they could pick if they're feeling less daring.
Such a list does not yet exist.
Currently, the assumption is that the chart will contain namely the monstrous races already on the reincarnate list, along with a possible few others-
But the ones already on The list are the ones I Fully intend to use.
Things that will certainly be on the list-
Bugbear, troglodyte, lizardfolk, kobold, goblin, gnoll.
Things I'm Considring adding-
Ratfolk, hobgoblin, tengu, nagaji, strix.
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I'd certainly be interested in this kind of game. Question though, would we start play after the table is used to see what we get, or would we have say, the first session as humans, all is as usual, yada yada, then BAM, angry witch?I'd assume the story would start immidatly after the witch happens - waking up dazed and confused, not quite sure where, or what you are.
I prefer to have the roll made after the charecter is, but that might be rather frustrating to some, so I'm flexible on that.
If I was chosen to join, I would prefer to start the campaign as [normal race] and change in the first session to [monstrous race], or change just before the first session but as part of the role-playing pre-game. I think that change should be open in group - rather than rolled privately. I love the random aspect of it all. :)
However, I'm willing to adjust as necessary.
I'd certainly be interested in this kind of game. Question though, would we start play after the table is used to see what we get, or would we have say, the first session as humans, all is as usual, yada yada, then BAM, angry witch?I'd assume the story would start immidatly after the witch happens - waking up dazed and confused, not quite sure where, or what you are.
I prefer to have the roll made after the charecter is, but that might be rather frustrating to some, so I'm flexible on that.
If I was chosen to join, I would prefer to start the campaign as [normal race] and change in the first session to [monstrous race], or change just before the first session but as part of the role-playing pre-game. I think that change should be open in group - rather than rolled privately. I love the random aspect of it all. :)
However, I'm willing to adjust as necessary.
Sure!
I'm never opposed to extra roleplaying.
Sounds like the total view is to start just before the Wicked Witch casts it.
For character creations, people should start by either rolling their random or picking the new race and doing their stats before hand. Then jeep those stats and just don't do any dice rolling before the change happens. Do it all roll play so you don't have to change any stats after it happens. Do some role play where the witch casts it. You're all shifted to the race you had either chosen or rolled for. For dramatic effect choose a humanoid avatar and use it until your first post in your new skin.
I think I might put in for this one to see what I can some up with. A couple of my games have stalled out for now, so I may have time.
Sounds like the total view is to start just before the Wicked Witch casts it.
For character creations, people should start by either rolling their random or picking the new race and doing their stats before hand. Then jeep those stats and just don't do any dice rolling before the change happens. Do it all roll play so you don't have to change any stats after it happens. Do some role play where the witch casts it. You're all shifted to the race you had either chosen or rolled for. For dramatic effect choose a humanoid avatar and use it until your first post in your new skin.
I think I might put in for this one to see what I can some up with. A couple of my games have stalled out for now, so I may have time.
Honestly, I think it'll be all random.
Heck, classes should probobly be chosen before the change.
Another question, what level would we have to have been to have garnered the ire of such a powerful witch?
Another question, what level would we have to have been to have garnered the ire of such a powerful witch?
Level is rather unimportant.
Upsetting people isn't too hard.
Now that we have a bit of correspondence on possible entrants, how bout some building specs?
I think making a burly and domineering natural weapon barbarian could only be good roleplay for this. If he gets bigger, he's happy, if he becomes a kobold, it's hilarious.
So, available class, list of reincarnates, point buy, traits, start level, start gold, etc. :)
It's a classic tale of a person of privilege transposing to a person of prejudice.I've had it pointed out to me that there are two conceptual flaws with this kind of story:
1) The idea that it takes a person of the oppressing power to free the oppressed, as if they oppressed are kind of "unworthy". Since said "unworthiness" is often the justification the oppressing power uses to justify their oppression the lesson falls a little flat.
2) The changed getting to change back in the end: this can carry the implication that the form of the oppressed is a thing to be hated so much that there must be offered a way "out".These are only second-hand philosophizings and should not be taken as statements against the OP doing said kind of story, just things to be aware of.
Why not have an option to have always been a monster? Does every character need to start out as human for this to work? You might actually avoid the flaws I mentioned by having some of the players play always-monsters and add in the exploration of the above themes via the interaction between the Changed's attitude about thing and the Always'.
The concept here is less about a lesson being taught, but a story told.
I don't care if there's a moral to the story. Just convincing charecters and a good story.
There's only a way out if the charecters persue it.
And as for needing other races to do the job, the fact that these races have managed to stay alive is a big deal on it's own- humans are populous, and hate them quite a bit.
Now that we have a bit of correspondence on possible entrants, how bout some building specs?
I think making a burly and domineering natural weapon barbarian could only be good roleplay for this. If he gets bigger, he's happy, if he becomes a kobold, it's hilarious.
So, available class, list of reincarnates, point buy, traits, start level, start gold, etc. :)
I kidna have to build the setting. This was all to see if i should make the setting in the first place.
The response seems like a yes.
Sounds like the total view is to start just before the Wicked Witch casts it.
For character creations, people should start by either rolling their random or picking the new race and doing their stats before hand. Then jeep those stats and just don't do any dice rolling before the change happens. Do it all roll play so you don't have to change any stats after it happens. Do some role play where the witch casts it. You're all shifted to the race you had either chosen or rolled for. For dramatic effect choose a humanoid avatar and use it until your first post in your new skin.
I think I might put in for this one to see what I can some up with. A couple of my games have stalled out for now, so I may have time.
Honestly, I think it'll be all random.
Heck, classes should probobly be chosen before the change.
That's the way I assumed it would be. Basically, flesh out your entire character as if you were going to be [normal race], and then change and roleplay the consequences.
Fair enough. Let me know when it's ready.
Probably going with my domineering barbarian type if people want to constitute a rounded party. :)
Haven't done a good barbarian yet. Roy was more of a fighter in that incarnation. Should be fun.
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What a cool idea, I love the idea of playing interesting, non-standard races.
In fact, might I reccomend you take a look at the Advanced Races Compendium
More than a 16 (and climbing) new and expanded PFPRG races: tieflings, gearforged, lizardfolk, aasimar, lamia, kobolds, minotaurs and many more, all fully fleshed out and detailed as balanced, player races. Might be a big help with this campaign :)
Interesting. Playing the actually good guy that everybody hates will be a fun ride
Interesting. Playing the actually good guy that everybody hates will be a fun ride
I'm hoping so.
There's a lot of work to do, but with the support I've got, I'm rsther sure I want to make this.
The races of ----
"Civilized" races
These races, while Largely unchanged from their standard stat blocks and personalities, they also are raised in a culture where creatures not of this group are to be feared or killed.
In addition, they tend to work, and live in veey tightly knit groups- their main offesnive tools are numbers and organization.
Humans, dwarves, half-elves, elves-
Farley par for the course.
half-orcs-
Usually looked upon with a mix of Pity and fear, half-orcs Aren't exactly treated poorly- they're treated more like somone with a disability.
This can often get on a half-orc's nerves, as people tend to expect them to be stupid and brutish.
Halflings-
Halflings are practically ignored by the other "civilized" races. They tend to make good bards or practice crafting, creating art, Through object or song, is a very common way for a halfling to make a living.
By far the most tolerant of all the "civilized" races, they tend to see a bit deeper then skin or scales.
Gnomes-
Barely even tolerated, gnomes are seen as corrupted creatures, that are mostly kept around for their usefulness in inventing new things. Most gnomes are too obsessed with their work to notice the prejudice.
---------
"Uncivilized races"
Tengu-
Seen as both thieves and symbols of misfortune, tengu are avoided out of mostly superstition.
Ratfolk-
Feared as bearers of horrid plagues.
Orcs-
What the other races see-
Barbaric, brutal combat monsters.
What orcs are-
Farely dim-witted and militant creatures, that form closely knit and functioning tribes, forced frequently into war as a direct result of other races pressuring them.
Nagaji-
Nagaji are a special case, in that they aren't hunted down.
Nagaji keep to themselves, and so do the other races. While they wouldn't be well-accepted in a town, they woudln't be attacked on sight, for fear of disrupting this shaky peace between them and the other races.
Kobolds-
Rather unchanged from normal kobolds. Tend more towards lawful then evil.
Goblins-
Goblins remain goblins.
Monster races-
Some races truly deserve their title and fearsome statute-
Troglodytes, bugbears, and hobgoblins are largely unchanged from thier normal state, being farely barbaric bears.
Extinct races-
Strix-
Strix, when they became feared and hated by humans, quickly grew to hate humans back, and attempted to pick them off when possible This painted a huge target on their backs, and soon enough, the "civilized' races had killed nearly every strix on the planet. The last one died five years ago.
Lizardfolk-
Following much the same path as the strix, and hunting their hunters back, the lizardfold died out a week ago, when the last lizard-folk was killed.
Reincarate table
1-9 tengu
10-18 ratfolk
19-27 orc
28-36 nagaji
37-45 kobold
46-54 goblin
55-63 bugbear
64-72 hobgoblin
73-82 troglodyte
83-91 strix
92-100 lizardfolk
Do we get to choose out own racial features and appearance or is that random too?
Do we get to choose out own racial features and appearance or is that random too?
Any decisions to be made about the race rolled are made by the player-
Genral appearane, gender, alternate racial abilities.
Will the characters racial stat adjustments change to fit the new race? Should make it interesting if the wizard ends up with a race with an int penalty. :)
Will the characters racial stat adjustments change to fit the new race? Should make it interesting if the wizard ends up with a race with an int penalty. :)
Pysical stats always do, as per reincarnate.
But Then eveyone would choose races with mental stats.
The two semi-balanced options are-
Have the racial modifiers apply to pysical stats, but they keep any modifiers to their origional pysical stats as well.
Or have the racial modifiers apply to both mental and pysical stats.
Reincarnate only lists physical ones. It says to remove the racial boons and then start new, but ignore mental score changes boon or otherwise.
Reincarnate only lists physical ones. It says to remove the racial boons and then start new, but ignore mental score changes boon or otherwise.
I know.
But that makes it so starting as a race with high mental stats and Low pysical stats is a better option by default.
So, the options are (assuming people care about this kind of balance) to make the old pysical stat chsnges stick in addition to the new, or make mental stats take an effect as well.
This is really a great concept and one I would like to be a part of.
I'm fine with either fix.
This is really a great concept and one I would like to be a part of.
Great!
I'm fine with ether fix.
Alright then.
I'm leaning towords the mental stats are effected one.
I'm thinking starting at level three.
A large issue to address is-
Psionics or no?
I'll take a vote on that.
I like them, but I'm not sure everyone else would- it's optional.
Which psionics source? DSP?
If so, I'm fine with it. I own Ultimae Psionics.
Which psionics source? DSP?
Yep.