Just for curiosity, what's the company take on possible new editions of the game? We will stay with this edition forever (hopefully but that's just my humble opinion) or there are already specific thoughts in this regard? Did you ever discuss this matter?
It's a very possible possibility. It will probably come out somewhere around 2020, maybe a bit later.
While I'm too lazy to dig up official references, it was said that they want to give PF 1e at least a decade or so.
Even though this is a bit late for my tastes (since I consider PF another 3e revision, not as a new edition), it's good to know that they're willing to give the game some time to play out.
I hope they don't do the major revision thing that happened to Dungeon and Dragons. I don't think any mechanics are in a state that they need a 100% overhaul. We don't need to have previous products invalidated because of rules changes.
Expecially considering it's one of the main reason why Pathfinder exists at all :)
*
Honestly I just hope the hypothetical new game maintains some respect for the original Gygax/Arneson game, a thing which 4E definitely does not. I am not criticizing that game now, I am just saying it's 4E doesn't "feel" like D&D anymore, while Pathfinder, and in particular the way the system is being developed, with huge nods to pulp book and movie fiction does.
It all depends on growth really. I am guessing 5-6 years or so, which honestly is a good run.
I would honestly prefer to see PF 2E as a different "style" of RPG rather than an overhaul of the current system. A PF modern would open up the setting to alot more genres (modern, western, sci-fi, etc) which I would love to see.
There is so much that has yet to be explored in Golarion, that they have a decade's worth of products to do. There are possible expansions to the existing rule set, such as a modern version, as another direction for revenue.
I also think Paiso will allow their customers to help drive what direction they go in. They seem to listen to our input more than any other developer I've seen. Hopefully, if there is a subsequent edition it will revamp the magic system.
This is just my personal opinion. Keep in mind I am a poodle.
I think a Pathfinder 2e is a different direction than what Paizo wants to go right now. As I understand it, Pathfinder came about because Paizo wanted to continue to release content for 3.5 and there was an obvious demand for maintaining support. To me, Pathfinder was just a bridge for Paizo to continue doing what they wanted to do. Infrastructure, if you will.
That is not to say that the success of Pathfinder may (or, perhaps, already has) cause Paizo to reconsider the direction they want to go. It just seems to me, they have a full head of steam for adventures and fleshing out Golorian.
On the other hand, 'core' products do appear to have a large market. I would not be surprised to see Paizo shift focus in light of this.
Non-committal enough for you? How about this…I predict Paizo will release Pathfinder 2e when it becomes economically unwise for them not to. When sales of other products have dropped and there appears to be a demand for a new edition.
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Just for curiosity, what's the company take on possible new editions of the game? We will stay with this edition forever (hopefully but that's just my humble opinion) or there are already specific thoughts in this regard? Did you ever discuss this matter?You don't talk about second editions of the game until you've decided to kill the game that's in place. I find it quite conceivable that there may never be a second edition of this game and that adventure paths may be Paizo's main source of income for Pathfinder. Maybe instead of Pathfinder 2.0 we might be looking at Pathfinder Gothic or Pathfinder Modern/Supers/Future.
A horror-esque pathfinder gothic would be cool, too!
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I would honestly prefer to see PF 2E as a different "style" of RPG rather than an overhaul of the current system. A PF modern would open up the setting to alot more genres (modern, western, sci-fi, etc) which I would love to see.** spoiler omitted **
What do you know? You use the metric system :/
All joking aside, for whatever reason, that's how I was taught it was spelled growing up and it's been a hard habit to break. Going to school in Oklahoma wreaks havoc on kids' spelling...my brother was eliminated from a spelling bee for spelling "wash" "w-a-r-s-h".
I don't think Paizo has the resources to do their own 4th Edition.
Define "4th Edition" in that context. What is it they don't have the resources for? A big overhaul of the rules, throwing everything that was away and starting from scratch?
I don't think they lack the intention to do that, rather than the resources. PF exists because enough people wanted their game back. I don't think Paizo is going to make the same mistake wizards did.
I'd hope they'd wait until they had a solid improvements on the d20 System or to address balance issues that crop up over the years. While I enjoy this system over 2nd and 4th Ed, there are some things I wouldn't mind moving away from such as DR.
As for spelling critiques, they annoy me. Must people don't have editors checking their work. Sometimes you use the wrong "there" even though you know better, some times you hit the wrong button or the key doesn't register a strike, and sometimes english is a pain in the butt language (affect vs effect, faze vs phase, etc.). Sorry for the rant, but as some one who has to fight with dyslexia it gets on my nerves when some one gets on my case for spelling "their" as "thier".
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I hope they don't do the major revision thing that happened to Dungeon and Dragons. I don't think any mechanics are in a state that they need a 100% overhaul. We don't need to have previous products invalidated because of rules changes.
I actually have the opposite opinion - I hope they do make quite fundamental changes and don't feel constrained by trying to remain backwards compatible. That might make me take another look at Pathfinder.
M&M 3rd Edition has made some considerbale changes (dropping ability scores and going with just modifiers, adding new abilities, overhauling feats etc). Equally, Shadowrun 4th edition changed significantly and was better for it IMHO.
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See, I don't think it's a good idea to go with a Pathfinder Modern or a Pathfinder Horror or whatever, as a replacement edition. The Sword-&-Sorcery RPG is what Paizo does -- if a gamer wants to play a Horror game, wouldn't they use WoD or Call Cthulu or something?
For Paizo to design these as additions to their Sword-&-Sorcery would be great, but not as replacements.
But I don't know that Paizo has the resources to branch out like this. When they put out the Horror Core Book lots will buy it. But many won't cuz they don't want to play a Horror game. Same with Modern. And Future. All in all, it could spread Paizo pretty thin.
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I think it's quite clear that at this time the core market for Pathfinder was 3.5 edition grognards who rebelled at WOTC's 4th edition but were willing to accept changes they thought would improve the game and create a market for something other than internet printed copies of the SRD.
Thier main constraint is not so much keeping backwards compatibility but not fracturing thier core market.
True, but by the time a 2nd edition comes around, things will have likely changed and I suspect that those who have moved onto, or been introduced to Pathfinder, will be more accepting of larger changes if they look to make the game better. I.e. by then Pathfinder will have hopefully stepped out of the shadow of 3.5 and 2nd edition will be seen as just that - Pathfinder Second Edition, and not D&D 3.Y.
The appeal of Pathfinder for me is the use of my very extensive 3.x library of stuff.
If Pathfinder no longer supports that, then I really won't have a need to support Pathfinder. I doubt I'm alone.
I didn't skip 4E because of the mechanics. To date, I have yet to so much as crack open one of their books.
I skipped it because it was, to me, just another attempt to force me to re-buy my entire collection of books.
Their 'reenvisioning" of Forgotten Realms sealed the deal for me.
I went with Pathfinder because 100% of my 3.0/3.5 materials are compatible with it. Some adjustments must be made, yes, but I don't have to basically just "keep the idea but remake everything else myself" as I would with a completely new edition.
I hope that whatever "next edition" we get, is compatible enough with what Pathfinder is making now that such is still useful.
-S
Wow,
Pathfinder has not even got there 2nd Bestiary out yet. Has not even got out there book of magic out yet
and you guys are already talking about a 2nd Ed Pathfinder.
I do not want to see anything like that for the next 10 years at least, maybe even 20.
Even then, only if it is truly better game system, thats easier to play, simpler & faster physical combat system, that still give the same Magical spell feel.
~~ i think someone is just trying to bankrupt me ;p ~~
The appeal of Pathfinder for me is the use of my very extensive 3.x library of stuff.
If Pathfinder no longer supports that, then I really won't have a need to support Pathfinder. I doubt I'm alone.
Personally, I went with PF and not wizards for a number of reasons:
I'm not saying the game should never change - quite the opposite! I think that in a few more years, 3e will have run its course and a new edition will be welcome.
But it has to be done right. For me, that means:
(Disclaimer: I'm not accusing Paizo of having done these things in the past. I'm just saying they better not start with this).
Wow,
Pathfinder has not even got there 2nd Bestiary out yet. Has not even got out there book of magic out yet
and you guys are already talking about a 2nd Ed Pathfinder.
I'm already thinking about what life will be like for humans who colonise other planets, and we're far, far away from when that will happen (probably centuries after my time).
And I sure hope Paizo has already started taking notes. In fact, I hope Jason has started taking notes back when he started working on PF, in the form of "I wonder how I'd do this if I were to make a new edition rather than a revision" kind of musings. Can't start too early.
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i am reminded of a few folk sayings: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." and "just because one can do a thing does not mean they should."
a new edition for the sake of a new edition seems wasteful and frivolous to me. not to mention disrespectful to the great many folk who've invested time, energy, and money into the game.
refinement and necessary change i am all down for. if a rule is causing, problems errata and clarify it. if a better, innovative, and more practical way of doing things comes along, then use it.
once all that errata and clarification equals the dearth of a new book, then maybe its time to create a revised edition. until then, i will be pleased as punch to have online updates and printable documents that aid me in my gaming hobby.
a new genre doesn't necessarily require a new edition. i would LOVE a modern/future pathfinder book. i loved gamma world, buck rogers, spelljammer, boot hill, top secret, and star frontiers. if there were a source book that would allow me to recapture some of that feel and use it all interchangeably in my pathfinder game, i would do back flips.
Not only do we not have any plans for a new edition, but we don't even have plans for planning those plans.
Folks, the Pathfinder RPG turned one year old only a couple of weeks ago. If this were a baby, it probably wouldn't even be responding to its own name yet.
sure it would. and would be taking a few steps too
sure it would. and would be taking a few steps tooNot only do we not have any plans for a new edition, but we don't even have plans for planning those plans.
Folks, the Pathfinder RPG turned one year old only a couple of weeks ago. If this were a baby, it probably wouldn't even be responding to its own name yet.
On my first birthday, I could read, write, and drive a car.
Probably my question was unclear, I apologize since I am a non-native speaker. I just wanted to know if never changing the ruleset completely like the OTHERS did with "the world's oldest rpg" was something that was part of the company mission, or if the future might hold such possibility. I just wanted to know if it's a "maybe who knows what the future will bring, we will think about it in due time" or a "we will never do that, we were born to continue an EGG tradition and we will stick to the roots of the game, we prefer to keep releasing quality stuff for a consolidated ruleset maybe with some - unearther aracana-like options - but we will never change the core rules, as they're part of our foundation".
CEO
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Probably my question was unclear, I apologize since I am a non-native speaker. I just wanted to know if never changing the ruleset completely like the OTHERS did with "the world's oldest rpg" was something that was part of the company mission, or if the future might hold such possibility. I just wanted to know if it's a "maybe who knows what the future will bring, we will think about it in due time" or a "we will never do that, we were born to continue an EGG tradition and we will stick to the roots of the game, we prefer to keep releasing quality stuff for a consolidated ruleset maybe with some - unearther aracana-like options - but we will never change the core rules, as they're part of our foundation".
It's a little bit of all that you wrote. There is a good chance that someday in the future, we will probably do a new edition of Pathfinder if there seems to be a reason to do so and a market of people who would want to buy it. But as Vic said, we are one year in! You don't start making wedding plans when your baby is one year old. You don't pick out a burial plot. :) There will most likely come a time in the future when we will start to think about that. Until then, we are enjoying creating new stuff for the rules that are just getting up and running! One thing you can be sure as long as I own the company is that we will always follow the EGG tradition and stick to the roots of the game. That is who we are and what we believe in.
-Lisa
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Folks, the Pathfinder RPG turned one year old only a couple of weeks ago. If this were a baby, it probably wouldn't even be responding to its own name yet.
Sure, but Pathfinder is a prodigy.
On my first birthday, I could read, write, and drive a car.
Heh, big deal, by my first B-day, I could read, write, and rolled my first Nat 20!
Paizo's hardback releases are moving forward in slow motion, 4 releases a year. The game has yet to release a hardback magic or setting book (which will come in the second year of publication instead of the first). Off the top of my head, I'd say that the line can probably support about 30 hardbacks before needing a refresh. That gives this edition about a eight year life expectancy, though possibly they could push it to ten and forty books.
Paizo is laying the groundwork for that new edition now. APG, Ultimate Magic and Ultimate Combat all offer or will offer rules divergent from the 3.x core. Once you've been playing with these divergent systems for a couple years it's going to get harder to remember what is 3.x and what is Paizo and really most folks aren't going to care. By 2018 you'll be more worried about backwards compatibility with your Paizo library than with 3.x.
For the next several years Paizo is going to have it's eyes squarely on the current challenges to its business: navigating a changing print and pdf marketplace; dealing with the rise of e-readers; price deflation and a poor economy; finding the correct balance of release schedules and staffing; and coming up with products that people want to buy. There's a long time before a new edition and a lot can happen between now and then.
A more interesting question is if Paizo is considering a format shift for any of it's lines now that WotC is putting out essentials as 9.6 inch paperbacks.
You don't start making wedding plans when your baby is one year old.
Madam, on behalf of 19th-century aristocracy, I resent your bigoted remark!
One thing you can be sure as long as I own the company is that we will always follow the EGG tradition and stick to the roots of the game. That is who we are and what we believe in.
-Lisa
Just the other day, I was thinking that I hope you never sell. I've seen the changes in TSR and WotC when the people running those companies changed.
Thing is with Paizo, their meat & drink is in selling the adventures, not the rules. If you drastically change the rules, all the old adventures become non-sales.
Hence I predict that Paizo will either produce another backward compatible edition with a lot of small changes the but the core system unchanged, or else they will lose their customer base extensively before doing a big overhaul.
I have no problem with the game evolving, but I don't want to see a version released that isn't backward compatible with the old to at least some degree - that was the big thing for me with 4e. Many 2nd editions did not contain total rules overhauls, nor do they need to. Just take the distilled houserules and comments about Pathfinder after many years of play and incorporate them into the new and improved ruleset.
sure it would. and would be taking a few steps tooNot only do we not have any plans for a new edition, but we don't even have plans for planning those plans.
Folks, the Pathfinder RPG turned one year old only a couple of weeks ago. If this were a baby, it probably wouldn't even be responding to its own name yet.
On my first birthday, I could read, write, and drive a car.
oh yeah? I was making out with chicks. so there
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CEO
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Paizo's hardback releases are moving forward in slow motion, 4 releases a year. The game has yet to release a hardback magic or setting book (which will come in the second year of publication instead of the first). Off the top of my head, I'd say that the line can probably support about 30 hardbacks before needing a refresh. That gives this edition about a eight year life expectancy, though possibly they could push it to ten and forty books.
Paizo is laying the groundwork for that new edition now. APG, Ultimate Magic and Ultimate Combat all offer or will offer rules divergent from the 3.x core. Once you've been playing with these divergent systems for a couple years it's going to get harder to remember what is 3.x and what is Paizo and really most folks aren't going to care. By 2018 you'll be more worried about backwards compatibility with your Paizo library than with 3.x.
For the next several years Paizo is going to have it's eyes squarely on the current challenges to its business: navigating a changing print and pdf marketplace; dealing with the rise of e-readers; price deflation and a poor economy; finding the correct balance of release schedules and staffing; and coming up with products that people want to buy. There's a long time before a new edition and a lot can happen between now and then.
+1
Btw, have you been hanging out in my head lately? :)
-Lisa
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oh yeah? I was making out with chicks. so theresure it would. and would be taking a few steps tooNot only do we not have any plans for a new edition, but we don't even have plans for planning those plans.
Folks, the Pathfinder RPG turned one year old only a couple of weeks ago. If this were a baby, it probably wouldn't even be responding to its own name yet.
On my first birthday, I could read, write, and drive a car.
I was Emperor of the Universe. Then I got bored.
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The appeal of Pathfinder for me is the use of my very extensive 3.x library of stuff.
If Pathfinder no longer supports that, then I really won't have a need to support Pathfinder. I doubt I'm alone.
I don't see the need for Pathfinder to "support" stacks of 3.5 stuff. What is it they need to support? It's your game. Use your splat books, or don't. It's up to you.
In my gaming group, we had every intention of using numerous splat books going forward, right up to when the APG was released. Then we felt that we could work with what had been presented without trying to shoehorn every old WotC title into the mix.
Right now, Pathfinder doesn't "support" 3.5 material. They've simply presented you with a set of rules that doesn't inherently exclude them, with the idea that some people will use those rules by themselves (without using older splat books), and some people will want to use every book they can find.
Since Pathfinder is essentially a revision/update of 3.5, how on earth could Pathfinder stop "supporting" your splat books without changing the game to a degree that it no longer supports its own Core Rulebook? I honestly don't have the foggiest notion of what you mean.
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Paizo's hardback releases are moving forward in slow motion, 4 releases a year.
I don't really see that as slow-motion. It might be when compared to WotC but that's not a great comparison
4 releases a year means we have about three years until Paizo is releasing niche material (PFmodern, Complete Blah 3, Environmental splatbooks, etc.) ah, well.
My spies have revealed this to be Paizo's theoretical imaginary aspersive release schedule:
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09 - Pathfinder Core
10 - Advanced Guides
11 - Ultimate Guides
12 - Savage Guides
13 - Epic Guides
14 - Psychic Guides
15 - Alternative Guides
16 - Demigod Guides
17 - Divine Guides
18 - Super Hero Guides
19 - Time Travel Guides
20 - Pathfinder V2
So I don't think we have anything to worry about for a while.
But as Vic said, we are one year in! You don't start making wedding plans when your baby is one year old. You don't pick out a burial plot. :)
Some Germans that use to live in East Germany told me that when a son is born, you ordered a car for him to give him as a wedding present. It took something like 15 years for a car to come from the factory.
(Ignore me. I'll be over there.)
You don't start making wedding plans when your baby is one year old.
Yeah, that's a little late for some people.
You don't pick out a burial plot.
The family mausoleum, obviously. Nothing you really pick out, though, so I give you that one ;-)
One thing you can be sure as long as I own the company is that we will always follow the EGG tradition and stick to the roots of the game. That is who we are and what we believe in.
That's a religion I can subscribe to! :D *looks at tags* Oh, I did.
So, what you're saying is that there's something abnormal about me?
That goes without saying. In fact, is there anything normal about you?
By the way: The goatee. Lose it. The times when that made you look diabolic are long gone. Ever since the guy who delivers our Pizzas had one, that look's time was behind it.