Alchemist Fast Bombs question

[Ravingdork]

Themetricsystem wrote:

Ravingdork wrote:

I guess 20th-level characters aren't allowed to have cool things.

I fail to see how the above 20th-level build is much different then some of the archer builds we see.

It is and never was about the level 20 character. It was about the level 8 character who literally quadruples the number of bombs he can thrown in with single levels advancement. Goes from level 7 where he can throw one, to level 8 when they pick up fast bombs. I cant think off-handed of a single class that explodes (Doh Ho Ho) in power level so quickly at at point in their level advancement compared to this.

That still doesn't sound that bad to me.

Wizards "explode" when they go from 4th to 5th and pick up fireball. Suddenly they go from hitting one target for 3d4+3 (or a few targets for less) and are suddenly dealing 5d6 each to 50 guys at once.

[Themetricsystem]

Ravingdork wrote:

That still doesn't sound that bad to me.

Wizards "explode" when they go from 4th to 5th and pick up fireball. Suddenly they go from hitting one target for 3d4+3 (or a few targets for less) and are suddenly dealing 5d6 each to 50 guys at once.

I wont compare fireball to bombs because they are apples and oranges but I will say that I have never seen a fireball hit more than 6 enemies in a live game before.

[Eric Clingenpeel]

You won't compare fireballs to bombs, but you will compare wizards to alchemists? That makes sense. I for one have witnessed a dozen plus in a fireball many many times, and I'm just counting in one campaign.

Even hitting six enemies is more than you'll be getting with bombs on average. If you don't see fireballing more than six at a time, then you'll never see hitting more than a three-four with a bomb. If you're hitting more than that with a bomb, then a wizard could easily be hitting more than six with a fireball.

Its all about how you focus your character. If you want to focus it with tossing all your bombs in one fight, then the character will be sadly weakened for the rest of the day. Just because you can throw out more bombs per round than normal, doesn't mean you should. Its all about being economic with your resources, that's pretty much what being any caster is about.

[Generic General]

So if we are doing this by rules for Fast Bombs.

Benefit: An alchemist with this discovery can quickly create enough bombs to throw more than one in a single round. The alchemist can prepare and throw additional bombs as a full-round action if his base attack bonus is high enough to grant him additional attacks. This functions just like a full-attack with a ranged weapon.

The part they mention that is up to debate is FULL-ATTACK WITH A RANGED WEAPON. Which means that with Rapid Shot you should be able to.

Benefit: When making a full-attack action with a ranged weapon, you can fire one additional time this round at your highest bonus. All of your attack rolls take a –2 penalty when using Rapid Shot.

Haste also states that it must be used with a manufactured or natural attack which means if a bomb is made its manufactured. And it's with a full attack action and so it should be counted then.

When making a full attack action, a hasted creature may make one extra attack with one natural or manufactured weapon. The attack is made using the creature’s full base attack bonus, plus any modifiers appropriate to the situation.

TWF is up to you guys because I believe that making a bomb would take more than one hand. And if any of you argue otherwise is up to your campaign to make the final ruling.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/rapid-shot-combat-final/
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/discoveries/paizo-al chemist-discoveries/fast-bombs/
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/h/haste/

[Gobo Horde]

Threadomancy?
Btw lack of quotes makes that particularly hard to read.
Also, no question at the end... Are you debating with a seven-year-dead-thread?

[ItsJustAce]

It was covered in the FAQ. Alchemist are allowed to have all the feats that give them bonus attacks with FastBombs.
Two-Weapon Fighting Including.
By Level 11 An Alchemist should be able to throw 5 bombs in one turn if they wish. 6 with haste, add an amulet of hidden strength that's 7. But, you do only have a set number of bombs a day so be careful.
If you build it right an alchemist can do roughly 26 damage minimum with one of his bombs by this level.
I know this because I have a PFS alchemist and I've ask John about it myself at GenCon.
Any questions on the build feel free to ask.