My player group for Kingmaker has taken the "Naturalist" approach to a party, meaning that the players are all pretty much nature themed. (Barbarian, Ranger, Druid, etc) with a Cleric of Gozreh thrown in for good measure.
Although they do want to "rule" a country, it seems that they aren't big fans of (large) cities... and want to try and attract more "Nomadic" barbarian tribes (which I am fine with, as there should be enough nearby in Iobara and Numeria)
However, the rules as written don't really support such a "nomadic" Kingdom. Therefore, I would like to ask people if they had the same situation, or if they have any suggestions.
I prefer to allow my players this type of rulership style, as it seems inline with their characters and they are really thinking about it.
My current ideas are:
- Adding "Tribal/Pastoral" Lands, which provide a 1BP consumption reduction (instead of 2BP for farms), but also don't cost anything in "consumption" as the Barbarian tribes double as patrols.
- Allowing the construction of specific "single" buildings, e.g. Watchttowers, a fortress etc, presenting a small outpost, without a real actual city.
- Allowing the construction of "Villages" which are only 4 9x9 sections to be in the same area as a farm or pastoral lands. (Anything larger precludes that the area is used for farming/husbandry).
Any other ideas?
- Allowing the construction of "Villages" which are only 4 9x9 sections to be in the same area as a farm or pastoral lands. (Anything larger precludes that the area is used for farming/husbandry).
I ofcourse intended 4 sections of 2x2. Thus 16 sections in total.
This is tricky. As you have guessed, the rules don't do a very good job of supporting this trend of play.
The players do not have to build large cities. It is possible to simply put one district per city hex. But they would have to be careful to not eat up all of their potential farm hexes this way.
As a baseline, a kingdom needs one farm per hex owned plus one farm per city district. This isn't as harsh as it sounds, because there are other ways to generate BP. But since large amounts of BP are needed for growth, and later in the AP, it is better if these sources of BP aren't counted on for basic consumption costs.
- Adding "Tribal/Pastoral" Lands, which provide a 1BP consumption reduction (instead of 2BP for farms), but also don't cost anything in "consumption" as the Barbarian tribes double as patrols.
This doesn't do anything effective. Costing 0, and providing 1 is the same thing as costing 1, and providing 2. The net gain in both is 1.
- Allowing the construction of specific "single" buildings, e.g. Watchttowers, a fortress etc, presenting a small outpost, without a real actual city.
I like where you are going with this. But I am not certain how it benefits your plans. I don't see it helping with making a less "civilized" kingdom more viable.
- Allowing the construction of "Villages" which are only 4 2x2 (edited) sections to be in the same area as a farm or pastoral lands. (Anything larger precludes that the area is used for farming/husbandry).
This might work. Assuming that these villages still increase consumption, it means they "zero out" the hex. (1 BP consumption for owning the hex, and 1 BP for the village, is countered by the 2 BP reduction of the farm.) Even if they made every single grasslands hex a village, the group wouldn't be gaining a whole lot. They are effectively paying double for the district spaces... But they get the benefit of farming where they build...
My gut tells me it hurts the players more than helps them. But at the moment I can't see how.As to your question for how to better make this work? I don't have anything for you. I'll think on it a bit, and see what I come up with.
Define all your towns/cities as fairgrounds. Most of the year your nomadic tribesfolk, shepherds, etc are out herding the reindeer, taking the goats out to pasture, picking wild berries, going a-viking, etc. Once or twice a year they gather in a large camp to trade all the nice stuff they've gathered.
The fair/camp site may or may not have a permanent caretaker or any permanent structures. A tent city is still a city whether you have tents, teepees, yurts, or magical pavilions created by tribal leaders who all own rods of splendor as signs of their leadership.
You can also use a similar system for tourist town and holy sites. What's the population of Mecca? What's the population of Mecca during the Hajj?
Define all your towns/cities as fairgrounds. Most of the year your nomadic tribesfolk, shepherds, etc are out herding the reindeer, taking the goats out to pasture, picking wild berries, going a-viking, etc. Once or twice a year they gather in a large camp to trade all the nice stuff they've gathered.
The fair/camp site may or may not have a permanent caretaker or any permanent structures. A tent city is still a city whether you have tents, teepees, yurts, or magical pavilions created by tribal leaders who all own rods of splendor as signs of their leadership.
You can also use a similar system for tourist town and holy sites. What's the population of Mecca? What's the population of Mecca during the Hajj?
How would you do this in game? Have them earn BP just twice per year. (But economy times 1.2 instead of 1/5th?)
I currently plan on using the following:
NON-CITY BUILDINGS & IMPROVEMENTS:
Presented below are additional buildings and improvements that can be build outside of cities. Please note that constructing any of these improvements takes the place of the "build a farm" action in your kingdom turn.
Please also note that Camps, Farms and Mines are mutually exclusive - you can have a farm OR a mine OR a camp in a hex. None of these improvements represent a single building in a 12-mile hex. It's not just one farm, or just one mine, or just one camp. Building means you have devoted the primary physical and human resources of that hex to the activity of farming (farm), mining (mine) or logging (camp).
Camp: (6 BP) A logging camp can be build in a forest area with a road or river. +1 Economy, +1 Stability. The economy bonus is doubled if the hex contains a resource like rare lumber: +2 Economy, +2 Stability.
Fishing Camp (4 BP): A fishing camp can be build in a hex including or adjoining a lake. However, only one fishing camp can be build per lake. A fishing camp reduces consumption by 3 BP per turn.
Fort: (12 BP). A sturdy structure that serves as a guard post and lookout for danger. +1 Stability; +2 Defense Modifier; Unrest –1. A fort can be build in any hex containing a road or river, even if a camp, farm or mine has already been established. If a city or town is built in an area with a fort, the fort is treated as a watchtower.
Mine: (6 BP) A mine is used for recovering valuable or less valuables minerals, ores and gems. A mine can be built in hills or mountains if a road or river is present. +1 Economy, +1 Stability. The economy bonus is doubled if the hex contains a resource like gold or silver ore: +2 Economy, +2 Stability.
Rivers: Much like roads, rivers can be used for commerce. For every 4 hexes of navigable rivers your kingdom controls that contain navigable rivers, you gain +1 Economy. (Yes, hexes with a river and a road count for both.)
A town overall functions like a city with the following exceptions:
Location: A town can be created in a hex that already contains a camp, farm or fishery. A town can only contain one district, and a town district consists of 4 2x2 city grids.
Costs: Cost for preparing a town district site and time for preparation are reduced, to reflect the more limited size of the town.
Preparing a Town District Site
Terrain Cost to Prepare Time to Prepare
Forest __________2 BP___________1 month
Grassland_______ 1 BP____________Immediate*
Hills____________1 BP___________1 month
Mountains_______6 BP___________2 months
Swamp_________4 BP___________2 months
Consumption: Town districts add 0.5 a BP to consumption. Consumption is rounded up.
Buildings: Only the following buildings can be build in a town: Alchemist, Barracks, Brewery, Brothel, City Wall (1 max), Dump, Granary, Graveyard, Herbalist, House, Inn, Mansion, Mill, Monument, Park, Piers, Shop, Shrine, Smith, Stable, Tannery, Tavern, Tenement, Town Hall, Tradesman, Watchtower.
Upgrading to a city It is possible to upgrade a town to a city. However, this takes time and costs BP identical to the cost of preparing a town district.
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I have been thinking along the same lines. Covering the hills and plains with roads, farms, and big cities is one intensive way to settle. But what about a less dense manner, including forests, swamps, and mountains? What about encorporating groups of fairies, primitive humanoids, and such as pockets inside your nation? Or, if as you state, your 'Natualist' players with druids/rangers/nature clerics want a differnt way for roleplay reasons?
While this doesnt really cover full blown wide-ranging nomadism, I've come up with the following house rules to handle this sort of naturalism. Hopefully it is less optimal than standard farms and cities, but encourages widespread, low density settlement.
Occupied/Settled (1 BP in plains, forests, hills / 4 BP in swamps, mountains): Instead of a farm or city, you can choose to lightly settle a claimed hex. This does not require a road. [i]-1 Consumption; and +1 Loyalty, Stability, Economy, or Defense (choosen at creation for roleplay reasons and cannot be changed later)
This rule lets you fill up lands (particularly forests) with huntsmen, gatherers, herders, and such without being a complete drain on the kingdom. It can also be used to represent making pacts with fairies and other humanoids. You can make a pact with fairies in a hex that 'civilized' people from your kingdom won't hassle them. You claim the hex (so any problems are your problems), but you don't have to send patrols or support fledgeling homesteaders (-1 Consumption negates the 1 Consumption cost of the hex). In exchange, everyone thinks you have treated the fairies fairly (+1 Loyalty).
Noting where the bonus comes from adds some flavor and roleplay hooks. Defense might mean youve recruted the lizardfolk of the square into your army. Stability could represent cowing the kolbolds so they dont cause trouble.
Mechanics-wise, this isnt very powerful. The Command DC goes up by 1 for each hex, so this only offsets that for one dimension. Upping the bonus to +2 might be appropriate. My quick playtests, with a mixture of settled, farmed, and city hexes, didnt show the DCs becoming too high fast.
Village/Outpost Building: Buildings can be build outside of city districts for +1 BP per building square.
For example, you can build a Shrine in a forest for 7BP (normally 6 BP in a city), or Castle for 58 (4 more for its four squares). This encourages spreading some buildings out as small villages. As each building square represents 250 people, you can think of a Smith in a hex as a village with a smith and other craftsmen. This also encourages using up the various free and half price buildings in various hexes, without making them cities. The Temple of the Elk makes just as much sense rebuilt in the forest as in the middle of a new city.
You might want to limit it to one buliding per hex, and not allow any building with house prerequisites. Slightly increased cost in mountains and swamps might also be needed.
I like the ideas some people have had with camps, logging, mines, and such. But they seem more expensive and don't offset the consumption of the hex. So they are more like a big group of loggers coming in and trying to maximize profits, clear-cut, and live off imported food. They help expand settlement into forests and mountains, but don't quite fit the naturalist mood. I might use a mixture of both options. (With rivers like roads as well).
Define all your towns/cities as fairgrounds. Most of the year your nomadic tribesfolk, shepherds, etc are out herding the reindeer, taking the goats out to pasture, picking wild berries, going a-viking, etc. Once or twice a year they gather in a large camp to trade all the nice stuff they've gathered.
The fair/camp site may or may not have a permanent caretaker or any permanent structures. A tent city is still a city whether you have tents, teepees, yurts, or magical pavilions created by tribal leaders who all own rods of splendor as signs of their leadership.
You can also use a similar system for tourist town and holy sites. What's the population of Mecca? What's the population of Mecca during the Hajj?
How would you do this in game? Have them earn BP just twice per year. (But economy times 1.2 instead of 1/5th?)
I don't have the rules in front of me but I'd simply build up the fairs as if they were full cities inhabited 24/7 then handwave the fact that the residents are out of town part of the year.
For pilgrimage and vacation sites, I'd assume that all your visitors are within your own lands, or at least handwave that the crossborder tourism is 50/50. Same production and whatnot regardless of where the inhabitants happen to be at the moment.
I mean, look at it this way. There's a house. How many inhabitants does that house have? Are they there 24/7? Do they get visitors? Are they ever out of town?
Occupied/Settled (1 BP in plains, forests, hills / 4 BP in swamps, mountains): Instead of a farm or city, you can choose to lightly settle a claimed hex. This does not require a road. [i]-1 Consumption; and +1 Loyalty, Stability, Economy, or Defense (choosen at creation for roleplay reasons and cannot be changed later)
I may steal this one. Although I may want to diversify the names for the types of lands (E.g. Pastoral lands: -1 consumption +2 loyalty, Allied Tribe -1 consumption +2 stability etc), however this is more to work it easily into my excel sheet than for anything else.....
I am also considering including Villages as an even smaller version of a town. Although this doens't support nomadism really, it does make it easier on the nature loving characters that don't want a large city despoiling the country side.
A village overall functions like a city with the following exceptions:
Location: A town can be created in a hex that already contains a camp, farm or fishery. A town can only contain one district, and a village district consists of a one 2x2 grid.
Costs: Cost for preparing a town district site and time for preparation are reduced, to reflect the more limited size of the town.
Preparing a Town District Site
Terrain Cost to Prepare Time to Prepare
Forest 1 BP 1 month
Grassland 1 BP Immediate*
Hills 1 BP 1 month
Mountains 3 BP 1 months
Swamp 2 BP 1 months
Consumption: Village districts don’t add to consumption.
Buildings: Only the following buildings can be build in a town: Brewery, Brothel, Granary, Herbalist, House, Inn, Mill, Shop, Shrine, Smith, Tannery, Tavern, Tenement, Tradesman, Watchtower.
Upgrading to a town: It is possible to upgrade a village to a town. However, this takes time and costs BP identical to the cost of preparing a town district.
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And new stuff inspired on people's input:
Allied Tribe (4 BP): An allied tribe Hex provides the country with an internal trade partner and defensive force. +2 Economy, +1 Stability; +2 Defense Modifier. An allied tribe hex does not cost any consumption per turn. An allied tribe hex can only be established in a hex containing a tribe of humanoid creatures with which the PCs are on friendly terms.
Pastoral lands (1 BP in plains, hills only): Instead of a camp, farm or city, you can choose to assign an area as pastoral lands for nomads to graze their herds. This does not require a road. Pastoral Lands reduce Consumption by 1BP; +1 Economy and +1 Loyalty.
Settled (1 BP in plains, forests, hills / 4 BP in swamps, mountains): Instead of a camp, farm or city, you can choose to lightly settle a claimed hex. This does not require a road. Settled lands reduced Consumption by 1; +1 Stability.