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let us see.
Strong evocation; CL 15th; Craft Wondrous Item, Craft Magic Arms and Armor, clenched fist; Price 25,305 gp; Cost 12,305 gp + 480 XP; Weight 160 lb.
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1.So maul of the titans does 3x damage to inanimate objects, does this work with sunder? So if that is a yes, what if I take greater sunder and smash some ones armor or weapon they take the leftover damage. So does this work?
2. Does sunder work with things like Cleave and Vital Strike?
should work with sunder
sunder and vital strike should work together
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You are skilled at damaging your foes' weapons and armor.
Prerequisite: Str 13, Power Attack, base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: You do not provoke an attack of opportunity when performing a sunder combat maneuver. In addition, you receive a +2 bonus on checks made to sunder an item. You also receive a +2 bonus to your Combat Maneuver Defense whenever an opponent tries to sunder your gear.
Normal: You provoke an attack of opportunity when performing a sunder combat maneuver.
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Sunder
You can attempt to sunder an item held or worn by your opponent as part of an attack action in place of a melee attack. If you do not have the Improved Sunder feat, or a similar ability, attempting to sunder an item provokes an attack of opportunity from the target of your maneuver.
If your attack is successful, you deal damage to the item normally. Damage that exceeds the object's Hardness is subtracted from its hit points. If an object has equal to or less than half its total hit points remaining, it gains the broken condition (see Conditions). If the damage you deal would reduce the object to less than 0 hit points, you can choose to destroy it. If you do not choose to destroy it, the object is left with only 1 hit point and the broken condition.
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You can strike two adjacent foes with a single swing.
Prerequisites: Str 13, Power Attack, base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: As a standard action, you can make a single attack at your full base attack bonus against a foe within reach. If you hit, you deal damage normally and can make an additional attack (using your full base attack bonus) against a foe that is adjacent to the first and also within reach. You can only make one additional attack per round with this feat. When you use this feat, you take a –2 penalty to your Armor Class until your next turn.
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You make a single attack that deals significantly more damage than normal.
Prerequisites: Base attack bonus +6.
Benefit: When you use the attack action, you can make one attack at your highest base attack bonus that deals additional damage. Roll the damage dice for the attack twice and add the results together, but do not multiply damage bonuses from Strength, weapon abilities (such as flaming), or precision-based damage (such as sneak attack). This bonus damage is not multiplied on a critical hit (although other damage bonuses are multiplied normally).
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I was afraid of this lol, I have a level 10 fighter in a game with enlarge person permanancied and a plus 6 giant str belt, and I have one of these mauls. So 30 str with weapon focus both sunder feats and weapon training I have a 27 cmb for sunder and a 3d6 + 28 dmg, which with a titans maul is 3d6 (9-54) + 84 dmg that will go straight to the poor sap wearing/holding whatever I smash. I only have 19 armor but so far this hasn't been an issue, also with cornugun smash and Intimidating Prowess he has become quite a Beast.
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1.So maul of the titans does 3x damage to inanimate objects, does this work with sunder?
Yes.
So if that is a yes, what if I take greater sunder and smash some ones armor or weapon they take the leftover damage. So does this work?
Yes.
2. Does sunder work with things like Cleave and Vital Strike?
Yes, and Yes.
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I was afraid of this lol, I have a level 10 fighter in a game with enlarge person permanancied and a plus 6 giant str belt, and I have one of these mauls. So 30 str with weapon focus both sunder feats and weapon training I have a 27 cmb for sunder and a 3d6 + 28 dmg, which with a titans maul is 3d6 (9-54) + 84 dmg that will go straight to the poor sap wearing/holding whatever I smash. I only have 19 armor but so far this hasn't been an issue, also with cornugun smash and Intimidating Prowess he has become quite a Beast.
brutal, but with a 19 AC your dm should pound you a hard one to make up for it.
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now the person doesnt get triple damaged by the msul, and i know it mentions the maul does triple damage, but does that explicitly mean 3x str on the damage? so is it 3(3d6 + str 1.5) or 3(3d6)+str 1.5?
also, the waepon doesnt resize to you if its ever put down, so if someone manages to disarm you, or you drop it, its no longer enlarged
also where's all the damage coming from? 15 from str, 3 from enchantment, 2 from weapon training, 2 from specializtion.. wheres the other 6 from? also d10 upscales to 2d8 i believe
so it should be 2d8+22 not 3d6+28 unless i'm missing somethin
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Sorry wasn't thinking the other day, the other 6 is from power attack and I did damage wrong, I was thinking Improved vital strike for the 3 x and then the maul dmg I listed is wrong I listed for a large great sword (doesn't 2d6 become 3d6?) and the damage from the maul would carry over as it says in greater sunder that any damage left over from the attack on the weapon carries over. so my damage would be weapon damage x6 and str dmg x 3.
Correct?
but the maul specifically does the extra damage to inanimate objects, not people.
Which is why it does NOT work on sunder et al. versus a players used items. NOTHING a player is wearing or wielding is an inamite object for purposes of magic. They are all attended objects.
Now if you wanted to do it to a persons armor when it was lying on the ground, I would say go for it. But once a person wears of wields something it gets subsumed into their personal aura and becomes, for pretty much all affects, THEM.
Even if one were to allow it on WORN armor or wielded items, the bleed through damage would definately NOT be tripled, since it is no longer damaging an inanimate item but a persona or living creature.
Time to remember how to multiply and divide if you really want to do this.
Or just make your gear out of Adamantine. Unless the maul is made out of it as well it can do as much damage as it wants and still not affect the weapon or armor since adamantine ignores damage from items with a hardness of less than 20.
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but the maul specifically does the extra damage to inanimate objects, not people.Which is why it does NOT work on sunder et al. versus a players used items. NOTHING a player is wearing or wielding is an inamite object for purposes of magic. They are all attended objects.
Now if you wanted to do it to a persons armor when it was lying on the ground, I would say go for it. But once a person wears of wields something it gets subsumed into their personal aura and becomes, for pretty much all affects, THEM.
Even if one were to allow it on WORN armor or wielded items, the bleed through damage would definately NOT be tripled, since it is no longer damaging an inanimate item but a persona or living creature.
Time to remember how to multiply and divide if you really want to do this.
Or just make your gear out of Adamantine. Unless the maul is made out of it as well it can do as much damage as it wants and still not affect the weapon or armor since adamantine ignores damage from items with a hardness of less than 20.
Thank you this was something I was looking for, its an attended object :) So far pathfinder has patched many broken issues and I'm glad this is another I'm glad that won't see abuse :) if even by me
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but the maul specifically does the extra damage to inanimate objects, not people.Which is why it does NOT work on sunder et al. versus a players used items. NOTHING a player is wearing or wielding is an inamite object for purposes of magic. They are all attended objects.
attended =/= animate
even while someone wields something, it doesn't stop being inanimate
from websters:
1 : not animate: a : not endowed with life or spirit <an inanimate object> b : lacking consciousness or power of motion <an inanimate body>
2 : not animated or lively
picking up an object doesnt change any of that
It has nothing to do with being 'an attended object'. That's saving throws. The only part about that that's relevant is actually hitting it. If it's unattended it has an AC equal to 10 + its size modifier + its Dexterity modifier (-5) -2. If it's an attended object, ie. something worn or wielded you make your CMB check against the CMD of the wielder.
Sunder specifically works against WORN or WIELDED objects.
Here's the description again, bolded where pertinent:
You can attempt to sunder an item held or worn by your opponent as part of an attack action in place of a melee attack. If you do not have the Improved Sunder feat, or a similar ability, attempting to sunder an item provokes an attack of opportunity from the target of your maneuver. If your attack is successful, you deal damage to the item normally. Damage that exceeds the object’s Hardness is subtracted from its hit points. If an object has equal to or less than half its total hit points remaining, it gains the broken condition (see Appendix 2). If the damage you deal would reduce the object to less than 0 hit points, you can choose to destroy it. If you do not choose to destroy it, the object is left with only 1 hit point and the broken condition. Whenever you sunder to destroy a weapon, shield, or suit of armor, any excess damage is applied to the item’s wielder.
I'm not trying to be condescending, but where's the confusion here? Remember it's the damage dealt - the armour/weapon's hp after hardness.
So say a suit of chainmail +2 has 14 hardness and 50 hp. You hit it with a +3 Maul of the Titans and deal an average roll of 5 + 3 = 8. For argument's sake let's add Weapon Specialization. That makes it 10. Your strength is let's say 26 with magical enhancements. 2 handed that's a mod of 12. We'll Power Attack at -3 to hit, + 9 to dmg. 12 + 10 + 9 = 31. So 31 damage multiplied by 3 for the sunder. That's 93 hp damage. Minus 14 hardness = 79 pts of dmg.
In this example we elect to destroy the armour, 79 - 50 (armour's hp) = 29 pts. of damage. Is that really that OP? As a 10th lvl fighter?
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In this example we elect to destroy the armour, 79 - 50 (armour's hp) = 29 pts. of damage. Is that really that OP? As a 10th lvl fighter?
29 points of damage after sunder, when a regular attack does 2d8+28 IS still a lot of damage. almost as good as just a regular attack. thats a free full power swing and sunder for free. that is pretty damn powerful IMHO. personally i say the carry over damage gets divided by 3 (since a person is not an object) and deals 9 damage to the wearer. still lets you cracks the shell, but the items ability to deal extra damage to other items shouldn't extend to the wearer, otherwise it gets crazy. sunder a dagger/armorspike and deal MAD damage to the person
example: dagger (hardness 10, 2 hp)
that means you sunder the dagger and get to deal 81 points of damage (using numbers from above example) to the person. thats WAY WAY crazy powerful. Thats the same as a crit, but without having to crit. now if the 81 is divided by 3 its 27. much more reasonable in this situation.
You're forgetting that when it comes time to sell the loot, that +2 chainmail is worth 0gp instead of 2225gp.
And that's every single damn magic item in the adventure.
Yes you can get Make Whole cast on every single damn magic item in the adventure but that's only if the caster's twice the caster level needed to craft it - which is almost never.
Seriously, if you did do this tactic you'd have a whole bunch of destroyed magic items buried somewhere until your caster was high enough level to repair them.
And if you find another caster that's high enough level, you can expect to lose a ton of gold.
*edit* But you're right if they have nonmagical items.
Makes me wonder...what if you sundered their holy symbol or spell component pouch.
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well it still cant damage a +4 or better weapon or armor. theres one way to stop the trick, also (for the OP) remember on a crit against an object (i think we can crit on those now) its x4 total damage, not x3 then x2, just in case it comes up
also it mentions some things in the damaging an item section. I'd say a club couldn't sunder a pouch (the example is a club cant sunder a rope). Even some things like chainmail seems less than practice.
what gets really ridiculous is sundering individual armor spikes with the above example (same numbers as a dagger, but very repeatable)
well it still cant damage a +4 or better weapon or armor. theres one way to stop the trick, also (for the OP) remember on a crit against an object (i think we can crit on those now) its x4 total damage, not x3 then x2, just in case it comes up
also it mentions some things in the damaging an item section. I'd say a club couldn't sunder a pouch (the example is a club cant sunder a rope). Even some things like chainmail seems less than practice.
what gets really ridiculous is sundering individual armor spikes with the above example (same numbers as a dagger, but very repeatable)
yep, yep and yep. But holy symbols are fair game.
as far as armour spikes are concerned again, yep.
but what was that about chainmail?
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well it still cant damage a +4 or better weapon or armor. theres one way to stop the trick, also (for the OP) remember on a crit against an object (i think we can crit on those now) its x4 total damage, not x3 then x2, just in case it comes up
also it mentions some things in the damaging an item section. I'd say a club couldn't sunder a pouch (the example is a club cant sunder a rope). Even some things like chainmail seems less than practice.
what gets really ridiculous is sundering individual armor spikes with the above example (same numbers as a dagger, but very repeatable)
yep, yep and yep. But holy symbols are fair game.
as far as armour spikes are concerned again, yep.
but what was that about chainmail?
idk, chainmail seems like one of those things you shouldn't be able to bludgeon apart. same with padded, hide and leather armors. and probably an armored kilt. full plate you could conceivably beat in untill its broken/not as good, but i really cant see how you can hit the armors i mentioned and not be attacking the wearer. doesn't make sense you beat the material and not the enemy.
also depends on the holy symbol. I'm sure some are exceptions.
I see what you're getting at.
In the next couple of days i'll be posting my homebrew rules that cover this exact problem.
Basically, it'll be a combination of the 'Armour as DR' 3.5 optional rule and the 'Armour type vs Weapon type' optional rule from 2nd ed.